This Week In Tech 440 (Transcript)

Leo Laporte: It’s time for TWiT, This Week in Tech, the week after CES. John C. Dvorak here with  Natali Morris and Marques Brownlee, and KBHD to talk about CES and more. Stay tuned, This Week in Tech is next.

Netcasts you love, from people you trust. This is TWiT.

Leo: Bandwidth for This Week in Tech is provided by CacheFly, at

Leo: This is TWiT, This Week in Tech, episode 440, recorded January 12, 2014

Sound by Steve

This Week in Tech is brought to you by LegalZoom. Visit to save on your legal needs, and gain access to a network of legal plan attorneys for guidance. Legal zoom is not a law firm, they’re better. They provide self-help services at your specific direction. Visit and use the offer code: TWIT to receive $10 off at check-out. And by GoToMeeting with HD faces from Citrix. The powerfully simple way to meet with co-workers and clients anywhere. Share the same screen and see each other face to face with HD video conferencing, even present from an iPad. Try it free for 30 days, no credit card needed to get started. Visit GOTOMEETING.COM, click the “try it free” button, and use the promo code: TWIT. And by, with over 28 million high-quality stock photos, illustrations, nectars, and video clips, helps you take your creative projects to the next level. For 25% off your new account, go to and use the offer code: TWIT114. And by Squarespace, the all-in-one platform that makes it fast and easy to create your own professional website or online portfolio. For a free two week trial and 10% off, go to and use the offer code TWIT1. It’s time for Twit This Week in Tech, your show for technology news for the week, and of course a very big week because, as everybody knows it’s the NFL Play- wrong, it’s CES week! And by the way, I got the memo, it’s International CES, and the CES doesn’t stand for anything.

John C. Dvorak: When did that happen? Remember when DVD, they kept changing the name of it?

Leo: Yeah, it’s the show formally known as the Consumer Electronics Show, now it’s just International CES. John C. Dvorak is here, in Plaid.

John: Hello.

Leo: The lumberjack Dvorak.

John: Yep, family man.

Leo: Also, I’m thrilled to have Natali Morris back from her beautiful New Jersey abode.

Natali Morris: Hi.

Leo: Did you go to Vegas this week?

Natali: No, I did not.

Leo: Did Clayton?

Natali: No, actually. We both sat this one out. Watched from the sidelines.

Leo: That’s how your know you’re a senior technology correspondent, is if you don’t have to go

Natali: Is if you don’t have to go, right. It’s mostly the peons that go.

Leo: Yeah, it starts out if you’re a little junior cub reporter, you don’t get to go. Then the day comes, “I’m going to CES!” You do that about 12 times and then you go, “I can’t wait not to go to CES.” And then finally you get senior enough, or old enough, that you don’t have to.

Natali: Or unemployed enough, if you want to put it that way.

Leo: Yeah. Or unemployed enough, that’s another way to put it! You know who is here, who was at CES, and I’m thrilled to have him on, YouTube star Marques Brownlee.

Marques Brownlee: Hey!

Leo: Ultimate Frisbee player, hey Marques! MKBHD. You say it so fast that I have to go ‘MKBHD.’

Marques: Yeah, I say it so fast in a lot of videos that I forget that people who are new don’t know what it stands for so I kind of have to slow down a little bit.

Leo: I’m thinking it stands for Marques K Brownlee in High Def.

Marques: Exactly.

Leo: I got it! Already you filed, I don’t know, 5 or 6 reports from CES and already more than 800,000 views on YouTube. The biggest one though, was ‘My Kit’ 170,000 views for the bag of stuff that you brought CES.

Marques: Yeah well I kind of teased that a little bit because I have changed a lot of the video gear I’ve been using in the past couple of weeks, so I was going to show what video gear I used anyway, and I figured CES was a good time to do that because I was bringing a select portion of it to cover the show.

Leo: You used a DSLR to shoot?

Marques: You could consider it, well, I guess it’s not a DSLR. The C100, Canon C100 is the camera that I use. I used to use a DSLR in the Canon 5  D-Mark 3.

Leo: So this is their 5 or 6,000 dollar kind of Mark 3, but it’s intended for video.

Marques: Yeah, it’s video first. As great as the 5-D is and always will be at video, it’s a stills first camera. So having a video-first camera, with a lot of video functions and video layout body and everything like that is really helpful for shooting. Especially with running and stuff you do at CES.

Leo: Yeah, but it does use the Canon lenses-

Marques: Yep.

Leo: Which is great. It’s got the best of both worlds.

John: What’s the model number again?

Marques: CEOSC100.

John: Okay, got it.

Marques: Yeah.

Leo: And they announced this, I think the last CES, yeah it’s pretty sweet gear. I could see that the Youtube videos are paying some money here, that’s nice!

Marques: Yep.

Leo: But Marques is still in school. You’re studying for an MBA, right?

Marques: Yeah, yeah I’m majoring in business so-

Leo: See, this is a smart guy.

John: Yeah, he’s not like us.

Natali: Oh, so am I. I’m getting my MBA as well.

Leo: You too?

John: Oh, well that’s- You’re over the hill.

Natali: What?!

John: Nothing, I didn’t say anything!

Natali: I’m over the hill?..

John: No, everybody’s raving about how beautiful you look today, by the way.

Leo: She’s a young woman.

John: Did you notice this, because they’ve been going on and on about how beautiful she is.

Leo: I think you’re gorgeous too, Marques. I just want to be fair! John, not so much. Me, not so much, we’re the old guys.

Natali: Now John, we had all these talks in the pre-show about how not to offend women.

Leo: He doesn’t care.

John: Brought to you by Dots.

Leo: Go ahead Marques. What? You’ve got even bigger Dots. You’ve one-upped him already! Hold up your Dots, that’s the world’s smallest Dot!

John: Well, hold on for a second. There are a million ways I could go with this and I refuse to go down that road. I refuse to go down that road.

Leo: He totally one-upped you.

John: Yeah, well.

Leo: We’re 6 minutes 30 seconds into the show-

John: This came from your studio.

Leo: It’s not my fault you show you’re little tiny Dot on TV.

Natali: So this is the game we’re playing right now, if I hold up something then you have to hold up a bigger version.

Leo: Apparently, Marques won like-

Marques: I literally just got it, I just had lunch. See, I’m on West Coast time so I forgot to eat lunch today and made the mistake of going shopping while hungry, not supposed to do that. So I ate lunch and continued eating, so that’s why I had these.

Leo: That’s why you buy the really big packages of Dots.

Natali: You do know that’s not food, right?

Marques: Yeah, I had the real lunch and was still hungry because it’s 9PM, West Coast time.

Leo: So, Kara Swisher kind of wrote the article, I guess a lot of people wanted to write about CES and I’d love to hear your opinion Marques because you were on the ground, in which she says basically it isn’t where innovation happens, it’s where marketing happens. And really, you go here to get bombarded with marketing. Marques were you able to, this is by the way on her new green codes-

John: That’s pretty astonishing, she’d come up with something so radical. It’s just a sale show for dealers.

Leo: Well, originally it was a show for dealers. And by the way she doesn’t knock it, she says it’s a great show, it’s just loud and- Well, the point I’m making, and the point she was making is, you don’t go there to see something new particularly. Marques did you see anything there that you thought was particularly innovative?

Marques: I would tend to say no, even though a lot of stuff there was really cool and advanced and “new,” in terms of the tech news. But I felt like half of the stuff that was really cool and new was just there to get some press and make some noise, and may or may not actually happen. So I tend to agree with the-

Natali: And then again, stuff like that never makes it to market. They say “Maybe fall,” so then you ask “When is the release date on this, what is the price on this?” And they say, “Uuuh.” And you know anything that’s actually come to market, this is my CESD Coder, if they give you the date and it’s like May, it will probably hit the market because that means it’s in the product development cycle enough that they know something about it, and it may not launch until October but anytime they say April or May, you’re like, “Okay, this I will actually see .” But if they say “Fall,” you’re never seeing that thing.

Leo: Forget it, there’s nothing there. So this is one that was more in the Fall category. It was at the Intel Booth from a company called Rest devices. And I thought because you have two young children, maybe you’d notice it’s a babies onesie that’s a baby moniter. And this to me says everything you need to know about CES 2014. It’s wearable, it has an attached lily pad and turtle that connect to your home’s WiFi, and with your kid wearing this, it seems like it could cause them pain in the hip because it attaches to the onesie. But it measures respiration, skin temperature, body position, and activity level. Then it sends it all, not only to a smart phone app, but to a mug that mom or dad has at the breakfast table. The mug is able to smile if the baby is happy, and frowns-

John: This is the worst thing ever.

Leo: This gets the Happy fork nomination for the dumbest product at CES this year, that got all of the coverage. All of the coverage. This is made for TV.

Natali: Yeah, that’s dumb. And dangerous.

John: I agree with that 100%.

Leo: Apparently, you can put it on teenagers too.

John: No, that’s different.

Leo: Oh, ok!

Natali: You know, I didn’t hear very much talk and I was looking for it. I was watching all of the coverage and I felt like if I took a shot every time someone said ‘wearable,’ right? I’d be wasted. But there is not very much research about whether or not that’s safe to have on your person. And I, personally used the Y Beams Baby Monitor that was announced last year at CES on my daughter. I just started to freak because it was a little too close to her. But I don’t know what the repercussions are, no one does yet, about WiFi being this close to our body. And I stopped wearing the FitBit because it’s constantly searching for my phone in order to send that data. Which means it is constantly going through my body. We just don’t know enough, and I know I always sound like the hippie on this show, but we just don’t know anything.

Leo: We know enough, yes. This is very low-powered.

John: Yeah, but when it’s searching, it usually has the spike.

Natali: That’s exactly my point, it’s searching for your device in order to send the data to the Cloud. It’s searching for your router or it’s searching for your device. How many things can you carry on your person? I carry my phone in my pocket all the time and so that’s sending signals about where I am, and what the weather is, and all of that stuff. Then you’ve got the FitBit on your arm, I had the withings right next to my daughter’s head while she was sleeping and I just freaked. So I ended up using the DropCam and put it way across the room so that I could see the whole room. So this thing about putting something directly on their hip that is sending a signal, and there are already mattresses that do this. There are mattress pads that test their breathing and test their movement and all of that. I think that would make you a super paranoid parent.

Leo: I think it’s conceivable that there’s an issue, I’ve looked at all sorts of research about EMF and WiFi and there’s just no way that it is-

John: Well we’re being bombarded by the economy.

Leo: There is zero after many, many studies.

John: That’s not true, there was a study that was done that showed some correlation with brain cancer and, wait wait! Let me finish. And the conclusion was that it wasn’t the WiFi at all, but it was the proximity  creating a build-up of heat.

Leo: You can’t microwave your brain, it’s a bad idea. I don’t think we’re at a level of power where your brain is getting heated up.

John: Apparently, if you’re on the phone all day it’s getting heated up a little bit. It’s not cooking, it’s just getting heated up.

Natali: That’s one of the reasons we’re told to not put the phone directly to our head. The chatroom is going crazy and saying I’m being a fear monger.

John: Yeah, they are. They think you’re crazy.

Natali: Right, but because it’s a pain point. Because I’m suggesting that maybe, we need to distance our person from this.

Leo: There are many, many, many, many studies on this. This is not-

Natali: But they’re not conclusive, I’ve read the same studies and they’re all very iffy.

Leo: That means there is no evidence. They’re not conclusive because there is no evidence.

Natali: They don’t have enough time though. Even a decade is too short of a trial period.

John: This show is brought to you by Motorolla.

Leo: No it isn’t, anyways. So Marques, by the way, you just came back from the most WiFi-electromagnetic, frequency-saturated zone in the world. If twenty years from now, you get cancer, you know who to thank.

Marques: CES.

Leo: If the Mimo is the closest thing to invasion, I think its safe to say. Did you see any wearables that impressed you at all? That was the term of CES’s year was wearable and the quantified self.

Marques: Nothing too shocking, I saw there’s a new Pebble. There’s been mostly positive impressions about the Pebble, in general. So the Pebble Steel and the API and their new app store for Pebble. So, that’s at least getting started in a way that may make wearables more interesting.

Leo: What do you think about the Pebble, do you wear a Pebble?

Marques: I don’t wear a Smart Watch, I don’t wear anything on my wrists. Well I used to use the Galaxy Gear for a little bit and then-

Leo: Dopey, it’s dopey right?

Marques: Yeah, it just got in the way. It’s clunky, the way the electronics are layed out. It’s kind of good-looking at first, it just wasn’t for me.

Leo: Well that’s the idea of the Steel, is that it’s better looking, anyway. Still completely silly. People love the Pebble, I think there was a soft spot. I was a Pebble contributor on Kickstarter. I have my Pebble, I think there’s a bit of a soft spot for people because it was one of the most successful Kickstarter campaigns of all time.

Marques: It’s very focused about what it does. Some Smart Watches I’ve seen tend to try to do either too much or they try to be everything in your life I guess. The Galaxy Gear has a camera on it, I don’t know why you’d need a camera on a watch. But the Pebble does a certain set of things, that seem like good ideas, really well. I guess they’re trying to continue to focus on a smaller set of things, rather than spreading it too thin.

Leo: To me, I guess I’m with you Natali, I don’t see any of these wearable particularly compelling. Whether it’s Google Glass, the Pebble Watch, the internet connected onesie.

Natali: I like the fitness/smart phone type thing, I think that’s fine.

Leo: You wore a FitBit, you said, right?

Natali: Yeah, I did. I have before, like I said I stopped for, well, I won’t go into it again.

Leo: The FitBit works, because it inspires you to get your numbers up. Just as the Jawbone Up did that, I used the Fuel Band just because it did that nice little animation when you hit your goal. That’s all it’s for, right, just to kind of, “Oh I’ve got to get my numbers up.”

Natali: I guess, the Quantified Life, it makes you go to sleep because you want to get your sleep numbers, it makes you work, you know. It makes me walk more because I can’t stand it when Veronica Beaumont beats me from FitBit. We’re friends on FitBit so we’re always competing and so if she’s walked more than me, I don’t like it, so.

Leo: But that’s good because it gets you walking.

Natali: Yeah.

Marques: I’d be curious how many steps we took at CES.

Leo: You didn’t count?

Marques: I didn’t have anything on, I didn’t have a pedometer. I probably should’ve installed one on my phone.

Natali: There are apps that do that now, you could install one on your phone.

Leo: The Galaxy Note 3 has it and the GS4 has it too, the little pedometer. Scott Wilkenson, our home theatre guy, he was there and wears a pedometer each year to CES, walked 24 miles in 4 or 5 days. That’s pretty typical, he says.

John: Nice, yeah. I think it is.

Leo: A few miles a day. Most of its just uncomfortable, you know? In fact, you know you’re in the really upscale booth when you get the really thick carpet. Like Intel-

John: You’re walking around and once you hit that carpet, it slows you down. It slows you down like you’re walking in quicksand.

Leo: It slows you down because you’re feet are happy.

Natali: It’s funny, FitBit had the one that you put in your bra for a while. Didn’t they actually have it in the instructions that the woman should wear it in the bra?

Leo: The clip FitBit you could wear in your bra, or on your belt.

Natali: I would always drop it, at the end of the day, I would take off my bra, and it would fall-

Leo: Yeah, I’d take off my bra and it would fall also.

Natali: -into the floor and I would never find it again. I would kick it under the bed or something.

Leo: I lost a FitBit-

Natali: They need some more boob innovation, don’t you think, at CES?

Leo: I lost a FitBit at the San Diego zoo, in Paris, in the toilet at home, and in the washing machine. It happens to me every time, I’ve gone through 4 FitBits, the wristband is not so bad.

Natali: The wristband snaps on me. The rubber is not really well made so as soon as I take it out to charge, it snaps right at the seam.

Leo: I hate it when rubber snaps. So Marques, what are you like 20, 21?

Marques: 20.

Leo: So, you didn’t grow up with wrist watches, probably, right?

Marques: Exactly, never really worn one.

Leo: So, exactly that’s what I was wondering. People make it a big deal about-

John: Clock bracelet.

Leo: Yeah, the Jack in the Box ad, “Did you invent the clock bracelet?” It seems to me, everybody is kind of trying to scramble to get in this market before Apple does, as if Apple is going to suddenly make this iWatch that everybody’s going to go, “Whoah.”

John: I think Apple is wise to put it off and see what happens.

Leo: And the problem is, you want, what you want is the Marques Brownlee’s of the world. You want young people who have never worn a wrist watch. So, have you tried Google Glass Marques?

Marques: Yeah, I’m a Glass explorer, I just shipped off my version 1’s today and swap to Google Version 2. I don’t wear Glass that often, and when I do, it’s usually with a certain purpose, like, I intend to record something, and so the whole wearable tech thing, there’s a lot of talk about it but I’m just not really that into it yet. I saw something from JBird at CES that I thought was a little unique, it was a fitness band, not a clock. But it was more flexible so you could wear it, it was actually more comfortable than some of the rigid ones like that clamp or clip, so I feel it would it would be a little less cumbersome.

Leo: It is the Jaybird Reign, they call it. R-E-I-G-N. Which makes makes no sense because “reign” that horses have are “E-I-N”.

John: That’s what this is -- the same thing, but you put it in our mouth.

Leo: It’s a bit!

Marques: Wearable mouthpiece. Mouthpiece wearable tech.

Leo: I think wearable tech is...

Natali: Dangerous.

 John : Most people concluded that this was a flop. It is a flop at the CES.

Leo: That all of it was.

John: Though everybody talked about Netflix. Netflix did the best job at getting their message out. They put their stuff everywhere. And now they are going to stream 4K. They came up with some scheme where they’ll pay your bill for bandwidth if they have to.

Leo: We have to talk about that AT&T thing -- that’s a big story.

Natali: What do you guys think about the connected home? It’s funky. This app for this refrigerator or this operating system. It’s not there yet.

Leo: “The connected home! It’s funky!” says Natali:.

Natali: It’s funky. That’s not the word. I think I wanted the word “janky”. It could be funky.

Leo: It’s because there’s no unified standard yet.

John: What about the X10 or whatever? This has come and gone for the last 30 years and nobody wants it.

Leo: And then there’s Zigbee. And there’s all these standards. I don’t know about this year, but past at CES there’s been an entire home automation pavilion.

John: Zigbee. Another flop. People don’t want this crap. First thing I would do if they...

Natali: I do! I like the August.

John: Yeah, here’s what I would do if you had a connected home, the first thing you do is you hack it and turn they guy’s heat up to a 110. That’s the first thing you do.

Natali: No one does that. Come on, the Nest was a success, so there’s a marketplace for it if you can do it well. We’re using the Hue. The Philips Hue.

Leo: I love the Hue.

Natali: That’s so neat! I mean, connected home -- that’s something.

Leo: But I gotta tell you, when I moved, I brought my Nest and my Hue and I didn’t connect up either yet.

John: There you have it. That’s how important it is to you.

Leo: It’s like there was no urgency. There was really no urgency, like, oh yeah one of these days I’ll...

Natali: Alright, well you come out to the frozen Northeast.

Leo: Do you have the Hue hooked up at Tinky Winky?

Natali: No.

Leo: The Hue is in Jersey?

Natali: Mhmm.

Leo: How about the Nest? Tinky Winky or Jersey?

Natali: Jersey

John: What is “Tinky Winky”?

Natali: And we’re using the Mickey one too. It’s the Mickey ears and you read a story. It’s like, you know, the Toy Story gang was in a tent and then they saw some shadows and the lights dim like when it’s at that time in the story. It’s so cool!

Leo: There’s a new app.

John: Wow.

Natali: You guys aren’t intrigued?

Leo: No. So, let me explain. The Hue is from Philips -- they’re expensive -- $60 bucks. You have to buy a base unit and starter kit and you connect them via WiFi and you can talk to them. They’re RGB so you can do any color from the hue. There is a new app, which John just showed me, called Exoplanet for iPhone and iPad. And what the app does -- you’ll like this -- it notifies you every time we’ve discovered a new exoplanet.

John: Great! I need to get notified when that happens.

Leo: That’s an earth-like planet in another solar system, is an exoplanet.

John: That’s a practical use.

Leo: No, but! This is the part I love!

John: Here’s the big “but”.

Leo: It ties into the Hue and you can automatically see what light on that planet would look like in your living room.

John: Oh. Fascinating.

Natali: Whoh! That’s as close as you’re going to get to space.

Leo: I love it!

Marques: That’s a nice twist. I actually like that. That’s kind of neat.

Leo: See! See!

John: Well there you go. You guys should work together. So I’m listening to the guy from LG say the following, talking about the idiocy of the connected home. He says “You know how you have...” This is about the texting product that came -- you can text your refrigerator, you can text your washing machine to tell it to start or...

Leo: This is so stupid. Come on. You just walk down the hall. You press “on”.

John: He says “Remember when you had to...” This is the quote. I memorized it. I use it on the show today on the No Agenda show. He says “Remember when you had to rush home to turn on your washer and drier?”

Leo: No! No, you never had to do that!

John: Besides that, are the clothes in there rotting? Is the drier ready to go? Why don’t you just turn it on when you’re ready to leave? Who puts the soap in?

Leo: So stupid.

Natali: Oh, don’t tell my mother-in-law that. You must never leave the house with the drier on -- what if it explodes?

John: Oh yeah. That happens so often.

Leo: The WiFi could go through the air, set the clothes on fire, the whole thing could blow up, and you wouldn’t be home to suffer.

John: That’s the first thing I’d do, is hack it and turn people’s washing machines on -- just let them go.

Leo: It’s completely nutty to have the idea that you would  want to remote start something that requires you to be there physically to put things into it.

John: Yes, with the soap and the clothes. I know, it’s idiotic.

Leo: It’s like, “I’ve set it all up, but I’m going to wait and start it via text message.”

John: “When I come home. When I’m on my way home” Yea, I know, it’s idiotic. This was the crap we heard in the late ‘90s. About the refrigerator that would tell you how much milk...

Leo: Well, no no. I want a refrigerator...

Natali: No, here’s but here’s what you do want. I want to preheat my oven. That’s the only thing I really want.

Leo: That’s a good one! That’s a good one.

Marques: Don’t they also send you a text message when your stuff is done?

Leo: When your stuff is done, so that you can run home and take it out.

Marques: If you have one in a different room in the house, and don’t know when it’s done or not. It’s done in the washer, you want to switch it to the dryer, you want to know when it’s done, a text.

Leo: I have one of these things on my washer -- it’s so cool -- when it’s done, it goes beep beep beep beep. I love that!

John: I have one of those too. Also the dryer makes noise.

Marques: I can tell when the dryer’s done.

Natali: That’s super annoying.

Leo: Tor Beck says “I lost my house to a dryer fire. Do not make fun of the dryer fire”

Natali: See.  

John: I’ve had dryers all my life, and none of them have ever caught on fire, so I think it’s a remote statistical anomaly when one does.

Natali: I think it has to do with being on an electrical or a gas.

Leo: Which is dangerous? Which is which?

Natali: I think the electric is more dangerous than the gas.

Leo: Why would that be?

Natali: I don’t know, let’s see. The chat room will tell us. One or the other is more dangerous and my mother told me to never do it.

John: Well, it’s also more expensive.

Leo: I know Natali’s mom by the way, I’m proud to say.

John: I met her.

Leo: Is it Verna? No, Verna’s Clayton’s mom.

John: Natali’s mom loves me, just like your mom. I’m a likeable guy when it comes down to it.

Leo: My mom wants to have your baby.

John: Well, it’s a little late for that.

Leo: I think you’re more likely to die in a dryer fire than to get cancer from WiFi, but that’s just me.

John: There you go. Call back.

Leo: Moving on. Curved television sets, as long as we’re talking about CES, they’re really... you know CES, frankly if you ask me, the biggest story at CES in the last 8 years has been televisions, right? But not always successfully. 3D was the story.

John: Is 3D still around?

Leo: In fact, in 2008, remember the big story was “mobile TV”, the little Flow TV and things like that? Of course, Marques was 8 years old -- he doesn’t remember this. But this was the thing and everybody would have a TV in their pocket. Nobody bought it. Went out of business.

John: Is that a TV in your pocket?

Leo: Then it was 3D TV, again... not successful. In fact, Vizio annouced at CES this year they’re not going to make anymore 3D TVs.

John: Why? It’s only a 5 buck circuit. It doesn’t cost anything extra to make them anymore?

Leo: I guess people didn’t want them. But what we did see, was a lot of UHD/4K, and it’s not quite an interchangeable term. I’ll use UHD, which is the industry term -- ultra high-def television.

John: They’re cheap too!

Leo: And many are sub-1000 dollars.

John: I’m surprised you haven’t swapped all the TVs. You’ve got monitors all over the place -- people don’t realize that when they come in here.

Leo: Because there’s no content. Marques did you look at the 4Ks?

Marques: I do. I have one right behind me. Another one right over there.

John: He’s way ahead of you. He’s got a Seiki.

Leo: Which one do you have?

Marques: This one is the Seiki 39”.

Leo: That’s under $1000?

John: Yeah.

Marques: It’s been under $600 for a while

Leo: Do you watch anything on that?

Marques: That one, no, because right after I got that, Black Friday happened and  TCL 50” went down to $799 and I bought that.

Leo: So that’s a prop behind you.

Marques: Until I find, yeah, I’m going to review it, which means putting it right here and connecting the Mac Pro to it, tonight maybe. But there was a ton of 4K TVs CES. I made a video about actually the 4K cameras at CES because there were a lot less of those and they were a little more interesting to me. But, yeah, everyone had a 4K TV.

Natali: Those are neat. Tell us about those.

Leo: Yeah, the 4K cameras.

Marques: So, the Galaxy Note III shoots 4K, or I should say UH- no, 4K.

Leo: No, 4K, it shoots 4K, yeah. And 60 frames, right? Full frame rate.

Marques: It’s very watchable, it’s just not the highest bitrate, and it tends to fall apart with any movement. But I talked about the fact that it has a 4K sensor and you can record 4K video. So, Sony came out with their new Handycam, which is a $2000, coming soon, 4K Handycam that you basically hold in your hand and can shoot 4K video with in really high quality -- they’re pretty good at that. They had a couple of other 4K cameras. There were some 4K at the Canon booth, nothing really new or cheap, but they had the 1DC, which is $12,000 and the C500 with is $25,000. So, the whole point of the video was that CES is showing things that are expensive now that will eventually, with volume, hopefully come much cheaper and available this year. So with all the 4K TVs, you might as well have a camera that shoots 4K so you can enjoy that to the fullest.

Leo: I’m shooting 4K right now on my Galaxy Note III.

Marques: Right now.

Leo: Look at that. It’s beautiful. Now admittedly, it doesn’t have a great lens or anything, but it’s actually fairly credible 4K... full frame.

Marques: I’ve seen some really well-done.

John: This is your newest phone? This is the phone du jour?

Leo: Phone du jour -- the Note III

John: I like this by the way.

Leo: It’s a little strange, I know. Yeah, I think that’s a good point Marques.

John: This is huge. This is like a laptop.

Leo: That’s the point of this thing.

John: The size of this thing...

Leo: You know, who needs a tablet? You have a phone and a tablet. It’s got all that Samsung crap on it. That’s the only thing wrong with it. But it wouldn’t make sense to do a Google edition because you got the stylus...

John: Is this the one with the Samsung operating system?

Leo: No. It ties in. It’s Android.

John: Yeah, the Mike Tyson...

Leo: Mike Tyson operating system. It has a lisp, but it’s powerful. In fact, Marques, you’re showing off the Note III right here on your video as I watch it. Did you shoot any of the video from the show on that?

Marques: No. I shot everything on the C100. I’m thinking this is the year I’m going to buy a 4K camera that I shoot my videos with.

Leo: Wow.

Marques: As 4K becomes more widely, or UHD video, I guess. But so far, yeah I shot everything on this guy.

Leo: You can distribute on YouTube in 4K, but it’s so compressed I don’t know the point, right?

Marques: You can actually tell when a video is shot in 4K when you’re watching in 1080p because the bitrate is actually higher, but not a lot of people even watch it in 1080p or 4K.

Leo: Curved TVs -- what do you think?

Marques: I think it’s the 3D of 2014.

Leo: I have a curved TV.

John: You do? You got one?

Leo: I got the Samsung OLED that they came out with earlier.

John: It’s curved?

Leo: It’s curved. It’s got about a 5% curve. The only thing, as far as I can tell, the only thing about it -- you can’t hang it on the wall because it rolls back and forth/ And you don’t want to be sitting on the side because you can’t...

John: Can’t see anything.

Leo: It’s curved. It’s dumb. They did it because they could. Did you see any advantage Marques? Did it feel more immersive?

Marques: Not really. In the 105” one, yes because it’s 105” so it would have felt more immersive anyway. But I feel like it’s one of those things they did for the press, and oops, so did everyone else. But they had one that you could actually press a button and would mechanically go from flat to curved and then press it again and it’d go back.

Leo: You press the remote, it goes *makes sound effect* zzzzzz.

Marques: You can get rid of the disadvantages of a curved TV, maybe you want to watch with your friends, watch the game, you don’t want it curved anymore, flatten it out -- $80,000.

Natali: But isn’t there a distance where there is some sort of advantage, right? That’s what I was reading.

Leo: Two feet.

Natali: If you get really far away from the television, then a really big crowd it sort of does serve. But in a small space it wouldn’t serve a small crowd.

Marques: What they’re trying to tout was that, if you’re sitting in line with the center of the TV, sitting a good distance away from it, the wrapping of the sides would feel more “immersive”, I don’t even know what they mean by that word, but it looked OK from the center, but once you get off axis from whatever distance you are, parts of the image that are curved will appear a bit distorted, which could be good, or bad. If you’re watching football, it’s going to look like the guy just got twice as big when he runs to the side of the TV, but if you’re watching a movie maybe you won’t notice that? I don’t know, it depends on the content. I don’t like the distortion in the first place, so I wasn’t a big fan. That’s also why I didn’t like 3D.

Leo: As you pointed out John, Netflix got the most mileage out of the UHD/4K story.

John: They didn’t even have a booth.

Leo: They didn’t need a booth.

John: No, they did very well for themselves.

Leo: They pointed out that House Of Cards was shot in 4K even though it wasn’t streamed in 4K for the first season, but will, starting Valentine’s day, streamed in 4K. The problem is the words “streamed in 4K”. How much bandwidth do you need for quality 4K streaming?

John: Ever so often, I meet with a guy, who I’ve met with once -- the Roku CEO. That’s the first thing I always ask is “what does it take to get the best stream?” “What’s the bitrate?” And all the rest of it. And now I have to go have lunch with him again to find out the perfect numbers for streaming 4K.

Leo: He used to be in Netflix. Roku was a Netflix product.

John: Yeah, I know. It was an interesting story of how he started Roku.

Leo: So let me tell you what Netflix says about HD, and we can assume UHD will use roughly twice as much: “2.8 gigabytes per hour”, if you’re watching HD. So you’re going to say 5 or more gigabytes per hour of bandwidth. Now first of all, if you’ve got 250 gigabyte caps, you probably shouldn’t be doing more than a few movies per month.

John: One.

Leo: Because you’re talking 10 gigabytes of movie. Second, I don’t know anyone who has bandwidth like that.

John: That would be 5 because 3D would be...

Leo: 3D is 4.7 gigabytes

John: And 3D would be twice as...

Leo: is 4K, because it has 2 frames. What is 5 gigabytes per hour in bits....

John: Per second.

Leo: It’s about 12-13 megabits per second.

John: Is it that high?

Leo: Is that right?

John: That seems high.

Marques: Times 8?

Leo: Marques, you’re young can you do the math for us?

John: Yeah, do the math while we sit here and vegetate.

Leo: It’s 15.6 megabits.

John: OK. That doesn’t sound right either.

Leo: Now, 15.6 -- you might say “Oh I have Comcast Burst, that’s 20 megabits.” It’s not sustained. In fact, very few people can really do a sustained 15 megabits. Google Fiber, maybe. So, it’s not a practical solution. I don’t know why Netflix is getting so much coverage if so few people can see it. Sony also said they’re be streaming 4K.

John: I do not believe that number, by the way. I’m sure it’s lower than that. I’m thinking it’s more around the 5...

Natali: Defer to the chat, when in doubt.

Leo: Defer to chat.

John: They’re all giving us different numbers. I’ll find out from somebody who knows what they’re talking about, who actually has practical information.

Leo: According to Gigaom...

John: Yeah, Gigaom -- they did a calculation. That’s all they did. I think it’s about 5.

Leo: Really, that low? If it’s that low, that’s good. Although, if you look at the ISP report from Netflix, very few people can give you sustained 5 gigabits.

John: 5 gigabits is rough, yeah.

Leo: It’s tough. We’re going to take a break. We’re talking with Marques: of MKBHD, the YouTube channel that is second only to PewDiePie in fan love. Tell, me Marques, do you look at PewDiePie and go “Why didn’t I think of swearing while watching video games.”? Why didn’t I think of that?

Marques: I don’t play as many games. There’s tons of only-gaming YouTube channels out there that get a ton of viewers, and that’s cool, but I don’t watch any of them -- I’m not a gamer.

John: This is why Marques is so productive.

Marques: That’s probably part of it. I don’t watch much TV either.

Leo: I think PewDiePie just broke a record. He’s the number one most subscribed YouTube channel. And didn’t he just go over, whatever it was, 15...

Marques: 20 million.

Leo: 20 million subscribers. Holy cow.

Marques: That’s a lot of people.

Leo: By the way, Marques, I just want to tell you: they’re all 10. Because I know, because I have an 11-year old in the house -- that’s all he watches -- PewDiePie. And he chortles.

John: He chortles. Is that actually what it is?

Marques: Chortles. That’s a word.

Leo: He goes *chortles*

John: Is he an old British man?

Leo: *continues chortling* No. *continues chortling* He watches PewDiePie, PewDiePie says a bad word, he goes *more chortling*. He chortles. It’s the only way to describe it. Also with is, Natali:, she is the, what is it, Tech Mommy? What is it that you do? What’s that called?

Natali: I’m not doing so much on Crash Test Mom, these days.

Leo: You’re not?

Natali: I’m not quite as active as I once was, but I’m going back to NBC actually.

Leo: What?!

Natali: I’m a contributor at NBC and CNBC, and also, I’m the tech contributor, the one and only, for the Queen LaTifah as well. I know you watch that.

Leo: That is exciting.

Natali: Yeah it is. That’s actually one of the fanciest things I did in 2013.

Leo: She’s awesome. Do you call her “The Queen”?

Natali: I try not to refer to her at all because she hasn’t invited me to call her “Dana” and she refers to herself as that in conversation. I don’t know if I should just call her “Queen”, so I just don’t say her name a whole lot.

Leo: Queeny. By the way, good news, just renewed for a second season.

Natali: Yeah!

Leo: Congratulations. I love her.

Natali: I do too, actually. She’s one of the only people that I’ve been star struck to me. Her and, actually, Joe Biden.

John: Joe Biden? The guy’s never made a right decision in his entire career.

Leo: Oh shut up!

John: I’m just saying.

Natali: Oh don’t start. That was a very exciting time for me.

Leo: You went to the White House. Tell us about that.

Natali: Yes. Skype and Bing sponsored a series of discussion questions with the politicians called “Ask The White House”, so I was asked to moderate the discussion and people sent in their questions over Skype. And the panel was about immigration. The goal is that they’ll do more about different topics, but it with Cecilia Muñoz, who's the Director of Public Policy, and the Vice President got word of it and he was like, “I want to participate too.” Because, you know, they’re really pushing their immigration bill and he asked to sit in. I had never done any work at the White House before. That was really exciting for me. If you want to see it you can go to

Natali:   I’m sorry,

Leo:  Ask the Vice-President!

Natali:  Yeah.

Leo:  I’ve always wanted to say, I’ve never done any work at the White House, so this was a real high for me.

Natali:  It’s scary!

Leo:  There she is…

Natali:  I’m really proud of that.

Leo:  Now wait, now tell me, tell me what is this room you are in?  What is the story with this room?

Natali:  That is in the Executive offices of the White House, and it used to be the office of, oh, I’m going to blank, the Secretary of Defense which used to be the Secretary of War, and it’s not, it’s no longer their office.

Leo:  Oh, going back to Roosevelt administration.

John:  No, it goes back to the Civil War actually.

Leo:  He was the Secretary of War, wasn’t he?

 Natali:  Yeah, he ran against Roosevelt. What’s his name?  Come on, history class.

John:  Well, four different people ran against Roosevelt.

Natali:  Uhm.  

Leo:  Henry Stimpson?

Natali:  No, no …

Leo:  He was Secretary of State.  I’m just looking at the chat room.

John:   I’m just looking at the chat room, too.  Come on, chat room.

Leo:  So, so, there he is, there is President Biden and his sign language interpreter.  That’s exciting.  Who is she?

John:  Is it that black guy, who just makes it up?

Leo:   Who is she?  Who is this woman?

Natali:  I just told you who she is, her name is Cecilia Menyoz.

Leo:  She was the Secretary of War?

Natali:  The Secretary of Policy.

Leo:  Oh, okay.

John:  Fidel Castro, said the chat room.  Thank you, chat room.  Very good.

Natali:  It’s Taft.

Leo:  William Howard Taft?

Natali:  Taft, yes.  I knew my husband would know.

Leo:  Really, did Clayton come running in and says that was William Howard Taft, he was Secretary of War.

John:  I don’t remember Taft running against Roosevelt.

Natali:  Clayton has a, he has a minor in history, and so he knows and he reads history books for fun, so I knew he would know.

Leo:  Is he in the other room watching?  He’s watching the football game, isn’t he?

John:  He better be.

Natali:  I have four messages, all in caps.  TAFT, TAFT, TAFT.

John:  When did Taft run against Roosevelt?

Leo:  Oh, does it matter?

John:  This is all nonsense.

Leo:  It’s all history.  That’s what matters.  The history of the world.

John:  He ran against Hoover, and then he ran against Randel, and then he ran against Smith.

Leo:  You look so good in this Natali.  Natali, this is so cool.

Natali:  Thank you.

Leo:  Did he offer to put his arm around you and get a selfie?

Natali:  No.

Leo:  Okay.

Natali:  and that was the same morning that the story broke, actually.

Leo: Ohhh.  Which one, the selfie or him putting his arm around the lady?

Natali:  Selfie at the Nelson Mandela funeral. That story broke that morning when I was in Washington so it felt like a buzzy day in Washington.

Leo: So is this William Howard Taft’s office?

Natali: It was.

Leo: He was so fat he had a special chair made.

John: Yes he was a fat guy.

Leo: In fact I remember seeing his bathtub, it was like, extra-large!

John: You saw his bathtub?

Leo: Yeah, I don’t know where. It’s been a long time.

John: If I were him I’d take a shower!

Leo: When I worked in the White House.

John: You know, the guy was so fat he had his own ZIP Code!

Leo: No, you can do better than that!

John: That’s an old line, I stole it.

Leo: There he is, Secretary of War, William Howard Taft. In fact, he initiated the second occupation of Cuba, so those of you who said Fidel Castro were close.

Natali: Taft was Roosevelt’s Secretary of War, and then ran against him.

Leo: He was president of course, briefly. Yeah, you’re talking about Ruusevelt, not Roosevelt. There is the bathtub! Where is that, because I have seen that bathtub?

John: It doesn’t look anything special.

Leo: In those days, you know this was the turn-of-the-century, they didn’t have big bathtubs.

Natali: But his portliness goes forward, not out, so you don’t need a big bathtub…

John: Take a shower, my friend

Leo: That’s what I always say, there you are, look, you can get four people in that bathtub!

John: Oh, it was a small boat! (laughs)

Leo: Rub a dub dub, the Secretary of War in a tub! We’re going to take a break,

John: About time!

Marques: That was the best innovation of that year at CES.

Leo: Winner of the year new innovations at CES for 1904!

John: Got it, you’re right: bull moose. The original Roosevelt, I was thinking of Franklin Roosevelt. Sorry about that.

Leo: that’s why it’s Rusevelt, not Roosevelt. Teddy was Roosevelt, did you know that?

John: no actually I did not know that.

Leo: yes, Teddy was a Rusevelt and his cousin Franklin was Roosevelt.

Natali: let’s ask Clayton he knows

Leo: Clayton knows, he’s listening. Ladies and gentlemen, our program brought to you today by It’s not a law firm, it’s better! It lets you get the legal stuff you need to do, done without paying for a high-priced attorney. It’s personalized, affordable legal protection. Now I’m thinking we’ve got some enterprising legal people here on the show today and many of you are watching. I highly recommend starting your own business, it’s the best thing I ever did, a lot of fun and of course, the first thing I did, I asked my friend Kevin Rose, I asked Kevin, who has started many businesses, and he said, go to LegalZoom, get an LLC for 99 bucks. And I said, okay, thank you. You could also get a corporation chapter S or chapter C Corporation. I also got Twit trademarked, the logo and the name, 169 bucks. You can get personal stuff too, last will and testament. Now here’s something new, this is something recently added, you can get connected with third-party attorneys. The LegalZoom legal plan pre-negotiate’s for a flat fee advice from an attorney in your state and you can choose that attorney based not only on their profile but on unedited reviews from LegalZoom customers. This is a great, great thing! to know about if you’re starting your own business you want to protect your family project yourself over One million entrepreneurs have done just as I did and gone to to get their business started. 90% of LegalZoom customers recommend LegalZoom to family and friends, that’s a very high number. It’s a very good deal, no surprise fees, no hassles. Go to, use the discount code twit just to let them know you heard about it on twit, they’ll give you 10 bucks off at checkout. Really it is a great place good to know about when you start a business;

Leo: Marques, have you incorporated, are you an LLC?

Marques: Maybe this year, not yet.

Leo: Yeah, I think it’s time, you’ve obviously got an Empire going!

Marques: Yeah, I’ll probably trademark it


Natali: If for no other reason, I learned this the hard way since I’m a freelancer too, if you incorporate then it’s easier to get a loan, buy a house or something, otherwise you need three years stated income for a certain whatever, but now interest rates seem to be changing fast in the year 2014, so anyone who might want to get any kind of loan should incorporate because it’s easier to prove when you’ve got an LLC.

Leo: Yeah, did you know that this week is the seventh anniversary, is that right, the seventh anniversary of the iPhone announcement at MacWorld Expo? I remember going to see this at the Moscone Center West, Steve Jobs, it was such an amazing moment! I want to go back a little bit and play for you, seven years ago, how old were you? You were 13, Marques!

Marques: Seven, yeah.

Leo: Did you pay attention to this kind of stuff then?

Marques: I remember that, I remember the day the reporter was interviewing a guy who just got his iPhone stolen during the video, the original iPhone. I remember someone getting one in one of my classes and like bringing it into school, which was a terrible idea, I remember that.

Leo: (laughs) But he was the star that day! I have, I actually, let me play a little bit of this, it was an amazing moment (video of iPhone announcement playing) this is probably, I would say, this is arguably the greatest moment in product keynote history and this is Steve jobs at his absolute peak. Now everybody in the room knows they were there probably for an iPhone announcement but nobody knew exactly what but we didn’t know what it was going to be called

John: This is the time you were filming it?

Leo: No no, this was before that. I was sitting next to Scott Bourne, Merlin Mann, Alex Lindsey; we had just gone to MacWorld, we were sitting in this keynote and there was really palatable excitement because everyone was wondering, what is Apple going to do in this space? Three new products, he says. People are excited about the iPod, a widescreen iPod, watch Steve because he’s eating this up, okay, now the crowd is saying, what could that be, three products… kind of a mild applause, they’re like, what?

Natali: Like, what does that mean?

(Steve Jobs says, three products, a widescreen iPod with touch controls, a revolutionary mobile phone and a breakthrough Internet communications device! Are you getting it? These are not three separate devices, this is one device! And we are calling it iPhone. Today Apple is going to reinvent the phone!)

Leo: I still get chills! You remember this, Marques?

Marques: I do, that was my favorite part, for a second, I was like, what?

Natali: Some people lip-synch in their bedroom, he walks around like this not to music but to the keynote!

Leo: You can learn so much watching this keynote, this is the way it should be done and you know I brought it out because I was thinking about this, during this event I was carrying this, it was the Blackberry curve, I think.

Natali: That very same one?

Leo Yes, this is it

John: He keeps all his phones.

Leo: And then this is the first iPhone and at first, you go, wait a minute, where’s the keyboard? There wasn’t an app store you remember, Steve said, you don’t need an app store, it’s all going to be web apps and then, just to really highlight, somebody in the chat room said, that wasn’t an innovation, big deal and I said, yes well, a year later Google comes out with its first Android phone. This is it, the G1 from Google and it’s like, it was horrible and it really underscored what a lead Apple had seven years ago this week! I just thought it would be worth…

John: it’s interesting how quickly Google caught up.

Leo: Yeah, well you know, Steve, I remember talking to Steve while he was in between jobs, he was at Pixar and he said, you know, companies catch up, we let Microsoft catch up, we had a huge lead when we came out with the Macintosh in 1984, 10 years later Microsoft had caught up, he said, by Windows 3.1, which you could argue, but certainly by Windows 95.

John: I wish Linux would catch up with Microsoft!

Leo: Linux has, it’s called Android!

John: I’m talking about these things, substantial machines.

Leo: Yeah, well Marques and I have The Machine, Marques hasn’t set his up yet. Are you excited?

Marques: I’m excited!

Leo: the Mac Pro is here!

Natali: I’m excited for you, show us! Marques has his, show us!

Marques: It’s up here; I can show you if I turn this a little bit (oohs and aahs)

John: It looks like a room deodorant thing

Leo: Were you surprised by how small it is Marques?

Marques: No, because I expected it. I had watched pretty much every video on the Internet of it already while I was waiting for it so I knew exactly how heavy it was going to feel because everyone who takes it out of the box says, wow it’s kind of heavy, so I knew it was going to be heavy but I’ve started my videos about it, my impressions about it, so we’ll see how that goes.

Leo: I want to thank, I did not know enough, I think it was December 19 when they put it on sale and if you happened to be up at midnight you could order it and get it in a timely timeframe. You must’ve done that Marques,

Marques: Yep!

Leo: But if you waited until the next morning, I didn’t know so I got up the next morning and I said, oh, and I ordered it, and it says, arrival in February! So I said, I’m not going to order it, maybe it will come out, they said it will be available December 31, maybe I’ll be able to walk into a store, no, I don’t think you still can walk into a store and find one. Fortunately, one of our viewers, Engelbert (I hope I’m saying your name right) he actually had ordered one, got buyer’s remorse, said, “No, I’m going to get an iMac, would you like it?”

John: And he just gave it to you!

Leo: No, I paid for it. It’s exactly what I would have bought, basically the base unit. Marques, did you load it up?

Marques: Basically, yeah. I chose the 84, fully loaded, dual V700 (indistinguishable) terabyte

John: He’s doing video, he needs all the power he can get.

Leo: I’ve got to get me a YouTube channel, my God!

Marques: It’s all about the graphics honestly, CPU and graphics, rendering video and while you’re editing it uses a lot of the GPU

Natali: Especially for K video.

Marques: Especially for K video

Leo: And you can hook up that

John: I bet you that will slow it down!

Leo: Did you look at the other 4K monitors? Lenovo announced an $800 4K monitor and

Marques: Yeah, I’ve looked at a lot of 4K monitors because right now I’m using a 2560 x 1600 display, which I like a lot, but every time I come back from using the Retina MacBook Pro to this, it just looks like I can see pixels and it’s disappointing, so I was scouting basically all the 4K display choices for when the iPro would eventually come because this is actually a DVI display and it doesn’t have HDMI, it doesn’t have a display port and the Mac Pro doesn’t have a DVI port, so I was like, I’m not going to use this display with Apple’s terrible adapter, I’ve tried that before, so I ended up choosing the Asus PQ321Q, which is a 31.5 inch 4K display, 4096 x 2160, which will take a display port actually, so it will go to my display port or Thunderball  on the Mac Pro, which I think is the same panel as the Sharp, which is a 31.5 inch 4K display. I saw Dell was planning on releasing a 28 inch 4K display for under $1000, I think it is somewhere at $800 but it would only support up to a 30 hertz refresh rate and that’s the big thing, the refresh rate that a lot of these support. The Seiki

Leo: Yeah, they’re 30 right? Terrible!

Marques: I had to narrow it down to one that would go at least 60 hertz.

Leo: So does the 321Q do 60 hertz?

Marques: It does 60 hertz through a wield technology called MST or multi stream transport, where there are two controllers in the monitor that will take inputs through the display port cable and essentially it is two 1920 by whatever half the display is, a controller for each half of the panel and through that it will do 60 hertz at 4K.

John: Well, there you go, Leo!

Leo: How much is this? Just out of curiosity, it must be 3 grand!

Marques: It keeps dropping, it has dropped a little more in price than the Sharp but I think I got it right under $3000.

Leo: The Sharp is $3500! The Sharp is as much as the Mac Pro!

John: This is the guy that’s going to put you out of business, Leo!

Leo: I know, that’s why we’re talking to him! Ladies and gentlemen, you have just seen the future and it isn’t me.

John: Well, it used to be, you used to be like this guy! Knowledge, at the right time, you were sharp you were fast, boom, boom, you were ready to rock, and now, nothing!

Leo: Thanks, John, I really appreciate it. (Laughs) This looks pretty nice, now, it’s interesting because you’ve got a 31.5 inch monitor at 4096 x 2160, that means pixels per inch is only 140 pixels per inch. So we’re so used to 300 or even 400 dots per inch on our handsets, of course, you’re at arm’s length, but do you think you’re going to be satisfied with that?

Marques: I think so, I’m currently using a 30 inch and a 20 inch, so a 31.5 inch will not be too much of an adjustment. The only thing is switching from two displays, which I constantly keep divided and organized, to one display, that might be a little weird, so I’m considering a second display, but it could get funky, or janky, having a low…

John: Hire him quick!

Leo: John, stop rubbing it in! I already tried to hire the guy, I can’t, he’s too good! So what you really need, Marques, is two 321Q’s side by side.

John: Yeah, that would be perfect.

Marques: If I like the first one enough, that’s probably going to happen. But I have to see!

Leo: Now, do you…(pauses)

John: All right, onward!

Leo: Onward and upward! Or sideways! You know what, before we go on, we should really take a look at some of the fabulous stuff that happened this week on our own CES coverage.

John: Is this a house ad?

Leo: Oh, baby! Take a look… (video of exciting Twit CES coverage)

(on video) Mike Elgin: Thanks Leo! The most important event this week is the launch of our evening news show called Tech News Tonight which starts Monday at 4 PM Pacific. The Biotech Showcase begins in San Francisco on Monday January 13, Toyko’s Automotive World show starts Wednesday January 15, and the DLD conference, (DLD stands for digital life design)begins Sunday the 19th in Munich, Germany. That’s what coming up! Back to you, Leo.)

Leo: Thank you, Mr. Mike Elgin. Catch TNT every morning, Monday through Friday, 10 AM Pacific, 1 PM Eastern time, 1800 UTC. And Tech News Tonight makes its debut on Monday, that’s 4 PM Pacific, 7 PM Eastern time, 2200 UTC.

Leo: We have a lot of CES stuff, by the way.  You can catch all of Father Robert Ballecer,  Dick DeBartolo, and Scott Wilkinson’s CES coverage right there.  

 There was automotive news at CES too, but the big automotive story was Alan Mulally saying, “No, I’m not going to be CEO at Microsoft.”  That was the drum beat.  Although the way he said it…and the way Wall Street Journal reported it.  I got the strong feeling that he actually did want the job, but eventually decided against it.  The Journal says, “He soured on the Microsoft job in part because of what he perceived to be leaks from Microsoft about the search process.”  Journal also has been saying that nobody wants the job because of the dynamics of the Microsoft board, including the fact that Steve Ballmer and Bill Gates are still on the board, so you’d have the two previous CEOs breathing down your neck.  Nobody wants that.  John, you follow Micro Soft.  Is that credible?  Do you think that Gates and Ballmer would be an inhibition on the next CEO?

John:  Absolutely.   John S Thompson is the guy to watch.  

Leo: He’s one of the directors, the guy doing the CEO search, former IBM-er.

John:  The common thing you see, is these guys do the search…

Leo:  He pulls a Cheney.  

John:  Dick Cheney did it.  “Mr President, we looked everywhere and couldn’t find anybody, so I’m going to nominate myself.  Raaah!”  

Leo: Do you think that’s what Thompson’s going to do?

John:  Yeah.

Leo:  Cuz y’know what? I don’t know who they’re going to find.  

John: Thompson’s perfect.  He’s in the business.  He’s a software guy.  He’s got plenty of creds, better than all these other guys.  He’s just the shoe in.  I don’t why nobody’s talking about him, except me.

Leo: You’re the one who said that he would be the guy.  Well, now that Mulally’s out of the picture, you’re looking at three insiders at least:  Tony Bates who came there with the Skype acquisition…

John:  Nah

Leo:  He’s biz dev guy right now…

John:  Bad

Leo:  Satya Nadella who’s an engineer who’s been around for a while.  And perhaps, and this would be kind of a dark horse, Stephen Elop, who a former Micro Soft-er, went to direct a company, went to Nokia, then came back to MicroSoft with the acquisition…  You’re right.  They got nothin’.

John:  No.  They got John Thompson.

Leo:  Is there anybody outside, some wild card they could bring in , maybe an Eric Schmidt.  I don’t…

John:  This has been done, beaten to death by every analyst in the world, especially in all the stock market rags, and no one’s come up with anybody that makes sense.  I’ve always thought that it was going to be hard to replace Ballmer, because he’s a singular person.  Bring in Gordon Eubanks and have him take over the place.

Leo:  Hahaha  There’s a reference that nobody but you and I get.  Is Eubanks still around?

John: Oh yeah.  Well, he’s not dead, if that’s what you mean.

Leo: Gil Amelio.  Still not working.  He’s out there.

John:  Now that would be good.  

Leo:  Chainsaw Al Dunlap.

John:  John Skully still works for a living.  He’s in Florida now.

Leo:  John Skully would be good.  Carrot top’s another possibility.

Natali:  What about Sheryl Sandberg?  Is she still…

Leo:  Now, THAT’s an interesting… Wait a minute, don’t pooh pooh that.  She’s the COO at Facebook, wrote last year’s big hit business book Lean In…

Natali:  She wants to lean in, she’s got the experience…Go ahead.

Leo:  Her experience though is running a social media company.  It’s not exactly the same as a…

John:  Not hardly.

Natali:  But before that she was at Google.  

Leo:  Another software company.

Natali:  Right, but so’s Microsoft.  Ok, but…

John: No, I appreciate what you’re saying, Natali.  Why don’t we just put Hillary Clinton in the job?

Natali:  Don’t start with her…

Leo: Meg Whitman’s available.

John:  No she’s not.

Leo:  Oh…  She’s running what, EBay?

John:  No, isn’t she still at HP?

Leo:  Oh HP.  I forgot about that.

John:  Uhhhn.

(general laughter)

John:  Give Michael Dell the job.

Natali:  William Taft?

Leo:  William Howard Taft.  

John:  Let’s put him in.

Leo:  All they have to do is increase the size of the executive washroom and they’re (snaps fingers).

John:  No, I’m saying there’s nobody.  You can come up with names left and right, and it’s John Thompson.

Natali:  Ok, John.  Have much time have you spent in head hunting?  We don’t know who’s in the woodwork.  We have this illusion that it has to be a big name, someone we’ve heard of…

Leo:  Right.  I think it kind of does.

Natali:  Steve Jobs groomed Tim Cook and molded him in his likeness.

John:  No one’s done that at Microsoft. They’ve never molded…

Natali:  They’ve not done that, and it’s really bad for their good will, but at the same time, we don’t know what talent lies beneath.  We’re not recruiters.

Leo:  Hey!  Chris Christie.  

Natali:  Queen Latifah!

John:  Ashton Kutcher.  Let’s get down to it here.

Leo:  Now this in an interesting question…

John:  I want a written apology from you, Natali, after John Thompson gets the job.

Natali:  I don’t have to apologize to you.  I’m just saying you’re not out there head hunting.  You don’t know.

John:  We can say that about everything.

Leo:  I think you’re right.  I think you’re absolutely right.  We don’t know.

John:  We’re only on this show to do speculation.

Natali:  To pontificate about that which we do not know about…

Leo:  That’s exactly right.

Natali:  But still…

John:  Do you know…Stop, Natali.  Natali.  Do you know something we don’t know?  Because you sound like you do.

Leo:  She’s been hanging out in the halls of ABC.

Natali:  I’m optimistic…damn it.

John:  You don’t like John Thompson?  That’s an optimistic thing…

Leo:  Can I ask an intelligent question briefly here?  I don’t want to interrupt the flow…derail you.

John:  How’s this going to happen?

Leo:  How important  in a very public company like Microsoft is picking a CEO that is known, that is somebody that people…and I think of Yahoo, which really in a masterstroke said Marissa Mayer.  That was about one of the few things they could do that perhaps change their fortunes, because she was such a public face.  Isn’t it the case that Microsoft needs to pick a name?  It can’t be some gray suited guy from…

John:  This is the question which has the answer within the question.

Leo:  Which is?  Yes?

John:  Yes!

Leo:  Ok, thank you.

Natali:  Ok…And here’s the next step of that question.  Do they have to have star power?

John/Leo:  Yes

Natali:  Because that’s not always the same thing.  A good politician doesn’t always have good speaking abilities, but these days we expect that, and we undercut people who don’t have stage presence.  And so do we want someone who’s going to run around clapping and screening developers or who’s going to do one more thing?  You know, we were a little hard on Marissa Mayer this week because, like, was her speech cool enough?  How much presentation do we really need?  We need execution in that role.

Leo:  When you look at Steve Jobs…when you look at that speech by Steve Jobs…there was a CEO that did it all.  He could help shape a product that really did transform a space.  And then he could market it in a way that no one else could.  

Natali:  He was a salesman.

Leo:  He was a brilliant salesman.  Steve Ballmer was supposedly a salesman.  He didn’t sell very well.  I guess my question is, do they need a front man or do they need a drummer?

Natali: Tim Cook was a business guy.  He went to business school, and don’t you think…my business books 101…say the role of CEO is more of a finance guy, the executor, the make sure our ships run on time, not the sales guys.  So is that role then changing?

Leo:  I guess that’s the question.  Much better put, but that’s the exactly the question I’m asking.  Do you need star power, or do you need a great administrator?  Your COO can be a great administrator, your president…

John: This is a public company.  They’re preoccupied, at least the shareholders are preoccupied with the price of the stock.  It has not done well over the last ten year.  They’re not going to put up with some dullard, as you guys would have it, that would come in and just be a good guy that knows how to dot the I’s.  They have to have somebody that has some cred.  And that’s only John Thompson.

Leo: There aren’t a lot of people out there.

Natali: But what do you mean by cred, though?  Cause you can have a very impressive vitae, but just have no star power or name brand recognition.

John: He’s got name brand recognition.

Leo:  How about General Petraeus?

John:  You may actually…I don’t think it would ever be him…but you may be on the right track .

Leo: Somebody that’s in the military with great logistics background, management background.  

John:  It’s always a possibility.  Except for the girls

Leo:  Colin Powell.

John:  Colin less so.

Leo: He’s a little too old.  

John:  How about Bill Clinton.  Now we’ll get the chat rooms completely off this rails.

Leo:  Ok.  Let’s talk about the key note, Marissa Mayer.  

Marquis:  Bill Cosby.

John: Ditka.

Leo:  Bill Cosby.  I’m wearing a Cosby sweater.  I think they’re fantastic.  Is that why you thought of that, Marques?  Did you go to any of the big speeches, the Key Notes, or did you eschew those, Marques?

Marques:  Press Day I went to three.

Leo:  What did you think?

Marques:  LG, Sharp, and Intel

Leo:  You missed Michael Bay’s Samsung meltdown.

Marques:  Yeah, I couldn’t be at Intel and Samsung because they were back to back, so I chose Intel.  Got out of line for it.  Saw the line to get into Samsung, said no, went back to the hotel and then saw that meltdown and was really disappointed.

Leo:  Never skip a Samsung show.  Something horrible always happens.

John:  I think it was on purpose.

Leo:   It wasn’t a meltdown; it was just a choke.  So Michael Bay comes out, he’s of course the director of the Transformers movies.  He’s standing next to an executive vice president of Samsung.  According to Bay’s blog he skips a big chunk of the introduction and goes right into it.

Bay:  As a director I get to dream for a living.

Leo:  Now, he knew that line, but the prompter is now lost.  And Natali you’ve worked with prompter.  John, you’ve worked with prompter.  If you have a prompter operator who says “I don’t what the hell’s going on” and starts to turn the knob a lot you’re screwed.

John:  It depends.  If you take a little improv once in your life you can just carry on.  I mean, you’re like the perfect example.  I tell people…

Leo:  I hate prompters.

John:  I mean I’ve watched him work with a prompter, and he’ll go off prompter most of the time, and the prompter operator has to be very special…Of course they do…but they manage to worm their way around and they get you back on track, and you come back into it.  But Bay apparently needed this thing to be right on the money.  If this is not a scam…

Leo:  It’s not a scam, although I’ve got to say they got more publicity out of it than they would have otherwise.

John:  That’s what I’m thinking.

Video of Bay/Vice President:  This is such unbelievable action.  What inspires you?  How do you come up with these unbelievable ideas?

Bay: I create visual that are so much beyond everyone’s normal life experiences.  And Hollywood is a place that creates, uh, a viewer escape.  And, uhm, what I try to do…

Leo:  I really feel for the guy.  You can hear his voice breaking up.

Bay:  I try to, try to…

Leo:  When the prompter’s doing that, and if you don’t know what the hell you’re supposed to be saying, you’re pretty much done.  Right?  What are you going to do?

John:  Yeah, you’re done.

Leo:  You’re done.

John:  That’s what he did.  He walked.

Leo:  He’s standing in front of a 105” screen tv.  I hope they give him the tv.  

John:  It’s probably part of the deal.  I’m sure he gets the tv.

Bay:  The type is all off, sorry, but I’ll just wing this.

Leo:  No you won’t.

Bay:  Yah.  We’ll wing it right now.  Uh..

Natali:  Look, all the phones come up.

Leo:  Yeah, did you see that?  Let’s get a shot of this.  It’s not going away.

Natali:  He’s blowin’ it.

Leo:  It’s another Samsung moment.

VP:  How is do you think it’s going to affect the viewers’ experience of movies?

Bay:  Excuse me.  I’m sorry.

Leo:  He just walks off.

Natali:  Tell you what.  I’m going to take The Transformer…here it is…and screw it up like I have been all along, and that’s all you need to know whether the screen is curved or not.

Marques: The guy tried to like prompt him, with a little improve, and what he came up with was “the curve”?

Leo:  The curve…it’s curved…you can see this in front of you right now.  So apparently, I don’t know how much Michael Bay…He was embarrassed.  He apologized in his blog.  I don’t how much he was getting paid, but he is groing around now on tour with this 105” tv and clips of the Transformer series.  So I hear one and one-half million dollars…Does that sound…?

Marques:  Yah.

Leo:   I would’ve done it for the tv, guys, and if the prompter broke I could’ve kept going.  I’m just sayin’.

John:  Sure you could’ve.

Leo:  I wouldn’t have said anything important.

John:  Your name’s not Michael Bay.

Natali:  Right, but Michael Bay is in a sense the CEO of his own brand.  Right, he needs to be able to do this.  He works in the entertainment industry.  What are all the stories of what he made Megan Fox do, and she… Her auditions or something.  He’s supposedly some super…

Leo:  He’s feuding with her.  Megan Fox apologized to Michael Bay.  Wait a minute.

Natali:  This was a couple of years ago…what she had to do for her…

Leo:  It’s been almost four years.

Natali:  audition.  What he made her do?  He’s the kind of guy…

Leo:  She called Michael Bay “Hitler” It’s been almost four years since Steven Spielberg made Michael Bay fire Megan Fox after she called him Hitler, causing her career to basically flat line.

Natali:  She said something like, “Oh yeah.  It’s not like hard to act in a Michael Bay film because it requires so little talent.

Leo:  Boy.  That was the movie “The Maker” the first Transformer, wasn’t it?  I’d never heard of her until I saw her in short shorts messing with Bumble Bee.

Natali:  Don’t you think he should have some kind of screen presence?  He goes out there promoting his stuff all the time.

Leo:  No, he’s a director.

Natali:  No, he was in some kind of commercial where things blew up behind him.   It was car commercial or something.

John:  I don’t know.  I never saw it.

Natali:  Yeah.  It was a big commercial.  “I’m Michael Bay, and this is what I do:  Pow, pow, pow.”

Leo:  The prompter was working during those explosions.  That’s the difference.

Marques:  That might have been better directed than the Samsung event.

Natali:  He sees himself as someone who can be in front of camera, so this is unacceptable.

Leo:  What’s wrong with Samsung?  Contrast what Samsung does with their keynotes.  That stupid Broadway show six months ago.

Natali:  Verizon.  You guys, it was a Verizon commercial.

Leo:  Verizon.  Allright.  Why is it Samsung has such a hard time making these work?

John: I think they’re dumb.

Leo:  Ok, that’s a good reason.  Meanwhile Marissa Meyer does what everybody thought she should do.  She talks mobile, she talks content, and she drags Katie Couric out on stage.

John:  Ah…She was a little weak, don’t you think?  Katie Couric made her look, made Marissa a little  amateurish.  She was slick, she was pro.  She came out

John:  So you watched this?

Leo:  Yeah. You can get a copy of it.

Leo:  I’d like to have seen it.

John:  She was a little nervous with Couric out there.  She looked great out there, though.  I think she represents the company well, and she just looks terrific.  

David Pogue also came out on the stage.  He received the most unfavorable scores of any Yahoo Keynote presenter, according to Dialsmith.  People said he was preachy.  

John:  Pogue rubs a lot of people the wrong way.  

Leo:  He’s – Now I can’t say if he’s the Jerry Lewis or the Benny Hill.

John:  He looks like a tall Chris Pirillo to me.  

Leo:  He’s very Pirillo like.

Pogue:  I thought it would suggest impact and drama and power.  Instead it just kind of looks like the cover of Dianetics.

John:  Not funny.

Leo:  So he is launching, and launched at CES, the new Yahoo TECH page.  Which, this always bothers me, I’m curious what Marques think about this.  Go to, you can see it.  They said this is for people – we’re not going to use big words here – This is for people… we’re going to go accessible.  This is mainstream.

John:  The word is that the last Twit that you guys just slammed this page?  Oh, I see what you’re up to.

Leo:  No, no, no.  I feel like…  I think, Marques, you’ve done very well on You Tube with your page by not talking down to people.  You know what I’m saying?

John:  This is a different audience.  This is for dummies. This is tech for dummies.

Natali:  If it’s for dummies, why cover CES at all?

John:  I agree with you.

Natali:  It’s…The whole page is all about CES.

Leo:  Well, that’s the tech story now.

John: All the news stories have CES crap on them. It’s all generalized stuff.  It’s like, “Oh look what we got.  We got a folding phone.  Oh, Look at the big screen.

Leo:  Now I’ve got to say…

Natali:  Our viewers who watched that on the news are like, yeah I’ve seen this.

Leo:  Right.  Maybe it’s just two different audiences.  The chat room’s saying that David’s interview with John Ledger, CEO of T Mobile, was very good.

John: Could be.

Leo: That’s a big gat, as we say…

John:  I don’t why it would be.

Leo:  Ledger’s pretty much everywhere, isn’t he?

So let’s talk about the cell phone companies.  AT&T announcing that it’s going to do just like T Mobile did and buy you out of your contract.  But also announcing something that I’m a little nervous about:  the idea that companies can pay for your excess bandwidth.

John:  Oh yeah?

Leo:  Essentially, if you ask me, anti-net neutrality.

John:  Probably.  I think net neutrality’s a dead duck.

Leo:  Led-ger.   Pardon me, I mispronounced it.  It’s not Le Jeur.  I like Le Jeur better.  Don’t you think he looks like a Le Jeur?  Hallo.  I am Jean Le Jeur, CEO of Ti Mobul.  Ah hef a bald mullet.

John:  He does?  He has a bald mullet?

Leo: Yeah.  It’s really short in front and long in back.

Marques.  Not so much business.

Leo:  Yah.  Not so much business.  

John:  No business whatsoever.

Leo:  A lot of party.  I’m done slamming people.  

John:  I love it when you slam people, Leo, it’s so rare.

Leo:  Yah, I do it all the time.  T Mobile said it will pay 350 bucks to leave AT&T, Spring, or Verizon.

John:  I like it.

Leo:  To cover your ETF fees.

John:  That’s how much people are worth.

Natali:  But you get no subsidized phone.

Leo:  Right.  You have to buy the phone.

John:  Well, there’s phones out there.

Natali:  So that’s even more expensive.

Leo:  Ahhh—AT&T meanwhile announces sponsored data.  The chairman of the FCC oddly enough came from the cable industry.  Well, I don’t know…  We’ll have to watch this with interest.

John:  Yeah, right.  We’ll keep an eye on it.

Leo:  Tom Wheeler says, “Exactly, I’m keeping a close eye on it.”

Natali:  Leo, why don’t you flesh this out for us?  Because the implications of having a not having a content delivery system means they could charge you not the market price for it now if they want to charge you for data.  So If someone’s using the TWiT app, they’re going to come back around and charge TWiT and there’s no guarantee that they charge you market price.  So this has to be something that makes you very nervous.

Leo:  Well, I’ll give you an example, I mean, since you brought it up, here would be an example which would be a problem for me.  What if Yahoo, which has deep pockets, says to AT&T we’ll cover the cost of any of your customers that watch any of our content?  In fact, something they’re very likely to do, right?  I can’t do that, right.  So when you watch TWiT you’re using up bandwidth, but when you’re watching Yahoo, you’re not.  Is that a fair use of the internet?  Is that how the internet was designed?  Or is that just business?  You could make the case:  Look, AT&T is a business.  It would certainly be bad for me.  It’s a marketplace.  AT&T could, y’know…

Natali:  It edges out the small guy.  That’s not…That’s not a…

Leo: That’s the negative. That’s the negative.

Natali: Right

Leo: And I always felt like the internet should, one of the important, you would say, foundation principals of the internet is, it’s democratic. That it gives everybody, look at Marques, Marques is a great example. Here’s a guy, 20 year old guy who says, “You know what? I’m going to make videos about technology. I’m going to do reviews.” And, because he does such great reviews, he’s built an audience based on free bandwidth from YouTube. And he’s got a business. And that’s what the internet is all about. And what AT&T is saying, well, maybe if you have deep pockets you should be giving us a little bit more. And the rest of you, you know. It’s not... It puts us at a disadvantage. Now Marques you don’t have to worry because you’ve got YouTube on your side. You are on YouTube and, of course, if somebody could pay it’ll be YouTube.

John: This is supposition.

Natali: But what if he doesn’t want to do that? What if he wants to break free from that because he has to share revenue with YouTube?

Leo: Precisely, precisely.

Natali: What if he wants to start his own thing and not share the revenue? He can’t pay the viewers.

Leo: It makes it much harder if Marques wanted to do what we’re doing here. Basically, he would just have to say, “I can’t. I have to stay under the umbrella of some big stakeholder otherwise I can’t do it.”

John: You’d be screwed.

Marques: I’ll be screwed.

Leo: Let’s take a break. I want, we got, we got much more to talk about. Marque Brownlee is here. MKBHD, I’m getting faster. Say it once for us.

Marques: That’s about as fast as I say it. MKBHD


Marques: Yeah

Leo: Yeah, (Laughs) it’s good, I like it! JCD ehh TV (Laughs) John C. Dvorak


Leo: No agenda NASDC

John: Yeah, that’s it.


John: Something like that.

Leo: That’s good. See a plug like that…

John: By the way, talk about a plug like that, @TherealDvorak, I need more twitter followers, they’ve flat lined.

Leo: I find that hard to believe.

John: It’s flat lined!

Leo: That’s…how could that be? By the way, please stop sending me notes that my daughters account was hacked by Russian spammers, I know. I’m trying to convince her.

John: Really?

Leo: Yeah

John: Cool

Leo: I texted her this morning, “Abby, can you change your password?” She said, “Yeah, I’ll get around to it later.” Maybe this is what you need John.

John: What? A Russian spammer?

Leo: To hack your account.

John: Well, I don’t think so.

Leo: Everybody should follow the real Dvorak, In case a Russian spammer hacks his account. Then you’ll be the first to know.

John: If you tell me I probably won’t, you know, fix it.

Leo: @TheRealDvorak. he’s the number one twitter user with the blue and green icon for an avatar.

John: Yes, it’s true. It’s a fact.

Leo: You’re the only one?

John: No, I think there’s others.

Leo: I don’t know. It seems like you own blue and green.

John: Yeah, it looks like it.

Leo: Square circle

Natali: Why don’t you get a proper headshot John?

Leo: Yeah, what is this?

John: That is my head shot.

Natali: That’s not a headshot.

Leo: If you’re a green dot! (chuckles)

Marques: It’s really, really close up!

John:  I had the camera set funny.


John: The white balance is off.

Leo: Yeah, Something’s off.  Natali Morris is also here of…well, what do we say? Of NBC news?

Natali: Of a bunch of different stuff.

Leo: I, I like that. I don’t care if it’s true or not. NBC news, Natali Morris is here.

Natali: That’s not true and don’t get me in trouble.

Leo: Laughs

John: Everybody gets all concerned about these fake monocures.

Leo: Chad, every time Natali comes on I want you to go “(singing) Dum Dum Dum. And now from NBC news, Natali Morris, (Sings)”

Natali: It’s only the 47th hour of the today show.

Leo: From the Queen LaTifa show, Natali Morris. Our show is brought to you by GoToMeeting. It’s a new year, you want to start off right, working smarter, getting more done, easier. GoToMeeting is the way to do it. You can meet and collaborate with clients and collegues anywhere they are. Even if you’re miles apart, it’s as good as meeting in person because you see them in crystal clear HD video. You’re going to see their screen or they’re going to see your screen. If you’ve got a power point presentation, Boom! They can see it AND they can see you. You’ll cut back on time and money wasted on business travel. Don’t get snuck in the snow like everybody did this year at CES. Get it done. From wherever you are! You’ll be more productive, your communications will be better and, GoToMeeting works on not only from your MAC or your PC but many mobile devices. You can actually present from an IPad. It’ll use the IPads microphone, audio and even camera, so you can be anywhere in meetings. Start the New Year right by a free 30 day trial of GoToMeeting. And when I say free, I mean Free. You don’t even need a credit card to get started. Just go to and click the try it free button. And use our name TWiT.  That’s and the promo code TW...I see you’ve got to click that link to go to that little window. TWiT. That’s, Promo code TWiT. Just do that so we get credit, that’s all. You’ve got to try it. Meeting is…Believing. And everybody should also, as long as I’m plugging, follow @therealDvorak.

John: Yes.

Leo: @therealDVORAK.  Apple wins. Uh Motorola sued, saying “Hey, Apple…google has patented something.” I don’t know what. And, 6 patents. They won, initially but on appeal, the patents were on.. they’ve lost. The control and delivery of data due to an application of a wireless device. Federal Circuit court said the commission… they uh, actually, they lost I guess. The ITC was correct to rule that Apple did not use the same technique. Apple did not infringe. I don’t normally report on patent cases but I guess it’s kind of important to keep score.

John: I guess.

Leo: One for Apple

John: Yeah, That’s about right.

Leo: One for Samsung. One for Motorola. So right now, it’s Apple two to nothing. Late in the fourth quarter. Did you see the new Apple Ad? Apparently you can make…Your IPad makes you into a poet. See this looks, this looks like your rig, Marques.

Marques: Heh

Commercial: Here we are. Out in the middle of nowhere and I’ve got.

Leo: Don’t. Please folks, do not do this. Do not put your iPad on a tripod.

Marques: Yeah, Please.

Leo: Please

Commercial: We Read and write poetry books because we are members of the human race. And the human race is filled with passion.

Leo: Is that Robin Williams?

Marques: No, I don’t think so.

Commercial: Let us involve business, engineering. These are noble pursuits and Necessary to sustain life.

Natali: It’s from Dead Poets Society.

Leo: Oh! It is Robin Williams!

Marques: Oh, maybe it is.

Leo: Dead Poets Society.

John: Yeah, you’re right. Either that or it’s a sound alike.

Leo: This is not, here’s to the crazy ones. This is Tim cook’s attempt.

John: It’s terrible.


Commercial: To quote from Whitman, “oh Me, Oh life, of the questions of…”

Leo: This is bad.

John: this is really bad.

Leo: it’s bad. I don’t even know what to think!

Commercial: What good it meant these, Oh life? Answer, will you?

Leo: Don’t take pictures with your IPad. Don’t take pictures with your IPad!

Commercial: The powerful play goes on…

Leo: Does this commercial ever end? It’s just random images with a random quote from a random movie.

Commercial: It goes on. And, you may contribute a verse.

John: This is all just like one giant nonsequeter.  It’s like a joke!

Leo: It’s, It’s the best IPad ad we’ve ever made.

Natali: Well at worst, it’s hyperbole

Leo: At worst?!

Natali: At best.

Leo: Supreme Court will be hearing the Aereo case. I think this is going to be interesting. I don’t know what to think.

John: This is a great, great case.

Leo: I don’t know what to say, if the Supreme Court will get this or not. Aereo is Berry Diller’s company. They invented the idea that you have these little dime size antennas. You put an array of them on a building, in New York, and then you rent them and people can watch local over the air television.

John: I’ve been trying to get an account with them since, I don’t know, when they first came up with the idea. They’re very hard to get accounts with. It’s almost just like they’re just making trouble.

Leo: So somebody brought us Dr. Mom, Lilly Magic…brought us her IPad with Aereo. She’s in the Long Island area. You can get Aereo marques, can’t you?

Marques: I have Aereo.

John: How’d you get Aereo?  I can’t get it.

Leo: He’s in New York! You have to be in the right city.

Jhon: I thought you could get it anywhere!

Leo: No!

John: Technically, you should be able to get it anywhere!

Leo: No! That’s one of the ways to get around this. You have to be in a local city where those antennas are. Right Marques?

Marques: Yeah, I’m close enough and every time I go in, it’s and I’m in the NYC section.

Leo: How does it work?

Marques: Uh, it’s pretty basic. I just take it… there’s a list of 40 channels or so, and you can record some channels. I haven’t used it for all that many things. I usually just watch a game or two or something when people are telling me to watch something. But I have it so...Its convenient to have because I don’t pay for TV otherwise.

Leo :I was going to say, are you a cord cutter? So you are.

 Marques: I am yeah. I actually never had a cord to cut in the first place.

John: Which is pretty common.

Leo: Growing up did you have TV...did you have cable or antenna?

Marques: We had it, but never really watched anything.

Leo: Mom and Dad, there’s the secret.

John: See another reason why...this is a guy who is very productive. He doesn’t play video games all day and he doesn’t watch idiotic television.

Leo: Marques, do you watch video games?

Marques: The first console I owned was the PS4 and I’m testing, “testing” the PS4 and the Xbox 1 for reviews. So I, technically, am now playing video games as I’m reviewing these but…

Leo: So you never played video games as a kid?

Marques: Never!

Leo: See, again, freak of nature.

Marques: See, I missed out on some really intense conversations, but other than that I don’t think I missed out on much. People argued all day.

Leo: Were you homeschooled? No, you went to Colombia.

Marques: Right.

Leo: Were you not an outcast?

Marques: You could say that. I mean every time my teammates, who’d talk about, you know, “remember this great game on this great old console?” Or, it’d be revisiting playing them, so they’d have an Nintendo 64 and they’d play Mario or play Mario card or something. So I’d watch because I don’t know how to play. But any of the games I play now would be, I guess… I guess PCgaming, in the little bit of it that I did would count because I’ve played the racing simulators. I’ve played Need for Speed on Android. I’ve played a couple of driving games and stuff like that.

Leo: Don’t you love this guy?

John: I’m telling you Leo. You should take some hints from him because you are always playing games, wasting your time.

Leo: Nonstop

John: It’s unbelievable to me how you even have a studio running.

Leo: Nonstop

John: It’s true .(chuckles) I’m surprised you have time to do this show.

Leo: So the Supreme Court is hearing this Aereo case, the justice has agreed on Friday. It’s ABC, Disney, I think CBS is among the plantiffs. And your company, Natali, NBC. I’m sorry. I won’t do that anymore. Natali does not work for NBC.

Natali: On behalf on NBC let me just say…

Leo: It’s hard not to though.

John: You’re going to get her in trouble.

Leo: I don’t want to get her in trouble. So, no Natali does not speak for NBC. But the big networks are suing. They say, “We’re gratified that the high court is taking the case.” Aereo, Aereo unsized kick and it worked.

Leo: I loved that, there was one like yesterday to

John: I know and… anyway go on

Leo: Aereo said, “It was hoped that our case would be decided on a merit and not through a wasteful war of attrition. We look forward to…” Well a war of attrition is almost over, you know. There’s nowhere to go after the Supreme Court we have every confidence the Supreme Court will validate, and preserve a consumers right to access local, over the air television, with an individual antenna. AKA personal recording with a DVR and, watch that recording on a device of their choice. That’s Aereos position.

John: Yeah. It’s an obvious scam! I like it.

Leo: They do the recording for you, they say, “No, the users have control over the system so the DVR feature is theirs, not ours.” Umm. I have to say, if the Supreme Court decides against Aereo, it is a miscarriage of justice. On the other hand, if they, if they do decide in favor of Aereo, ABC, NBC, CBS and FOX are all going to pull off their live, over the air, free broadcasts.

John: That’s idiotic.

Leo: They’re going to say “Well fine.”

John: That’s a ridiculous situation

Leo: That’s what they said they were going to do

John: This reminds me of the national championship college football game that was only on ESPN. What a scandal that is, that nobody cares! It should have been on broadcast television! Broadcast television is a good thing.

Leo: It’s a dying thing

John: No its not!

Leo: Now, it’s interesting because CBS, FOX and NBC all three, I think streamed the playoffs on various restrictions, and they apparently plan to stream the Superbowl. I don’t know if… I think some of them… I think it’s CBS who had to demonstrate that you had a cable.

John: Right, that’s very common with a lot of this, but they can’t pull OTA off because of this idea. By the way, someone in the chat room asked what difference does it make if you get OTA? Why would you use one of their antennas? You can go to radio shack and get an antenna. This is because, that’s not the scheme, the scheme is...yes, first we get New York and then we roll it out Nationwide. So I am in Berkley and I can get this system and watch New York television instead of having local cable or whatever. I mean, that’s what the long term plan obviously is.

Leo: Marques, correct me if I’m wrong, but you can take your iPad with you in Vegas and watch your local television

Marques: Yes, and on my android phone as well, I can watch TV on my phone. Yeah.

Leo: I think that’s awesome. What do you think? Is that a… a…

Marques: It’s useful in a pinch. Like someone will ask, “Hey is the game on?” Like the other day, I had… so  I also have chrome cast on this TV over here, so I don’t have anything except for chrome cast and two gaming councils plugged into that TV. So we were gaming and someone asked, “Hey, when this is over can we watch the game?” So I said, “I’ll check.” So, while the game was playing, I walked over to this room, opened up Aereo, found the game on a channel, broadcasted it over the TV, and was watching it on a 15 inch TV over chrome cast without any cable bills. So, It’s useful.

Leo: So I’m trying to figure out… Let me see right now I can watch live, the Chargers and Broncos games going on right now. I’m going to violate every precet

Natali: Ohh don’t do that!

Leo: Uh oh, uh oh of broadcast television.

John: Because you need special written permission

Natali: Fees are high for that!

Leo: It is my contention this is fair use as part of coverage of a news story, in which we are discussing the fact that you can watch the NFL on the stream. I’m just seeing if I can. I have a 30 second preview preroll Verizon ad it looks like.

Natali:30 seconds is too long

John: Yeah, this is taking forever.

Leo: Oh I’m sorry, it was Exxon. Don’t you find they all blur together.

All: There’s the game. There you go.

Natali: Oh yeah, theres the game

Leo: I didn’t have to say I have a cable contract. I didn’t have to do anything. It’s not very high quality.

John: Well no but you can up that.

Leo: Let me see if I can boost that up. Oh you can set the bit rate as high as you want, up to one point two megabytes, let’s see.

Leo: Boy that looks good!

John: Well it doesn’t look good at all, but at least you can watch.

Leo: Oh, it’s getting better now, I’m upping the bitrate.

Marques: I think after while it figures out your connection and then it can handle it.

Leo: Right, Full screen, there you go. You gotta figure the companies are looking at Aereo saying, “we gotta do something.”

John: Now some people in the chat room have defended themselves for using Aereo, saying, “Look, I live behind a hill, my antenna doesn’t work.”

Leo: Aereo is great. You’re renting an antenna in a good location.

John: Yeah.

Leo: That’s’ al.l If the court rules against Aereo, they’re stupid.

John: They’ll have some rational I’m sure, they’re not just going to slam the hammer down on them.

Leo:  Alright. What do you think, anybody want to argue in favor of the networks? On this?

John: No one is going to do that.

Natali: Please!

Leo: I guess not on this network. (Laughs) I just think it’s interesting that companies that make, that give free broadcasts with ads. The ads are not gone by the way, they’re still there.

John: Yeah, everything is there.

Leo: This is their economical model, but they’re upset now because they’ve been able to double dip for so long. By charging cable companies for access to you.

John: Right.

Leo: So they’re mad.

John: Although that’s been flipped. Aren’t the cable companies now charging them to be on the cable? Isn’t that the way it’s working now? Because it did flip at some point.

Leo: No, the cable companies pay CBS for their content. Do they not?

John: I thought C..oh I think they do now, but originally CBS… I don’t know.

Leo: CBS well…

John: If you think about it, it could go either way!

Leo:  here’s how it works with tech TV.

John: Well they were bribing people.

Leo: We were basically bribing people. We wanted to get on lots of cable channels, right?

John: Right.

Leo: So you go with a bag of money, you say this is co-market dollars.

John: Yeah co-markets

Leo: Co-market back of dollars, but eventually it flips and they start paying you 5 cents a subscriber If you’re pockets are…. like ESPN has them over a barrel.

Leo: It is also another anniversary, a sad one. We’re going to talk about the anniversary of the death of Aaron Schwartz coming soon and how the internet is going to respond because they’re, and get ready because it’s another big internet disruption coming up. Our show today brought to you by a great resource for anybody who needs royalty free images, pictures, vectors, video clips, illustrations. 30 million, actually the total is thirty two million five hundred thirty eight, and 948 royalty free stock images. They added over 200,000 this week alone. Most of the images are by professionals.  Photographers and artists, they’re of course, each reviewed individually for content and quality. You’re going to have a huge selection. They also have footage of 1.5 million royalty free stock videos. Great stuff too! You know, some of the stuff we’ve been using, this is a snowfall loop that alpha channels so you can use this to add snow markers to your CES coverages, you know.  Bad idea. But you could. You could put Marques in a snow-globe and let the snow just fall down on top of him. (Laughs.) I love Shutterstock. One of the best things about Shutterstock is their search engine and I encourage you to sign up for a free account, you don’t have to give any information or credit cards, just sign up for the account because then you can save your searches in your own personal light box. Searches are by noun but also by adjective so I could search for football and get a lot of football stuff.  But I could also search for angry football and then I would get angry footballs!  

John:  I would like to see this!

Leo:  Would you like to see an angry football?  If you haven’t  seen their iPad app it’s - oh look, there is nothing more angry than that guy!  I’d be angry for being painted the Italian flag colors too.

John:  You should see this guy with all these face paints.  

Leo:  Yeah, well it’s different nationalities, Dude.

John:  Dude?  Did you become Brian Brushwood?

Leo:  Dude!  Dude!  Oh, that’s angry.

John:  Yeah, that’s angry.

Leo:  Angry football gorilla.

John:  Yeah, okay.  You made your point.

Leo:   You see, you see!  Shutterstock.  I love Shutterstock.  You will too.  Sign up for the free accounts.  You can lightbox it.  You can also narrow down images.  There’s actual angry footballs!  You can narrow it down by using their color picker to give you exactly the shades you’re looking for.  I only want red angry footballs.  And then you can do that.  There aren’t any red angry footballs.  At least not with the color FF245D.  I was probably too specific in the angry football color.  If you would like to try this for free you can.  It’s easy to set up an account.  But when you decide to buy images, they sell them as packages but also subscriptions.  We have the 25 image a day subscription; great for publications.  Use our offer code TWIT 114 and you’ll get 25% off your subscription.  That is a very good deal.  TWIT 114 for 25% off.  She’s angry because she’s trying to blow the whistle and nobody is paying any attention to her.  Look at this football - its angry because he just got through the goal post and now nobody likes him.

John:  I like the way you create stories where none exist.

Leo:  That’s exactly it!  It’s inspiration.  I collect these images and I get inspirited!

Leo: Sad Anniversary but I’m glad to see that there’s a lot of attention.  Aaron Swartz passed away - committed suicide about a year ago.  A year ago Saturday.  He was facing federal hacking charges - really serious charges for something that was absolutely not hacking.  And Congress is now saying “we want to know more about this aggressive prosecution".  John Cornyn of Texas, Ron Wyden of Oregon, Jeff Flake of Arizona, US Representatives Darrell Issa of California., Jim Sesenbrenner of Wisconsin, Alan Grayson of Florida, Zoe Lofgren of California and Jared Polis of Colorado sent Eric Holder, the Attorney General, a letter asking for more information about that prosecution.  What the hell happened.  Good.   Good.  They should.  Yesterday was the Anniversary.  And the internet is going to respond next month right?  With another one of these internet black-out kind of things.  I’m trying to find this news story.  There’s also a documentary showing at SunDance; The Internets Own Boy.  Anonymous commemorated it by hacking MIT.  Remember it was also MIT that aggressively pursued Aaron.  

John:  Right.  Which is disgusting.  

Leo:  Yeah.  The Anonymous group said remember the day we fight back - this is February 11 -  the day we fight back against mass surveillance using Aaron as inspiration to protest what the NSA has been doing to spy on us.  This is kind of a sequel EFF is working with them on this.  A sequel to the SOPA and PIPA fight of 2012.  So add a banner, tell the world you’re taking part.  You get to a point where you get a little fatigue on these things.  They have a little bit of less impact and yet I think it is probably a good idea for this citizens of the internet to stand up and say this isn’t good.  This isn’t good.  In Aaron’s honor.  So we’ll talk more about that as we approach February 11th.  

Natali:  Such a sad story and I think from Eric Holder there’s been no response or from the Attorney General’s office.

Leo:  Of course not.  What are they going to say?   Yeah, we’re sorry.  Their going to say the same thing they’ve been saying all along; this is appropriate behavior.

John: We do what we do.  

Leo:  We do what we do.  You break the law expect to get prosecuted.   Kanye does not like Coinye.  I want to clear this up.  We talked about this Bitcoin derivative called Coinye.

John:  Yeah?

Leo:  Named Coinye after Kanye West.

John:  Okay.  

Leo:  Turns out wasn’t Kanye’s idea.  

John:  I wouldn’t think so.  

Leo:  And his lawyers have filed cease and desist to…

John:  To who?

Leo:  To the anonymous internet coders behind Coinye West.  Come on man!!

John:  This is a publicity stunt!  This guy’s great at that!

Leo:  No I think he has to protect his trademark right?

John:  Its not a trademark. Coinye.

Leo:  No, West’s lawyers say it is trademark infringement.

John:  Anyone that uses ‘ye’ I guess, at the end of any word?

Natali:  So cancel Twit-ye.

Leo:  No more Twit-ye.  We thought this was a good idea.  So, this is like a doge coin - another coin cryptocurrency.

John:  There’s quite a few of them actually.

Leo:  There’s basically an infinite number of these now.  Its based on scrypt right?  Another kind of problem. Its like coins problem solving technology.  Same idea though.  I think Kanye is worried that people think he’s setting up his own currency.  

Natali:  But he’s such an ego maniac that we wouldn’t be surprised by that kind of news.

John:  Yes exactly.

Leo:  “Excuse me, excuse me.  Its great but I just want to tell you I’m not setting up my own currency.”  I don’t know.  “I want to let you finish.”  That name is long gone.  I’m sorry I brought that back.  

John:  Nobody gets it.  

Leo:  There’s nothing deader than a dead internet name is there?

Marquis:  We should bring that back.

Leo:  You’re right.  We should bring that back.  “I’m going to let you finish, but…”

Marquis:  Yeah! It’s simple.  

Leo:  It’s good.

Marquis:  I like it!  It rolls off the tongue.

Leo:  Big, big news.  Intel, which bought McAfee Security for over a billion dollars from John McAfee, is finally decided to drop the name McAfee.  Finally John McAfee is enough of an embarrassment that Intel says…

John:  What are they going to call it?

Leo:  They’re going to call it Intel Security Suite or something like that.

Natali:  John McAfee with two middle fingers blazing in the air says “Good”!

Leo:  He says “good”!  It’ll be Intel Security.  Bryan Krzanich mentioned this at the CES keynote.  In fact there was that video that McAfee did where he showed how to uninstall the antivirus with the sledge hammer.  And there was some bath salt consumption involved.  He says quote;  “I am now everlastingly grateful to Intel for freeing me from this terrible association with the worst software on the planet”.  

John:  I think they still own his name though, so I don’t think he can start McAfee anything, to be honest about it.  Its a real problem when you sell your name.  You lose control of your own name.

Leo:  Did I say a billion dollars?  

Natali:  He can’t even come back as McAfee-ye!

Leo:  McAfee-ye!  Guess how much Intel paid for McAfee?  

John:  I don’t know.  2.1?

Leo:  7.6 billion dollars.

John:  Well they’ve got money to burn then.

Leo:  For the worst software.  Is there anybody that loves McAfee software?

John:  First thing you do is you get rid of it.

Leo:  First thing you do.  

John:  What are you using for an anti-virus on a PC?

Leo:  Nothing.

Marques:  The brain.

Leo:  The brain!  Thank you!  

Natali:  Yeah!

Leo:  Thank you Marques!  There are many people without brains who should be using an anti-virus.

John:  I use Avast.

Leo:  You used to like Kapersky.

John:  I did.  

Leo:  Eset was a long time sponsor and I really do like Eset’s stuff.

John:  I like Avast.  Its free.

Leo:  Should that be their criterion though, for the software that is supposed to protect you?  

John:  It is for me.  I’m not making any money here - so I’ve got to get free.  I’m starving to death.

Natali:  Are you the one who can’t help yourself but click on the “win a free ipad” banner that looks nefarious?  

John:  I don’t do that.  

Natali:  I mean that’s really the reason you need this kind of stuff.

Leo:  So Marques are you a Windows guy?

Marquis:  I use OS10.

John:  See you guys are a bunch of Mac users.  I’m going to Linux but Linux is still not cutting it.  

Leo:  You have Windows 8?

John:  Yeah.

Leo:  How do you like it?

John:  I don’t care for it but it works fine with…

Leo:  It comes with a built in antivirus so you don’t have to add an anti-virus.  

John:  Yeah, I’m sure it works fine.  I put on the classic shell and its okay.  

Leo:  Classic shell so you have a start menu and all that.

John:  Yeah, that little menu is handy.  Without the menu you’re poking too much.

Leo:  Another thing Intel announced at the CES and it kind of got buried, which is too bad, is a computer the size of an SD card.  Edison.  I think that’s really neat and its essentially based on  their 22 nanometer technology thats essentially a Linux computer, built in wifi and bluetooth on a chip the size of an SD card.  

John:  Isn’t that great?  

Leo:  Its amazing.  

John:  What about the Nuc?  

Leo:  Yeah they were really promoting the Nuc for awhile.

John:  I got one.

Leo:  You have one?  N-U-K.

John:  Its spelled N-U-C.

Leo:  Its N-U-C?  I’m sorry I was confusing it with the three stooges!  You’re right.  It’s N-U-C.  The new ultra small computer.  So you have one of these little do-hickey’s?

John:  Yeah.

Leo: Its shaped like a puck.  

John:  The Nuc puck.  Its very small.  You can use it for all kinds of things.  The thing is that nobody talks about it.  Intel’s - I don’t know why they don’t give it more publicity.  They spend 7 billion dollars for McAfee and they spend zero marketing dollars on the Nuc.

Leo:  But they don’t sell the Nuc.  They’re just trying to get other people to make Nucs.

John:  They sell it.  I bought mine in an Intel box.

Leo:  Intel sells the Nuc? No no no.  That’s a reference Nuc you have.

John:  It might be a reference Nuc.

Leo:  Its entirely a reference Nuc.

John:  Well maybe it is a reference Nuc.

Leo:  They have a kit.

John:  There it is - look right there they sell it on their website.

Leo:  Where?

John:  Well you’re looking at it.

Leo:  Where does it say for sale here?

John:  Well go up to the top.  There it is.

Leo:  Where’s the buy it now button?  There’s no buy it now button.

Natali:   Lets look for it on Amazon.

Leo:  Yeah.  Amazon Nuc!  

John:  They might have it.  

Leo:  Oh look, they do sell it directly.  

John:  Yeah.  There you go.

Leo:  Okay.  I stand corrected.  Have you done a review of the Nuc, Marques?

Marques:  No

John:  No.  He’s never heard of it because he’s a MAC guy.

Marquis:  I use Windows on my MacBook Pro.  

Leo:  There you go.  That’s the way to do it.  

John:  You get a Nuc, you put one of the Linux distros on there and then you put a disk on there and put a mythTV and put on there and the next thing you know you’ve got a nice little home entertainment system for the $299 or whatever it costs.  

Natali:  Oh, it’s an acronym for Next Unit of Computing.

Leo:  That’s right.  

John:  Chat room says that Intel is the only one making the Nuc.

Leo:  I’m sure that wasn’t the plan when they first started.

John:  You don’t know that.

Leo:  I’m sure they wanted other people to make Nucs..  

Natali:  Yes, you can get it on Amazon too.

Leo:  Yeah.  Thank you Intel.  I want to buy an Edison.  They are also having a competition called the Make It Wearable competition.  1.3 million dollars in prizes for people that build the Edisons into things like the Mimo.

Natali:  Yeah, the baby killing Onesie.  

John:  The baby killer.

Leo:  Edison will be available sometime mid year.  Galaxy S5.  Are you excited?  What’s your daily driver Marques?

Marques:  Right now, its the Nexus 5.  

Leo:  Oh yeah you mentioned that.  Thats a nice one.

Marques:  Yeah.

Leo:  Are you going to look at the Galaxy S5?  Did you skip the S4?

Marques:  I used the S4 for a little bit and then I used the Google eVision S4 a little after that because I’m not a fan of touch whiz.  In fact I still I have my Note 3 and as soon as an engine mod comes out for a Note 3 or a similar ASP based Rom I will probably switch to the Note 3.

Leo:  So I routed this Note 3 and it was easy to route and then I couldn’t find any Rom - this is the ATT Note 3 and I couldn’t find any good Roms for it.

Marques:  I’m also on the ATT Note 3 and I’m also still looking.

Leo:  Still waiting for CM or something?

Marques:  Yeah.

John:  Well looks like the Denver team won so they have to take on Brady again and Brady keeps beating Peyton?  

Leo:  That’ll be fun - Brady and Peyton; the battle of the best Quarterbacks in the league.  Some say best Quarterbacks ever.  Because if you don’t have hyperbole, it aint TV.  

John:  Thats true.  You gotta yell once in a while too.

Leo:  Alright.  Galaxy S5 - going once, going twice.  They’ll announce it at Mobile World Congress in Barcelona in April.   Any excuse to go to Barcelona if you ask me.  

John:  Its a great place.

Leo:  I love Barcelona.  It’ll have a fingerprint reader because Apple has one.  

John:  You know its typical of these guys.

Leo:  Somebody had an Iris reader.  A 300 dollar Iris reader.

John:  You don’t want to stick a laser in your eye.

Leo:  And I imagine that will be more stupid than the Note.  The Note has a golf mode camera.  

John:  How does that work?

Leo:  You take a picture of your swing.  

John:  How do you do this?

Leo:  You go into the camera and you go to golf mode.  Its crazy.  I can’t wait to get rid of this stuff.  

John:  Why is there a naked picture of Lisa on there?  

Leo:  I don’t know, it just makes me feel at home.  She’s not naked.  She's fully dressed.

John:  I’m just kidding.

Leo:  Yeah, but people don’t think you're kidding and that’s the problem.

John:  They are fools.

Leo:  Samsung also says we want to do a wrap around display on the next Note.  You can’t really make it any bigger so now they want to do a three sided display.  So that images could be read from an angle.  I’m not making this up.  They did ship 91 million smart phones in the last quarter so they’re doing something right.  So now I can’t even launch the camera; its crashing on me.  

John:  Its horrible.

Leo:  So disappointing - great hardware, right Marques?  You want to use this hardware.

Marques:  I love the huge battery, the huge display, the internals are awesome but then the software….

Leo:  Its worse than… they need a de-crappifier.  I wanted wireless charging; it wasn’t very expensive, just 5 or 6 bucks.  Just this little thing - they have contacts on the Note 3 for a wireless charging thing.  

John:  That’s kind of cool.

Leo:  Have you done that Marques?  

Marques:  I have one in my pocket.

Leo:  It’s in your pocket?

Marques:  The Nexus 5 is charging so I don’t need that.

John:  So there’s no back to the thing?

Leo:  They sell this case.  You could have a regular back with leather or you could have this display back.  See one of the things on the Galaxy S4 is that they sense this thing closed and then you can have a special display.  See how well that’s working?

John:  So you have Brian Brushwood’s birthday as one of your key things on your calendar?   What’s going on with you and him?

Leo:  Me and Brian are like that.  I can’t wait for a wrap around display.  I want to use this cell phone.  It gives me full 180 degrees.

John:  I think you’d be looking good walking down the street.

Leo:  People will be walking into trees even more. started selling with Bitcoin just a couple of days ago.  Their first day, 780 orders, 124,000 dollars.  

John:  I find that hard to believe.

Leo:  You know the mistake they are making?  Maybe you’ll agree or maybe you’ll disagree.  They’re doing this through Coinbase, they immediately cash it in for American dollars.  

John:  Oh, okay.

Leo:  Hold that Bitcoin.  

John:  Not necessarily.

Leo:  Hold that Bitcoin.  Hold that Bitcoin.  Why not?  

John:  Because its going to be worth what its worth which is about forty five cents.

Leo:  But what if its worth about forty thousand dollars?

John:  Could happen.

Leo:  That’s what the Winklevii  think.

John:  Thats what Max Keiser thinks.

Leo:  Who is Max Keiser?

John:  Max Keiser thinks its going to be worth 100,000 dollars.  Max Keiser’s the guy who invented the Bitcoin as far as I can tell.

Leo:  You think he’s Satoshi Nakamoto?

John:  Yeah, because he’s the one who did that Hollywood thing - he knows how to do these kinds of things.  

Leo:  So he’s hoping its worth 100,000 coin because he’s probably got billions and billions…

John:  I have no idea.  All I know is he knows this is one of his core competencies.  

Leo:  He’s not smart enough.  He’s a broadcaster.  it says right there.  That means he’s not smart enough.

John:  Well, he’s only a broadcaster to promote Bitcoin.  He’s not a real broadcaster.  

Leo:  He’s on Russian State Media.  

John:  He’s on RT - that’s not broadcasting.

Leo:  But he was born in New York state - New Rochelle.  So he’s not a Russian.  

John: No. I’m just saying, nobody knows who did it, and this Yaka Moto guy or whatever his name is just a lot of people suspect Kaiser behind it.

Leo: Kaiser did the Hollywood Stock exchange.

John: Yeah, that's it. He knows how to do these sorts of things this is one of his things.

Leo: That was kind of a cool idea.

John: Until they busted him!

Leo: Well that! There is that! Do you know about You must know about

John: I know about It’s some website, you should go to it and check it out. It is a square space site.

Leo: Let’s go to it and do an experiment. You cannot bring a square space site down. I want everybody listening right now to go to We’re all going to go there at once and going to bring the site to its knees. That will be the end of this commercial and this relationship with

John: It didn’t happen!

Leo Well, it hasn’t happened yet, let’s refresh. That’s the other thing, when you go there just refresh refresh hit it hard refresh we want to D Doss the site completely come on everybody let’s break this. You can’t! You know what’s happening right now at squarespace headquarters? Voom! Some engineer is peeing in his pants! But then, Voom! Well no, they don’t have to do anything actually, they’re home watching the game because square space uses its hosting plus software, it’s tightly integrated, it’s a Java thing, the front end is JavaScript, they are Java servers, they’re all virtualized so if something happens like everybody, nobody understands, if all of a sudden 20,000 people suddenly go to and they hit it and they hit it, automatically the virtual stuff kicks in and you cannot bring it down! You’ve even got media on here! Everybody go to and start playing the MP3 file and let’s bring this thing down. It can't be done. (new podcast audio starts) do you have a professional announcer on that show?

John: Yes, this show is a slick, professionally produced show.

Leo: That sounds good!

John: Of course it does!

Leo: It sounds really good, think we could get an award or something! He doesn’t say with $60,000 worth of airplanes strapped to my butt anymore, does he?

John: I never heard him say that ever.

Lady: That was on the last show. That was on Daily Source Code.

John: That was years ago.

Leo: We need a professional announcer.

John: You've got one – That TWIT opening you guys do, with the girl (whoever she is) and you....Netcasts you trust from people you love.

Leo: Okay how many clubs do you have? You have the 582 club and the 583 club?

John: The next show would be the 583 club.

Leo: Oh I see, it's episode 582 or 583. I get it.

John: Yes

Leo: You've done that many?

John: Yes we're cranking them out.

Leo: That's more than us.

John: We do a lot of work to make that show work.

Leo: So we've been trying this whole time as we've been jawboning trying to bring down no and we can't do it because it's a square space site.

Natali: My site is on square space too.

Leo: You too?

Natali: Yes

Leo: Let's all bring Natali's site down.

John: It won't work.

Natali: It's

Leo: n-a-t-a-l-i-m-o-r-r-i-s .com and boom you can't bring it down, you cannot bring it down. So ladies and gentlemen you may wonder why such intelligent people as Natali Morris and John C Dvorak and yes even Twit, our inside twit blog is running on square space, why we use square space because it's the best hosting, plus the best software, it's mobile responsive, it starts at eight dollars a month. It's a steal. If you want to do commerce, 24 bucks a month when you buy the annual plan. It's mobile ready, in fact the new square space metric app – this is brand new for iPhone and iPad, lets you check site stats like right there. So you, Natali, or you, John, could go to your mobile metric site or page rather and know what page usage you had and unique visitors, social media – you could see the spike when we mention it, BOOM like that and then it goes down. With the blog app you can make text updates, tap and drag images to change layout, monitor comments on the go. It is sweet and all hosting is included all software is included. I want you to try it free. Go to right now and click the try it button and you get a chance to play with it and see how it really works for you. You can even import your existing blog. They have importers for all the blog api's. Click the get started button and you can start using it right away. No credit card needed, you don't have to give them any information. After 2 weeks you say this is – this is the right place, try all the templates, that's the nice thing too once you get the content in there – See Marques you should use Marquee (template). After you get all the content in and then you say I don't want that – so you want to change, so you click a button, BOOM you've changed. When you decide to sign up, I know you will, do TWIT1 as the offer code, because we're in January you get 10% off. Still can't bring the sites down, we're trying.

Leo: Sad, Barnes and Noble, their struggling Nook unit....I want to have a struggling Nook unit. The struggling Nook unit sales down 60% over the holiday season.

John: If you get a Kindle Paperwhite....

Leo: You'll never go Nook.

John: What a great product.

Leo: Yeah I agree, they just don't have a chance. Just some quickies we're going to get before we wrap this thing up. Have you read the new Jeff Bezos book The Everything Store by Brad Stone? That's good.

John: I won't read that.

Leo: What? Why not?

John: I don't have time.

Leo: Oh you should. It's really interesting.

Natali: Is that good? What are some of the juicy nuggets?

Leo: I think it's a good business book. I mean it's not intended to be a business book. You know it's one of those “behind the scenes thing”.  Brad Stone is....

Natali: It's a biography right?

Leo: Yes sort of. Not exactly a biography. It's the story of Amazon, but Jeff Bezos is very interesting as a business book. It's very fascinating. To hear both what he did right and what he did wrong, and how he corrected the stuff when he did it wrong. Yeah it's just a great read. And then the next one I want to read, well I've got the next book, Twitter book, “Hatching Twitter”, that's on the list. And Fred Vogelstein, I want to read his book “Dog Fight”, which is about Google VS Apple. Marques you don't have time to read any of this probably as a student.

Marques: Oh I've got a bunch of text books to read so...

John: What are you studying? I know you're studying business but what area?

Marques: Information systems and marketing.

John: M.I.S?

Marques: Yes

John: So is that like, but you want to be a broadcaster right? I mean you'd be crazy if you don't pursue this.

Marques: It would be good to have an M.I.S background, sort of blanket knowledge, along with the whole business part.

John: Do you want to start your own company? Is that kind of what you're thinking?

Marques: That's a potential thing, I've considered it obviously but no idea yet.

Leo: He's going to go right after you Leo. With 4K.

John: That's a terrible idea. Don't do it Marques!

Natali: Soon he'll be hiring you. Just send him your resume.

John: Speaking of 4K, Samsung,I think one of the biggest stories of CES, wasn't it CES, it was in Australia. Samsung's giving an interview to an Australian and they say “Oh by the way, (this is vice president Philip Newton) Oh by the way, yeah we can make 4 layer Blu-ray that have 4K capability.

Leo: 4 layer, WOW.

John: Yeah, Oh by the way! He says, by the end of the year. He also says it will not be a problem for Samsung to make players that can read...

Leo: Well I hope so! Why make the disc if you can't make the players.

John: I would think....I can see that! So you're going to make the discs mate, are you going to make the players? Yes

Natali: Oh we have to do that too?

John: No we're just going to make the discs. Targeted mits? Yeah, It wasn't 40 million, it was oh 70 million

Leo: It was 110.

John: Oh, is it up again?

Leo: It was 110 the last time I looked.

John: Pretty much everybody in the world's credit card information was leaked by this target breech.

Leo: It's very suspicious.

John: Home addresses, email addresses and phone numbers along with credit card numbers and encrypted pins.

Leo: And then Neiman Marques got hit too, same thing.

John: All mentioned after Christmas of course. So it's 40 million plus 70 million.

Natali: Because they say it's not immediately clear how many overlapped. It could be accumulative, it could be maybe -

John: It could be 99 million for all we know. A third of the population.

Natali: Worst case scenario, 70.

 John: No, it could be more!

Natali: Worst case.

John: Beats, I didn't mention beats!

Leo: The one thing it tells me is that a lot of people shop at Target.

John: Yes, that's just from Black Friday through December 27th That's just in one month.

Natali: Why is that news to you? You don't go to Target?

John: Sorry?

Natali: Why is that news to you, that a lot of people shop at Target?

Leo: I didn't know that a third of the public shopped at Target. That seems like a lot.

John: Have you ever shopped at Target?

Leo: Yes I shop at target. I didn't shop during that period by the way.

John: Marques where do you get your giant thoughts? Yeah, this is a Target shirt.

John: And by the way! Target's a great place. Tarjet as we call it, but I did not shop between Black Friday because I called my bank....(I have a great bank) and he let me look. He said ah there's no credit card activity at Target. It's a great bank.

Leo: So you just call them up and say Hey dude am I, have I been -

John: Is there any possibility and he said no, there's no possibility.

Leo: That's such a good bank, I love that.

John: It's the mechanics bank.

Leo: Oh yeah, it's a big San Francisco bank.

Natali: I have a Target credit card.

Leo: So you're the one that's really in trouble now.

Natali: Right, I have their card.

Leo: So even if you didn't use it you're probably screwed. Do you have a Target club card?

Natali: You get 5% off when you use that card, that's why.

John: I never use those cards. The information goes straight to the insurance company, they jack your prices up and the whole thing is a scam.

Natali: Yeah but when you've got babies and you're buying those little squeezy pouches of baby food sauce that they down and baby wipes.

Leo: Stay away from those Gogurts. Basically Gogurts is sugar with a little thin protein coating.

Natali: Now Leo, do you think that I'm the kind of mom that would buy gogurts?

Leo: No! You are not a Gogurt mom. I'm looking at you and I could tell you've got cloth diapers in that washing machine, don't you?

Natali: I do, I've got cloth diapers in the dryer.

Leo: That's a fanatic, 20 years ago we did cloth diapers for like a day and then it was like no, this is bad. But you get the diaper service and then you keep the diapers and they make wonderful little head cloths.

Natali: No I don't use the diaper service, I use -

Leo: You wash them yourself?

Natali: I have a diaper sprayer, so – Do you want to know this? This is diaper talk...

Leo: Yeah we'd like to know...this is pretty weird.

Natali: So it's shaped like a little pocket. I'm going to go get it and show it to you.

Leo: So while she gets her diaper sprayer...

Natali: So then you spray it, you spray it into the toilet

Leo: I was wondering, what do you do with the stuff? You don't want to throw the whole thing in the washer.

Natali: It's just spray

Leo: Oh you have the Bum Genius.

Natali: I don't have that one.

Leo: I use that all the time.

Natali: Yeah you don't want to use that as a personal cleansing product, cause the water comes out really cold.

Leo: Oh no that's not good.

Natali: Don't ask me how I know that.

Leo: Go get it while I talk about my toilet.

John: The whole world's interested in this toilet as far as I can tell.

Leo: I go into my bathroom, the toilet raises to greet me and it says “All hail thee, what would you like to donate today. It has a button that I can raise a 2nd seat and then so I touch nothing except the remote control which everyone touches so it's kind of gross. I touch nothing and then I walk away and the toilet goes oh you're done, he flushes -

John: It's a male toilet? Isn't that kind of homosexual? You and the toilet?

Leo: It's got nozzles in the front, it's got nozzles in the back, it's got oscillating, it's got pulsating, it's got a hot air dryer, it's got a heated seat.

John: All I know is if you're a guy do not push the button that says RT

Leo: Oh really?

John: Yeah, remove tampon.

Leo: There is no remove tampon button!

Natali: How can a toilet retweet?

Natali: Here, this is a cloth diaper and it snaps like that.

Leo: Isn't that cute! Now Miles is out of diapers, isn't he by now?

Natali: Yes he is but my daughter uses the same ones and it's estimated that each baby puts 1 ton of garbage in the landfill so I use the same stash for both babies. So that's 2 tons of garbage that did not go. So you take this little insert and you stuff it, like that and then you put it on them. If it's pee it just washes right out but if it's anything else you just spray it into the toilet and then the washing machine will wash it.

Leo: Right. Did Clayton do the plumbing on the Bum Genius, or did you have somebody come in?

Natali: Oh that's a long story. I tried to do it and I sprung a huge leak. It was one of those things like he's going to be so impressed with me. That I can do this plumbing job and then we had to call rotor rooter in the middle of the night and the guy was like, “What even is this”?

Leo: The lawyer who acts as his own client has a fool for a plumber.

John: As it were.

Natali: Yeah.

Leo: Beats is going to launch January 21st. This is a very well as you might imagine capitalized Music company. They bought Mogg for 14 million dollars, getting their database. Of course Beats is Dr. Dre's headphones. They make a lot of money on that. They're going to put a lot of money into their streaming music initiative. Now Marques, do you say Marquez, Marques, Marques?

Marques: Marques.

Leo: Have you fallen for the Beats marketing message?

Marques: No

Leo: What are those? Are those German Maestros?

Marques: These are audio-technica, I'll just show the top.

Leo: They're colorful.

Marques: They're the same color as Beats and I initially fell for Beats because they're red and black and I'm a sucker for anything that's red and black but after hearing things that aren't beats...

Leo: They don't sound that good. But yeah, you've got Drey's name on there you've got the styling, HTC bought intuit thinking well we'll put this on our phone...

Marques:  Yeah, I did a video called Beats audio explained, about a 5 minute video that talks about the way they integrated that technology and the way that it's all entirely software after the amplifier and yeah, not a fan, to put it lightly.

Leo: That's why 826,000 people have watched this beats audio explained video. Obviously... boy you blow me away at the success you've got here. Um so, by the way, I've got this Anki thing, I know it's just an advertiser but I got that Anki, I love this, so much fun!

John: What is it?

Leo: Come over to the house

John: You always say that...

Leo: It's like a slot car racing thing but it's bluetooth LE

John: You get in it?

Leo: No, it's this big!

John: Oh.

Leo: You control it with your iPhone or iPad

Natali: What's the lag on that? Can you actually play against someone else?

Leo: Oh yeah and there's AI each, I have 4 cars, you can play against yourself.

Natali: Oh yeah.

Leo: And the other cars can play you, and they're smart. It works really well, now.

Natali: Oh wow that's neat. They bill it as a whole family fun type thing?

Leo: No. I got it for my son, here we are playing it. I got it for my son. He went back to college, he left it here.

Natali: He didn't want to bring it for the frat parties?

Leo: You see we're shooting. Well if it's virtual shooting, plus you can upgrade the cars. There's an upgrade tree, like in gaming, where you build a skills tree and stuff. It's really cool! It's a little pricey.

John: I liked it. What's pricey?

Leo: Its 200 bucks for the starter kit which is 2 cars and then $69 for the cars.

John: For slot car racing that's about right.

Leo: Obviously there's a dog not included.

John: I like the dog in there.

Natali: I was thinking of this funny story on the 404 and the podcast and they were talking about the knock offs that are beats, the beats knock offs. The way that you can tell is that you can see the neck on the box, did you know that?

Leo: No

Natali: Because the knock offs in china, they have just the face. But if you see the silhouette with the neck then you know that's a knock off. Then there's certain knock offs that they don't use the name but they use the same branding and logo and design, that they're called, especially in China, this one brand is popular, it is called Sound by Steve, or something. That's a true brand.

Leo: At least Doctor Steve, I mean, I don't want any... Sound by Steve!

Marques: Yeah I seen a bunch of different ways to tell whether your beats are true or not, because I sold my beats pros on ebay and I got a message from a potential buyer, like, can you take more pictures of the box so I can see this, that and the other? Wow, he really wants to make sure its authentic. And everytime you do an ebay search for beats by Dre there's always a huge authentic title, so you know these are real. You can trust them.

Natali: There's a real huge knock off market.

Leo: If I'm a huge counterfitter I'm going to put the word authentic on it.

John: I would

Leo: Authentic Sounds by Steve.

John: And if it sounds like crap anyway, who cares

Natali: If you take a little white marker and draw that neck on

Leo: It's authentic

Natali: It's all you need.

Marques: At this point I'd say it might be a better deal buying a $30 knock off beats that sounds the same as

Leo: It certainly wouldn't sound and worse, it's probably true. I will be interested to see what they do with streaming music. It seems a little late for this, Modify, amazon and google are crawling the streaming music marketplace. $10 all you can eat music thing, microsoft, I don't know if there's room for another  one, we'll have 20 million titles and they do say, this is the problem with some of them, we wont have any spam titles, cover. A  lot of times you choose an artist and you get the cover song. It's really annoying, and a lot of these, no karaoke versions. So hey if they do that, maybe that by itself would be sufficient. So look for that January 21st, come da beats.

John: Is Bob Hyle coming out with any head phones?

Leo: Yes, he has good head phones. The Hyle pros are quite good. I think we're done, I don't see anything else of great interest. I want to thank Marques Brownlee for joining us, it was great to see you, have you on. Good luck with MKBHD. You're doing great, and twitter @mkbhd

Marques: Thank you for having me!

Leo: You're always welcome to come here if that company of yours fails. And can I have a job, thank you very much. Natali Morris is a regular correspondant on NBC, the Today Show, and of course Queen Latifa renewed for another year. You could find her at Natali Morris on the twitter. Great to see you and your diapers again

Natali: Thank you! That's a first.

Leo: Oh that's good! That's crash test mommy right there

Natali: You know saving the planet, one poop at a time. You're welcome to do that too.

Leo: I prefer to call it dookey. John C. Dvorak, Make sure you follow him, he really needs some followers on twitter.

John: I do, @theREALDvorak and don't forget the which apparently cannot be brought down by a hoard of chat room maniacs

Leo: We did everything we could to bring that site down. It's more responsive than it was before.

John: Yeah, it's snappy.

Leo: It's snappier than it was, I think that's because they poured on the bandwidth.

John: Yeah, probably.

Leo: Isn't that amazing. Look at that. Boom! There we go again. Boom! I'm refreshing it...

John: It's always a pleasure to be here, Leo.

Leo: Thank you, John. Thank you for being here everybody else too, we really appreciate it. Our live studio audience. Email tickets to if you want to join us. We do the show Sunday afternoons, 3pm pacific, 6pm eastern time. That is We would love to see you in the chat room or in the studio, but if you can't, we do make on demand audio and video available after the fact at Where  our fine podcasts are aggregated and distributed. So that wraps it up! Thank you to our great producer Chad Johnson, he of the red hair.

Chad: Schedule change of 2014 still in effect?

Leo: Yes, but not for twit. Twit will never move. We are like packed in concrete. Thank you everybody for joining us. We'll see you next time on another twit!

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