This Week in Google 741
Please be advised this transcript is AI-generated and may not be word for word. Time codes refer to the approximate times in the ad-supported version of the show.
00:00 - Leo Laporte (Host)
It's time for twig this week in Google. Paris Martineau here, jeff Jarvis is here, Ant Pruitt's here. We've got a little tribute coming up to Ant's mom. She retired this week. Congratulations, mom. We'll also talk about the open AI developers summit some pretty big announcements. They're a U-turn for GM's crews and Something that's happening in the EU that could make browsers completely insecure by law. It's all coming up next on twig Podcasts you love from people you trust this is twig.
This is twig this week in Google, episode 741, recorded Wednesday, november 8th 2023. The whole muffin, this episode of this week in Google, is brought to you by fast mail. Reclaim your privacy, boost productivity and make email yours with fast mail. Try it now free for 30 days at fastmailcom Twitter. And by Melissa, the global leader in contact data quality. Bad data is bad business. Make sure your customer contact data is up to date. Get started today with 1,000 records cleaned for free at Melissa comm Twitter and by Milio. Milio photos is a smart and powerful system that lets you easily organize, edit and manage years of important Documents, photos and videos in an offline library Hosted on any device and it's free. See what has us so excited by visiting miliocom. Slash twig.
It's time for twig this week at Google to show we get together with the great Googlers of time. Momorimum more. Take two. That's Paris. There's Martin laughing up Roy's Lee at me. Hello Paris, you're so good at saying words from the information. Yeah, aren't I? Just, it's like they just float like net, like like out of water, out of a Mm-hmm. That's it, welcome back. We miss you, doctor. Thank you, sir.
02:19 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
Thank you, sir, all dressed up, you had a nice vacation. I did had business to handle, but it was all good. He has some business.
02:28 - Leo Laporte (Host)
He's cagey this one yes cagey.
02:30 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
Hey, I'm private, not cagey. Oh yeah, I'm just don't tell everybody what.
02:33 - Leo Laporte (Host)
I'm doing. Jeff Jarvis is also here too. Is everybody everything he's doing, I tell everybody.
02:41 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
What do you want to know? Every day is asked me for lunch. Today I had very good hummus and lob day.
02:50 - Paris Martineau (Host)
And what book open?
02:51 - Leo Laporte (Host)
sit open book lob day, open book and open sandwich. Actually, yeah, he is the Leonard Tao professor for journalistic innovation at the For now Newmark Deorbited graduate school of journalism at the City University of New York. Emeritus, emeritus tea. It says it. You know they stand up, but you're not a meritous. Yeah, you still have to finish. No.
03:14 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
I'm not semester, right? Well, no, I'm not actually officially a meritus till next fall. Oh, that's okay, is that?
03:20 - Leo Laporte (Host)
some sort of legal thing? The emeritus yeah, no, I mean not. Why would look when, if I quit today, I'd be gone. That wouldn't be podcast host. Emeritus, right?
03:33 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
It's? It's because the only fringe benefit I get as a teacher in New York State is that we have traviolive, which allows me to use all of my use sick time up to a term. So I stay on payroll until next fall. Oh.
03:47 - Paris Martineau (Host)
Wow, it's a prayer right now.
03:49 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
Nice, nice like that.
03:52 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Did you stay there long enough to get a sabbatical? That's the biggest con game I what?
03:56 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
no, here's there. Here's what I'm such a shmuck, leo. I Stayed long enough to get to and you never took one. Oh, I took one, and then, while there were crises at the school, and so I Basically still taught the baddest a schmuck.
04:09 - Leo Laporte (Host)
I was an idiot sabbatical Is a paid leave of some length, sometimes a year, sometimes a semester, either full pay one term or 80% for a year. Amazing. And the idea is your professor, you'll write a book, you'll do research a few. Yeah, my dad Use his sabbatical and look at there, it is a good burr this is and the new magazine. Take a closer look. A history of the magazine.
04:42 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
Cute little book, just a little book. Outstanding Magazine is already available. Is that what you say? Answer yes, it is this week, this week, yeah, yeah, okay, excellent, very excited.
04:52 - Leo Laporte (Host)
I can't wait to read it. I'm really really excited about it's fun. It's a little fun little book. Paris, are you gonna ever write a book? You think? You think you got a book in you?
05:00 - Paris Martineau (Host)
Yeah, at some point it'll just have to be the right topic.
05:02 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Yeah, Jeff was.
05:04 - Paris Martineau (Host)
First one wisely.
05:06 - Leo Laporte (Host)
That's true. You never forget your first. Jeff was raving About Taylor Lorenz's new book extremely online. You really liked it.
05:17 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
I really liked it a lot for Primarily because this is the argument I'm making in my next book, because we got to stop looking at her knows technology and see it as humanity's culture, a human network, and that's how she sees it. She's a ball. She covers it that way, right, yeah, that's what I loved about it. I love she started with blogs and mommy blogs and it made me wistful. It made me sad in the end because We've lost all these young people as creators no, it's not that. All these young people as creators, you know, who are young and talented and energetic and imaginative. They're corrupted, not by the internet, not by social media, but by advertising and by the desire to reach scale and reach as many People as possible and to be as crazy as possible, getting there the attention economy, and so it's. That just made me a little sad. That's all yeah, but it was very good reporting it again. What I also respect about Taylor is reporting is that she she doesn't just dismiss oh, some 14 year old, she uses their name.
Yeah, you know she's respect covers them as she would someone in entertainment.
06:19 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Well, they are and that was to me also interesting, because people like Julia Fox, who really got no respect whatsoever, still doesn't.
06:27 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
06:28 - Leo Laporte (Host)
06:31 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
Good friend yeah.
06:35 - Paris Martineau (Host)
06:37 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
Wow, I, I do know her. I interviewed her at internet week back when we had those.
06:42 - Leo Laporte (Host)
She was a early Star. But because she's woman and that's the other thing I got out of this book is that's that almost invariably, if you were a female Influencer, you got trashed, you got told, you got yeah, and eventually, you know, thrown on the Fire on the. It was very sad for me, a lot of the, a lot of the women, I guess in some ways, that that happens to. I mean, look at mr Beast, who is now getting, you know, trolled for what he does, I feel like.
07:18 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
But it's worse for women, I really do see, oh, by all means, is at the black Twitter. Someone I held in February, andre Brock Jr, who I've quoted, often talks about the joy that black Twitter brings, and three women who are the room said, okay, but let me also tell you about the harassment and abuse and doxing and, you know, asked why they don't leave us because now it's now part of their businesses, as part of their, their, their you know financial lives and it's that mix we've got to deal with. Yeah, and the brilliant. The problem isn't technology, the problem isn't even companies. The problem is us people.
07:54 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Yeah, so I was talking about with my nightmare last week. It ain't the AI, it's the people who wield it if they have power. Jeff Hugh and Jason Howell covered open AI's first dev day this week a couple of days ago and their Keynote Sam Altman. You know, I thought he did. At first it was like he's a little Mark Zuckerberg robotic. Yeah, he was a little lock, yeah, but I also appreciated that it was a human on stage Talking about real things, and the developers were there, were thrilled by all of the things that open AI announced, which was curious did you guys think that this should have been a Live-stage keynote, or is this another?
08:40 - Paris Martineau (Host)
could have been a press release or an email sort of keynote. Oh, that's I've seen a lot of positive attention towards it, which I was surprised by, because when Apple or Google does these sort of things, we all roll our eyes a little bit.
08:55 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
Well, first, what did you think? Do you think it should have been live? Keynote Paris.
08:59 - Paris Martineau (Host)
I Didn't watch it. So okay, I just I thought that was fine.
09:03 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
But I think it made a statement and it showed the excitement of the developers in the room, which course I can be excited they're, you know they're doing their stuff again. At least they didn't get their eyes burned out like other, boys. I Think that there were Significant enough announcements, so we get into that now. I think the most important thing yet it's faster, it's better, it's cheaper, it's all that fine, fine, fine. The important thing was the Creation of a store for GPT's that's kind of amazing.
09:34 - Leo Laporte (Host)
They're calling it GPT's, where you take their learned models and you create your own Based on it, and he gave quite a few examples of some really interesting apps that people. Now the store doesn't isn't open yet. It will be Called the maps, which is interesting. They called them GPT's. That was the social media.
09:54 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
And it's a new. The other thing behind the scenes. They showed assistance. The GPT's are something that schmucks. Idiots like me could write Assistance, or things that you could write, leo, because you know what you're doing.
10:07 - Leo Laporte (Host)
The API for the credit.
10:09 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
Yes, but in either case, it's the. It's the long heralded arrival of agent team. Yeah, here is your agent to do something and we'll see. Jason made a lot of good points about what. We'll see how good it is, how much in depth it goes. If it just says, you know, if it just goes to Google and search or something and gives it to you who cares, you can go to Google. What does it do? That makes it more Expert, more interesting, more functional. But that was the interesting part. I think it makes you think about a different way to imagine programming. And here's an example relationship with a larger connected world where it can go out on your behalf and do things for you.
10:49 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Sam Altman is building a new GPT. He says I want to help startup founders think through their business ideas and get in some of their advice. And then, after cuz remember Sam Altman used to be the president of Y Combinator he says after the founders gotten some advice, grill them on why they're not growing faster, which I'm sure all the devs in the audience Laughed at. This is a cut down that that's seen at made, but the idea is it's gonna build what is effectively an app. In fact, it even names it itself. He says well, you know what should our name be? I think he called it mentor.
So it literally goes in and and then you could run this app and say hey, I'm a founder, here's my business. What do you think? And then it would do what Sam Altman, as a human, cuz he gave him a speech.
So, it just, it just gasses out of that speech what Sam would say and gives you some anodyne, stupid, obvious thing that you could get this is my, so this is my general problem anyway, with all of these LLM's is that the stuff they produce is superficially good and looks good, but now but it is ultimately banal.
11:56 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
So it actually created code that didn't have to go through a view or anything like that, and it's oh yeah, oh yeah. I mean, I don't ever see code, it's just a thing you don't see the code.
12:08 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
GPT's on your phone. Jason, I'm very, very proud that a few weeks ago on, on inside a AI, inside the CEO of a company whose name I'm suddenly forgetting, said English is the most important language Programming language in the world today, and this demonstrates it. Yeah, I remember that. Command the computer with English. That's the point. Sorry, paris, you were straight.
12:26 - Paris Martineau (Host)
I was just saying. I feel like this is kind of telling on yourself, at least in the example of the VC advice giving. Gpt like, of course You're. So you're saying is this advice that we're giving is so banal that you can just plug in a couple of speeches and Just a language synthesis like large language model is going to be able to mimic it?
I think that that's the question here with all of these apps is what sort of value Are they going to provide the long term, beyond just kind of some facsimile of Giving advice or responses?
13:02 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Well, in the. In some cases, if it's tied to a database, it can be useful. I've used chat GPT 3. To you know, when we got an unexpected stop in Genoa, italy, in the spring, I said give me a two-hour walking tour of Genoa, starting here. And it was good. It was very, it was quite good. So if it has a source of Information, it can often distill it in a way that's useful. So I can imagine a GPT that would help you do flight booking, for instance, and probably do every bit as well as a human Travel agent minus. The one thing a travel agent really adds is value. Is it the actual experience Like, oh yeah, I've been on that flight and I don't like it, you should take this one. But other than that, I mean it certainly could do the booking well.
13:50 - Paris Martineau (Host)
Yeah, I mean, I guess the question I have, even with the walking tour example, is in what way is GPT 3 more useful than you just googling walking tour?
14:01 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Oh, because I said I'm standing here, I have two minutes, make our two hours, make sure I can go from one to the other and it actually gives you could do this all by hand, I guess. But it said okay, you're gonna start here on your left. You'll see this. Now, walk three blocks to this way and you'll see that now we're gonna take you over to Christopher Columbus's house versus doing a Google search.
14:22 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
Well, you'll get a story along with you. On your left, you'll see this, this here and this, this, this is pretty close to having a human guy you know, but it took a lot longer.
14:30 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Yeah, and I may have Be honest it may have stolen it from Rick Steep's Travel guides. That's part of the problem. One of the things that they did it the Open AI's dev days. The same thing Google did last week, which is indemnify its users Hmm for copyright violation. They said we have copyright shield which will absorb the cost. If you create something and somebody sues you Saying you stole my artwork or you stole my writing will defend you, which I think I'm both open AI and Google's part is something they have to do, but also show some confidence that they will win those kinds of lawsuits right.
15:11 - Paris Martineau (Host)
I question that I have with all of these Technologies is like what is the end game? Because if this becomes a thing that most people use for, like those sort of purposes of you know, like making the walking tour or Recommend how I should, what I should order for dinner tonight, or like make for dinner tonight and give me the grocery list, now I should get it. The thing it is getting that information by scraping the web where people have already put that information together, and if there are no longer incentives for people to do that initial research, what is chat GPT going to scrape from eventually? Oh, there'll be nothing new.
15:50 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
So there's a there's a bug friend of mine who I saw last night at Rutgers, michael Kirshen. Matthew Kirshenbaum from University of Maryland argues exactly that Paris and what he calls the text apocalypse, in which the machine spits out Content and it trains on that content, trains on that content will becomes a gray goo with no substance whatsoever.
16:12 - Leo Laporte (Host)
But humans are not gonna stop creating right and I agree.
16:16 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
I think there's still gonna be a place for creators to still go back and regurgitate old ideas and give it a little bit more Pizzazz or refresh it. That's been going on forever and every man you know you can.
16:29 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
The real job is not everybody knows how to make Cookies, but does not stop the people from creating more recipes for chocolate chip cookies cookies every year.
16:37 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
16:41 - Paris Martineau (Host)
Publishing those these online is because they're getting ad dollars from Google and they're trying to get up high in the SEO rankings. Yeah and there's all these sort of incentives to commercial incentives to create and publish these sort of things online en masse. And that's the thing that kind of confuses me about this Notion that chat, gpt and these generative AI tools are the future, because it seems like it Really throws a wrench in that.
17:10 - Leo Laporte (Host)
I think humans, even though they might Rely on these things, will always make their own. You know what? He's gonna stop Joe Esposito from creating more, try as we might to get him right, and so this is a natural human tendency, and I think Joe is prolific and and I don't care if it, you know, it may be an AI could do this, but Joe's always gonna have more inputs to put out and I, even if AI could create our shows, I wouldn't stop doing it because I like doing them. Yeah, so I don't, I'm not. I think there'll be plenty of content to add.
By the way, one of the things that they did announce is they've updated their information to April 2023, and Sam even kind of acknowledged yeah, being cut off in 2021 was kind of a disadvantage. September 2021 was also able to search the web.
18:04 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
That's one of the things you can do. It can. It can use Bing, yeah. Yeah, you can go out and search actively. Leo, I think what I argue in my next book is that Making more content is kind of pointless. We have plenty of content. It's not about making content. What we what we do need to do in an age of abundant speech, is to find the good stuff, and the first reflex to the internet was that we have to get rid of all the bad stuff. So they must be done. And now we turn our attention to saying that there's more wheat among more chaff out there and the the challenge is to find the Joe Esposito's of the world and then put them into a room and not let them out.
18:43 - Leo Laporte (Host)
But that's another question you know, I remember in the early days of the internet, this was the same conversation, was like there's just gonna be this onslaught of content, and we had the same answer, which is I don't know if this happened or not that people will become curators, that the curator is what will be valuable. Oh, yes, who finds the good stuff? That's what we thought would be a very important role In the internet back in 1990. Yeah, is it true? Did it happen?
19:16 - Paris Martineau (Host)
Because we're not creating new curating new stuff.
19:18 - Leo Laporte (Host)
We're curating others stuff and then giving our comments.
19:21 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
Chocolate chip cookies of content, the other thing Well said so those aren't chocolate chips.
19:27 - Leo Laporte (Host)
The other thing that Was a big deal, I thought, was the expansion of the context window, the number of tokens. The chat program, the GPT program would consider it was 30. Now can you explain?
19:40 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
that all us, leo. Yeah, how do you? How do you know how many tokens you need? And put it up. But to make something work, Well, the context window.
19:48 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Yeah, the simple answer is you know, 32 K is about 30,000 words, right, so it's a 30,000 word article. Okay, 128,000, which is the new context window. That's like war and peace. So what it means is that the answer that you get will be generated from a much larger corpus of information by factor four. That's a big difference, and I think that it's what's really to me was interesting was the speed with which these advances are happening. We're growing very, very quickly and going from 32 K to 128 K and getting faster and getting cheaper at the same time cheaper.
20:32 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
He's going down by two and a half times. Cost is two times the cost is two Kind of changes that we used to see over many years and it's happening over months Now one could argue he's an extremely competitive landscape and In the one way he's trying to stay ahead, the other way it's gonna be hard yeah. And it's also expensive and he didn't really Address this.
20:57 - Leo Laporte (Host)
I don't think I didn't see the whole thing you did so tell correct me if I'm wrong, but one of the things that comes up again and again he had such an Adelaun. Microsoft was not a invisible presence, but but this is all running on Microsoft using Billy, literally billions of dollars in credits that Microsoft Gave them as an investment, ten billion dollars in credits or some amount thereof. It's really expensive to do this and I think it's one of the reasons you see it being very big companies like Anthropoc and open AI and Google and Microsoft and and we're told Apple and their latest investor, call Tim Cook, said well, we're doing that too. We got a. We've been working on generative AI forever, which shows you how much pressure there is on all of these big tech companies to say what, what are you doing with AI?
21:49 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
I Am still. You know, I'm the one who's smaller models.
21:53 - Leo Laporte (Host)
I mean, I've been the AI skeptic all along and and the one has been saying it's just, you know, trivia that they're spewing out, that just nicely polished. But I'm starting to think more and more Apply. There are applications for this. Yeah, you know, start a mentor may not be a very useful application, but I think that the some of the GPT's they showed were kind of, I think, interesting. We'll know when that store opens.
22:18 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
Yeah, I think they're all the other thing he announced so it was faster, bigger, cheaper, all good and that they're gonna identify Users of GPT when it comes to copyright, which is what Google has said as well with Bard, which fascinates me, because what they're saying is we think we're gonna win in court.
22:42 - Leo Laporte (Host)
I just said that exact thing about ten minutes ago, are you? Were you tweeting?
22:49 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
No, I said this.
22:50 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
I said this during the show.
22:53 - Leo Laporte (Host)
I literally said the exact same thing a few minutes ago. Yes, they are confident.
22:59 - Paris Martineau (Host)
Jeff has been replaced by chat. Yes, he's GP.
23:04 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
Jeff, happening right now. I'm sorry, I was just trying to do the full roundup. Okay, they weren't done now.
23:10 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
You were talking about how expensive this is. Do you see a point where this is actually going to start to go down far as how much it costs for these tech companies to run these models and do all of these computations? Will it eventually get cheaper the way Hardware got?
23:26 - Leo Laporte (Host)
cheap. Question the cost of it is hardware. Yes, because you have to have these fancy processors in a lot of them, mm-hmm. It's also storage and bandwidth. Something's got to go out and get the information, store it and then and then chew it. I think it'll go down because all computing goes down in price. But right, I don't know if it'll go down as fast as you know, say the whole deal.
23:51 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
This is where I think there's two, two angles to it. One is open source, and this is where Yanlac own and meta are fighting hard for open source, and as is Mozilla and others. Yeah then two Is that there is a lot of talk about doing much smaller models, which is part of what the stochastic parents paper said is you've got to deal with a smaller data set and make that work. So we can make it, we can audit the input. And then, secondly, I think the goal is going to be to get this stuff to operate in full, you know, on your device and be updatable and be able to call out to other things, and so this gigantic I have the biggest one BSD stuff I think might go away at some point.
24:34 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Yeah, in fact I downloaded whisper Open whisper onto this new Mac they just to see how much faster Jason snow was saying it was noticeably faster and AI processing and the biggest model is three gigabytes. But the fact that you can do it on Device without going to the cloud is what's really remarkable. And it that's another thing that's kind of changed, which is and and Microsoft's been talking about this almost and Qualcomm to almost all computers going forward, your phone too. We'll have to have neural processing units. We'll have to have AI specific hardware, because they're gonna suddenly be doing stuff on device and a lot of it and the speed with which they can do that's gonna be important. You're gonna hear an awesome.
25:19 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
Is there an oscillation here back and forth, where, where you, you started with mainframes and dumb terminals and then you went to PCs, then we went back into the cloud? Is this just kind of a natural progression that the processing and the effort, if it can, is going to come back into our devices because it's, in a long run, cheaper and also more in our control? It's more.
25:41 - Leo Laporte (Host)
it's more than that, it's more useful if you're wearing a VR goggles or you're carrying a phone around. You don't want to have to have it go, connect to the cloud Processing and come back. You want it to be able to look at text and have it immediately translated. You want to be able to you know, look at the landscape and know what that building is. You want to be able to translate languages Instantaneously. So all of that's eventually got to be on device and but that's the transformational thing that's gonna happen, and it's, I think, so forget.
26:08 - Paris Martineau (Host)
How far do you think we are away from that, from some sort of actual real-time, easy to wear AI heads that that is going to. You know, do like real-time translation and that sort of stuff.
26:22 - Leo Laporte (Host)
It's funny you should say that we were talking about that on Sunday because jet Mike Elgin had the new Ray-Ban Meta glasses which he says the speakers in the temples are very good. It has AI in the temples, he said, and I think he's right, it's not, it's a matter of months Before. Remember, google showed this at a Google I owe and made me so mad with the Google buds, like seven years ago, yeah, simultaneous translation. And then a year or two ago, they did it in the glasses. It's been, we've been on the cusp of this Forever, but I think maybe we really are in the cusp of it now.
I think it the translation we see, we see the translation happening in real time in being translate, google's translator. Yeah, putting that in the glasses, having the. Now we've got the Babel fish right. You, you you're wearing those glasses and somebody's speaking to Chinese and in your ear you're hearing English. It's simul, it's in simultaneous translation done by a machine. I think that, to answer your question, and I think it's it's 2024. I think it's coming instantly, soon and that's a revolution.
27:28 - Paris Martineau (Host)
I think it would be so cool if you had a version of that plus, like I don't know if I See someone, it could suddenly pull up all of my notes like a summary. Exactly. I guess chat GPT generated of the recent like notes I have from our last conversation.
27:43 - Leo Laporte (Host)
That would be incredible and, by the way, there's a great use of AI. It's got a corpus of information, every contact you've had with that person, and it's gonna be smart enough to say here's the three things you need to know, paris, as you're walking towards that person, his name is the last time we spoke.
27:58 - Paris Martineau (Host)
Used to work with him. Yeah, mm-hmm. Yeah, you saw.
28:04 - Leo Laporte (Host)
He looks so familiar yeah, it will be good for people like me, because I have face blindness like I. Yeah, you do you like you see something?
28:12 - Paris Martineau (Host)
I know it's embarrassing, I know I know you, but it's just. I see your name or someone says it. I'm like, oh yes, of course.
28:23 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
Just, I, just, I just cannot extract the name from my brain same, why?
28:28 - Leo Laporte (Host)
is it Okay, now I'm really, and you too.
28:31 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
I fly out just say, hey, can you refresh my memory, because I'm really bad with names and faces.
28:35 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Why is it? Why is the four of us have this problem? Is that a is regatus?
28:40 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
I don't know.
28:42 - Paris Martineau (Host)
I'm a bit of a narcissist. Probably does have some.
28:46 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
I don't need to know your name.
28:48 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
Let me tell you about me. What in my family I'm quite selfish. So yeah, all right, let's do it, let's do it.
28:53 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Let's do a face blindness test. I wonder if this is true of our audience too. I wonder if, if this is something that's common among Geeks. So there are tests that we can do for face blindness? Oh god, I'm gonna fail In this test. You'll be shown a long series of face. For each face, you must say if you've been shown that person before. Actually, I won't even do this, but this is a personality test online. But here's another one. You we can do all of you at home. Go ahead and do it. No, no, no. Just think about this, mm-hmm, this one. Then I realized this. I realized I have a disability. I can't, if I close my eyes, I cannot see my children's faces. I cannot see my wife's face. I cannot conjure that up in front of me. I can't even see what an apple looks like.
29:41 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
Yeah, that's can you see over straight.
29:43 - Paris Martineau (Host)
Sands face. That's, that's do you not picture like Images in your mind's eye? I can't. That's really that's free. Yeah, that's legit. That is like I'm forgetting what the name of it is. Yeah, there's just a whole class of people out there, much like you, that don't Think in.
29:58 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
That's why he's an audio guy.
30:00 - Paris Martineau (Host)
Oh, that's why. Maybe it is why because I can hear, just I can conjure up smells and sounds.
30:05 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
Mm-hmm, I can imagine when you hear a voice, leo, do you recognize voices?
30:10 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Yes, oh yeah, it's oh very well its faces. It's called a fantasia. It's more common than you think, in fact. This is the the quiz for it. Like, here's a bird, a cardinal, and If you're not, if you're just listening, close your eyes and imagine what a cardinal looks like, and what do you see in your head? I don't even see this number two, dimmer, vague. I see nothing. I, wow, I can say it, I Do you hear it?
30:46 - Paris Martineau (Host)
Do you just?
30:47 - Leo Laporte (Host)
I could hear it if I wanted to, yeah cardinal.
30:50 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
Yeah, it's conceptual. What about something? Something famous that you know? You've seen a hundred my wife's face.
30:57 - Paris Martineau (Host)
I've seen that a lot Children's faces you would think I mean it kind of hurts me that I your home. Can you think of your home and what it looks like in your mind's eye?
31:08 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Oh, that's interesting. Yeah, I kind of can't do. That's good with furniture a little bit better.
31:13 - Paris Martineau (Host)
That's really sad. So you can walk through the home in the dark furniture. Oh yeah, easy without I can do that.
31:19 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Yeah, I do that all the time in the dark, yeah you can't see a face. Same level of blindness but see this thing, it's not that I don't, I don't know, so you. So this is not that uncommon, there's a yeah some like 10% of people. Actually, I'm sorry, two to four percent of people. I have this. It's not uncommon, all right, um, oh Well, never mind, when did?
31:41 - Paris Martineau (Host)
you realize that not a fairly recently.
31:44 - Leo Laporte (Host)
You know what you know what it also realizes, why I have a hard time telling stories or I will. I can't be a writer Because I can't visualize. I could be a non. I could be a fiction, nonfiction writer, bro Mm-hmm, but I can't visual. And I have written quite a few nonfiction books, but I can't Stories. I can't visualize Stories or characters in a story, things like that. I can't do it. That's. I asked Daniels worries. I tried it. You know it was a great science fiction author. I was having lunch with them. I was saying Daniel, can you, when you write something, do you see it? He's oh, yeah, what, don't you? I said no, yeah, and I think it's a radar shine.
32:21 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
That was really. Says Leo loves photos.
32:24 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Well, I think there's a reason why. I love, is that a substitution? Yeah, yeah, that's what it sounds like and I can definitely. I always knew that that was supplementing my Stronger ability with sounds. I, you know, I can hear, and I can hear sounds.
32:39 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
So I, so I should be able to help you in all kinds of ways. Yeah, just think about it.
32:44 - Leo Laporte (Host)
To prompt that thing that Paris wants is exactly what I want where it says hey, that's a, that's Paris used to work with her, she's got four kids and is the CEO of a giant multinational chewing okay company Leo, look at it.
33:01 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
Please look at it now. Mm-hmm look at aunt. Yeah, could you. Could you draw the shape of Paris's glasses?
33:07 - Leo Laporte (Host)
No, no, no, I know they're. I know there's geometric. They're not. They're not round, patrick.
33:15 - Benito Gonzalez (Guest)
Della hanty has a good question Interesting. When you read, what do you see? Nothing.
33:21 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Wow, you see just the words all his Concepts is very concept focused, so it's like I can. I see the concepts. I try to see. We see it's actually frustrating for me. I try so this in fact, because you don't know what people other people were seeing. I just thought this was normal and it was only like in the last 10 years five years maybe that I've realized this. But like, so I'm reading a science fiction book? Yeah, I don't. I try to see the thing, but it's like this blobby, it's not very, it's not.
33:49 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
I am so sorry, can you see it? I have all kinds of.
33:54 - Paris Martineau (Host)
So I read Reading the words I'm just, I'm in it.
33:58 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
Are you? Do your dreams? Have pictures, leo.
34:01 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Uh, not very detailed. Yeah, usually it's one thing and then a weird yeah, when you leave seeing Oppenheimer. We don't have to make this about me, can you?
34:13 - Paris Martineau (Host)
stop. Oh no, this is fun. Sorry, we're deep in this now, oh yeah we are now.
34:17 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
We've always thought you were weird, but you're really In your head.
34:20 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
Can you see?
34:21 - Leo Laporte (Host)
it, then all I can see of Oppenheimer right now, if I close my eyes, is silly and murphy's giant head. Because I told that story, so I probably sealed it in on the iMac screen snatched waste? No, I don't. Does he have a snatched waste?
34:38 - Paris Martineau (Host)
that's interesting, he does in that film.
34:40 - Leo Laporte (Host)
34:42 - Paris Martineau (Host)
Notice it on.
34:45 - Leo Laporte (Host)
It makes me very jealous because whatever the opposite of a snatch.
34:49 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
Oh, I'm looking this up now. Oh, I have me.
34:52 - Leo Laporte (Host)
I have it's like uh, you know it goes in instead of out a v yeah mine goes out instead of in one's a muffin top, one is not. Yeah, I'm a muffin top. I'm not even a muffin top, I'm the whole muffin.
35:06 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
I think it was a skull sir, we'd call you biscuit? All right well.
35:15 - Leo Laporte (Host)
I was interested. I, I, yeah, I hate, I get very Self-conscious, but. But but to me it was an interesting thing and I think for people with that disability, yes, I will have some very interesting uses um it. I guess it could. If for people who can't smell things, I, everybody can like recreate smells, right? No, I know that room, no see, so that's what happens the brain compensates.
So there's a, there's some missing piece of my brain, but it's been given over to sounds and smells. I can. I can smell. I can smell any smell anytime, if you were handed an apple right now with your eyes closed.
35:51 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
Would you know what it is by a show. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
35:52 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Yeah, I'm not an idiot. What is this? I don't know. Is it a baseball? Uh, no, I can tell. It's not like it's not.
36:07 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
Why is it apple?
36:08 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Yeah, no, that's the weird thing. It's not like that. That is one of the piaget I think that's. The one thing that I'm going to be talking about is that the childhood learning stages is object permanence. Yeah, and you all know that I'm just telling for the audience. That's why kids, when you do peekaboo, believe that you've disappeared and then have reappeared and they're going oh whoa, that was cool, whereas every normal adult goes well, oh, nice trick, let me steal your nose. Anyway, it's no, it's not like I don't know what an apple is and I understand the concept of apple. I know it's red, it's sweet, tastes, crisp and all that. All of that I just can't. If I close my eyes, I don't see an apple.
36:58 - Benito Gonzalez (Guest)
See it, it comes down to a lack of a mind's eye. Basically, right yeah.
37:02 - Leo Laporte (Host)
I don't have a mind's eye. I got a great big hole where my mind used to be.
37:08 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
That sounds like a a hole in my heart, a hole in your mind, but I can't play, uh, belters gate three.
37:13 - Leo Laporte (Host)
You know I will, once Paris teaches me. Let's take a little break now that we've talked about AI. I'd infinite them and my lack of an eye. Um, it's probably why I got into, you know, I think when I was a kid, I played chess and I I was always Trying to play blindfold chess, and I play well enough that I could do that.
Yeah, but I don't see how young were you? Oh, 12?. Yeah, I'm not really young, not little little. I start. I got into it in seventh grade and uh, and there are people who could play 30 games of blindfold chess and they see, they can see the board right and they can, and they can have the the. The Champion of this was an old San Francisco international master named George Colton Aske used to write the chess column in the San Francisco Chronicle. You might.
you might have remember Colty Colty, he, but he, I think his record was um 34 games simultaneously, blindfolded, wow and uh, and winning, by the way, winning every one of them. So I would always try to do that. I could do one, I can only do one, but, but it's a lot of effort because I can't see the board. I could play over the board, and then one of the things I think that got me into chess was this idea of seeing moves ahead, because you don't, you have to kind of imagine this move, this move, this move, this move, and it was a way for me building up, wow, that capability, um, would you like to know more about me? Anything else? Yeah, can you draw.
Can you type without looking at the keyboard, like I'm not a train touch type is, but yeah, no, I don't have to look at the keyboard because I've done it enough. Now I know where the keys are that's muscle memory, though, isn't it?
38:58 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
that's different, that's true, I mean it starts with kind of visualization.
39:02 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Could you paint? No, can't paint or draw. I guess you know if I were looking at something I could, I could look at, I could, I could.
39:15 - Paris Martineau (Host)
It's a really good sticker another fabulous Now.
39:19 - Lou Maresca (Other)
See everybody at home listening is going get it. What are they saying?
39:22 - Leo Laporte (Host)
What are they looking at? I don't know. They know how I feel, right, I can't visualize that sticker.
39:26 - Paris Martineau (Host)
This is you're living inside Leo's mind.
39:28 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
It's dark in there, I guess, folks, is why you have to join the club, so that you can in the future, watch streaming On. Joe Esposito has made a sticker.
39:36 - Leo Laporte (Host)
He makes stickers with our pictures and funny Slogans. In this case, I have my hands over my face, I'm playing peekaboo, and the slogan at the top is I'm not an idiot, and at the bottom, this weekend, apples and uh, maybe you had to be there, but it's, it's, it's. I would like to put that on my laptop, that's for sure. That's awesome. So I will tell you something about me, my emails provider. Uh-huh, fast mail. Our show today brought to you by oh, I love it. Fast mail, and more and more. I think.
If you ask around, john DeVorek used to have a test to see if somebody was a geek or not. He'd say what's your search engine? If they said out the vista, he'd go, you're nothing, you're nobody. If they said google and this was in 2011 or something, oh see, there's a, there's a geek. If you go around and you ask the smartest people in technology that use technology that you know the it gurus is over what email provider you use, they don't say gmail, they don't say hotmail. They don't say aol. They don't say, uh, outlook, they say fast mail because the free email services Turn you into a product. You're not the customer, you're the product. Fast mail yeah, you pay for it, like it starts at three bucks a month.
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Fast mail will sell you a domain or you can bring your own. I have brought more than a dozen domains to fast mail. Why would you do that? Well, for a couple of reasons. One I can send email from any of those domains using All of the top Authentication processes, so your mail is much more likely to get through. You know de kim and spf and things like that. But also the other advantage of having a domain hosted at fast mail for email is I can create an infinite number of email addresses at any of those domains. So I use my domains to really control how I get my mail. Who gets which mail address? It's really fantastic.
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Big, big decision going on in the eu today and I hadn't heard a word one about it till steve gibson mentioned it yesterday. Article 45 this is an article from the electronic found here foundation. Article 45 Will roll back web security by 12 years as part of a new regulation that you use, voting on it today. Roll back yeah, it's called idas eidas 2.0, and buried deep within it in the text of article 45 is a rule that says any country in the eu can create their own certificate authority, and browsers and operating systems must include that certificate authority in the browser, which means Any government in the eu can basically snoop On any traffic that's going on In your browser that. How does that work?
How does it. So? A certificate, so you know about um, um, https, secure, yes, and that's done with public key crypto. Essentially, you have a private certificate and a public certificate. There is a. Every operating system and every browser comes with a list of approved certificate authorities reliable, trustworthy Companies approved by ican to sell certificates. We use go daddies one, we use digis cert, that's another one, and you can change your own asm, yeah, and you can, and so you get that certificate and on my website. So if you go to effect, we can do it right now. If you go to twittv, wait a second.
46:23 - Paris Martineau (Host)
So is this why sometimes when you click on a website, let's say in like google chrome, it says like oh, go back, it's insecure. There's something up with this, well that's one thing.
46:31 - Leo Laporte (Host)
They also scan, for they also yes, so you could have a. So, for instance, if you set your um, your, your date and time to 1970 on your computer or to 2028, all of a sudden a lot of sites won't load anymore. It'll say, no, the certificates out of date or it doesn't have a proper certificate. That's because you can't establish an encrypted traffic with that site and every site now is https, because their certificate is doesn't match your date.
47:00 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
Right, you're part of what comparison is asking to right leo is some sites that aren't https.
47:05 - Leo Laporte (Host)
You'll get that message yeah, the google's been pushing on that. Yeah, this, this is only for https, but now almost everything you go to is is secure using certificates. You can go to a secure site and you can and you can find out more about their certificate. If you click the lock on the site, it'll say connection secure and then, in our case, it says verified by go daddycom. You can even look at the.
47:32 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
That makes me feel secure.
47:34 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Well, no, they're legit. They're a legit. I know, I know I'm not a crazy about them, but they were a lot cheaper than we used to do a stage of cert. But you can see that that go daddy has verified that, that this is twittv. Cs has verified by and you can actually view the certificate. And and go daddy is a certificate authority. That means that iCan, the has approved them to issue certificates and the browsers then have that information stored in them as well as the operating systems, so they can say, yeah, yeah, you're on a secure site.
And that certificate that you're getting from the site really does say You're at twit, you really are at twit and you can get a. You know, there's the public key info. There's all sorts of there's fingerprints, there's all sorts of information in here which you never have to look at but the browser does to verify that, yeah, you are there. And what that also does is establish an encrypted Signal that's the whole point of HTTPS between your, your browser, your computer and the server, so that nobody can intercept it, nobody can insert anything into it. It's a private, encrypted Transaction. Except the EU now wants to allow and says, well, I don't know, must pass yet must that any country, including turkey, include any country in the EU, can establish a certificate authority. So, victor.
48:58 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
Orban has his certificate exactly and it gets inserted there. It's not a certificate.
49:04 - Leo Laporte (Host)
It's a he mints certificates and he and he can be essentially do a man in the middle, oh, I see, for any site that's using that certificate. The EFF says this is a catastrophe for the privacy of everyone who uses the internet, particularly for those who use the internet in the EU. Browser makers have not announced their plans yet, but it seems inevitable they will have to create two versions of their software one for the EU with security checks removed, another for the rest of the world with security checks intact. By the way, it is not just the browser. These days, many browsers chrome I think does this use the certificates from the operating system. So it's really apple and microsoft and google that uh would be responsible for this. The current text of article 45 requires browsers trust ca's appointed by governments, and this most critically prohibits browsers from enforcing any security requirements on those ca's beyond what's approved by etas.
50:06 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
I always say governments are not, are not the best protector of privacy. They are the worst threat to privacy because they have laws and police and jails and so on. Yeah, leo, let me ask you a question, though. Could I, could you, as an individual user, choose one certificate? So that's not the point. No certificate is at the, at the, at the site you're going to. Yeah, about your browser. So here at, twitchtv.
50:28 - Leo Laporte (Host)
We have private keys and, uh, your certificate authority, your browser, your operating system has the public key. When you come to our site, it says verify this public key. If I, and if I don't have the private key, I can't verify it, then you know I'm not twit, I'm somebody impersonating twit, right? Furthermore, there's an encrypted transaction established with twit and it. It certifies that that encrypted transaction is secure. Um, miss, you miss. Issued certificates is again quoting the eff have been used to spy on traffic in the past.
51:07 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
Uh, they're very sorry, you're going to a site. I'm still understand.
51:10 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Are you going to a site that you think is twit and it's not, and that's how that's one way to spy upon or okay, if twit were using a certificate issued by victor or bans turk government, uh, or or urtawan's government, uh, then in hungry, then, uh, they could actually do a man in the middle on that traffic and see what you're doing. So if so, this is problematic to say the least, is there?
51:37 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
any possible Realist, appropriate rationale why the eu Government would think this is a good idea, the same as the uk trying to get rid of encryption? Is this a way to do? This is not quite a back door. This is something else. Someone lobby. What's what's their Justificat? How would they justify?
51:56 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
this. I think it would sound more like what you were saying with the man in the middle. You know you can still get to where you go a good way to spy on. But somebody is able to scrape, yeah, and probably monetize off of the data that they're scraping.
52:08 - Leo Laporte (Host)
It's a strange thing to ask for. I suspect that's the reason, but I'm not sure. They're basically lowering security. Uh, why a government would want to lower security? Uh, this the efs says that's why it's so disturbing. Eats two is poised to prevent browsers from holding ca's accountable. By all means raise the bar for ca security. But permanently lowering the bar Means less accountability for certificate authorities and less security for internet users everywhere. Uh, they say the text isn't finally yet, but it's subject to approval behind closed doors in brussels today. Hmm, so I just thought I pat. I had no idea about this.
No one's been yelling, no one's raised the alarm until steve gibson did on security Now yesterday and like my hair was on fire.
52:56 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
Nobody yelled about this.
52:58 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Wow, I'm, I'm watching, I'm monitoring to see if what comes out of brussels. I mean, I see no reason that the thing is. No, there hasn't been time to raise a protest. There have been some protests from. I think there was a letter signed by the fathers and mothers of the internet Saying let's not do this.
53:19 - Paris Martineau (Host)
You have 500 cybersecurity experts, researchers and ngo's signed an open letter.
53:24 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
Yeah, but it's being uh, we're not that single number. We're a single number under paris's name. If you got any scoops about this, that's where you go, yeah it's just a shocker. That is wow, because because, well, it was only after a hell of a lot of pressure in the uk there are. There are so-called online safety bill, which is now an act was going to Require backdoor and through encryption, the authorities want their ways to spy on what we do.
53:54 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
I have restored and taught us that, yeah, and I think that's kind of what the real motivation is behind this, but and isn't it authorities motivation um For for our own public security is why they want that backdoor? They're gonna say I think that's what I've been hearing at one point.
54:11 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Yeah, oh, it's for us, it's good for us, it's a child pornography, child porn.
54:15 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
Make sure, make sure everybody's gonna be in favor of child porn.
54:18 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
Ant To go up. What's wrong with you?
54:21 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Yes, it is. It's amazing. What a world. Huh, yeah, I don't. I don't have anything more to say about that. I'm glad, uh, yeah, you were obviously, uh, paris, you're doing some research, so, um, maybe the information could cover this. I'll be very curious to see what happens. Yeah, I wonder. Normally goes back to your point about ai leo, it's, it's.
54:42 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
we got to be concerned about humans and we got to be concerned about For most of us humans, it's always the humans yeah gosh, darn humans.
54:49 - Leo Laporte (Host)
They ruin everything. Gm has halted production Of cruise driverless vans. We've been covering this story. First the california public utilities commission said go ahead, put self-driving vehicles all over san francisco. Then there was a death, an accident. Uh, then the dmv Pulled their license, saying you miss, misled us, you lied to us about what happened. Then, uh, gm's cruise shut down operation All over the country. And now the latest is they're also going to stop producing these cruise driverless vans.
55:26 - Paris Martineau (Host)
Wow boy going from yeah quick slide.
55:32 - Leo Laporte (Host)
55:34 - Paris Martineau (Host)
Reeling from a u-turn, you might say a u-turn.
55:38 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Rim shot three point u-turn cruise CEO kyle vote, held an all hands meeting on monday to explain how the company Was planning to address concerns that its vehicles are not yet safe enough to operate. Uh, one of the very first announcements was they were going to pause production of their fully autonomous van called the origin, which they were going to put everywhere In addition, cruises software had quote problems recognizing children, putting them at risk, according to a monday story from the intercept.
56:08 - Paris Martineau (Host)
Yeah, that's typically not what you want, you don't want. Children are kind of a Target audience for not you know.
56:15 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
Sort of things you'd want to know. They're the non target audience, ideally.
56:23 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Yeah, I mean, that's what somebody accused. Tesla's Fs3 was accused of also hitting kids. Remember the guy who made videos? He would put little kids shaped.
56:33 - Paris Martineau (Host)
Yeah, I remember mannequins out there and they kept running them down the guy who challenged someone via tweet to come over and put your child in front of my tesla. I promise you won't hit it to you. Did he really? Did he like do this? No, elon didn't do that. Some someone else did. I don't think that they actually put their kid out there, but it was. A tweet was sent to that effect and it haunts me.
56:56 - Leo Laporte (Host)
My god. We've showed this before, but I'll. This is uh. The independent tesla crashes into child dummy as auto rake test Fails. Here's a tesla, there's a child. Oh, no, no, no.
57:08 - Paris Martineau (Host)
There goes its head. It didn't slow down at all. It didn't slow down. There is a piece of that the child's leg. Look at these other cars stopped.
57:18 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Well, let's see. Wait a minute, here it comes. Let's see, this is, uh, I don't know who this is. Is it a gm? Well, I don't like a lexus. The first one looks like uh yeah the first one stopped tesla, right, but the first one go Reach so it is possible to recognize children. Yeah, it's a lexus.
57:38 - Paris Martineau (Host)
Um, I love that they dress the child dummies up in jeans and hoodies and they have them kind of like midwalk. Uh, really a lot of attention to detail here.
57:47 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Uh, tesla is demanding an advocacy group Take down those videos.
57:55 - Lou Maresca (Other)
Um yeah, well, I can understand why they might be a little sensitive, a little bad press.
57:59 - Leo Laporte (Host)
This is back from August of last year. Anyway, apparently crews had the same problem. This, you know, this is they're little, they're easy to miss. Yeah, that's all it is.
58:09 - Paris Martineau (Host)
And I can't. I every time we, you have this problem too, right, leo? I hate to say it, you're like oh man.
58:16 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
I don't recognize what a kid looks like anymore. I forget what kids are.
58:20 - Paris Martineau (Host)
I close my eyes and I don't remember.
58:22 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
I think I remember that they're little. I remember that characteristic. Are they red and round? No, that's an apple.
58:27 - Leo Laporte (Host)
I just try not to do anything in jeans and a hoodie. That's my, my.
58:31 - Paris Martineau (Host)
I think that's really smart.
58:33 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Um, that's crazy. It is interesting that that they that they admitted this. This is from a, a recording that Forbes heard from an all hands meeting, Um, the, so I guess maybe put a hold on that van for a little while. But I have to point out, every time we do this story, humans probably hit kids a lot more than self driving vehicles.
58:57 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
Yeah, yeah, with something that's going on like that, with crews and halting production, basically going back into R and D, right, they're not necessarily just shutting things down, yeah, okay. So with that said, uh, shareholders and people that are investing in this, that's it. I'm assuming they would take this and strive and say, okay, let's get this stuff right, because we'll eventually make our money, or or is it going to be? I?
59:20 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
look, I look at just stocks down 3%. Okay, well, that's big, wow, wow.
59:27 - Leo Laporte (Host)
I think a lot of people feel like this uh, the future of uh cars is self driving. Yeah.
59:33 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
I don't want that, but sure Cause I like driving, sometimes my new car, that's what I'm going to say Don't people love driving cars?
59:40 - Paris Martineau (Host)
Isn't that, famously, what car people are all about? I?
59:44 - Leo Laporte (Host)
asked Ford CEO back in the day, when, when? What are you doing with self driving, cause Tesla had already started? He said, leo, people love to drive. That was his answer yeah, now I drive a self driving Ford's.
59:56 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
I don't like driving around the city. But you know, I do enjoy going through Napa on those back roads.
01:00:02 - Leo Laporte (Host)
It's nice when cars help you.
01:00:04 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
01:00:04 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
01:00:05 - Leo Laporte (Host)
They don't have to drive. I don't trust them.
01:00:06 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
I don't trust them. I never, I, never, I have never done cruise control. What Really I do not. Oh no, oh God, no, I will not do cruise control. I love it. I turn it on all the time.
01:00:16 - Leo Laporte (Host)
No cruise control. I'm a technical director and expert. Yeah, I've never used cruise control either, really. Yeah, you are weird, I use it all the time.
01:00:26 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
All the time.
01:00:28 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
Harrison till you moved to New York. Were you, did you drive?
01:00:31 - Paris Martineau (Host)
I eight years ago. Yeah, I drove, but I drive and driven. I don't drive now. That's one of my favorite things about living here.
01:00:39 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Is your driver's license expired?
01:00:41 - Paris Martineau (Host)
I had to transfer it to a New York one, and then I keep it up to date so that I can occasionally take a zip car. I'll drive a zip car to the Costco in Brooklyn and I don't use cruise control for that, because I am going about five miles an hour.
01:00:55 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
So, mrs Jarvis, are you going to drive from Jersey to Petaluma without cruise control? That's what you're saying. Oh yeah, I couldn't do it.
01:01:04 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
Yeah, wow, the only time I used it was when my hip hurt. I was getting my sciatic and trying to keep my foot on the darn pedal was hurting. That's the only time I've used it and I hated it. I hated it. Control freak. Oh, I feel out of control.
01:01:20 - Paris Martineau (Host)
See, this is why we never remember anyone's faces is because, Jeff, you're out here being like I can't relinquish control from driving. You're not going to have any room left in the brain for the face.
01:01:31 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
Well, I damn near didn't get married because we almost got divorced. We got married because I was trying to tell my wife that I had a stick shift car and wanted her to learn how to ride the stick shift car. Why, why would you do this?
01:01:42 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
Do you still have a stick shift car? No, I'm with you on the stick shift, I love it. Benino has a stick shift. I'm with you on the stick shift, I love those.
01:01:50 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
I like that you don't own that now when you're BMW Do you add.
01:01:55 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
If it were, I would have been happy for it. But no, they don't have a stick shift. No, I have a little driver's stick shift. I have a like a knob on my Mustang.
01:02:03 - Leo Laporte (Host)
It's like a dial that you dial and I think the new car's got a little like just a thumb. Yeah, it's got the little push Thumb shifter, the new car. I'm excited because if I have the cruise control on and I want to change lanes, I just look at the mirror and it goes that's pretty cool, that's crazy. I think I'll be turning that off pretty quick.
01:02:27 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
Oh, and yes, Queen Pruitt can drive a stick shift. Yes, she can. Can she? Yes, she can. You know who really?
01:02:31 - Paris Martineau (Host)
just pulled up. You can drive a stick shift.
01:02:33 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
No, no, I just remembered, I can drive it.
01:02:36 - Leo Laporte (Host)
You know who could drive a stick shift. What has terrified me is my lovely wife, lisa. When I had a Mustang with a stick shift but we were buying it she said let me do a little test drive. You sit in the back seat. I love that Gosh.
01:02:50 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
I love that.
01:02:51 - Leo Laporte (Host)
That was pinned to the side and then pinned to the other side.
01:02:55 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
I've seen how she drives pepper Her car out there now.
01:02:58 - Leo Laporte (Host)
She is a little speed demon, she ain't afraid. Not afraid that's a good way to describe it Not afraid.
01:03:06 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
Don't leave him.
01:03:06 - Leo Laporte (Host)
meanwhile he's going over the bridge in his three wheel bike yeah.
01:03:11 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
01:03:13 - Leo Laporte (Host)
So talk about AI. The sag strike is ongoing. The producers made a take it or leave it offer and, according to Gizmodo, by pushing a truly horrifying AI deal. I like this picketer whose sign says pay the actors, you AI holes. Nice, this is the final offer, they said. Well, we'll see.
01:03:39 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
You know how that is Well yeah, that's not a great negotiation, it's our final offer.
01:03:45 - Leo Laporte (Host)
We're going to take our toys and go home.
We don't need actors. So the clause included in the offer. The Alliance of Motion Picture and Television Producers is seeking to secure AI scans for Schedule F performers, that is, guild members who earn more than the minimum series regulars, which is a lot 32,000 for TV episode, 60,000 for a movie. If you get paid that much, then they say you, we can scan you. That's bull. We are required, as are the streamers, to pay to scan the likely likeness and when we, until you're dead, and then we can use it anyway. We want forever. Oh, no, oh we need something.
01:04:34 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
Oh, we need somebody for this Hebronite cream commercial.
01:04:38 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Let's use the dead guy without the consent of their estate or SAG. After we will have the right to continue to use those scans. So basically, what's the class for an extra? Or yeah, I don't. I don't. Let me see here, this is one of the big makeup people that this is why you somebody real according to SAG negotiators, maybe Fran Drescher. I'll do it in a friend Drescher voice. This is one of the big no, I won't. This is one of the biggest. I love it she's immediate bail the nanny.
01:05:11 - Paris Martineau (Host)
That's great yeah.
01:05:13 - Leo Laporte (Host)
This is one of the biggest reasons SAG did not accept the last, best and final offer from the AMPTP. We could not allow that language to stand. This is massive.
01:05:21 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
Every single last and final is redundant and we're just offended by that. But keep going.
01:05:26 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Yeah, every single ABCD and E-Lister, all the higher pay performers who think this is a minimum wage strike. They must know they are in this fight. Yeah, because it would affect them. They have to realize this is about protecting them. This is their strike. Now, when they realize what's on the line AI is, it turns out, ai is you know. At the time I thought, oh, ai is a side problem to the issue of getting paid properly for streaming, because there's no residuals for streaming. But as it turns out, they've come to, they've come together on the streaming part. It's the AI part they're really having a trouble with.
01:06:03 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
Name, image and likeness, basically.
01:06:06 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Yeah, yeah, forever, without asking permission.
01:06:10 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
I suppose you know, if they want to create somebody with AI, they can create someone. I'm assuming. In the future all of our technology is going to get better as far as creating 3D models and texture models.
01:06:23 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Put yourself in the position of the producer. That's exactly what they're saying. We just while these guys are alive, we just want to get a scan of them.
01:06:31 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
Yeah, I don't want them scanning any of the actors, but what I'm saying is but if they have some, one knows how to sketch out a person they never after forever, after they have Tom Cruise. What's the class four? I still want to know that that's cool.
01:06:46 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Class schedule F performers that's people who are more than minimum, so the big guys so it's not lowers, it's the big guys.
That's the whole point. The company suggests clause requires studios and streamers to pay to scan the likeness, but not for the reuse of the AI scans. Sag-afr is seeking to attach a compensation for the reuse and producers would need to secure con consent from the performer. The language currently in the offer would see the studios and streamers secure the rights to use scans of deceased performers without the consent of their estate or SAG-AFTRA. That's just ridiculous. It's such a sneaky little grab.
Oh, we'll pay you to scan you, but after that it's ours, but you can be in.
01:07:35 - Paris Martineau (Host)
You know every commercial or movie we want to put you in and will not give you a cent. Yeah, it's absolutely ridiculous.
01:07:42 - Leo Laporte (Host)
I imagine if you're a list, you can say you, you make your own deal. You can say, well, absolutely, you kidding, absolutely, and we'll have control of his image and likeness. That's the problem with the afterness.
01:07:53 - Paris Martineau (Host)
The Church of Scientology will have control of its grasp.
01:07:56 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Well, yeah, it's a habit, troy.
01:07:59 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
Actually, he's been dead for years and they just make him up every year.
01:08:04 - Paris Martineau (Host)
01:08:06 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Oh, here's another AI story we're doing this week in AI, I guess. Now this now consider the source on this. This comes from CNN, who says Microsoft is making a mess of the news.
01:08:18 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
There are some bad stuff in here.
01:08:19 - Leo Laporte (Host)
There's some really bad stuff, so Microsoft used to have editors.
They had 800 editors in 2018 working on Microsoft News, which, by the way, if you use Windows, you know this in the lower right hand corner of Windows 11 is a little widget. Click it and you're going to get news. So it's really all. I knew some of those editors. They were good editors. Well, they're not there anymore. They're using AI now, and this is a CNN's lead False claims False, by the way. I want to underscore this False claims that President Joe Biden fell asleep during a moment of silence for victims of the Maui wildfire, a conspiracy theory that the latest surge in COVID-19 cases is being orchestrated by the Democratic Party ahead of the election, and an obituary for a late NBA player that described him as useless.
01:09:07 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
Yeah, he wasn't even late. The guy was still alive.
01:09:11 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Oh yeah, he wasn't dead. These are being published by Microsoft on their company's homepage, MSNcom.
01:09:17 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
Microsoft doesn't create right. They're linking the awful stuff. Is that what it is? Yes, I forget.
01:09:23 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Yes, because they're using automation to curate the homepage, and the automation, I guess, just can't tell the difference between a true story and a made up story, and I mean some of this. You can really lay the blame at the foot of the internet. It's full of stuff like this, right, yeah, and more all the time.
01:09:41 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
Yeah, but again, if we're going to use AI tools, we should have some human interaction to go in and do a little fat checking here and there.
01:09:49 - Leo Laporte (Host)
The biggest, most public thing was the Guardian was furious because they had an article about a young woman who was found dead with head injuries at a school in Sydney, australia, of unknown cause, probably a murder, I think you know she didn't follow the slide. When MSN republished the Guardian story, it accompanied it with an AI-generated poll asking readers what do you think is the reason behind the woman's death? Murder, accident or suicide?
01:10:22 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
01:10:23 - Leo Laporte (Host)
God and people blamed the Guardian because it was right next to the. They thought the Guardian had generated that poll. Anna Bateson, chief executive of the Guardian media group, said in a sharply worded letter to Microsoft Sharply and no Sharply that the auto poll was deeply concerning application of the company's AI technology and demand of Microsoft take full responsibility. Not only is this sort of application potentially distressing for the family of the individual as a subject of the story, it's also deeply damaging she wrote to the Guardian's hard won reputation for trusted, sensitive journalism and to the reputation of the individual journalists who wrote the story.
01:11:02 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
Hey, but Microsoft PR, they respond it.
01:11:07 - Leo Laporte (Host)
A Microsoft spokesperson said the company was disabling all polls on news articles Investigating the cause of being appropriate.
01:11:15 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
We're pulling back all of our self-driving cars and editor. We regret the error.
01:11:19 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Yeah, Can statement number one I did five B, sir.
01:11:24 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
That's all that was.
01:11:27 - Paris Martineau (Host)
I did think it was really funny when they republished a story about Brandon Hunter, the former NBA player who had died unexpectedly at the age of 42, but they published it under the headline Brandon Hunter useless at 42.
01:11:41 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
No, there was another one where the guy was still alive. That's exactly what an AI would think. There was another one where the guy was still alive. He actually just traded.
01:11:49 - Leo Laporte (Host)
We can't use him anymore. Oh, that's totally what an AI would say. Yeah, I remember that when he was dead he was traded.
01:11:56 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
He was traded he was close, good grief.
01:11:59 - Paris Martineau (Host)
Not dead, dead to me.
01:12:03 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Yeah, so I mean it is seen in gloating a little bit on C. C's what happens when you don't use humans. But that is pretty bad, that's right.
01:12:14 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
Microsoft is making, I argue, often irresponsible use. They should have put chat GPT in search. You expect decent results. It's not hallucinations. It doesn't know facts. It's wrong to put it there. You say a nation, a chat GPT in search.
01:12:30 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
That's what you just said, yes. Is it okay Is it okay that Google puts Bard?
01:12:35 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
there. I think it's also bad. But Google does it a little bit differently. Where it's not the search engine, it's to the side, and all this is extra stuff and you can judge it Fair. I'm not saying that's a hell of a lot better, but it is at least different. Okay, I'll play in the game. Leo, we see you on the other camera.
01:12:56 - Leo Laporte (Host)
I'm getting ready for the next ad You're trying to. I'm getting ready for the next ad. I'm getting ready for the next ad.
01:13:03 - Paris Martineau (Host)
It's the time where you've got to be sending a tweet.
01:13:05 - Leo Laporte (Host)
It's supposed to be tweeting. No, I'm setting up my Leo on my new computer and we'll talk about my Leo, and just a little bit. But first a word from our other sponsor, melissa. Yay, oh, this week in Google, brought to you by the data quality experts Melissa. For over 38 years, melissa's helped companies harness the value of their customer data to drive insight, maintain data quality and support global intelligence. All data expires this is important to know about 25% a year. Having clean and verified data helps customers have a smooth air, free purchase experience. Bad data that's bad business In fact costs an average of $9 million every year.
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01:16:21 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
He's really good when he's on the Sunday show. He's very smart.
01:16:24 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Well, I forgot to put a link in, though, yeah, I'm stalling as I try to find it. Oh geez, he says that AI, open AI, is a lot more vulnerable than you think. Vulnerable to what Do you know, jeff, did you read it or did you? Did you find it?
01:16:43 - Lou Maresca (Other)
I put it in the article. Yeah, I have the article because I you have it now. Oh, yeah, I subscribe.
01:16:46 - Leo Laporte (Host)
He's in my omnivore. All the press money and awards in the world won't prevent open AI from the reality of competition.
01:16:57 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
Right. This is going to want to say before is that, you know, is open AI doing what it's doing with more power, bigger, bigger, bigger and cheaper? Because it's just they want to be ahead of our rate or because they're scared of who's going to come up behind them?
01:17:11 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Yeah, he quotes Michael Mignano of VC at Lightspeed, who says the trend is you start with open AI. Then the second step you build your product's model agnostic and you swap in any model and the experience stays exactly the same for the user. Then the third and final step you start training your own models and everything's proprietary in-house. And, of course, as you pointed out, open source is also going to be a threat, which is good.
01:17:36 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
I mean, which is great, but there's government forces trying to stop that. The EU is thinking of trying to outlaw open source AI and Missila is saying no, and John Lacun is really fighting the fight to say that we need benefit. Now you can argue that it's cynical on Meta's part. That's the only way they can keep up, like Amazon and like Android and Google, but I think it's also a matter of principle, Right? I think the story that I forgot I mentioned before is Law in 63. Is Microsoft making advances with small models? I think this is a factor too. Is that what holds the barrier to entry is well, my God, we have the entire world of all text ever done and it's really, really hard for you to beat. Well, if you could make small models and make them updateable easily and their open source, maybe there's not much room for a barrier to entry here.
01:18:30 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Yeah, this is from our good friend Reed Albergotti, writing at the SEMA for another regular on our shows. He says the most impactful advances in AI have been smaller open source models like Meta's Llama 2, which doesn't come close to beating GPT-B4 and GPT-4 and overall in performance, but its small size and its ability to be customized makes it a good option for a large swath of people. I think that's probably what these GPTs that open AI announced are in response to. Like well, hey, wait a minute, slow down. You can use us in a variety of ways as small models, I think it's a great area.
I mean there's just nonstop competition and that's good right?
01:19:16 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
Am I understanding this? That these smaller models are basically just more curated models? I'm not quite getting it.
01:19:24 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
As I understand it. Well, leo, you try first. You're smarter than I am.
01:19:28 - Leo Laporte (Host)
I can't see it. Well, I mean because, no, they're smaller in a couple of ways. You've seen Google talk so much about how it can compress models. Right, Everybody would like to put the models on your device.
01:19:41 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
01:19:41 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Google's got models down that are small enough you could put on the Pixel 8 and so forth, so that's one way you kind of compress them. The other is fewer tokens, simpler models that aren't as big as elaborate. They're also cheaper to generate, which is okay.
01:19:55 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
The big I still think cost.
01:19:56 - Leo Laporte (Host)
We've talked a lot about this with Richard Campbell on Windows Weekly because he's kind of big on enterprise computing and cloud computing. The big issue is going to be the cost of these models. Training these models is very expensive and running them is very expensive.
01:20:08 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
But that's the question is, once you know how to write, once you know how to do some of these basics and you have an open source version, then training them on a finite corpus, I think would be cheaper, right.
01:20:22 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Making them smaller cuts the cost as well. Absolutely. Yeah.
Yeah, absolutely. So that's certainly an area where people are going to push. I think it's very exciting. I mean, as I said, I've been an AI quite an AI skeptic for some time, but I do feel like there's some. I'm starting to see some real uses that you know. Even here at TWIT, we use them and they're quite, quite good. Not just for graphics, although that's been fun. A lot of it's been toys and fun stuff, but the show notes that we generate are quite good. There's a lot of value that we can, you know, especially when an AI is given a corpus of information so it can't make stuff up. That's the key. There's a lot of value in what an AI can do, and I could see, I could see in the years to come we're going to have all sorts of. We're going to have little AI buddies everywhere, don't you think, in our glasses frames yeah.
01:21:14 - Paris Martineau (Host)
What would you? I mean? I think that that's part of what is interesting about this stage in the discourse we're getting to. As I was on your side, I was very you know, hesitant and skeptic whenever everyone was saying AI is going to change everything about life and totally take over the world. But I think that, yeah, it's very reasonable and likely that AI is going to change a lot of little things.
01:21:37 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
Yeah, I like the idea of little buddy AI is that there's something that we can manage ourselves and not through some big company holding our hands yeah, everyone gets a clippy. Right, give me that, but let it be something that I can control and manage and store all of the information on it, not necessarily something that Google has its eye on. You know what I mean. Yeah, yeah.
01:22:01 - Paris Martineau (Host)
What would you use a little clip before Ant.
01:22:05 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
Remembering. Is that Paris Martin? Or is that Would you use?
01:22:10 - Leo Laporte (Host)
AI in your photography. Would you use AI in photo editing and processing? Yes, yeah, all the time. Already, luminar does some really amazing stuff.
01:22:19 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
Speeds of the process.
01:22:21 - Leo Laporte (Host)
They've had for a couple of years a program called Luminar AI which does things like if you're you know, I take a lot of pictures when you're traveling and it's a cloudy day, it's a cloudy day, You're not going to be able to stick around till it's a beautiful sky, but Luminar AI will put a better sky in your photo. Oh, there's the sky. Let me fix that for you. Boom, it's pretty amazing. It does a really good job. Or and we've seen that Google show this again and again removing parts of a picture, or or as we saw switching faces.
01:22:50 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
The Washington Post a week ago screamed about this this is the end. We're never going to know what's true again, and I went back and looking at one of the most famous portraits of Abraham.
01:22:58 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
Lincoln Dude, it has been stuff photoshopped for years.
01:23:01 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
Yeah Well, even back to Abraham Lincoln, one of the most famous portraits of Abraham Lincoln. He was standing up with a you know something there and a book in his hand. It's Abraham Lincoln's face, but it's infamous, horrible anti-abolitionist John C Calhoun body During the 1816 campaign as a Republican candidate.
01:23:28 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Rumors of Lincoln's ugliness proliferated the northern, I'm sorry. The New Bern weekly progress wrote that Lincoln was quote coarse, vulgar and uneducated. The Houston Telegraph opined he was the leanest, lankiest, most ungainly mass of legs, arms and hatchet face ever strung on a single screen frame, he has the most unwarrantably abused the privilege which all politicians have of being ugly.
So yeah, admittedly he wasn't the best looking fella ever, so this is an actual photo of Lincoln. But one way that they made him look better was to take this 1852 engraving of the famous slave proponent, john C Calhoun. Racist, a horrible man, yeah.
01:24:18 - Paris Martineau (Host)
Okay, but anybody could look good in an engraving.
01:24:21 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Well, they're not engraving someone to look bad, Bothered doing a new engraving. They just put Lincoln's head on him. Why?
do a hole in engraving when you can just chop off a guy's head and put Lincoln on it. So you're right. This has a. By the way, no one knew about this or noticed for a century. It was only recently this was revealed to be fake. Photojournalist Stefan Laurent was compiling photos of Lincoln for his book Lincoln, a picture story of his life published in 1957. When he noticed in the print, the mole on Lincoln's face was on the wrong side. Apparently this is how they do most sorry, continue. No, go ahead.
01:25:11 - Paris Martineau (Host)
I was saying this is how they do most movie trailer posters or a DVD box art back in the day is the actors often don't have time to stand for an extra shoot to kind of do the poses, so they have some other like B or C or D or F list actor come in, do the body part of it and then they Photoshop the actual actor's face on their body.
01:25:35 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
We'll never, know what you believe again.
01:25:37 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Were you a TV guide Did they put. Oprah's head on Ann Margaret's body. I just put that in discord.
01:25:45 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
I just put that in discord because I remember this this is like early nineties or late eighties or something like that and that was my first recollection of like wait a minute this is Photoshopped or something Terrible and making Ann Margaret black is just beyond.
01:26:07 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Oh, and that same Atlantic article has the Lincoln Calhoun thing. So this is a. This is a good article in the Atlantic about photo manipulation from a 2012 Megan Garber, oprah's head and Margaret's body a brief history of pre Photoshop fakery. Good article, good article. What else do they have?
01:26:28 - Benito Gonzalez (Guest)
It was also Stalin, right. Stalin was famous for deleting people from.
01:26:31 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Oh yeah, they would just snip out the people on each side until they were all gone. Yeah, here's an image of Ulysses S Grant mounted on a proud steed before his troops in city point, virginia during the civil war. Doesn't really look quite accurate. Turns out it's a composite of three separate images the head is from a portrait of Grant, the horse and body belong to Alexander McCook, the background from a print of Confederate prisoners, and then they put it all together and there he is.
01:27:02 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
By the way, you know how hard that was to do in a dark room. Yeah, that's, that's where it but still, that's work.
01:27:09 - Leo Laporte (Host)
It's a lot easier with Photoshop, isn't it? Yeah, yeah, here's. Here's Mussolini who traded horse handler for heroism. Oh, I see they cut out the person holding the horse of course, to make it look like Mussolini was stable on his steed. And yes, Benito, here is Stalin missing Gorky or somebody. He would frequently airbrush people out of the photos.
01:27:35 - Paris Martineau (Host)
Wow, stalin, he's just like us.
01:27:40 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
You mean, he can't? Imagine he just couldn't remember the guy, that's all. Spaces either.
01:27:45 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Yeah, that's a great article that predates this.
01:27:48 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
Well, if you go back when, I would go into the morgue at places like the examiner and get photos from the 20s and 30s, you know they were. They were retouched like crazy. Really, they're painted.
01:27:58 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Oh God, we should explain that in this case, a morgue is not where you find dead bodies, but dead.
01:28:03 - Paris Martineau (Host)
Yeah, I was about to say.
01:28:04 - Leo Laporte (Host)
01:28:05 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
Sorry. Yes, it was the library, yeah. I think most people know that. Can I? Can I point to a story I like, Leo? Yeah, because I'm pretty much out of steam yeah, I'm done. Line 58. Axios. Today a surveyed more than 200 academic AI experts and my favorite part of it is they can't stand AI CEOs why?
01:28:35 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
01:28:36 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
Because they think they are disingenuous, disingenuous and dishonest and untrustworthy, and so what that says to me is all these bozos and their test Creole. By the way, we have a major, major guest, I just found out from Jason on AI inside tomorrow, Emile Torres, who is the leading expert in test Creole and long-termism and all the crazy faux philosophies of these guys. So the nuttiness that they come out with rubs off badly on the whole brand of AI and nobody can stand them.
01:29:10 - Leo Laporte (Host)
I just want to thank you for working so hard on the SEO for that AI show because I think test. Creole expert is just going to sell that. Show that people are flocking.
01:29:24 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
Okay, I'll do it differently. Now you're going to find out exactly how crazy Elon Musk is. There you go there you go, why he thinks he should have so many babies and why he thinks that we should be on Mars, and why all these guys are not just nuts, but they are more dangerous than their machines. How's that by?
01:29:43 - Leo Laporte (Host)
the way, here is Joe Esposito's Thanksgiving card, AI inside. Yeah, here's Joe Esposito's Thanksgiving card. Apparently he is. He's put his head on a turkey, that's really good.
01:29:56 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
I'm assuming that's you, joe, that's him, that's him, okay, that's him.
01:30:00 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
Oh, that was in my mind's eye, because I have one. That was not Joe Esposito, that is him, that is him.
01:30:08 - Leo Laporte (Host)
All right, give me another line, mr Test Creole what? About the most unfortunate choice of acronym ever.
01:30:17 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
But there's so many crazy philosophies to stick in there.
01:30:21 - Leo Laporte (Host)
It's a real thing and I completely agree with you. It's an appalling thing. It's just. Long termism is probably better than test Creole, I think.
01:30:27 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
Yes, but there are variants on the theme Right. Well, here's the other one on two lines down is I didn't realize this the test Creole nut jobs are also big, not surprisingly, in the psychedelic pharma.
01:30:41 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Okay, I could have told you that.
01:30:43 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
Macrodosing. I think macro dosing Leo.
01:30:48 - Paris Martineau (Host)
They've got to be. Yeah, they're dosing, they're just dosing.
01:30:52 - Leo Laporte (Host)
I'm learning right now for the first time there's something called the Journal of Psychedelic Studies, which I kind of want to go to work for that and, by the way, to get a PhD. In that cover that is a colorful cover. Right there she fits. Yeah, I took a lot of acid, and not recently, I don't recognize faces?
01:31:18 - Paris Martineau (Host)
Maybe I don't know, but did you get visuals at the time? Did you see things? Good question, not when I close my eyes.
01:31:25 - Leo Laporte (Host)
No, I didn't hallucinate, but I would see you know you've done it Maybe. No, you probably too young, but you know you'd see you do this with your hand and you see, you see like a hundred of hands trailing out. Never saw that, John. You stare at the ceiling and it looks like it's a circuit board and it's kind of moving with like almost a lot.
01:31:45 - Paris Martineau (Host)
But you close your eyes and you wouldn't see all the colorful patterns. That's crazy.
01:31:48 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
That's normally after doing heavy squats or deadlifts.
01:31:54 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
Same, exact, that's ants, psychedelics, squats, dude.
01:31:59 - Paris Martineau (Host)
Just rigorous exercise.
01:32:01 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Too many squats, silence.
01:32:05 - Paris Martineau (Host)
No music playing.
01:32:06 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
What did you think of line my abs are?
01:32:08 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
six different colors oh threads is in a little bit of trouble.
01:32:13 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
Line 50 or 52. Oh, okay.
01:32:16 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Pick one. I was doing 52 threads is a little bit of trouble Because they don't own the trademark. In fact, worse than that, a software company called threads say that said that meta came to them, tried to buy the domain and when they said no, kicked them off Facebook. That's crazy.
01:32:32 - Paris Martineau (Host)
Yeah, because if you notice, threads is not threadscom, it's threadsnet, which I've always thought is so funny, and I guess it's because they can't get the dot com threads Software limited, a UK based software company, is threatening to sue.
01:32:47 - Leo Laporte (Host)
They've owned the threads trademarks since 2012. It makes it on you, yeah, good on you. Go after them. I hate it when companies steal your name Make money.
01:32:58 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
You know, there's another company that they mentioned there at the bottom American threads, that was getting confused when threads was oh, so this is a different company that was kicked off. Well, they no, no, yeah, they weren't. They were not kicked off, but they did go ahead and change their handle on the platform and I'm wondering if meta came to them say, hey, you know, we can't nudge nudge, can we have that?
01:33:20 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Here's a couple they were at threads and now they're at American threads, which probably is better, right? I don't know why you get so attached to the name threads. Surely there's other names that would have been just as good as thread.
01:33:33 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
Probably. The boss said he wants that name and everybody said okay, okay, we gotta get it for him.
01:33:36 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Yeah the Apple does this all the time.
01:33:38 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
I mean, they didn't own iTunes, they didn't own iPhone, but you know, when I was at Condat out, we wanted, we wanted to start a new site. So we started Epic Curious for Vogue, for Gourmet and Bon Appetit, so it was a new brand. And then for Vogue and Glamour wanted to start a new brand, we want to start stylecom. We had to buy it from a porn site, style, yeah. So somehow in those early days, you know, the smart ones were the porn sites always.
01:34:08 - Paris Martineau (Host)
Yeah, forbs had an interesting story this week about how Elon Musk and X or Twitter, I guess are now like trying to sell like single word handles for a high, like amount of money, for like tens of thousands of dollars. They're essentially taking them from people who've had the account, if they've been inactive or, in some cases, just haven't logged in a little bit, and they're trying to sell them off to the highest bidder.
01:34:36 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
Yeah, I mean, well, he does need that money back those.
01:34:39 - Leo Laporte (Host)
I'm glad I never had at Leo, because those were the handles that hackers always went aggressively against to hack. They were. They were real valuable as gamer tags. So I can. I can understand. I mean, they're trying to sell everything but the kitchen sink over there. I don't know.
01:34:57 - Paris Martineau (Host)
Oh, they did sell the kitchen sink, I believe. Yeah, you did see that.
01:35:02 - Leo Laporte (Host)
That's it. You did see that. They're there now considering creating a store for inactive Twitter handles $50,000 for so if you don't, use your for your dead aunt's Twitter.
01:35:14 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
Yeah, you don't use your.
01:35:15 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Twitter like Hollywood, they could take it away and sell it to somebody. I think it's probably those three names, three letter names, though that are the ones that they can think of. Some money for Google's gone to the EU and the Digital Markets Act to try to force Apple to open up iMessage. No more green bubbles. As you know, google's had a campaign for a long time saying you know, apple, don't be, you know, don't be a dog in the manger. Let us let us in. Now they're actually going, going ballistic on this, going legal on it. Google and a group of major European telcos sent a letter to the European Commission saying that, because Apple's iMessage is designated as a core platform service under the Digital Markets Act, it should be interoperable with other messaging services. That's one of the requirements. I think they might actually have ground to stand on here. That would be a very interesting thing.
01:36:18 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
So can you answer why RCS is so important?
01:36:24 - Leo Laporte (Host)
I don't think it's that RCS is important, I think it's just that interoperability. Google knows that one of the most Apple's actually in the Google versus DOJ case and another Apple lawsuit cases, we've learned that Apple actually has done a lot to prevent the success of Android. One of them I think I can't remember was it Eddie Q Said you know, we can't put messages on Android because then they won't, parents would buy Android phones for their kids. And then just recently we saw oh, my God, Apple being an anti competitor.
A slide in the trial that said Android devices are well. Was it spyware or you know? And then I mean it's all coming out that Apple has all along been really more afraid of Android than they've admitted. Remember, google was very afraid of Apple. Google had designed its first smartphone and then saw the iPhone for the first time and stopped and said, whoa, let's redo this. They went back to the drawing board. So both companies are very sensitive to each other and actually in a way that makes sense, because they basically divide the smartphone market half of its Android, half its Apple in the US.
01:37:40 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
So I ask about the importance or just how how much it means to have RCS versus SMS, because recently there was, you know, Queen Pearl had sent it out an SMS to the group and it was delayed and she went into her settings and saw that there was an option that says, okay, use quote SMS instead, and the messages were just flying through. But she also has a Samsung device and I later found out that there is something that's been going on with certain Samsung devices using I think it's the RCS and it's the carriers.
So that's why I was like, well, is this any better? No, it's terrible. What is the point and the importance of it, and why is Google so much behind it and trying to get Apple to be behind?
01:38:28 - Paris Martineau (Host)
I'm not trying to defend Apple. I mean, I guess I have a question of like I have a similar thing of whatever I have an iPhone, whatever I'm texting friends with the Android, like half the time pictures just won't go through on either way. Yeah, videos are weird. It's just a mess.
01:38:42 - Leo Laporte (Host)
I know why that is. And that happens because my daughter, of all of everybody in our family, is an iPhone, except for my daughter, who says I will never use an Apple device. So when I try to send pictures to Abby, invariably she says I can't see it, and it's because Apple uses a format for its pictures, the high efficiency image format. Ah, that the that the Android phone doesn't understand. And so what you have to do and almost always I have to do is both with movies, because they also have an HEVC, the high efficiency video.
That's awful with movies and pictures. I have to export those and put them in JPEGs or MP3 or what you know a format that she can understand, or MP4, and then send it to her as an attachment. She can usually get it.
01:39:34 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
But you can even send in pictures, or pictures or videos over SMS. Just seems weird to me.
01:39:41 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Well, that doesn't work at all. You have to use MMS and you have to turn that on. Yeah, it's not on by default on iPhones Right.
01:39:47 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
So what I've done is, whenever I want to send something like that to the group chat or what have you, I just create a link through Google Photos or something. Well, you know what people end up doing.
01:39:57 - Leo Laporte (Host)
They use WhatsApp. That's how they solve it and that's really what Apple's afraid of and it's also Apple's defense. Apple's defense is well, your honor. There's plenty of messaging apps People can use whatever they want, and it's true that WhatsApp doesn't interoperate with Telegram, which doesn't interrupt. I mean, you know these, these messaging apps are silos themselves, but almost everybody in the world uses WhatsApp, right, and if you want to, if you want to communicate with the broadest number of people, you just use WhatsApp, which I hate doing because it's meta. But what can you do? That's what everybody uses worldwide.
01:40:32 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
And there's a story today that Zuckerberg who said I'm going to keep hands off, meta basically is now finding business benefit in it. Oh, that's problematic. I don't know exactly how.
01:40:46 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Yeah, because they don't have ads yet, so that's interesting.
01:40:50 - Paris Martineau (Host)
That is very interesting actually.
01:40:52 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
01:40:53 - Leo Laporte (Host)
So that's one thing you should look at on Paris on your iPhone is go into the messages settings and make sure I've got MMS. Mms is enabled. Yeah, yeah, I think.
01:41:03 - Paris Martineau (Host)
Then it's just that I've got two different phone numbers on my phone, because I've got the signal number that you guys see here. It's my work number and I've got my personal number. So I I'm fiddling with those settings all the time.
01:41:15 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Yeah, and you can send signal to signal. You could send a movie or a picture and there wouldn't be an issue, I think.
01:41:20 - Paris Martineau (Host)
Yeah, no problem, you can send files, yeah.
01:41:22 - Leo Laporte (Host)
I think it's fine. It converts it yeah.
01:41:25 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
But for some reason, zuckerberg said if you're envisioning what will be the private social platform of the future, starting from scratch, I think it would basically look like WhatsApp. It'll be discord.
01:41:35 - Leo Laporte (Host)
We already know that Our club Twitter members I mean I don't know if you I mean look what Joe's doing in our discord. We can all see it.
01:41:45 - Paris Martineau (Host)
Wait, no, you got to scroll down a little bit, leo. There's some better ones, there's more, there's more.
01:41:49 - Leo Laporte (Host)
There's. Joe, as a tip you got to keep going. So to me this and, by the way, this is kind of like WhatsApp too. Right, this is a messaging platform. You could send pictures. Oh, here's one. There you go. Hey, I did a lot of acid, didn't seem to fit me it's got laser eyes.
01:42:11 - Paris Martineau (Host)
It's great I loved.
01:42:12 - Leo Laporte (Host)
I mean it's funny. I didn't really know anything about discord until we started using it for the club and I've come to really like it. And they add features all the time to this thing. It's free to use, which is amazing. I mean it's free for somebody to set up a discord server or to join another discord server. There are boosts you can buy that make it more powerful, but you can totally use this for free. It was a very smart move, for instance, for mid journey. Instead of having an app and creating you know an app with you know the mid journey capabilities, they created a discord channel and there's another advantage to that, which is you can see what other people's prompts are. It's a community of prompts.
01:42:58 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
I do like that you sort of learn what works, what doesn't work, and it's.
01:43:04 - Leo Laporte (Host)
You know, I you know if you'd go through it. So I love discord. Maybe this is a chance for me to mentioned that that is one of the benefits of joining Club. Twit Ant Prude is, of course, our community manager, so he makes sure it's a lot of fun Tomorrow in our Discord Stacey Higginbotham's book clubs Stacey, she said I can keep doing the book club. I keep doing that Kaiju Preservation Society's the book, that great John Scalzi book. Tomorrow you and Jeff Jarvis, you and Jason will talk with Emile Torres about Test-free now, test-free now.
01:43:38 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
And then hey, hey, hey, hey hey, hey, hey, hey, you make fun, it's the most important single topic in all of artificial intelligence. Forget all this other stuff. These boys are ruining the world, so we've got to talk about what makes them do it that sounds good.
01:43:51 - Leo Laporte (Host)
That's tomorrow, 1 pm Pacific. That's tomorrow Next week. Fireside Chat with our old host on Macrick weekly. Renee Richie, who is now creator liaison at YouTube, got big shot, so that should be a lot of fun. And then Jeff and I will join Doc Searles and Steve Gibson for our holiday show and Rod Pyle and Rod Pyle Nice. That will be December 7th, 5 pm.
Club members will get to see that. It'll then be the holiday show, I think Christmas Eve or something like that. So that's one of the benefits. The other benefit you get if you join the club is ad-free versions of all of our shows. You also get special stuff that we don't put out anywhere else, not just those special events, but like Scott Wilkinson's Home Theater, geeks and other stuff.
More importantly, this is really for, I think in fact I want to kind of talk about this with you all. I feel like the days of the free internet. It was a promise that we couldn't keep. Eventually, somebody has to pay, and it's either advertising or it's a paywall. We I love the idea that anybody who wants to listen to our shows can, and as far as I can, you know, as far as I'm able to we'll continue to do that, but advertising is no longer covering the costs, so we either have to cut back or we have to get you, the listeners, to come and join our club. $7 a month and it really supports what we're doing here. I think it's a fair price for all you get, but I understand not everybody can pay and I do want to keep it free as long as possible. But, honestly, advertising has just fallen off the face of us.
01:45:26 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
One of our friends watched Jason and me covering the open AI and came on right afterwards and said this is why I joined the club and, as I said back, every member matters. Yeah, yeah.
01:45:38 - Leo Laporte (Host)
So I invite you to join at twittv slash club. Twitter $7 a month, $84 a year. There's family plans, there's corporate plans. If you can't, I understand, it's no harm, no foul. But if you can, that would sure help us out. We really appreciate it.
01:45:54 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
And if you can't, at least be sure to tell someone about our shows and say, hey, go download Special this is one of my favorite shows. Tell it to all your friends and all your family, and at least one enemy.
01:46:07 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
Tell the enemy about TestGrid, one of the really good enemies network.
01:46:10 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Yeah, Sorry Paris. What did you say? Testgrid on that work I was just saying.
01:46:16 - Paris Martineau (Host)
I think we want a really good network of enemies listening to this podcast.
01:46:20 - Leo Laporte (Host)
I think Jessica Lesson was very brave 10 years ago when she started the information and it's paywalled. It's 100% paywalled. It's a lot easier.
01:46:29 - Paris Martineau (Host)
It's been 100% paywalled. I remember well at the time, I think a lot of news outlets, like Business Insider, I think, wrote all these snarky blogs. I'm like who's going to ever read a paywall publication $400? A year. No one's. This media company's never going to survive subscriptions, have they? Ever heard of that 10 years? Later, 10 years later, insider is trying to do the same.
01:46:51 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Yeah Well, and the thing is it's hard when you've been giving something away to suddenly charge for it. So Jessica was smart, she never gave it away, it was never free, and so there isn't that resistance to paying. We're kind of facing that We've been giving it away for 15 years and now we want you to pay. It's kind of hard to put up a paywall. I don't really want to do a paywall, but that's what I mean when I say I think the days of the free internet are numbered. Yeah, it just didn't?
01:47:21 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
Well, it'll always be a free internet. It'll be filled with crap, because that's where the disinformation will be, and crap you can find the mix of guardians and twits that can find ways to have some support. All that's the secret to the best internet we can have. And so when you join a club like Twitter, or when you give money to a guardian or you give to public radio, you are supporting something so that all may have it and the internet as a whole is going to be better.
01:47:51 - Leo Laporte (Host)
It's our fault. I mean, in the early days of the internet, there was this feeling Remember, apps were free, everything was free, and it was like, well, we'll make it up in volume. There was never a long-term plan for this, but we definitely created the impression that it didn't cost anything to do a website, that it didn't cost anything to do a podcast, and so we could give those away for free. But in fact it does cost money. It can actually be quite expensive, very, and the economics of it just failed and people really don't like advertising. I mean, there's a universal bias against advertising, ad blockers. I don't know, but I'm going to guess a few people who listen to our show skip the ads Right, please. How dare they? How dare they? I don't blame you for doing that, but people don't want to hear ads. But something's got to give. You can't and this is not a big plea break, pledge break for a club Twitter.
At this point, this is really kind of I'm thinking about this is really how does the internet continue? And people say to me well, I've got subscription fatigue. I understand that too. I subscribe to a surprisingly large. I mean not just the information, but Ben Thompson's trajectory and Bloomberg and PBS. You mentioned PBS.
01:49:17 - Paris Martineau (Host)
That's a bunch of podcasts. That's a thing I do pay to ask.
01:49:20 - Leo Laporte (Host)
But you find value in those. That's us after a while.
01:49:23 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
You find value in those. That's why you have subscribed to them, and when you don't find value in them.
01:49:29 - Paris Martineau (Host)
You won't. It's like the sort of thing where it's like I want these things to stick around, so I pay for them. I subscribe to a local weatherman on Patreon. Do you really Wow? New York Metro weather the best hyper local weather in the New York metro area. Would highly recommend you don't have to subscribe to him.
01:49:49 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
He's just on other things I don't know if that's top of what you mentioned last week, because, yes, I was listening to this show last week. Was it the game? What was that game you were talking?
01:50:01 - Paris Martineau (Host)
about oh, the network dropout.
01:50:06 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
01:50:06 - Paris Martineau (Host)
Was that what we were talking about. Yeah, that's fantastic.
01:50:09 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
I had no idea about that, and they're huge now.
01:50:13 - Paris Martineau (Host)
They are huge, they're expanding, they have hundreds of thousands of subscribers. They've been able to basically build a media empire.
01:50:21 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
Because it used to be college humor. Is that what it was?
01:50:23 - Paris Martineau (Host)
It used to be college humor, it used to be college humor and then essentially IAC fired everybody right before the pandemic. We're going to totally shut the site down. Then they sold it just kind of in name and rights, to one of the executives, this guy Sam Reich, and he's been building it back up ever since and now they have a small staff and they're making it work just through a full subscription model.
01:50:47 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Is that the future of media is like hyper and you said hyper local weather, but in a way this is hyper niche programming. Where people are very small. They're small, it's human scale. There's maybe only a few thousand people paying $10 a month, but that's enough to support it, to sustain it. Is that the future?
01:51:05 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
Yeah, and before the mechanization and industrialization of print, as I say in the Gutenberg parenthesis which you can buy at this account for GutenbergParenthesiscom, the average circulation of a daily newspaper in the United States was $4,000. Take $4,000. Imagine getting $10 a month and you have almost a half million dollars. That's big enough. That's quite big enough to do a lot of things. Is it big enough to be the insider? No, but can you be somebody serving an audience?
01:51:31 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Yeah, Do we need big publications like the insider or New York Times or the information?
01:51:40 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
I'm thinking no.
01:51:41 - Leo Laporte (Host)
I'm thinking no, we could have a little mom and pop, just a lot of mom and pop shops. Who is the nature of your hyper? Local weather guy. What's his name? How can I subscribe to him?
01:51:52 - Paris Martineau (Host)
NY Metro Weather. I think he's NY Metro WX on Instagram and Twitter. The thing I like about it is every day he'll post a vibe check and tell you between 0 and 10 what the vibes are going to be for that day. Wednesday's weather rating was a 5 out of 10. That was pretty accurate. It wasn't great. Yesterday, it was really lovely.
01:52:17 - Leo Laporte (Host)
It was 7 out of 10 days. That's a millennial weather report. The vibe man is 8.
01:52:22 - Paris Martineau (Host)
It's wow, the weather rating and there'll be some days where it's a 10 and he's like you got to go outside. It's phenomenal. Here's why.
01:52:30 - Leo Laporte (Host)
November 1 is a storm. I also really like it.
01:52:32 - Paris Martineau (Host)
The reason why I subscribe to the Patreon is he'll do these in-depth. You know, when you have a storm or something coming in, He'll do just like a little five minute video At the beginning of the day. I'd be like here's what we're seeing, here's what the things mean, here's what all the weather people are talking about. It kind of explains the science behind weather predictions and what you should actually expect in different areas. Really great.
01:52:52 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
I love weather geeks I know some and Brian Stelter loves storms. Brian Stelter, the ex-media critic at CNN, and he just loves this stuff.
01:53:03 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Oh wait a minute. He's pretty cute too, isn't he? Paris?
01:53:07 - Paris Martineau (Host)
OK, so that's the thing. This is not related to this, but one thing I think is very funny is that I've been following this guy for years and there came a time about a year or two ago where he realized that people could be thirsty for him online so we would start to post a photo of him in front of the weather thing like a selfie and it was like a weather man of thirst trap and I was like this is so funny.
01:53:32 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
Oh yeah, that's what you said, this is so funny.
01:53:38 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Oh, but yeah, I mean, that's exactly what I said. So you couldn't do this in Sioux City because there wouldn't be enough people. But in New York you can, there's enough people. You probably could do it in Tokyo, in Mexico City. That's pretty cool, any big metro if you're cute enough. And it's true, it's certainly health. Hey, you know what? It's a bad time. That's all I can say. He's actually he doesn't post his picture all over the place, so it's OK.
01:54:03 - Paris Martineau (Host)
No, it's very rare.
01:54:05 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Yeah, he's pretty good. In fact, he has four. He plays hard to get, he's not. This is a big operation. That's pretty cool.
01:54:13 - Paris Martineau (Host)
Yeah, there's a flat iron building.
01:54:15 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Do you see that? No, no, that's not. It's a fake flat iron. Yeah, you see that the flat iron building is going to be turning to condos Going condos.
01:54:26 - Paris Martineau (Host)
I've noticed because my office is right around the corner from it, so I'm always over there looking it's kind of sad, I guess that's. It's kind of sad, but there's not anybody in there, right?
01:54:35 - Leo Laporte (Host)
now? No, it's empty.
01:54:36 - Paris Martineau (Host)
I think it should be better that it's housing than a yeah housing, Very famous.
01:54:42 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
It's expensive housing.
01:54:43 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Famous building because it was built on a little triangle of land, so it's just a triangular building. We actually have one like this in San Francisco where Francis Ford couple is a Zoetrope. Offices are, but I guess office space is not great. Macmillan Publishers was in it, but then the pandemic hit.
01:55:04 - Paris Martineau (Host)
Nobody's been there since then and so On the ground floor at the very end of the triangle and where the points go to the part that you see. The photo of the ground floor is kind of it's all glass and for a while Cheddar News was in there and they'd be doing live broadcasts, but just with glass all behind it, so you could kind of go behind and cause mischief behind the newscast, which was very fun. That was my dream.
01:55:29 - Leo Laporte (Host)
That's what we wanted to do with Twit. We had a storefront, we had big glass windows. I really wanted to do that. I wanted to be like Cheddar News man. If I had the money, I would buy that building and that would be the Twit building. I tell you.
01:55:41 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
Well, I'll give you something you might be able to afford, leo, if you go to the Discord, the smallest piece of property in New York.
01:55:48 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Oh yes, this is quite famous the Hess triangle, famous, famous yes, it's a friend of a newsstand Property of the Hess estate which has never been dedicated for public purposes. Wow, what does that mean? Never been dedicated? I don't know what it means.
01:56:05 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
Stay off, don't use it in a office Right in front of a hot dog place.
01:56:09 - Leo Laporte (Host)
01:56:10 - Paris Martineau (Host)
I'm pretty sure there's a place you can get fries like two feet away from this? Yes, there is. Yes, there is.
01:56:16 - Leo Laporte (Host)
I love New York and I love the history of New York. I have to say what a great place. New York's smallest piece of private property, hess triangle. Hess triangle All right, it's a private. It's private land is a matter of principle. Yeah, people are so strange.
01:56:41 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
I got property in New York City when Right there.
01:56:46 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Got a triangle in front of a hot dog stand. What of it? Two by two, by two.
01:56:50 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
We haven't done Paris's great NFT story yet, oh yeah, shall, we watch some nerds dance the board Ape Yacht Club.
01:57:01 - Leo Laporte (Host)
As you may remember, yoga Labs was a big I guess still is a big NFT operation Cartoon pictures of apes that people would buy as an NFT and then hopefully somebody would come along and spend, give them more, even more money for the ownership. They had an event, the Ape Fest, in Hong Kong November 3rd through 5th with a concert. Apparently they were using UV lights on the stage. Now, uv is yeah, that's sunlight, and it was burning people's eyes. These are the people dancing. You know what's burning my eyes?
01:57:47 - Paris Martineau (Host)
The video is just a sea of men doing the weakest dance moves you've ever seen.
01:57:52 - Leo Laporte (Host)
There are literally no women in this whole thing. These are. You have to be a board Ape Yacht Club owner to attend the Ape Fest. Loser. And uh never attended a party before. That's not right. Is this the kind of party you go to Benita?
01:58:07 - Benito Gonzalez (Guest)
No, I'm saying, these people must have not. Oh, this is their first time.
01:58:10 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Yes, their first party. They don't get out much.
01:58:12 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
Nobody invites me anywhere. I finally got invited. I hate to make fun, but it's you schmucks, you're buying this.
01:58:20 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Well, it's actually quite serious because they got their eyes burned. Some of them woke up and couldn't see. Some of them had bad sunburns. Uh, you know, I don't know if you can blame you go labs for this Somebody. They probably hired a promoter to put on the event and the promoter was so stupid they put up. You're going to find out. The sun sun lamps on the stage, idiots, uh-huh, anyway, uh, it happened before in Hong Kong. It was used for the disinfection of equipment.
01:58:54 - Paris Martineau (Host)
So it was a very strong ultraviolet light.
01:58:58 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
Oh my gosh, it's the UVC, the ones they put in those little boxes, right.
01:59:03 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Oh yeah, you're not supposed to look at that. When you get your, you put your. We have one at home, you put yourself on and you close it, and then it comes on.
01:59:09 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
I'm not supposed to look at it. He has one.
01:59:10 - Paris Martineau (Host)
You have a UVC, you're not supposed to dance under it for hours.
01:59:14 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Oh yeah. John and I fell for this this was a Kickstarter. John and I fell for $100. Covid mask that this has UVC in it, so it has a thing. It weighs about three pounds, by the way.
01:59:29 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
Yeah, perfect for your face.
01:59:30 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Perfect to wear, and do you ever wear it anywhere? No, is this mine or yours? This?
01:59:36 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
is mine. I don't want to ask that before you put it on me.
01:59:42 - Paris Martineau (Host)
Can you even talk through it?
01:59:49 - Leo Laporte (Host)
But, he's safe now it has a fan and it blows the air it takes and it has this like this tube system inside and it goes past UV light for a sufficient amount of time to fully disinfect. So this is not an N95, this is an N100.
02:00:04 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
I remember you getting that and bumping the mic every time you tried talking.
02:00:12 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Oh, now I'm stuck. Yeah, you charge it up, though, right?
02:00:20 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
I like that hair Duleal. That's good, that's good.
02:00:22 - Leo Laporte (Host)
02:00:23 - Paris Martineau (Host)
Good luck what are you mocking me? Imagine being like oh sorry, my mask is out of battery.
02:00:30 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
No, no, no, no, no. You should leave it that way.
02:00:32 - Paris Martineau (Host)
No, lean into the bangs.
02:00:33 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
No, go into it, go into it, yeah, oh yeah, yeah, oh yeah, you can do the New York weather, what is?
02:00:40 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
that look, you went cross-eyed for a second.
02:00:45 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
What is this red thing I put in your head, Leo? Can you figure it out?
02:00:49 - Paris Martineau (Host)
Close your eyes. What is this?
02:00:52 - Leo Laporte (Host)
I took too much acid, I don't know. Oh look, a party it's about board apes.
02:01:01 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
I think I'll go. It's like fun. I love apes. Apes are good. Is there any more video of this? Now, what more video? As you found this, surely you can find some more.
02:01:12 - Leo Laporte (Host)
I don't like to make fun of people dancing. I don't either these guys are dancing. What about? The guys behind them are just standing there looking at the other guys dancing.
02:01:21 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
Yeah, well, that would be me. You're not a dancer.
02:01:24 - Leo Laporte (Host)
I'm not a dancer, so I'm just going to watch you. I dance like nobody's looking. That's my. That's my. That's what I've heard. I'm a broadcast like no one's listening and I danced like nobody's looking.
02:01:41 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
What is wrong with this here?
02:01:44 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
This is the great thing we're all willing to make fools of ourselves for the good of the show. Is that why I'm? Doing it, some of us.
02:01:53 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Good of the show. Huh, what else? Give me some stories, take the attention off of my hair.
02:01:58 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
What did I have? You went through my two.
02:02:02 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Two. I have put in like 50. No, I had two in there.
02:02:05 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
Was this more than they usually put in? I was very happy to see that.
02:02:07 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
What are your thoughts on that? What are your thoughts on Line 72?
02:02:10 - Paris Martineau (Host)
Wait, I put something else in here.
02:02:11 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
I'm sorry 72, as well as like Mr Salt Hank. What is this? What?
02:02:16 - Leo Laporte (Host)
is this? Tiktok is shutting down its $2 billion creative fund, of which Salt Hank got nothing. Oh yeah, never. He has two and a half million followers in TikTok. I asked him. I said you know they've got a creator's fund. You see any of that money? He said no, I don't know how it works out.
02:02:32 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
That seemed to be the sentiment of a lot of the creators according to this story. Yeah, this fund was out there, but the people that, if they got anything, it was next to nothing. And it sounds very familiar to what was once said about Instagram and Reels the people that were putting up Reels constantly, pretty much at the same time that they were doing TikTok videos. They were seeing next to nothing for us a revenue share, so they ended up going to YouTube. Shorts Because.
YouTube paid a little more, but either way it's still not a ton of money.
02:03:05 - Leo Laporte (Host)
You know I have real misgivings about it. It's kind of like Maggie's Farm, right, I ain't going to work on Maggie's Farm, no more.
02:03:12 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
I don't know what that is, sir. Did you just?
02:03:14 - Leo Laporte (Host)
age me out of the conversation.
02:03:16 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
Who is Maggie? What was this, maggie? And?
02:03:19 - Paris Martineau (Host)
Why did she own a farm? Does she have farm hands?
02:03:24 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
02:03:24 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Jenner these losing his mind off camera. I have an exercise for the audience.
02:03:28 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
We're getting into all the. Guthrie, though, speaking of farms.
02:03:31 - Leo Laporte (Host)
now your work what happened to Alice's Restaurant? Nothing let's talk about that. Is that in the rundown as well, what you can get anything you want at Alice's Restaurant. I know, and Bob Dylan said I ain't going to work on Maggie's Farm?
02:03:46 - Paris Martineau (Host)
02:03:47 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
Am I having a stroke? I swear this is the most ADD ever.
02:03:54 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Just a couple of hits from my asset playlist. Okay, don't mind me. Oh it's just, I feel like by now everybody should understand when you're creating content for the man, the man is not going to pay you unless he has to, and the man apparently doesn't have to pay you, right?
02:04:21 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
If it's their platform, I guess it does, it can backfire.
02:04:24 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Remember Vine, and in fact Taylor Lawrence has a great chapter on the Vine saga which I wasn't even really that aware of. I knew it shut down shortly after Twitter took over Vine, which was those four second things. People were becoming huge Vine celebrities.
02:04:41 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
You talk before I take a picture Huge mansions they were getting for them.
02:04:46 - Leo Laporte (Host)
And they went to Twitter and they said dudes, we're making you all this money and Twitter did not acknowledge them, they did not compensate them and eventually, all these guys eventually left for TikTok and other waters. But are you surprised? The same thing is happening at TikTok now, or it's going to keep happening Because somebody figured it out. Oh, the best thing to do is get these suckers to create great content for us and in great quantity. This was the difference between we've talked about this before Quibi and YouTube. Quibi was Hollywood's idea. It was done on the Hollywood model. You hire the best talent, they make great content and then you charge people to see that content and it failed in months.
Versus. Silicon Valley's idea was you make it easy for people to upload. You get everybody to upload. We don't care if it's good content or not, because a good content will rise. We algorithmically promote it so that people see it. Now you've got something people actually watch. You can monetize with advertising and give as little as possible back to the creator. Here's one more thing you do you make sure you take a handful of creators and make them rich, because it's just like Las Vegas Just enough of a carrot to say hey, you put a billboard up right in front of Las Vegas saying you just won a million dollars on the slots.
You can win. I got a chance, but most people lose their shirts. That's how you build Las Vegas. It's the same thing. Youtube does this relentlessly, and PewDiePie and all the people who make millions, and you say, look how much they're making. And you give a whole generation of people the notion that they can make a living as influencers.
02:06:25 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
Well, speaking of that, what are your thoughts on Line 74 from Taylor Lorenz, with camps teaching kids to be YouTube tubers Perfect example.
02:06:36 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
It is and it's the same. She's doing just such great work following the book about the business of all this and it's sweet. Kids can make YouTube and they can do stuff. But here's the thing it's not just about. Well, youtube is going to rub blood. The kids all say I'm doing this because I want to be rich. Seven year olds saying I'm doing this because I want a lot of money. That's our society, that's what we've done to them. Oh boy, yeah, yeah.
02:07:00 - Leo Laporte (Host)
And you know. The real truth is there. Tiktok ain't going to give you any money and YouTube isn't going to give you any money. There's not, unfortunately. We did the same thing to kids in the inner cities when we said you could become an NBA star. Yeah, you can go pro and ball. Yeah. And you know what the NBA got some great players out of that they did, because if you have a million kids all playing basketball as many hours as they can, a few are going to rise up. They're going to make millions.
02:07:28 - Paris Martineau (Host)
The 1% not even 1%, yeah, and then you get to you know, reap the rewards from having people do hundreds and hundreds of hours of unpaid labor to practice for it. And then you know, dance for you at training in the hopes that they'll hit it big.
02:07:42 - Leo Laporte (Host)
I ain't going to work on Maggie's farm no more, never worried of it, sir.
02:07:48 - Paris Martineau (Host)
Maggie doesn't pay. Maggie needs to pay her employees above minimum wage.
02:07:53 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
Oh, I'm sorry, mr Jarvis, you said Bob Dylan. Yeah, let me make sure I pull him up on my Spotify.
02:07:58 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Well, wait a minute. Rage against the machine also did a copy, bob Dylan. You can listen to the Beastie Boys version of it.
02:08:04 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
Oh yeah, beastie Boys. Yeah, let me pull them up too.
02:08:07 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Yeah, the Beastie Boys said Washington Windows on the Bowery at a quarter to four because he ain't going to work on Maggie's farm. No more Sure.
02:08:20 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
Listen to either of these, bob.
02:08:21 - Paris Martineau (Host)
Dylan is older than Joe Biden.
02:08:23 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Is he really oh my, no one's older than Joe Biden?
02:08:28 - Paris Martineau (Host)
I didn't think so, but apparently Bob Dylan is the one. Two years. He's got two years on.
02:08:34 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Biden Is that the new metric? What? Was the older than. Joe Biden. How old is he? He's older than Joe Biden. You know Donald Trump's only four years younger than Joe Biden. It's not like he's a kid, but he's got this vision. He was smart. He created an image of vigor. You can never make posters of you as a Superman and stuff and people forget that you're just as decrepit as anybody else. I ain't going to work on Maggie's farm. He's got bones first.
02:09:03 - Paris Martineau (Host)
He can't walk long distances.
02:09:06 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
I wake up in the morning, fold my hands and pray for rain. I got a head full of ideas that are driving me insane. It's a shame the way she makes me scrub the floor. I ain't going to work on Maggie's farm, no more.
02:09:19 - Leo Laporte (Host)
It's a lesson for everybody that Maggie's brother who makes money.
02:09:25 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
Okay, no, I ain't going to work for Maggie's brother, no more.
02:09:28 - Paris Martineau (Host)
Maggie is a bad boss.
02:09:30 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
Well, he has you a nickel, he has you a nickel.
02:09:33 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
Maggie is in violation of US labor law. Where's Oshah and Maggie buddy? Yeah.
02:09:39 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
He asked you with a grin. If you're having a good time, then he finds you every time you slam the door. I ain't going to work for Maggie's brother, no more.
02:09:48 - Leo Laporte (Host)
See, it's like the Tennessee Ernie Ford song oh my soul to the cup. It's a story.
02:09:56 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
Maggie's paw. I never saw this one, Leo. Oh, it's the whole family. This is.
02:10:01 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Maggie's paw. Now it's baby shark. It was baby shark for the 60s.
02:10:08 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
He puts a cigar out in your face, just for kicks. His bedroom window is made out of bricks. The National Guard stands around his door. I ain't going to work for Maggie's paw, no more. Jesus, what a weird. Man employment lawyers should have been salivating.
02:10:24 - Paris Martineau (Host)
I could just say For often at the mouth, to go after Maggie's family.
02:10:28 - Leo Laporte (Host)
As a child of the 60s tripping balls those lyrics spoke to me so much.
02:10:35 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
Since then they spoke to me.
02:10:37 - Paris Martineau (Host)
You're like wow, I really like the lesson.
02:10:39 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Why do you think I created a podcast network? Because I wanted to be Maggie. You wanted to be Maggie, you wanted to be the man. I wanted to be the man, I respect that.
02:10:48 - Paris Martineau (Host)
I'm trying to imagine a version of this song about you and your son the TikToker, Uh-huh.
02:10:54 - Leo Laporte (Host)
You know Henry did work here for a while. He worked at sales for a couple of years here. Oh, hey, hated it. I didn't know this, but later he said oh, you had to go home, cry every day, oh, no, are you serious?
02:11:05 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
I didn't know that.
02:11:07 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Well, but the lesson learned was I don't want to work on Maggie's paw, no more. The lesson learned was I don't want to do sales.
02:11:15 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
Sales is hard, sales is hard Work. Sales is hard, sales is really hard.
02:11:19 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
And if you were going to inherit this business, you're going to inherit the business.
02:11:22 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Well. I think that that was the reason he wanted to work here is he really did want to kind of follow in my footsteps and inherit the business and take it over, and I said that's fine, you can. It's good that you learn the business from the ground up. And here's the hardest part of the business is making money. And he learned. But he also learned you know how to be an influencer and he's done very well. He's done well, yeah.
02:11:44 - Paris Martineau (Host)
So did he ever do podcasting?
02:11:47 - Leo Laporte (Host)
He has a podcast. Yeah, I mean, I think his biggest efforts were, as you know, cooking on Tik Tok and then Instagram and now YouTube. He does a lot of YouTube short films, short films, and really you don't make money on any of that stuff, it's all to promote something else.
Exactly so in his case he's going to do a salt lovers club, he's going to sell salt, he's got merchandise, he's got a cookbook coming out next year and all that stuff. That's what you. That's, that's how you turn that into money, because it's just fame, it's not money.
02:12:18 - Benito Gonzalez (Guest)
And that's the part that all the influencers miss, that's the part that all of them Absolutely who, who, you know, how you know the biggest money makers on YouTube aren't making money.
02:12:27 - Leo Laporte (Host)
I mean, some of them are I guess Mr Beast makes his money from YouTube, but most of them are selling makeup right or selling a product of some kind or doing their own internal advertising. Marquez gets a lot of money. Marquez Brownlee adds on his network, or hundreds of thousands of dollars. They're very, very expensive. I'm guessing his CPMs are pretty good too, yeah.
Yeah, well, they are, because he, you know, and I have my misgivings about YouTube numbers I think they're highly inflated but he has millions of views on every uh he sticks very close to the gadgets, yeah. Which it makes me cry because, uh, we briefly podcasting was the next big thing and that's all over. It didn't last. I'm going to hang in there. We're still here. I'm going to hang in there until still swinging down, until they pull the plug on the until I get my next book out, so I can promote it here.
02:13:24 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
Yes, just for.
02:13:26 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Jeff, that's all I want. All right, let's take a little break and then, uh wait, we haven't done the changelog, have we? No, let's do a quick changelog, here we go.
02:13:34 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
The Google changelog.
02:13:40 - Leo Laporte (Host)
YouTube is introducing AI as a comments summarizer and conversational tool. That's screw you, no, screw you yeah.
02:13:52 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
Don't you want your own biggest?
02:13:53 - Leo Laporte (Host)
problems on. Youtube is comments, isn't it? Right, that's gotta be ugly yeah.
As part of the package available to paid subscribers. Youtube users will be able to try out a new conversational tool that uses AI to answer questions about the content and make recommendations, as well as try try a new feature that summarizes topics in the comments of a video. Um, I don't think. I want that to get this, you'll have to go to youtubecom, slash new, uh, you have to be a premium subscriber, which I am, uh, and then you can try these various experimental features. Comments who cares? Right, that's a big problem.
02:14:31 - Paris Martineau (Host)
Who wants comments to be sub summarized?
02:14:34 - Leo Laporte (Host)
I turned it on. I don't actually know. I suppose I should go to a video and see I turned it on a long time ago. Uh, I could see those some real value. For instance, one of the things I hate about YouTube and it's the algorithm promoting this is I'm going, I search. How do I reset my iPhone? Oh, there's a YouTube video to do it. Oh, 15 freaking minutes, yeah.
Somebody says hit the button, do the thing. Oh, and I think, oh, this is going to be. It's really good weight you won't believe. And then you know, the little juicy nugget you need is like three quarters of the way in. Good luck finding it. Well, if an AI could summarize that in a little text field at the bottom, count me.
02:15:16 - Paris Martineau (Host)
Okay, I will say yeah, as a person who famously doesn't watch YouTube videos. If I ever get in that situation and I try every other option for him and go to the YouTube video. I then just look at the transcript which is on the side and scroll through it with the video off. So yeah, if they could summarize that let me see.
02:15:32 - Leo Laporte (Host)
This is a salt Hank's living. My best recent YouTube video this is his Western bacon cheeseburger that he's building. That's my boy. Get him. Let me see if are there summaries. Um, these are all very nice, but I don't. Where's the?
02:15:49 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
by the way, he gets constant proposals of marriage Shocking in here A man that can cook, yeah, yeah, a good looking man Wow.
02:16:00 - Leo Laporte (Host)
I you know, we've never gotten so many good comments on our stuff.
02:16:03 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
Holy cow, we got to talk about food more.
02:16:06 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Yeah, clearly, but I don't see any comment, I don't see a button for summaries or anything. I don't know Anyway.
02:16:14 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
Similar to Miss Paris. When I'm looking at videos like that, I look at the progress bar and there's usually a little spike of what's been replayed the most nine times out of 10. If it's something I'm looking for, that's probably the spot that I jumped to and it usually does answer the question.
02:16:30 - Leo Laporte (Host)
That's good, but that's new too. They've added those chapter markers and stuff like that. Um, okay, I'll tell you a little secret here he's in his mom's kitchen using his mom's queasy and art ladies taking away the magic here.
Look at that color grading. I don't know what he's making. Here Are those onions? Oh, there's a little salt? Oh, no way, what is that? Oh, I don't know. You're going to have to watch it, folks, to know what he's up to. He's a. He's a clever fella. Oh, he's making his own barbecue sauce. I think there's some wish to shish shish shire. What's this here sauce? It's a bush to. Oh, he's doing it on an induction burner too. Look at that. He's fancy. Oh, you know what it? Probably it's a sponsors product. Everything in here is a sponsors.
02:17:23 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
Um huh, all right, cheeseburger or something. What was that? It's the best.
02:17:27 - Leo Laporte (Host)
It's the best Western bacon cheeseburger ever. What is he doing? Oh, so that was all the.
02:17:32 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
he made it Um those are the onion rings.
02:17:36 - Leo Laporte (Host)
That's what he's making his onion rings. Those are onion rings, those are onion rings, not whole onions, chopped up onion rings.
02:17:42 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
Minced onion. That's weird, that's weird.
02:17:46 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Well, go, all everybody go watch that. So that's one of the new features which I didn't see. Uh, the conference, the conventional tools responsible to be generated by a large language, models that drawn information from YouTube and the web. To help viewers dive in deeper, they are adding a button. This is the. This is the silliest button ever that says I don't care, just play something next.
02:18:08 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
No, just play Just it's like a big Okay, I take that back. That was easy. It's not, it's not for everybody, but somebody would want that. It's like a right here. Here's your watch that.
02:18:19 - Leo Laporte (Host)
You know they want that. They said just give me a button.
02:18:22 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
I don't want that but some people do. I mean, spotify is doing it with its little AI DJ essentially, yeah, and you just hit that's right and it, and it picks something.
02:18:33 - Leo Laporte (Host)
If it does it, if it did it well, it'd be great.
02:18:35 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
Wouldn't I dig it for the most part. Every now and then I have to tell it and know you got this wrong, but most of the time it does a pretty good job for me on discovery or going back and pulling up stuff that it calls my classics, because I'm in a vibe or whatever the hell. It says Some crap I don't understand.
02:18:51 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Oh, here's a new feature in ways. I love you know ways has always warned you about it. There's a speed camera, speed trap ahead or accident ahead. Now it'll say ahead is a road that people tend to have accidents on. It will warn you when you're driving on a road with a history of crashes. Who gave it that?
02:19:07 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
day there's Tesla's running over children ahead.
02:19:13 - Paris Martineau (Host)
Wow, there's a GM cruise ahead.
02:19:16 - Leo Laporte (Host)
History of crashes. That's wild History of crashes. Next one mile they're not going to do it on roads you drive every day because you presumably you'll freak you out Right.
02:19:26 - Paris Martineau (Host)
Too many One would assume that that would be exactly where you'd want that.
02:19:31 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Yeah right, this is based on reports from the Waze community, including historical crash data. That's wild. Google Chrome is going to get a quick way to see how much memory each tab is using. Chrome is a notorious pig, as everybody knows, in memory and CPUs. That's still the case. I don't use Chrome. I think they're always working to get it better, but this is going to let you know how much memory.
02:19:56 - Paris Martineau (Host)
Yeah, let me see the Discord tab I've got open right now for ClubTWIT is using 63 megabytes.
02:20:03 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Yeah, see, there you go, Isn't?
02:20:04 - Paris Martineau (Host)
that interesting Whoa Insider 104.
02:20:07 - Leo Laporte (Host)
So you have this feature already. You have this, yeah.
02:20:11 - Paris Martineau (Host)
I've had this for like a week or two, maybe more. It's been on my Google Chrome. I noticed, because I this is something very useful for me as someone who got. When I got my new MacBook last year, I got as much like RAM as possible because I have so many Google Chrome tabs open at all times.
02:20:28 - Leo Laporte (Host)
And if you've been waiting for Google's new search generative experience, it is now available in 120 new countries and territories. It's basically AI generated search results. Yes, so it's currently in the US, India and Japan. It's adding countries and territories in Latin and South America, Sub-Saharan Africa and Asia and Pacific. Go to Google Labs to sign up for it. It's another one of those experiments. Has anybody used SGE? I don't think I ever got invited.
02:21:02 - Benito Gonzalez (Guest)
I keep getting pitched that Every time I search on Google. Now they pitch it to me Really. I keep saying no.
02:21:09 - Leo Laporte (Host)
I'm cool. I feel like the future of searches is somehow AI related. No, no way, because, oh, you have to do it on mobile, oh no, on the desktop or the Google app on your phone. No, I'll pass. Yeah, I'm using Firefox?
In what way? Because what is a search? But asking for a bunch of links to something that answers a question? Right, and if you could have the AI, instead of going to those links, say a summary of what? In other words, it's basically Google saying don't go to sites, just we'll answer the question, which I think if I was the site, I'd be unhappy.
02:21:53 - Benito Gonzalez (Guest)
Yeah, I still want to go to the site and read the expert's opinion.
02:21:56 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
Yeah. I want to go to the site.
02:21:58 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Yeah, okay, Hopefully there's a question to the site, to the top. You don't need to go to the site. Well, google does that already right, they just show that.
02:22:07 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
They put the cards on the side.
02:22:09 - Leo Laporte (Host)
He's old man, but he's not as old as Biden, that's true, you people are. I'm a what two-thirds of a Biden. Should we make a Biden be the new age unit.
02:22:21 - Paris Martineau (Host)
It's the new age unit, oh God.
02:22:25 - Leo Laporte (Host)
So you're a quarter of a Biden. Paris, and you're about a half a Biden. I'm about a half. Jeff and I are about 75% of a Biden.
02:22:36 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
What's the actual math? Is it a BD or a JB?
02:22:42 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
It's a BID a bid.
02:22:45 - Leo Laporte (Host)
You're an old biddy. You've heard that before.
02:22:47 - Paris Martineau (Host)
That's where it comes from 30% of a Biden.
02:22:50 - Leo Laporte (Host)
You're 30% of a Biden.
02:22:52 - Paris Martineau (Host)
There you go.
02:22:53 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Jeff, do you want to do the math and tell us no.
02:22:55 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
He said no B. I don't want to know.
02:23:00 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
02:23:01 - Leo Laporte (Host)
I don't want to fall into this trap because, yeah, he's old, but he's doing a good job and people don't like him because he's old, but I got bad news for you. The alternative isn't going to be much younger and is not going to be any, is not going to be better.
02:23:18 - Paris Martineau (Host)
I don't know, you can't take away from us the greatest American pastime, which is hating on our presidents. This is something the whole country gets to do. It brings us together. Freedom, baby Freedom. I hate it. Every person. People were hating on him for his gangly weird arms, they shot him.
02:23:35 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Are you kidding?
02:23:36 - Paris Martineau (Host)
Yeah, they did. They shot him, they did do that. They did that, they did like his arms.
02:23:42 - Leo Laporte (Host)
They killed the man. Yeah, they did. But yeah no, I hate. You know what? I hated every president, because that was my youthful exuberance, until Obama, and then I loved the man.
02:23:53 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
But I think Well then, my left wing friends couldn't stand Obama. I thought I voted for Hillary Clinton versus Obama. I thought, oh, change, change, change, change. What's the big deal? But he came in, he was. I thought he was great, I was delighted with him. But my leftist friends who supported him were all disappointed because he didn't get this done and this done and this done and this done. Yeah, and that's what I heard.
02:24:16 - Paris Martineau (Host)
Well the thing is, you got to keep your expectations low. Exactly Outlook on life is cynical.
02:24:21 - Leo Laporte (Host)
It's not like you're a dictator where you can go in and say, well, we're going to fix everything.
02:24:25 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
I just don't want to pay damn near $7 for a gallon of petrol. I do not.
02:24:31 - Leo Laporte (Host)
I think he could blame the A-Rabs for that.
02:24:33 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
That's all I wanted.
02:24:35 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Remember in the heydays of the late 2000, 0019, where Obama is your new bicyclecom. Do you remember this website? No, what is this? No, yeah, you click it and you get something new.
02:24:54 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
I've never seen this.
02:24:56 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Barack Obama sent you flowers. Barack Obama added you as a friend. Barack Obama rescued you from drowning. Barack Obama offered you his seat. Oh, followed you on Twitter, dedicated a song to you. Page your speeding ticket. Sure, this was the whole website. Was this Wow?
02:25:15 - Paris Martineau (Host)
See, we need more websites like this, just absolutely no.
02:25:19 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
Also known as S-Posting this is how the web was back in the day this was it.
02:25:25 - Paris Martineau (Host)
Listen, I got a pic that is related to this. Oh, good.
02:25:29 - Leo Laporte (Host)
And then again the site was free. They didn't make any money, but they published a book. Oh my gosh. So there you go.
02:25:38 - Paris Martineau (Host)
With a haunting cartoon of Barack Obama. Truly upsetting oh, it's Matt Honen.
02:25:46 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Oh, that's hysterical, that's so funny.
02:25:48 - Paris Martineau (Host)
It's Matt Honen.
02:25:50 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Oh, what a hoax.
02:25:54 - Paris Martineau (Host)
He was stoned while making the website.
02:25:57 - Leo Laporte (Host)
What is Matt up to now? He wasn't wired.
02:25:59 - Paris Martineau (Host)
I don't know, Isn't he, he's uh, is he at MIT Tech Review?
02:26:05 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Oh, he might be. They've got a lot of people at. Let me see it.
02:26:10 - Paris Martineau (Host)
Here's his editor in chief at the Tech Review. Yeah, he's the editor in chief at the Tech Review. Mit Tech Review.
02:26:15 - Leo Laporte (Host)
They have turned that around. That was a very boring place and then and actually I subscribed to it, I paid for it because it's got they have great stuff in here. Great stuff, all right, let's take a little break for our last convertible of the of the hour and then your first new bicycle. Did I, did that make sense what I just said? I?
02:26:42 - Paris Martineau (Host)
don't think it did.
02:26:43 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
No, not at all Okay.
02:26:45 - Paris Martineau (Host)
Just take another tab. Take another tab of acid, anymore acid.
02:26:50 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Our show today, brought to you by my Leo I am. You know. This is what I was doing when you caught me looking over at my laptop. I was putting my Leo on my new computer. My Leo is the ultimate digital asset management tool for not just your photography but your videos, in fact, for all your documents, but they call it my Leo photos because that's the first thing you're going to do with it. My Leo is the solution to managing. I have I'm just looking 200, two, I mean here's the count, and, by the way, I just installed it and already all the photos are on here 207,000 photos from my Leo photos.
I love this. Now they're not on there in the original. They have thumbnails and if I want, I can make it be the originals. Here's the deal you can now use my Leo photos to backup photos from Instagram, from Facebook, from Google photos, from Apple's photos, and put it all in one place. D Dupit, make it all available to you and then it assigns automatically in the background AI smart tags so it's easy to find. You tell it like that's my wife, that's Paris, that's aunt, and it will find all the pictures of those people in there. I have a whole big folder of ant photos. I take photos of you a lot and, I guess, whole big photo of ant photos. It's so cool. It does this automatically and it doesn't do it on the cloud and that's what's great about this. My Leo photos lets you store and collaborate and share and edit all your photos without having to store them in the cloud.
With their new spaces tool, you can easily determine what's visible and what's not, which means you can share collaborations at work or with the family. They could see the photos you wanted to see and not all of your photos. You can create custom categories Right into a quick collection that's quick to share. Other my Leo photos users can then use it to collaborate on editing, managing and sharing media. So remember, we used to do this with Google Photos. We did it in the cloud. You go to a wedding Everybody share. Now with my Leo, you don't have to put it on Google's cloud. My Leo will synchronize them all automatically and you can keep the spaces private with a password or a pin. It's completely secure. If you decide you want to back up into the cloud, my Leo supports that. Whether it's OneDrive or Google's Drive, it'll encrypt it before it goes up there, so nobody can see it but you. And if you get the my Leo Photos Plus subscription, as I have, you can put my Leo on everything. So it's on all my devices, all my phones, all my computers. Just got a new computer. I put my Leo on there, so they'll have all my photos on this computer too. And because I made, I decided because I wanted to do this as a way of backing up my photos. I got a lot of storage on here, so I have all of the originals on this laptop, don't have the same amount of storage on my phone, so I only have thumbnails on my phone. I have a little bit more storage on the other laptop, so I have thumbnails and reduced you know, you know, compressed versions of it, and then if you want to edit the original, you can download it from any other machine Again without using the cloud. All my devices can connect in one library with no cloud storage required. I think this is an amazing solution the auto tagging, the searching, the sharing, and look what they've done. They've actually put all my photos into a calendar so I can see each month of every year and see the photos from that day.
Part I just. I think my Leo Photos is fantastic, and I haven't even started to touch the aspect that you can do it with documents to. It has built-in OCR so it'll also keep track of all your documents, and auto tag based on the text content in the documents. Here's the deal. I should have told you this up front. It's free. I think you probably now don't believe me, but you can use my Leo today for free. Try all the features. What you're missing is the my Leo Photos Plus, which puts it on all your devices. Just download it it's free and see what's getting me so excited.
Myliocom slash Twitter. Get my Leo Photos on your computer or your mobile device. Start with one device Myliocom slash Twitter. Myliocom slash Twitter. Download it for free, though, right now, so you can see what it can do. It's really you know. I've tried them all Adobe Pekasa back in the day, google Photos, microsoft's photo solution. I've tried them all and this is the one. This is absolutely the one. Mylio Photos at Myliocom slash Twitter Quick. Thank you, mylio. I think we can wrap this show up with our picks of the week. Let me start with you, paris Martino.
02:31:45 - Paris Martineau (Host)
Yeah, let me get over here. Yeah, so I've got a couple. One pick of the week I have here is this really cool site called gift cities org.
02:31:58 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Which is actually mean Geo cities.
02:32:00 - Paris Martineau (Host)
No gift cities, but it is like Geo cities. The Internet archive essentially took all of the have all of them safe. They have to tear about all the animated.
That has come from every Geo city and so you can search. So one thing I like to do is search the word skeleton on here. A bunch of different spooky skeletons come up, but then you click on them and it will take you to the Geo city page and then you know what you needed from what I've had fun. Going through all of this if you go on to skeleton and that little spooky guy who's like, who's like this creep?
02:32:43 - Leo Laporte (Host)
02:32:47 - Paris Martineau (Host)
It takes you to a really fun Geo city page.
02:32:52 - Leo Laporte (Host)
I am question mark and we are about to go an adventure into the mirror world.
02:32:57 - Paris Martineau (Host)
It was amazing like adventure thing that actually works, like you can click on that door and go on.
02:33:02 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
It's amazing what people do. This person is now an accountant somewhere.
02:33:06 - Paris Martineau (Host)
Yeah, this person now works for the IRS.
02:33:08 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Yeah, oh, this is a great find. Wait a minute, let me do mail, because, remember, you couldn't have a website under construction. Under construction, there's gotta be a million of those. Let me do that, yeah, yeah, obviously, benito did has a little bit of web design experience. Everybody has that. They had the opening closing mailbox. They had the shovel oh, now it's doing. He did email first, now it's doing under construction. Oh, look at all of these, the guy with the jackhammer. I want to make a site with all of these now. No, you don't.
02:33:46 - Paris Martineau (Host)
Oh, yeah, that's right, we're looking at it, but like I want to find, I love it because you can click on it and it'll take you to all these cool different Geo cities sites.
02:33:56 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Oh, somebody at the internet archive had a great time writing this. Wait a minute. How does this visible underwear have anything to do with under construct? Oh, I guess under here's the classic head banging on the computer. I Don't understand the language, so I'm gonna back out of that one. That's hysterical and these are from ancient times like 2004.
02:34:22 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
This was what we did. The internet was so cute different On the construction.
02:34:31 - Leo Laporte (Host)
This page is copy protected. Try right click your mouse unauthorized Documents here are copy protected. You must get a license for the webmaster nice try webmaster webmaster.
02:34:45 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
Were you a webmaster.
02:34:47 - Leo Laporte (Host)
I was a webmaster. Yes, the God. This is Filipino. Yeah, yeah, oh yeah. Disclaimer the webmaster is not liable for any plagiaristic contents, If ever that could be found here. The author strongly stated that these articles are original and a product of his creativity strongly stated. I strongly state that man, we, this was a different time. Yeah, kids, you didn't know, and back in the day the internet was so fun.
02:35:19 - Paris Martineau (Host)
So this is back in the day gif gif cities.
02:35:23 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Are you a giffer or a giffer? I'm a giffer. Yes, I knew.
02:35:27 - Paris Martineau (Host)
I like if cities, uh gal, and that's the correct way to say it as it is my pick. So it shall be said. The other thing I have is also a little bit of Old internet stuff. I was at a I don't know a bookstore Up on the metro north this weekend and I found a bunch of old issues of bite magazine. Did any of you guys ever read this? Oh, does that?
02:35:50 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
bring out our memories.
02:35:51 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
I was a part of the rebirth.
02:35:55 - Leo Laporte (Host)
02:36:00 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
Wow, there were as thick as Vogue. Oh, this was the best they're incredible.
02:36:04 - Paris Martineau (Host)
I've got multiple of them.
02:36:05 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Do you? I've been I got two.
02:36:08 - Paris Martineau (Host)
when you were up there, I bought two, I bought two, my friend bought two. I've been going through them.
02:36:13 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
You know, sure was the other cover with the hardware.
02:36:15 - Leo Laporte (Host)
So nerdy. What was so nerdy? They had the best covers. Yeah, so the one of the first articles. I published was back in 1984 when the Mac came out. It was more fun than crayon Mac bite magazine With the Macintosh on the front cover of it.
02:36:32 - Paris Martineau (Host)
God, that's right before it shut down, then 1984 did it last that 1984?
02:36:39 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
No it was a face at 94. Yeah, I bought I bought a Shure didn't understand a single one of them.
02:36:44 - Paris Martineau (Host)
That's the thing is they're kind of inscrutable, but they're very pretty.
02:36:48 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Yeah, the great Jerry pornell wrote the chaos manner column in there. We loved Jerry. He was on very frequently.
02:36:55 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
This was, so these are the best, or is?
02:36:57 - Leo Laporte (Host)
these are PDF downloads. Look at that. Look at that.
02:37:02 - Paris Martineau (Host)
It was all about making pretty things, your computer also the ads I love all the old magazines to look at the advertisements yeah it's incredible.
02:37:11 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
Yeah, what's funny is my book called, I bought a book during the show last week and it hasn't arrived yet, aren't you wonderful?
02:37:22 - Leo Laporte (Host)
You know it's. It's so fun to see the young people today Really appreciating what we did is old-time, as Jeff. You have some appreciation for you appreciate this is a very famous bike cover. That's a cool Look at the. Look at the Timex watch drawing a robot arm. That's pretty much an extra drawing. Yes, it was take off an extra drawing. That's right. Here's how you can be fully computerized.
02:37:51 - Paris Martineau (Host)
At the end of its run in the 90s, byte had a circulation of like like half a million. Yeah which is really impressive.
02:37:59 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Yeah, yeah, this was a cool. Oh, I'll Mars either.
02:38:03 - Paris Martineau (Host)
Um, it was bought by McGraw Hill and then sold to I'm forgetting who, but then they shut it down Private equity private equity. Yeah.
02:38:14 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Yeah, Peter Bruno Hampshire, what a yeah that was a burrow. Yeah, that was a great magazine, oh Paris you just, that's so cool that you yeah, it's a nice, the kids today, the kids they appreciate us and what.
02:38:30 - Paris Martineau (Host)
Did legacy media oh?
02:38:34 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
I said she thinks this is such ancient history. I love, but I know Listen.
02:38:38 - Paris Martineau (Host)
I'm so happy that you guys wrote for bite. I was spending a lot of time reading about the history of it this week and Looking back to read old articles.
02:38:47 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Jerry Cornell, who was on our shows until he passed Was wrote probably the most important column, I think, in bite magazine, the chaos computer call chaos corner column, and I you know he inspired a lot of what we do here because he was so brilliant as a user Representative of the user it was great. And then Gina Smith brought it back After. Was it after equity capital bought it or because you wrote, for it was a new page, right, yeah?
02:39:19 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
I, it was after that, I believe that was in it was sold to CMP that's later launch right website yeah and and you wrote for that yeah, and pro it actually.
02:39:32 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Let me do Jeff first, then we'll do your pick. You're gonna get the word right, jeff.
02:39:35 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
Jarvis, I didn't like my son. I knew that we didn't get to. I think it's important it is that YouTube is cracking down on ad blockers globally. We saw that story last. Oh yeah yeah. But the interesting part is that that privacy freaks in Europe, which I talk about occasionally here, are now going after YouTube arguing that ad blocking blockers are A vial, our surveillance and a violation of price. Oh my god.
02:40:04 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Europe don't ever change. Don't ever change. They call spyware Please no, I think they're gonna lose this one if they don't. That's terrible, because any website should be able to say you're using software on our website and that we don't like it. Incidentally, the other side of that story is people are just modifying their ad blockers to get around it. It's gonna never endings. Yeah, so battle you know? Wow, wacky mole. Wow, youtube wants to force us into surveillance, advertising and tracking, so you shouldn't let them and Pick of the week, my pick.
02:40:48 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
I'll be quick here. The first one is for the tri-county foster kids. I recently shared a post Excuse me on threads and other social media. Hardhead was selected for an all-star game football that'll be coming up here in December. But the thing is they don't sell tickets. They asked all the attendees to the game to just bring a backpack. They don't sell tickets, just bring a backpack and they donate the backpack to foster kids. Great. And they also sell sponsorship.
So if you are interested in just supporting these, the tri-county organization, there's a link there in that post that'll take you to a forum to make a donation to them. But it's all about just raising money to. Yeah, they need to try to help run the event, but pretty much they're trying to get people to bring back packs and make donations for the different foster kids here in the tri-county area. Fantastic. And lastly, I have a sweater. Here is one of my favorite sweaters ever. Yes, it says Tennessee. That's my other favorite football team, but that's sweaters very special to me because I got it back in like 1994, 2003, from my mother who bought this and it cost $50 back, and I remember it really, really Pissing her off that she had to buy it.
Well, she, you know she was like man, this is a lot of money, but she still bought it for me anyway.
02:42:18 - Leo Laporte (Host)
The importance of this yeah she cared well.
02:42:23 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
She is now officially retired and I wanted to give her her props Congratulations 30 plus years Kicking ass. I remember a lot of days of her working three jobs so she could buy her heart-hated son $50 sweatshirts that he really didn't deserve, and take care of my sister. She started at that company, you know, at a very interlevel position and just worked her way up. Over the years she was one of the top sales reps there and 30 something years later she's now officially retired.
02:42:55 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Is this her slogan, honey? We gonna make it work.
02:42:58 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
Clearly that is one of the things she likes to say.
02:43:02 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Oh, and here's the team saying goodbye to her.
02:43:05 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
Oh, it's there at the studio Doing retirement celebration for what is mom's gonna do now. My sister is next to her and one of our friends over there on the far left.
02:43:15 - Leo Laporte (Host)
This is your sister. Yeah, that's my sister, she's gorgeous, of course.
02:43:20 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
I mean we got good genes.
02:43:21 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
Oh yeah, oh, my gosh, I'm gonna cry.
02:43:29 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
This was um. That's where I was last week. I was able to get out there for a day so glad so that's great. I'm so glad you got to do that. I was able to get out there for a day and surprise her and be there Celebration yeah, that's why you're not in them, right, okay and um, just shout out to you moms, as I know, you watch the show every now and then you like to troll me.
02:43:47 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
And yes, I did put on a car and I did put on a stave, a laser.
02:43:52 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
Today so you better not be talking about me.
02:43:56 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Love you. Oh, I bet she misses you. Yeah she got her moments. That's so sweet. That's great. What's she gonna do with all that free?
02:44:09 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
time. Well, she is taking the trip here soon.
02:44:11 - Leo Laporte (Host)
I know that she's gonna come visit us.
02:44:13 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
Oh well, I shouldn't say that she's taking a trip to um somewhere in the Caribbean here very soon. That was like her first thing, oh good, but she'll be. She'll probably come out here in the holidays. I hope she will. Yeah, very nice, it would be cool Congratulations. I hope you bring her into the studio. Yeah, if she comes here, I'll be more than happy to bring her out.
02:44:31 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Should I call her missus pruit? What should I call her?
02:44:33 - Ant Pruitt (Host)
You better, okay, ma'am boss Chief she don't play, man, I'm telling you she don't play nice very nice. Uh, pictures are at ant pruitcom and you're yeah, they're on my blog at prudecom on the blog.
02:44:51 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Thank you for sharing your, your family and your, your joy with us always. Ant pruitcom and of course ant is you'll find them in the club Busy man in there he's our community manager putting together great stuff tomorrow 9 am. Pacific minister, looking forward to this one. Tomorrow, case stacey higginbotham will be back with her book club. We will be so happy to see her again. It's john scowsy's uh most a second, most recent book, the kaiju preservation society.
02:45:20 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
Yeah, that'll be fun and you're gonna very important years.
02:45:25 - Leo Laporte (Host)
AI inside yes, at 1 pm.
02:45:27 - Paris Martineau (Host)
And why is that?
02:45:29 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
Because we're gonna tell you how the world ends and it's not the way you think tess.
02:45:39 - Leo Laporte (Host)
02:45:40 - Paris Martineau (Host)
Those bad bad boys. They're up to no good.
02:45:42 - Leo Laporte (Host)
They are. See now, that's see that somebody knows how to write a headline. Jeff Jarvis is the director of the town night center for entrepreneurial journalism at the craig Newmark graduate school of journalism at the city university of new york. And, of course, buzz machinecom.
02:46:01 - Jeff Jarvis (Host)
He's the most of this year next week, because I will be there in san francisco. Oh, what you doing? I can't be. I'm going to a world economic forum Event on AI. Oh, I won't be at the show. Well, that'll be interesting.
02:46:12 - Paris Martineau (Host)
Well, you're gonna fix all of the problems You're gonna bring. That's what's what they do about leo's dream.
02:46:17 - Leo Laporte (Host)
I tell them about my dream. I have a dream and it's not good. It's not good. Thank you, jeff. Thank you, aunt Pruitt, thank you. Thank you to the wonderful Paris Martino who can Consented to join the team. We're so thrilled from the informationcom. She's on signal at 267 7978 655. If you've got a scoop, give it to her and uh, you are working on you know, can never really say, but it'll be an interesting one oh oh good.
How, how long do you get to work on each article? Do you have? I mean what? How often do you have to to file?
02:46:59 - Paris Martineau (Host)
Ostensibly I'm supposed to publish like once a month or that's all so Like, but if yeah, it rules, it's honestly the best.
02:47:07 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Um obviously you do a lot of reporting and I do it's because we I do a lot of reporting.
02:47:13 - Paris Martineau (Host)
Okay, high impact features Okay. Well, let me see that's.
02:47:16 - Leo Laporte (Host)
You know. We talked about why the information is such a success behind a paywall from day one. It's because you get great scoops. You have the information has great reporters who are really good at the you know, knowing what's going on. And it's worth the four hundred dollars a year because the information is so good, and I think that that's a testament to it is that they give you the the time and space to write important stories. Wow, that's great, that's gotta be better.
02:47:41 - Paris Martineau (Host)
That's kind of the whole model Is. Uh, you get you hire good reporters and you give them the time to do their best work. It's really great. Yeah, there have been times in my career right to write daily between two to six stories a day.
02:47:54 - Leo Laporte (Host)
Wow. Yeah not good. No, this is. This is, um, kind of an old-fashioned way of thinking about it, to be honest with you, which is really neat. Uh, I love it. I have been a subscriber since day one. Thank you, paris, thank you aunt, thank you Jay Jay. Thank you all for joining us.
Appreciate all our club twit members who made this show possible and, uh, invite you to join it. Twittv slash club twit. We do this week in google every wednesday afternoon, 2 pm Pacific, 5 pm Eastern, that's 2200 UTC. The live stream at livetwittv. You can chat with us in the irc at irctwittv or in our discord if you're a club member. After the fact, on demand versions of the show available at twittv slash twig. You can also watch it on youtube. There's video there, uh. And after the fact, the best thing to do, subscribe in your favorite podcatcher. We like pocketcasts. If you're looking for one, you don't have one yet that's ios, and android really does a good job. There's a web interface too, and if you just look for this week in google, you'll find it right there. Press the subscribe button and you'll download it automatically the minute the next one's available, so you don't miss an episode. Thanks, everybody, we'll see you next time on this week in google, mama.
02:49:14 - Lou Maresca (Other)
Come join us on this weekend enterprise tech expert coast and I talk about the enterprise world and we're joined by industry professionals and trailblazers like ceo's, cio's, cto's, ctos every acronym role plus it pros and marketeers. When we talk about technology, software plus services, security, you name it everything under the sun. You know what? I learned something each and every week in a bitch. You will too. So definitely join us and, of course, check out the twittv website and click on this weekend enterprise tech subscribe today.