This Week in Google 664, Transcript

Please be advised this transcript is AI-generated and may not be word for word. Time codes refer to the approximate times in the ad-supported version of the show.

Leo Laporte (00:00:00):
It's time for TWiG This Week in Google, Jeff Jarvis is here. Ant Pruitt and filling in for Stacy Higginbotham Shoshana Weissmann. We're gonna have a lot of fun. Twitter is holding Elon Musk's feet to the fire. They said, you said you were gonna buy us. Now you gotta big tech is suing SCOTUS to stop that Texas social media law, and why you can't always blame algorithms. Plus Jeff Jarvis terrifies us all with news of monkeypox. It's all coming up next. Don't worry. It's it's it's it's okay. On TWiG.

Intro (00:00:36):
Podcasts, you love from people you trust. This is TWIT.

Leo Laporte (00:00:46):
This is TWiG. This week in Google episode, 664 recorded Wednesday May 18th, 2022 Slothtoberfest. This Week in Google is brought to you by Buck Mason, Buck Mason's clothes are second to none. Once you try Buck Mason, they'll become your go-tos too. Head over to buckmason.com/twig get a free t-shirt with your first order. And by Nureva, traditional audio conferencing systems can entail lots of components. Installation could take days and you might not get the mic coverage you need. That's complexpensive, but Nureva audio is easy to install and manage no technicians required and you get true full room coverage. That's easyconomical, learn more at nureva.com. And by HPE GreenLake orchestrated by the experts at CDW to help deliver a seamless and scalable cloud experience that comes to you. Learn more at cdw.com/HPE. It's time for TWiG This Week in Google, the show, we talk about the latest news from the Google verse, the Twitter verse, the Facebook verse, and all the verses Ant Pruitt's here, Hands-on Photography, Maven community director at Club TWiT, and his shirt says no, but his eyes say yes. Yes, yes. Woo. Woo. I'm just gonna chill all up into my spine. I'm I'm sorry everyone for going out. I know I have a wait. He's taken ladies. He's taken that's the Leonard tower professor for journalistic innovation, ladies and gentlemen from the Craig, Craig Craig Newmark graduate school of journalism at the city university of New York, Jeff Jarvis. And Stacy has the week off, but Jeff has brought us somebody I'm very excited to meet. Shoshana Weissmann is here. She is from R street. She's a digital media and head of digital media and a fellow at the R street. Think tank political think tank. She's also Senator Shoshana from East Virginia. It's so great to have you. I hope your primary bid goes well. <Laugh>

Shoshana Weissmann (00:02:59):
Yeah, it was actually fine yesterday. Okay. Well Woshauna Seisman lost.

Leo Laporte (00:03:04):
Oh good. I hated her. <Laugh><Laugh> <laugh> we have a lot to talk about, but I guess I'm gonna have to break our covenant not to talk. We don't talk about Elon. We're not, we're gonna have to talk. Woohoo. We're not, no, we have to talk about Elon because the plot thickens. So Elon who,

Jeff Jarvis (00:03:27):
So does the skull.

Leo Laporte (00:03:28):
Yeah. So yeah. So does the tongue Elon yeah. Agreed to buy Twitter for $54 and 20 cents without doing any due diligence. That was literally part of the agreement. I, okay. No problem. No due diligence then <laugh> apparently somebody, what he supposed to do due diligence. Well, one normally does when you bid 44 billion of, for something, even if you take the people who's money, you's not your money on that. Yeah. But that, but he got, I, I think he's getting cold feet, which I, oh yeah. Wouldn't blame him. He suddenly noticed that Twitter has a lot of bots on it. A lot of spam bots on it, really? So, and he said, well, I had, no, we had no idea this gonna put this on hold now TWI, the latest is, Twitter's saying, no, we're gonna hold you to it. You sign on the bottom line. This house is yours. This will be a very interesting thing. I think the market is feeling like it's not gonna happen. We, you know, we, they talk about the wisdom of the crowds and we ask our pundit, well, market's

Jeff Jarvis (00:04:31):
Feeling like nothing good is gonna happen right now

Leo Laporte (00:04:32):
Yeah. Right now

Jeff Jarvis (00:04:34):
My Fu money just said, F you again

Leo Laporte (00:04:35):
Oh Lord, did it. Lord don't even get started. That's that's right. A lot of us will be putting retirement off again. You

Jeff Jarvis (00:04:43):
Can't get rid of us Uhuh.

Leo Laporte (00:04:46):
Oh, we're Twitter's down now to $36 and 85 cents. Elon offered 54 20 that tells you the market has you know, does has no faith that it's gonna happen. Otherwise it would be closer to that. Right? 54 20. So

Jeff Jarvis (00:04:59):
Mike, Masick had a nice parlor game wondering that if Elon leaves and the, and he's managed to bring the stock way down, who might come in, his thought was Microsoft.

Leo Laporte (00:05:08):
Nobody. No, that's nuts. Well, okay. So if this doesn't go through, isn't he on the hook for a billion dollars? No Twitter said Twitter's not even looking for the, the, the cancellation fee Twitter wants him to. They said, no, no, you agreed. You said there would be no due diligence. You have no out on this. Mm-Hmm <affirmative> Twitter might have an out because Elon's apparently broken their NDA and yeah, he's disparaged them. He said it. He, this is very mature. I have to say he did something that even Donald Trump never did on Twitter. He sent <laugh> the CEO of Twitter, a poop emoji. Oh wow. Even Trump never sank that low. Wow. I don't think, I think Masnick's nuts. I don't think anybody wants Twitter. Twitter's been for sale for years. This has never been a money maker. I don't think anybody wants Twitter and is definitely given who the chairman is. Maybe Bennioff. He wants to clean up the internet. No, no. Shoshana, it's great to have you welcome. And she's coming to us. You wanna buy Twitter? <Laugh>

Shoshana Weissmann (00:06:11):
I was gonna, but but I decided to buy something else instead, because I definitely have that amount of money. Just not, not for Twitter

Leo Laporte (00:06:19):
Because of we, maybe people don't know, but you are married. Is it to SpongeBob himself? <Laugh> yeah. <Laugh> so many people don't know that the residuals man are a killer. I mean, does, is there official R street position on Elon Musk at this point?

Shoshana Weissmann (00:06:41):
So we, we just kinda think everyone's flipping out and we're, we're staying out of it a little, like we're kinda like, yeah. Yeah. Like it could work out fine. It might not. I don't know, but what I will say is as someone who watches cartoons a lot, this reminds me no, a lot of, yeah. <Laugh> yeah. Of the King of the Hill episode where Hank doesn't wanna sell his house. So he ruins it strategically. And the home inspector comes and like, realizes what he's doing. Yes. And I kinda like, wonder if Twitter's like, oh man, look at all these bots, it's yours now. And then like, to dissuade him and like, I mean, someone made a comment that like, the producers is kind of like the more AFT comparison, but it's, it's more to me that king of the hill episode, like that very like,

Leo Laporte (00:07:22):
And like, you nailed it. He's ruining in the. Yeah. Yeah. Although it's not exactly the same because he doesn't own it yet, but he's

Shoshana Weissmann (00:07:30):
Definitely no, I mean like Twitter saying, there's more bots than there are,

Leo Laporte (00:07:33):
Oh, Twitter doesn't

Shoshana Weissmann (00:07:34):
Wanna, it's like, yeah.

Leo Laporte (00:07:34):
Twitter did though. Agrawal did tell shareholders, we want you to take this deal and we're gonna hold onto it. So I, who knows who, what, who knows what the motives are. This is crazy. I do have a question though, for you, since you covered government, why hasn't the S E C done something about Elon? He's just he's. I think one of the things he's getting away with at this point is just completely flouting all the

Ant Pruitt (00:08:01):
Rules. I mean, is the S E C pretty much like a figure head. They just, no, I mean, they just sort of see,

Leo Laporte (00:08:05):
They fined him 20 million, 40 if you included the Tesla fine. But

Ant Pruitt (00:08:10):
Apparently did they take that 20 or 40 million? Did they get it out of his pockets

Leo Laporte (00:08:14):
Or, yeah, but he wants it back, but he's the judge said no, every time

Ant Pruitt (00:08:17):
I hear Elon Musk and S C I'm thinking, oh, this is just another, nothing burger nothing's gonna happen. He,

Leo Laporte (00:08:23):
No, they say they're investigating again is the SEC a toothless tiger?

Shoshana Weissmann (00:08:29):
So I haven't really touched the sec before I don't do financial regulation because personally I'm more of a comedy Jew than a finance Jew

Leo Laporte (00:08:37):
<Laugh> 

Shoshana Weissmann (00:08:38):
So like finance often goes way over my head, but but financial regulation is kind of its own beast. But yeah, like I know, I know people want the government to go after him and if there's financial issues. Sure. But with the anti-trust stuff, that's something I get less where they're like, oh, he can't, he can't buy Twitter. Cause that's too much like to have this, all these companies and Twitter. And I'm like, Twitter is a lot smaller than like, it's not like he's buying Google. That would be, I think maybe a different conversation. Twitter's,

Leo Laporte (00:09:05):
You know, Twitter's revenue is roughly equivalent to that, of the Olive Garden literal. I'm not making that up. <Laugh> yeah. And no free bread. <Laugh> no bread stick. So it's not you're right. And what does it have to do with cars and space and boring holes under Las Vegas? Nothing. So I don't think there's any regulatory issue. I, I, I, I guess it has to be approved as any merger of that size has to be, but I Don's on a merger. It's a purchase. Is there, is there an CC, right? Its technically a merger. I think that's what Twitter's calling it as a merger. Oh a how a merger with what? A merger with a, I dunno Twitter and the Elon's money. That's what it's

Ant Pruitt (00:09:43):
<Laugh> yeah, right.

Leo Laporte (00:09:44):
I don't, I don't know. Well, whatever it is, poop emoji, I mean, it's a, it's a purchase obviously, but, but,

Ant Pruitt (00:09:51):
But don't we still have another, at least five months of these shenanigans to deal with, unless

Leo Laporte (00:09:55):
They said it'll take about six months. So depressing,

Shoshana Weissmann (00:09:58):
You know what? The longer this goes on the less likely people are to change section 230 slash more on the internet. So I'm like, all

Leo Laporte (00:10:06):
Right, actually that is part of this, isn't it? Because Elon has said, and we've talked a lot about it over the last six weeks. It feels like <laugh> long that he wants free speech, but no spam. He's he doesn't and section 230 says that you can moderate all you want, but he says, well, they should never have kicked Donald Trump off. They shouldn't moderate. Sounds like he wants a moderation free zone after what happened in Buffalo this week egged on considerably by 4Chan. I think you could see the end game of no moderation. That's not what we want.

Shoshana Weissmann (00:10:48):
Yeah. But also like Elon doesn't seem to know what he wants for moderation, like at all, just all together because he was praising the EU standard and he was saying, yeah, we need to get rid of all this speech, but not this speech, but also first amendment standard. He also had this strange conception that like whatever speech a government allows is free speech. And I'm like, yay know how that certain countries,

Leo Laporte (00:11:13):
That's what that means.

Ant Pruitt (00:11:15):
It seemed like the whole EU praises him was just a way to get them to shut up and get off his back though.

Shoshana Weissmann (00:11:20):
Was that what that was?

Ant Pruitt (00:11:22):
Seems like it because he's he's

Shoshana Weissmann (00:11:24):
I can't figure

Ant Pruitt (00:11:25):
Him out. He wants to do, you know, it's like, all right, y'all let me pacify you for a minute. So y'all could stop talking about me. Right. Meanwhile, I'm gonna go over here and just continue to ruin this social platforms.

Leo Laporte (00:11:35):
Yeah. Well,

Shoshana Weissmann (00:11:36):
And also Sam's free speech. Like I don't, I don't know how he is gonna, you know, buy the free speech standard. Yeah. How he's gonna say like, I mean, I'm not sure if you all have gotten this, but for years my DMS were full of hello, my dear. Yeah. And it was like romance, scam starts. I messed with them and it was very fun and I kind of missed, you

Leo Laporte (00:11:53):
Actually met with them. You went and until messed with them. Oh, messed with them. <Laugh> you said you met with them. I thought that's brave if you went to Nigeria for that or <laugh> wow. Yeah, I get a lot of, I get those too, by the way. So

Shoshana Weissmann (00:12:07):
You should reply to them. It's really fun. I've gotten some very, very angry. But one,

Leo Laporte (00:12:13):
They hate that when you play with them. Yeah.

Shoshana Weissmann (00:12:14):
Yeah. But one was telling me to download an app and I'm like, all right, I'll I'll, I'll do this, but first tell me what's an app. <Laugh> so then I'm like Google this and I'm like, what's cool. And then we keep going and eventually, and I'm like, so it's inside my phone. Should I crack my phone open with a hammer? Oh really? And they're like, good question. No <laugh> this

Leo Laporte (00:12:35):
Is really good. Yes. Well they want somebody dumb. So they St at first they probably loved it. And then they started to realize you're playing them something evil. Yeah. So the Texas social media law, which I think we all agree is insane. And, but of course it is probably gonna be the law. The fifth circuit has blocked the blockage, what he has lifted the injunction. Now a couple of tech industry groups, net choice, and the C CIA have filed an emergency application with the Supreme court asking to stay the, the lift of the injunction which in other words, to keep the law from going into effect last week, we were talking about this. I can't remember if it was Mike Masick, who, who said that unfortunately the fifth circuit's guy on the Supreme court, the guy who would rule on this in the shadow docket is none other than the wonderful justice Alito. So I'm not sure it appealed to the Supreme court for an emergency injunction rule.

Jeff Jarvis (00:13:45):
Well, the other thing is, is that in the legislation itself, some I forget who it was, who said this week might have been masic cuz masic says all things is that within the, within the law itself, it, it negates itself because federal law supersedes it and section two 30, supersedes it. So it's the law that isn't, that isn't, it's an NFT of laws, right?

Leo Laporte (00:14:03):
Net choices. CIA say Texas, the Texas law is unconstitutional, which it obviously is because it essentially amounts to the government compelling a private business to carry speech. They otherwise would remove the first amendment prohibits, Texas. They say from forcing online platforms to host and promote foreign propaganda biography, true pro-Nazi speech and spam left standing HB 20, the Texas law will turn the first amendment on its head. 

Jeff Jarvis (00:14:33):
That's one way to put it. I think it might be doing something worse. Fondly harmed in the first amendment.

Leo Laporte (00:14:38):
Yeah. I almost hate people saying, but what about Texas section two 30? Because I hate, almost feel like don't mention, we don't talk about section two 30. Don't bring it up. Cuz that just gives people more ammunition to go after a fight on it. Right? Yeah. True Sohan. What is the chance that the Supreme court will strike down HB 20?

Shoshana Weissmann (00:14:58):
Yeah. Like on a larger panel? Stuff Gorsuch has said like Gorsuch understand I'm a big Gorsuch fan. Usually. we agree on a lot. He likes licensing reform. He's like alluded to it. So I'm like, we're vibing here. You and me Gorsich. He also likes UN enumerated rights, which I'm very excited about. And I think he'll look at this and know this is dumb. Kavanaugh's had opinions in the past where like he recognizes how section two 30 works. And he also understands like the dynamic of this stuff. I don't know. The other justices judge Jackson was talking about in her confirmation hearing, she was act about two 30 and she seemed to have a pretty good grasp on how everything works around here. It's so hard to say how they'll apply it to a state law. But I mean, a lot of the standards around the stuff are gonna be strict scrutiny and like I'm not a huge fan of the rational basis test, especially when applied to UN enumerated rights.

Shoshana Weissmann (00:15:47):
So like I extra appreciate strict scrutiny cuz it's like the go the Supreme court doing its job to review government actions and it's first amendment. So I think it'll be okay. But like you never know. I mean the Supreme court gives us horrible surprises now and then so I'm like, I, I, I hope but I mean the one thing that I'm sure of is that I think it's a really good use of government money to to spend throwing this through court, defending it just the whole process. This was really, really worth taxpayer dollars

Leo Laporte (00:16:18):
<Laugh> so it would be up to Alito whether the court would take the case on he has the right at this point to unilaterally say no we're gonna let the fifth circuit's decision stand. And that would be that until the case comes to court, do you think is what it, you didn't mention Alito is he pro two 30? Does he good question? I'm sure he is an enumerated rights guy.

Shoshana Weissmann (00:16:45):
Yeah. He's not with me on an enumerated rights and I don't even just mean like the, the abortion case. I think there's a, a real deeper theory there that, that people tend to ignore and only see abortion. Well, for me, it's the right to earn a living. That's an enumerated, right? That's been giving more protection. There's all kinds there. But 

Leo Laporte (00:17:01):
Sy Buster is an UN enumerated right too. Let's get rid of that. I'm sorry. First amendment is that count as an enumerated, right? Yes.

Shoshana Weissmann (00:17:11):
Oh, enumerated. Not UN

Leo Laporte (00:17:12):
Enumerated, not unen enumerated. But section two 30 UN enumerated merely means it's it's mentioned specifically in the constitution.

Shoshana Weissmann (00:17:18):
Yeah. Yeah. They wrote it down. Yeah. And the ninth amendment says just cuz we didn't write it down. Doesn't mean don't protect it. They get the same protection. And then you had judges for like decades being like, I'm gonna ignore that now and just kind of do what I want. So I'm big on, on like UN enumerated rights theory that it deserves the same protection, but like we're talking about fundamental rights with this case. Like the, you know, free speech, which I think it's the, you know, I don't think it should be treated differently than unrated rights, but it is. So it it's harder for the court to mess it up. It doesn't mean they won't, but it it's definitely like less likely that that you're going to look at their decision and stress out. But you know, for it, it still depends if Ali is gonna do something beforehand. I haven't read him on tech law. I know him on certain areas, but not this. So I'm just hoping he won't disappoint us.

Leo Laporte (00:18:05):
Oh, it'll be very interesting. Yeah. In a way I <laugh> somebody in the chat room is saying, there's something wrong with me. I, I wanna watch the world burn in a way. I feel the same way. I kind of, I kind of wanna say, make it a law. Let's see what happens. Be very interesting to see what happens. What would the consequences of of the HB 20 B would a Twitter? Can't say we're not gonna operate in Texas.

Jeff Jarvis (00:18:31):
Yeah. They can. They can find some way.

Leo Laporte (00:18:35):
Can they that's

Jeff Jarvis (00:18:36):
What, yeah. I mean they'll is it gonna be imperfect? It's gonna be IP and somebody get around it and say, ah, I'm in Texas and I got you Twitter, but it's but yeah, they can, they can, I mean, Facebook pulled its news from Australia,

Leo Laporte (00:18:51):
But Texas

Jeff Jarvis (00:18:52):
Is its news, state Spain. It's not a country. Yeah. Yeah. But it'd be really interesting then is, you know it becomes a warning shot to companies. Yeah. But God knows with this Twitter administration and this board who knows, who knows what's happened. Yeah. But that's gonna move him to Texas. So God knows.

Leo Laporte (00:19:11):
Well, and it may be more to the point. Facebook would also have to get out of Texas. Wouldn't it Facebook's as big that big or maybe not. Yeah. But

Shoshana Weissmann (00:19:19):
How do they do that with the law saying they can't stop operating here just because of the law. Like

Leo Laporte (00:19:24):
The law specifically says you have to continue to operate in Texas.

Shoshana Weissmann (00:19:27):
Like functionally, maybe there's a way around it, but I'm not, I'm not sure how they do that.

Leo Laporte (00:19:32):
It's crazy.

Jeff Jarvis (00:19:34):
You could make people coming in from Texas indemnify you by saying that you won't do anything. And then if they don't do it, then you put it in here. Yeah. But you can't get in, unless you have a lawyer give you a blood signed oath, you know, that kind of

Leo Laporte (00:19:48):
Stuff. So how do you feel about cookies and would you sign this blood oath? It's perfect. Yeah. Yeah,

Shoshana Weissmann (00:19:52):
Yeah. Yeah. That's a lot of blood though. I mean like then you have to get the you have to get health authorities involved. I'm just that that's extra layers that I'm not sure they'd be willing to take on for that. They might just stop moderating. Yeah.

Leo Laporte (00:20:04):
I that's what I'm wondering is maybe they would just say, okay, fine, Texas gets to give

Jeff Jarvis (00:20:08):
Us your, give us your first born. Now that you're required by law to have it. Yeah. You know?

Leo Laporte (00:20:12):
Oh geez. Okay. Too soon. <Laugh>

Shoshana Weissmann (00:20:16):
Wow. Well, but first four and two, then you have to get other agencies involved. Like it seems like all a <inaudible> you're getting more regulatory complexity. And I don't think it makes anything easier.

Jeff Jarvis (00:20:26):
This is the world we live in. No wonder you live in a half fantasy world. Hanta it's called Washington. Now

Leo Laporte (00:20:31):
Don't tell her it's a fantasy. I think she,

Jeff Jarvis (00:20:35):
Bob,

Leo Laporte (00:20:36):
Bob, we call him

Shoshana Weissmann (00:20:38):
Smile. Yeah. I mean, I live here with my husband and I go out west a lot. But I'm not sure what you mean by fantasy.

Leo Laporte (00:20:46):
Yeah, exactly. <Laugh> Mike actually has an interesting piece in Monday's detector that Twitch could have actually violated the Texas social media law by pulling down the live stream of the Buffalo murder spree because that's moderating that gives you some reason to pause. It's just also stupid. It's it's, it's such a bad law that you almost wanna see what would happen if they tried to enforce it. I just, I sometimes I think people make these laws much like the social media law in Florida. And of course know, Florida says you can't protest in front of Justice's homes, even though there are no justice. No, Florida's Florida. I feel like they make these laws. Oh. To, to get media justice. It's a political statement. It's troll. It is it's trolls. Not trolling. It's that's too nice to them. It's trolling. Yeah.

Shoshana Weissmann (00:21:42):
It's true. Yeah. I can't think of a better use of legislative time than trolling though. <Laugh> like, I'm not sure what else it would make sense to do.

Leo Laporte (00:21:50):
What would you do if you didn't troll, right.

Shoshana Weissmann (00:21:52):
Yeah. So governor Ducey has been doing like, you know, like letting people from other states work in Arizona and he's done. He had a, a law that actually got me interested in him years ago saying that state and local governments could not use government money to pay lobbyists that they hire to lobby government itself, cuz that's silly and duplicative. But really instead of doing that, I wonder what he could have done and what he could have accomplished. If he just tried to troll a, a little bit harder, you know,

Leo Laporte (00:22:20):
We want 10% of the money that we pay to the lobbyists to lobby us. We want 10% actually you could really, you can really make some money on that. I believe, I think that's a violation of quantum mechanics, but I, I think you could make money on that charging. We can,

Shoshana Weissmann (00:22:35):
You have Ty Kaku like, can you check it?

Leo Laporte (00:22:38):
Strength theory would be very very helpful in this. <Laugh> good Lord. It,

Ant Pruitt (00:22:44):
I got a question about this whole with the Buffalo shooting and, and the way the government went after Twitch how fast are we expecting the moderation to be able to jump into the live stream and kill it?

Leo Laporte (00:23:01):
You know? Well, the thing that's interesting about the Twitch is I think only, I think I saw the number 40 people saw that stream. You saw it there, there, but as soon as it was pulled down, it was reproduced everywhere and millions, 40 million people, something like that saw it. Mm-Hmm <affirmative> subsequently mm-hmm <affirmative> there's that stre sand effect.

Ant Pruitt (00:23:19):
Right. But it's so, but people are yelling at the social media platforms as if it was

Leo Laporte (00:23:25):
Twitch's fault. It's not Twitch's fault, you know? No,

Shoshana Weissmann (00:23:28):
It's not. Yeah. And one thing that gets me too, is that like, obviously platforms don't want the stuff on them. Right. Sometimes they don't act fast enough, but I never understand politicians who genuinely think that their business model is to have like the worst stuff like this and monetize it cuz that's, it's functionally not how it works. Like it doesn't benefit them to have it on the platform.

Leo Laporte (00:23:48):
Is this just grandstanding because it's primary season more trolling

Shoshana Weissmann (00:23:53):
Pain. It's just pain for me. I'm always in pain from this like politicians just not knowing how the internet works.

Leo Laporte (00:23:59):
Yeah. let's see. Hey, I think I've speaking,

Jeff Jarvis (00:24:06):
Speaking of, of, of the video though, I think it was the, I put a story in there that I found really interesting. 

Leo Laporte (00:24:12):
This is from garbage day. Exactly. Email. Yeah. Yeah. You can't always blame algorithms. So here's the thing, Tim,

Jeff Jarvis (00:24:23):
Tim Kane did a TW tweet saying, you know, nevermind Fox news, nevermind Tucker Carlson, nevermind, whatever. Actually everybody's finally talking about Tim Kane finally wakes up and says big tech go through big tech and algorithms. And, and then this, this, what used to be known as a blogger is now known as a newsletter writes I'm forgetting his name suddenly that, you know, it all came in fortune Chan for Chan. The point of for Chan is that it's ephemeral there's no, there's no amplification. There's no algorithm involved at all. And so this idea that let's, let's get rid of all the algorithms. Cause that's, what's corrupting society. Sorry guys. Not in this case.

Leo Laporte (00:24:59):
It's the other way around. Yeah. It's

Jeff Jarvis (00:25:00):
TV and it's fortune Chan meeting and, and,

Leo Laporte (00:25:04):
And I don't, I'm sorry, Tim Kane. I don't think you could call fortune Chan big tech.

Jeff Jarvis (00:25:08):
No

Leo Laporte (00:25:08):
You can't. No, you can't. We must stop. He tweets, we must stop big tech from propagating big lies that lead to carnage. I don't think anybody in big tech, he clearly wants replacement theory. Propagated. He clearly had no idea.

Jeff Jarvis (00:25:23):
No, no idea. <Laugh> it was an easy, it was an easy thing.

Leo Laporte (00:25:27):
Son

Shoshana Weissmann (00:25:28):
Of it's really frustrating though. But especially because like you're saying like the bad stuff comes on other forms that have, has nothing to do with algorithms and algorithms. Just go for what people want anyway. And sure. Try to mitigate the harms. But like, I mean, I, I'm still kind of floored that. I remember the video game, moral panic when I was a kid. I remember that. But then like looking back and remembering that Congress was basically having hearings on seven pixels. I just can't like trust them on anything when it comes to like these moral panics. Yeah.

Jeff Jarvis (00:25:58):
Yeah. I'm doing re I'm researching right now. Moral panics. So watch out, watch out ant get your finger ready. I've been great on that's things. Who's

Shoshana Weissmann (00:26:10):
Adam, Adam fearer at Mercatus has a ton of work. Yeah. Yeah. I'm glad you know him already, but he's oh yeah, he's great. I need to read his moral panic work so I can, you know, understand so I can moral panic or moral panics,

Jeff Jarvis (00:26:24):
But I, I, I, so I've saved things. I've saved bookmarks to moral panic since 2017 and oh boy, it's just, it's just, you know, my, my favorite of all of them is that sex toys could kill. Oh

Shoshana Weissmann (00:26:39):
Boy. Have they?

Jeff Jarvis (00:26:41):
I don't think so. Haven't seen anything, but they could, yeah, they could remove control, control, cyber sex toys could be the death of us.

Leo Laporte (00:26:50):
<Laugh> yeah. I'm willing to try just out of experimental purposes.

Ant Pruitt (00:26:54):
Okay. Yeah.

Jeff Jarvis (00:26:55):
Lived

Leo Laporte (00:26:56):
Dangerously. They just like

Ant Pruitt (00:26:57):
You

Leo Laporte (00:26:57):
Have at it, sir. I'm I'm, I'm a, I'm a chance. I'm a chance. Risk taker. I right. Alright boy. Let's see. Books

Ant Pruitt (00:27:05):
Can kill you too.

Leo Laporte (00:27:06):
Says Berk, BCH can kill. We know that.

Shoshana Weissmann (00:27:10):
Yeah. Books don't kill people. People do.

Leo Laporte (00:27:12):
People. Ideas are what kill people and the, and yeah. Yeah. I don't, I don't think big tech is the problem. Tim came. Sorry. It's hard for me to no, think that that's the issue. I'm trying to get through. I don't know I'm going on and on through Elon Musk stuff. I'm trying to, there's

Jeff Jarvis (00:27:30):
Like his mother on the, on the, on the sports illustrated swimsuit cover.

Leo Laporte (00:27:33):
Wait a minute. Elon's Musk is on the cover of sports.

Jeff Jarvis (00:27:36):
No, the mother, his mother, his mother is

Leo Laporte (00:27:39):
Literally and the

Jeff Jarvis (00:27:40):
Jor Jordan Peterson. Oh, dis a woman full wa too much on the SI cover and left. Yeah. 70 some.

Shoshana Weissmann (00:27:47):
Yeah. Wow. She looks really good. Yeah.

Leo Laporte (00:27:49):
Okay. Yeah. Love the Palm tree earrings too.

Shoshana Weissmann (00:27:53):
Yeah. Those are fun. Yeah.

Leo Laporte (00:27:55):
Yeah. Swim. I, first of all, why is there still a sports illustrated swimsuit issue? And I guess they're trying to paper over the, the, the flaw and the concept by putting well, a variety of other women that you would normally put. I mean, it's just hopeless. You can't

Jeff Jarvis (00:28:12):
It's now owned by is now owned by another content factory. Like all the other time magazines are now owned by dot dash that you, I dunno if you saw this story this week is a big story. This week, the latest report is that people magazine not long ago, the most profitable magazine on earth may fold its print edition. Just like he w did.

Leo Laporte (00:28:33):
Wow. People, people, people read people. What are you gonna look at when you're at the grocery store and law? Exactly. People read people, Elisa reads people, but she's, you know, more and more she's reading it digitally in apple news. Mm-Hmm <affirmative> so maybe that's, but she's her fault. That's the thing. But, but people wouldn't go away. They would just be digital only. There'd be no news.

Jeff Jarvis (00:28:51):
Yeah. Yeah. That's that's the, that's the, that's the, that's the new death

Ant Pruitt (00:28:54):
With regards to that sports illustrated swimsuit, shout out to hands on photography. Episode number 95, miss Loretta Houston.

Leo Laporte (00:29:03):
She was one of the photographers.

Ant Pruitt (00:29:04):
She's the photographer

Leo Laporte (00:29:05):
For the whole thing.

Jeff Jarvis (00:29:06):
Whoa, swimsuit. Whoa.

Leo Laporte (00:29:08):
Which episode?

Ant Pruitt (00:29:09):
95.

Leo Laporte (00:29:10):
Does she talk about it at all?

Ant Pruitt (00:29:11):
Yeah, we, we, you go into it. How Tyra banks got her, the opportunity. Nice. Tyra banks found her on Instagram and gave her an opportunity and it just blew it

Leo Laporte (00:29:22):
From wow. Yeah. Netflix hit by 150 layoffs offs. It feels like Netflix is panicking, lose a couple hundred thousand subscribers. And now it's all over and time to fire people. Now they're 11,000 employees, but it feels like they're panicking,

Jeff Jarvis (00:29:41):
But their whole model, they, they spend millions on, on entertainment. And

Ant Pruitt (00:29:46):
I think they're trying to, to position themselves to be able to pay all of those millions of people. Not millions of people,

Leo Laporte (00:29:53):
Thousands, those

Ant Pruitt (00:29:54):
Thousands of people that they gave huge contracts, you know?

Leo Laporte (00:29:57):
Oh, for the movies. Yes.

Ant Pruitt (00:29:59):
Yeah. All of that content. They, they didn't just throw a cheap number up there. Like Shonda Rons I wanna say she got almost 50 million bucks.

Leo Laporte (00:30:06):
I think they already paid him though. Right. You know, you know, she's not waiting for the check still.

Ant Pruitt (00:30:10):
No, but I'm saying is this, they made a big investment in, oh, I think

Leo Laporte (00:30:13):
Return as I remember, 13 billion last year, it's crazy on content. I mean, a lot of that growth was fueled by the pandemic. Pandemic's over home. People are going outside.

Jeff Jarvis (00:30:23):
No, it's not. No, it's not. Well,

Ant Pruitt (00:30:27):
Not

Leo Laporte (00:30:27):
Over. Okay. People are going outside, whether there's and we have monkey

Jeff Jarvis (00:30:31):
PS now monkey PS in is in, is it Massachusetts?

Ant Pruitt (00:30:34):
By the way,

Leo Laporte (00:30:35):
Is monkey PS related to COVID or something completely different. It's

Jeff Jarvis (00:30:38):
Something whole new thing to worry about whole

Ant Pruitt (00:30:40):
New. Oh boy.

Leo Laporte (00:30:42):
All right. Now I'm gonna look this up, cuz I don't want you to spread which

Shoshana Weissmann (00:30:45):
<Laugh> which monkeys in Massachusetts started it.

Leo Laporte (00:30:49):
Do we know <laugh>? Oh boy. I think it was released by the monkeys intentionally. It's a small Massa,

Jeff Jarvis (00:30:55):
Massachusetts confirms case of monkeypox. I, I, I tweeted one of the doctors I trust on the topic.

Leo Laporte (00:31:02):
This is it from ABC news. I don't wanna show you the pictures. Disgusting. A Massachusetts resident has tested positive for monkeypox the first case of the rare virus in the United States. This year shades of February, 2020. When we were saying, oh yes, there's this new flu in China. Mm-Hmm <affirmative> is trans is

Jeff Jarvis (00:31:22):
Angela Raba. Who's who? Angie underscore Rasmuson who's one of the, the experts I trust from my COVID list. It's transmitted by aerosol and direct contact. It's not easily. Transmissible person to person requires close physical proximity. So might move away and move away a little bit. I think

Leo Laporte (00:31:40):
He's risky. The patient is an adult male who recently traveled to Canada. There is your problem, Canada. Right?

Jeff Jarvis (00:31:47):
Canada used to be okay in

Ant Pruitt (00:31:49):
Canada has beenchusetts

Leo Laporte (00:31:50):
Department of public health says the case poses no risk to the public. The individual is hospitalized and in good condition. Oh boy. Don't worry.

Ant Pruitt (00:32:01):
Go to a panic. Huh?

Leo Laporte (00:32:01):
Monkey P you

Jeff Jarvis (00:32:02):
Hit the moral hit the panic

Leo Laporte (00:32:04):
Monkey P is a rare disease caused by the appropriately enough monkeypox virus. Yeah,

Jeff Jarvis (00:32:12):
I didn't mean to get us off.

Leo Laporte (00:32:13):
I think we don't have to worry about monkeypox so well,

Jeff Jarvis (00:32:16):
We've still gotta worry about COVID it's not overly.

Leo Laporte (00:32:19):
No, but from the point of view of Netflix, it is

Ant Pruitt (00:32:21):
Well, anyway, Netflix <laugh> they see the right on the wall with all of those subscriptions dropping and nodder talking about different ways to pivot. I

Leo Laporte (00:32:31):
That's, they did say they did. They did say in their quarterly results that they anticipate millions of subscribers lost in the next quarter. So they do see wow. A, you know, an avalanche mm-hmm <affirmative> coming, but I think they, they, they had, this is what we're seeing now in general, in tech industry, there were steep growths over the last two years. Tech industry garnered trillions of dollars. Mm-Hmm in windfall profits from COVID and now it's over. Yep.

Ant Pruitt (00:32:58):
What's the next move?

Shoshana Weissmann (00:33:00):
Well, well with monkeypox I think there's some hope that monkeys could start using the internet more like we were over the past few years. So I think the solution here is for tech companies to send phones to monkeys.

Leo Laporte (00:33:15):
Oh, Netflix should not ignore the vast and growing monkey population. You're absolutely right. Shahan yeah. It's a real opportunity here. See, that's what I call taking lemons and making lemonade. There you

Ant Pruitt (00:33:28):
Go. Brilliant.

Jeff Jarvis (00:33:29):
Yeah.

Leo Laporte (00:33:29):
Brilliant. There's always a bright side to everything, including monkey pucks. All.

Jeff Jarvis (00:33:35):
So the rights of monkeys are not enumerated in the constitution. That's they

Leo Laporte (00:33:39):
Have enumerated

Jeff Jarvis (00:33:40):
Freedom,

Leo Laporte (00:33:41):
UN enumerated monkey PS. It happens.

Ant Pruitt (00:33:45):
So Netflix with ads. Good idea. Bad idea. <Laugh>

Jeff Jarvis (00:33:48):
Thanks for getting us back here.

Leo Laporte (00:33:51):
What are you gonna do? I think the idea for Netflix is we wanna make a lower cost subscription available. People who don't wanna pay, what is it now? 14, $15. Mm-Hmm <affirmative> and I that's, that's gotta be one of the reasons the subscribers are dropping, right? If we have an $8, one, like Hulu does Hulu, we have a five or an $8 plan and you're gonna have to watch some ads. Mm-Hmm <affirmative> I think that they're hoping that will, that will work. Plus

Jeff Jarvis (00:34:11):
They, their programming was all in all depressing. It was all dark. It was really dark Netflix during 20 did never find anything like cheery in the midst of a pandemic.

Ant Pruitt (00:34:21):
A lot of the content was dark during 20. I agree.

Jeff Jarvis (00:34:24):
Yeah.

Shoshana Weissmann (00:34:25):
Meanwhile, Hulu is where you can find king of the hill. <Laugh>

Leo Laporte (00:34:30):
I have been Shahan I admit watching a lot more Hulu lately. So maybe that's you go? Yep.

Shoshana Weissmann (00:34:36):
Yeah. Bob burgers too.

Jeff Jarvis (00:34:39):
Oh God. I like Bob burger. Think about Netflix is <laugh>. She is she's good. She's got, I told you. She's good. <Laugh> Netflix. Yes. The, the most amazing pivot in the history, the, you know, modern history of media, right? What other company shifted from mailing you red envelopes? Yeah. To becoming fully digital and, and, and, and gigantic. And what, and just used to just ship stuff and then made stuff. It was a phenomenal pivot. They

Ant Pruitt (00:35:08):
Will laughed at it's

Jeff Jarvis (00:35:09):
Like, why are you? And cat has only so many lives, you know?

Leo Laporte (00:35:12):
Maybe

Jeff Jarvis (00:35:13):
Can you pivot again

Leo Laporte (00:35:14):
Maybe? Yeah. And what do you pivot to

Jeff Jarvis (00:35:17):
Two? That's the thing they're not pivoting. I think this is Ann's point. Yeah. Was they're not pivoting to anything right now, except panic. Right? It's a panic pivot.

Ant Pruitt (00:35:24):
They're just trying to figure out what to do next.

Jeff Jarvis (00:35:27):
Yeah.

Leo Laporte (00:35:28):
Not easy actually. No, no, not sure what I do. It's very expensive to create original programming. Honestly. I think Hulu needs to improve their app. I think that by itself, discovery, terrible may be worst Netflix app on television. Yeah. Hulu's bad too. Actually come to think of it.

Shoshana Weissmann (00:35:45):
Also they will let me record brief clips to make gifts and like I'm great offended by that. Yeah. This is I don't things to let me,

Leo Laporte (00:35:54):
That's very shortsighted. I go to a museum and the occasionally go to older museum and they say, no pictures, no Instagramming. The hip modern ones go Instagram. Here's an Instagramable folk is promoting us. You know, why wouldn't you allow people to make clips? Yeah. To promote it. Maybe their contracts with the creators are limited, but they should redo those then. Oh, fo. So they used to let you do king of the hill clips and you can't do that anymore.

Shoshana Weissmann (00:36:18):
Yeah. Just through a screen recorder. Now they block that. And all I'm asking is just for like 30 seconds. Like, I'm not like I'm not doing the whole thing, but 30 seconds and throw on a Hulu logo, you know, that's, that's just good branding because my gifts, I actually, my gifts get very good traction on Giffy. So they're, they're wasting a branding opportunity.

Leo Laporte (00:36:36):
Do you wait a minute now are, wait,

Jeff Jarvis (00:36:38):
Wait, wait. Yeah. Now we gotta go another premier

Leo Laporte (00:36:40):
<Laugh> I would take a break. I was

Jeff Jarvis (00:36:43):
About to ask question about this is the, this is the new, the

Leo Laporte (00:36:45):
Giffy cottage industry. I think this is very exciting. Yeah. I'd like to know. Do you have a

Jeff Jarvis (00:36:49):
Favorite? Do you have a best Giffy, a gift you've ever made?

Shoshana Weissmann (00:36:54):
There, there's just a lot of really good ones lately. I've been a fan of Homer Simpson when a when he's sleeping in a hammock and a and a caterpillar crawls into his mouth and he coughs out a butterfly like that's, that's really, you know,

Leo Laporte (00:37:09):
Does Giffy allow you? Like, do you have an, oh yeah, you do. Yeah. You have an account. <Laugh> you're an account on Giffy. And you can yeah.

Shoshana Weissmann (00:37:18):
For mainly ones that like people people don't have, like, I, it's not easily Googleable or it's one that I've created and I have trouble finding, they have millions of views and I'm just like, alright, I mean, I needed this. So maybe you need this gift

Leo Laporte (00:37:31):
Too, but you can't monetize your Giffy views.

Shoshana Weissmann (00:37:35):
No, I don't really monetize stuff that much. I'm a capitalist, but like I'm really bad at it. <Laugh> but

Leo Laporte (00:37:42):
My favorite kind, by the way, let's talk, I think we should have more, really bad. That's

Jeff Jarvis (00:37:45):
Very real. Yes.

Leo Laporte (00:37:47):
Yes. <Laugh>

Shoshana Weissmann (00:37:48):
But I'm working with the sloth Institute. And one of my projects that I've wanted to do with them is to get their cute videos of slots and make gifts and always have their logo on it. So then people can go back and then be like, oh, I should donate to the sloth Institute.

Leo Laporte (00:38:01):
Of course. Wait a minute. Like, like sloths, like, like the animals, sloths and trees. Mm-Hmm <affirmative> yep. Is this a, a, a, is this a political AC? Is this on K street? Is it a political actress? No, no,

Jeff Jarvis (00:38:13):
This is, this is another

Leo Laporte (00:38:14):
Thing. Okay.

Shoshana Weissmann (00:38:15):
Yeah. They're based in Costa Rica and I always thought it would be really freaking funny if I got to be an associate fellow at the sloth Institute and I kept tweeting them like, Hey, like what if I were an associate fellow with you? So I am, and I actually do government research for this. Oh

Leo Laporte (00:38:29):
My God. And help model with social

Shoshana Weissmann (00:38:30):
Media.

Leo Laporte (00:38:31):
<Laugh> why are you still, you know, let's put that in your lower third. <Laugh>

Shoshana Weissmann (00:38:37):
I know. Look at them. Look cute.

Leo Laporte (00:38:39):
I love sloths.

Shoshana Weissmann (00:38:41):
Oh, they actually, we just

Jeff Jarvis (00:38:41):
Saw great video of a sloth, a sloth being, being reunited with its babies. He was

Leo Laporte (00:38:48):
Thinking that, oh, I was, I just saw that it was so cute. The sloth hug isn't that

Shoshana Weissmann (00:38:52):
What's really sad is they always look like they're smiling. I mean, that's why I love them cuz they're just always smiling at you. But that's not even when they're, they're not really happy. They're smiling. It's really sad. Yeah. But they do amazing work to stop S sloth, electrocutions. They hang from stuff. The wires there aren't well insulated. So they're actually breaking on stopping it and lots of slaws die that way. They rehabilitate and my first meeting with them, they were, you know, setting up and they're like, well, we're getting this ready. We'll just put the camera in front of this baby's slot. So I'm just sitting for a couple of minutes talking to them, watching a baby

Leo Laporte (00:39:24):
Slot. Oh, I'd be so happy. That would be, I would just say, can I call you tomorrow? I'd like to, we'd like to do more of this.

Jeff Jarvis (00:39:31):
Oh, oh

Shoshana Weissmann (00:39:32):
Right.

Leo Laporte (00:39:34):
I thought when you said this,

Jeff Jarvis (00:39:35):
Oh wait, wait, wait. There's sloth Birch. Okay, come on Leo. You gotta buy some sloth Birch.

Leo Laporte (00:39:39):
I'm sorry. Alright. All let's see. Let's get a mug worse on this show. I've spent many, many dollars on bad sloth stuff. Oh, sloth mug would be good.

Shoshana Weissmann (00:39:49):
Oh, tell me about it.

Leo Laporte (00:39:51):
Yeah. I don't believe what I'm seeing. Oh, I love slots. <Laugh> you know though, they're making a mistake cuz honestly cartoon slots are less cute than the real. Yeah,

Jeff Jarvis (00:40:01):
Exactly. And I wanna real sloth. Yeah. But maybe they have rights problems, you know?

Leo Laporte (00:40:05):
So I see they're all into veganism. People don't eat S sloths, do they?

Shoshana Weissmann (00:40:11):
No. I'm also actually a vegetarian. I'm a kosher vegetarian and my diet sucks because my body's falling apart. I have like lots of autoimmune diseases. <Laugh> so like I can't eat like anything. It's fine. Like its fine. But like it sucks to be a kosher vegetarian who can't have chickpeas or cauliflower. Like that's not super fun.

Leo Laporte (00:40:27):
Yeah. Wow. But

Shoshana Weissmann (00:40:28):
Yeah, it sucks. But as far as I know people don't eat

Leo Laporte (00:40:32):
Slots. They don't eat slots.

Shoshana Weissmann (00:40:33):
Yeah. Thankfully

Jeff Jarvis (00:40:34):
Chickpeas, like is that that's a

Shoshana Weissmann (00:40:36):
Help. Yeah. I know.

Jeff Jarvis (00:40:38):
So you can't have,

Shoshana Weissmann (00:40:39):
Oh, makes me really sick. Yeah. I, I figured out one day that it was making me super sick. I

Leo Laporte (00:40:43):
Know that's terrible. That really? Oh,

Jeff Jarvis (00:40:45):
I'm sorry. Oh

Shoshana Weissmann (00:40:46):
Hummus. Oh, it's okay. A

Leo Laporte (00:40:47):
Beautiful

Jeff Jarvis (00:40:48):
Thing.

Shoshana Weissmann (00:40:48):
Oh I know. I every now and then I'm like, maybe I can have it now. And then I'm like, oh my gosh, I cannot have chickpeas now. It's really bad. It's good. It's good. I'm

Leo Laporte (00:40:56):
Just next to October. We have to do a thing on October 20th. It's international sloth day. All right. And maybe we could do something to celebrate Jerry put on the company calendar. Put that on the calendar that

Jeff Jarvis (00:41:09):
I just want. I just want it on the record here that as someone who takes this show down rabbit holes Shahana has beat my record already.

Shoshana Weissmann (00:41:16):
Oh yeah.

Jeff Jarvis (00:41:17):
10Th was the way into the show.

Leo Laporte (00:41:18):
They actually celebrate international slot day with sloth Tober Fest. <Laugh> yeah.

Shoshana Weissmann (00:41:25):
So a couple of years ago I was giving a I was giving a talk with governor juicy at Alec and and it was us too. Add a dinner on the main stage. And I ended it, letting him know that Texas is the Texas is beating Arizona, but Texas is the only state in the country that has a three toed slot. And I ask him what he was gonna do to get more three toed slots to Arizona. So if you think I take you guys down rabbit holes, just know that like that's what I do for a living.

Leo Laporte (00:41:53):
Well the big sloth deficit is something I think all Arizonans are concerned about. Yeah. Yeah. That's a yeah. Serious issue. Let me let's take a little break. <Laugh> unbelievable as if we, as if we haven't unbelievable. Shaana Weisman is with us. She's great. Not only a policies head at the sloth Institute. She also head of digital media at RSI, a fellow there and a Senator Shahan from east Virginia on the Twitter. Of course Ant Pruitt and Jeff Jarvis as well. Our show today brought to you by Buck Mason, love my buck masons. Did you wear those Buck Mason wearing my book? You're in a Mason britches today. I gave you I gave you a pair of, I don't call 'em britches pants. Oh, I'm sorry. Pants. I gave you a pair of pants. You did. They fit.

Leo Laporte (00:42:42):
They fit. Darn great. Feel great. Oh, I love these Dago. I love my buck masons too. We all have, you know, we all have our I, you know, I wear work clothes. I wear, you know, a blazer to work. You, you, you wear a teacher. I just show up <laugh> we all have work clothes. But and I remember when I was a kid, my mom used to say, okay, take off your school clothes, put on your play clothes. Well, I love getting home. And even as a grown up, my play clothes are buck masons, shirts, sweaters, jeans. It's the, it's your go to in the closet? You know, when you don't have to wear a suit and tie, when you get to wear what you want, you, you wear Buck Mason, buck, Mason's closer second to none timeless and never go out of style.

Leo Laporte (00:43:24):
By the way, they have jackets too. I'm gonna have to start working on my they, the carryon collection. Isn't that great for, for your day trips or your overnight trips? Jeans, shirts, jackets. I love my bris. I don't think they call 'em bridges. <Laugh> the t-shirts are famous for their t-shirts by the way, the curved, het and GQ calls it the best t-shirt in the game. And I would agree. They're really, really nice. They're tailored. They look good. They fit well. And I wash 'em. I wash 'em every time and they look just as good as the, with the day they arrived. I just love it. The cotton, the quality, the how well made they are makes Buck Mason a real standout in, in men's and women's clothing too. Once you try Buck Mason, they'll become your go-tos too. So I want you to visit Buck Mason, B U C K M a S O n.com/TWiG.

Leo Laporte (00:44:23):
What are you gonna get? Well, as a little reward, you get a free t-shirt with your first order buck, mason.com/TWiG. And there's people like to wear t-shirts with <laugh> other people's advertising on them. Buck Mason. I like it, cuz it doesn't. I'm not advertising for anybody except my beautiful body buck. Mason.Com/Twig, B U C K M a S O N. Get that free t-shirt with your first order. I love the buck masons and you, you know what? You're probably a hard guy to fit. That's that's the key. These are definitely queen Pruit approved. As I put 'em on and he's so comfy, so, and she's like, Ooh, them look good on you Uhhuh. So Uhhuh. Yeah. Cuz this is a hard time finding britches to fit in these not bridges. Are those sweatpants. Are those, are those Buck Mason bridge? Oh yeah. I could tell cuz the boy you have massive thighs. Yes I do. So <laugh> <laugh> but they fit do you fit, but they fit so, and I can tell cuz the material's not thin. It's like it's like solids thick. Yes. Yeah. Feels great. So yes, I need to, I need to get some more of these look, mason.com/TWiG. Thank you so much for supporting this week in Google. This Shahan. This is not a typical show. I'm so, so sorry.

Jeff Jarvis (00:45:38):
That's because you're here. <Laugh>

Leo Laporte (00:45:40):
It's it's

Jeff Jarvis (00:45:41):
It's it's self-fulfilling

Leo Laporte (00:45:42):
You know, I guess so it wouldn't be a typical show of any kind of Shan's here. It's so nice to have you. We appreciate it. 

Jeff Jarvis (00:45:49):
Yeah. Breaking, breaking disinformation. Hot news.

Leo Laporte (00:45:52):
Yes.

Jeff Jarvis (00:45:53):
So Charlie Warz I put it in the rundown at 1 55. Okay. Says that Costco disappeared. Did he already take it down?

Leo Laporte (00:46:00):
Hot dot crash. Oh, he killed it. He pulled it down. He didn't like it. What did he tweet tweets? You know, you can

Jeff Jarvis (00:46:08):
Costco's Costco's stock crashed 13% with a meme account that tweeted a fake headline that Costco was raising the price of its hotdogs due relation.

Leo Laporte (00:46:17):
Oh, that's one of the few things that has not changed in years. The buck 50. You gotta wonder what it's made of cuz if you can't. Yeah. If you don't raise the phrase. Well

Jeff Jarvis (00:46:27):
It's like the Costco, you know what? Here's a secret and I know you don't trust because of the, the cash Pepe and screw year for that. But the Costco chicken street of $5 RO history chicken is incredible. Good. Yeah.

Leo Laporte (00:46:39):
It's great. Yeah. Wonderful. so the stocks are tumbling.

Shoshana Weissmann (00:46:44):
So the hot dog was, was the cause of this. The, the hot dog caused the,

Leo Laporte (00:46:50):
That it was gonna go on fake rise in price, fake,

Jeff Jarvis (00:46:52):
Fake red in price.

Shoshana Weissmann (00:46:54):
So I will say it's not the first time that like a hot dog has been a big indicator of like the direction of a company. I'm a big fan of the Snapchat hotdog, because that was kind of like their plan to monetize. They just they're like, here's a dancing hotdog. And I kind of feel, this is very much the same thing where it's like hotdog, you know, company crash. Like it just makes sense.

Leo Laporte (00:47:16):
Oh, here's the Charlie just wanted to update his tweet that Charlie Worzel tweet is here. Oh actually he's tweeting something debunking mm-hmm but, but look at, let me just show you

Jeff Jarvis (00:47:27):
That.

Leo Laporte (00:47:28):
Wait, wait, just lemme you the stock. It is, it has gone down 57 bucks in the FA past five days, 11%.

Jeff Jarvis (00:47:37):
But is that because of this

Leo Laporte (00:47:38):
Or is it because the hot dog? I don't know. Yeah.

Shoshana Weissmann (00:47:42):
I think it's the hot dog. I really think it's the hot dog. Like, you know?

Ant Pruitt (00:47:46):
Wow. Oh

Leo Laporte (00:47:47):
<Laugh> well that would, you know, that would that certainly would cause people to be concerned by the way the chairman's performing. They, they are Hebrew national hotdogs. They're very good. Hot. Ooh, those are good. They're good. Hot dogs. They're not just AOL hotdogs. I guess it's a

Shoshana Weissmann (00:48:02):
Loss Jewish hotdogs, finance, you know? Yep.

Leo Laporte (00:48:05):
I think it's a loss leader for them. Right. They don't care what you pay for the hot dog cuz they know you're gonna buy an 800. You're

Ant Pruitt (00:48:10):
Gonna buy

Leo Laporte (00:48:11):
Bag of taco chips.

Ant Pruitt (00:48:12):
Right? 20 pound bag of chips.

Leo Laporte (00:48:15):
Yeah. <Laugh> so they they're kind of okay.

Jeff Jarvis (00:48:19):
The pizza looks like, but the, oh, we also have just break lip breaking Jo. I

Leo Laporte (00:48:23):
Got news today. What

Jeff Jarvis (00:48:25):
Jolie B dancing on 1 53. It's a little you know Jo

Leo Laporte (00:48:30):
B no who's Jo B.

Jeff Jarvis (00:48:31):
Oh Jolie bee is the Korean chick. Get this. It's a Fri it's very, very beloved. What fried chicken franchise that also serves spaghetti with, with

Leo Laporte (00:48:42):
Tomato sauce. Okay. I'm IM gonna have to call you on this. I don't think this is breaking news.

Ant Pruitt (00:48:46):
What

Leo Laporte (00:48:46):
The heck is this? I just, I just don't think this is breaking.

Ant Pruitt (00:48:52):
Oh, now this watch history. What's the music.

Jeff Jarvis (00:49:02):
I don't know. It's been set to other music. It sounds

Leo Laporte (00:49:04):
Like that's like Kazu band.

Jeff Jarvis (00:49:06):
Yeah, I don't. All right. All right. Sorry.

Ant Pruitt (00:49:08):
Step away from the Twitter.

Jeff Jarvis (00:49:10):
I've gotta, I've gotta maintain my title here from S for, for res

Shoshana Weissmann (00:49:16):
You'll never win.

Leo Laporte (00:49:17):
No, I think he's trying too hard kids, but

Jeff Jarvis (00:49:20):
See what you're doing to us. Yeah.

Leo Laporte (00:49:21):
Yeah.

Jeff Jarvis (00:49:22):
We could go. We can go to Google's new headquarters.

Shoshana Weissmann (00:49:25):
Ah, like to, to go off about like how about which of us is gonna go down the most rabbit holes? Like is, is Google gonna judge?

Jeff Jarvis (00:49:34):
<Laugh>

Leo Laporte (00:49:35):
Google will judge. Cuz we never actually talk about Google. I gonna say consider on a show name this week in Google.

Jeff Jarvis (00:49:41):
I'll try to get us back to Google.

Leo Laporte (00:49:42):
Here's the new giant tent. That is the Google headquarters. It's got a slide in the middle,

Jeff Jarvis (00:49:50):
But from like nowhere to nowhere.

Leo Laporte (00:49:52):
Yeah, it looks like, like maybe they're pushing hedges down the slide or something. That's what like it's a Bush slide. What is it? Clear story windows allow light on the desks. Automated window shades that open and close. They have to cuz the sun I'm sure Google officially opens to yesterday their Bayview campus in mountain view, California. 1.1 million square feet. Wow. Four BU four buildings.

Jeff Jarvis (00:50:18):
That's the size. That's the size of a, of a, of an Amazon warehouse.

Leo Laporte (00:50:23):
You know, they always say that if you're on the cover of sports illustrated, that's gonna, that's the curse. That's the end of your career. Right. and, and I think it's always been, it's often been said that big corporations that build overly fancy company headquarters. It's usually their last act. Yeah. But I think that this is not the case. Apple just built that billion dollar spaceship, campus

Ant Pruitt (00:50:43):
And people aren't going there to

Leo Laporte (00:50:45):
Work. Yeah. That's true. Kinda a waste waste.

Ant Pruitt (00:50:47):
<Laugh> that's beautiful. Right? You are

Jeff Jarvis (00:50:49):
Is empty. It's cursed.

Leo Laporte (00:50:50):
Google says it's gonna invest nine and a half billion in offices and data centers this year.

Ant Pruitt (00:50:56):
Data centers make

Leo Laporte (00:50:57):
Sense. Yeah. this is Google's commitment. They say according to fortune to physical office space, there's the front lobby, which is singularly ugly. If you ask me like it it's it is brutalist the right word. It looks like concrete, but then there's balloons and it's very ugly. 

Jeff Jarvis (00:51:23):
Birthday concrete.

Leo Laporte (00:51:24):
Yeah. Birthday concrete. That's it. And then why, why are there, why are there plants grow?

Ant Pruitt (00:51:32):
I, those plants at the top. Yeah.

Leo Laporte (00:51:32):
It looks like they, it looks like the end of times and the concrete has been, you know, the plants have taken over or something. You can see,

Jeff Jarvis (00:51:38):
You can sit there and be watered or something. Yeah.

Leo Laporte (00:51:41):
Ah,

Ant Pruitt (00:51:41):
Interesting.

Leo Laporte (00:51:43):
Okay. This is what they call a dragon scale solar system. That's all solar panels. That's called 90,000 silver solar panels generating 40% of their annual electricity for the campus. Wow. This is such a hodgepodge of,

Jeff Jarvis (00:52:00):
Of is styles. And there's like, there's, there's a huge like camel in the background there. Yeah. Blue camel.

Leo Laporte (00:52:05):
Yeah. Artwork from local artists. Depicts scenes of bay area. Ecology

Jeff Jarvis (00:52:11):
Red trees.

Leo Laporte (00:52:12):
Yeah. I don't think we have those the ventilation system. Oh, here's something interesting. Uses a hundred percent air

Jeff Jarvis (00:52:20):
Outside.

Leo Laporte (00:52:21):
Oh. Outside what? Outside air. So yeah, it really isn't ventilating if you take it just from the inside, I think it's good to a hundred. I've

Jeff Jarvis (00:52:29):
Better for COVID which is still among us.

Leo Laporte (00:52:32):
Yeah. Just stop with that monkey box thing. Bayview is a hundred percent electric and effort to decrease carbon emissions

Jeff Jarvis (00:52:39):
As opposed to what

Leo Laporte (00:52:41):
Natural gas.

Jeff Jarvis (00:52:43):
Well, they also have,

Leo Laporte (00:52:45):
They don't

Jeff Jarvis (00:52:45):
Have what we call it. Heat pumps cold.

Leo Laporte (00:52:47):
In addition to collaborative and community areas that campus includes phone rooms and other private spaces. Oh this is that thing that we were talking about where privacy thing comes in. Oh look, there's a massage chair. <Laugh> kind of peering out from behind

Jeff Jarvis (00:53:00):
The curtain. It feels, it feels really like dirty.

Leo Laporte (00:53:04):
It feels thrown together. To be honest with you. I'm sorry. But I don't know.

Jeff Jarvis (00:53:10):
I'm they've been building this forever. They've been building this for four iOS, but

Ant Pruitt (00:53:15):
What was wrong with the current Plex? Was it just growing small? Is that

Leo Laporte (00:53:20):
Growing small? They need the 11,000.

Jeff Jarvis (00:53:22):
They didn't build that, that Plex

Leo Laporte (00:53:23):
Room for 11,000 new employees who are not coming to work after. Yeah. But

Ant Pruitt (00:53:29):
I was saying, what's the point of following through if, well, I guess they didn't know. Cause it's not like they started building this lot.

Jeff Jarvis (00:53:35):
Oh. But literally four iOS again. I was there watching the construction. Yeah.

Ant Pruitt (00:53:41):
I remember seeing the dirty lot a couple

Leo Laporte (00:53:44):
Weeks ago, add Tech's biggest data breach. I didn't even, I'm so

Jeff Jarvis (00:53:49):
Sick of data

Leo Laporte (00:53:50):
Breaches. Did you know about this one?

Jeff Jarvis (00:53:51):
All data is gonna get out. Yeah. Let's just know it. Let's.

Leo Laporte (00:53:55):
This is the Irish council for civil liberties. Talking about this real time bidding system. When do you hear this? Actually, this is kind of stunning. RTB is the biggest data breach ever recorded at tracks. And, but not by hackers. This is intentional tracks and shares with people view online and their real world location. 294 billion times a day in the us 197 billion times a day in Europe, the Mo so get ready. Okay. this is an estimate again from the I C C L per person per day, across the us. And by the way, if you live in Colorado, you're the worst, worst off of this. If you live in Colorado 987 RTB broadcasts a day per person, that means your location data particularly. So RTB exposes people's data on average 747 times a day. Google, the biggest player in the RTB system allows four thou get ready for this 4,698 companies to retrieve data about the people in the us, your, your location, data, Microsoft, which ramped up its involvement in RTB in December when it bought AgTech firm, Xander from at and T may send data to 1,647 companies, privacy and security concerns have been raised about RTB for years, especially in Europe, but Ari, but awareness is arising in the us.

Leo Laporte (00:55:36):
This is from a tech crunch story that came out yesterday, Natasha Lomas writing the real time bidding systems use of web users, interviews, or info for tracking and ad targeting

Ant Pruitt (00:55:53):
Businesses business clearly.

Leo Laporte (00:55:56):
Well, and again, I don't, honestly I've said this before. I don't really care if a company buys us to target me with advertising. That seems to me to be a minor hazard mm-hmm <affirmative>. But we now know that it's not just companies, it's law enforcement in Texas. It could just be your neighbor. Yeah. Trying to figure out if you went to an abortion clinic recently, so he could Sue you mm-hmm <affirmative> this is becoming, you know, we, the warning went out if this Roe V Wade decision goes through the Supreme court, you could, you should probably not use a period tracking app. Right. Right. Because that information could be sold on to somebody who would take advantage of it and prosecute you

Shoshana Weissmann (00:56:35):
And those apps have had leaks. I think flow is the one that had a really big data leak. And also one thing that I actually love related to this is Senator Ron white, and obviously who created two 30, I was in Oregon giving a speech and I'm like, Ron, Weden created two 30. The thing I'm talking about,

Leo Laporte (00:56:52):
He's two 30 fan girl. There's no high heart, Ron white. I do under two.

Shoshana Weissmann (00:56:57):
But he has AI. He has a bill that would stop government from buying data to get around like third party doctrine holes, which I love, I think that's a great idea because it's like, oh, we can't have a warrant. We'll just buy the data. Like that's not acceptable. Right. And it's, it's crazy to me, you know, I I'm open to a federal privacy law, our straight works on this issue, but I also think it's kind of what you're saying. It's more dangerous for the government to be able to have this stuff, to be able to buy its way out of the fourth amendment. And because those holes are there, like it's crazy to me, that government isn't like, Hey, this, this seems like a real hazard here. Like maybe we take care of this. And it's just like Ron widen. And his co-sponsor is in their corner being like, Hey, we're trying to fix this. Maybe we wanna do this. You know,

Leo Laporte (00:57:42):
The Irish council for civil liberties goes on to say, there's no way to restrict the use of RTB data after its broadcast data brokers used it to profile black lives matter protesters. The us department of Homeland security and other agencies used it for warrantless phone tracking. It was implicated in the outing of a gay Catholic priest through his use of grinder. I CCL uncovered the sale of RTB data, revealing likely survivors of sexual abuse. This is horrific. So it's not the kind of data breach. We usually talk about where a company that's been collecting data got hacked and the data leaked out. These are people selling it. This is a system. Yeah. For collecting the data, aggregating the data and then selling it on. And Google is a, is the biggest player, but that's not news anymore. Right. That Google, although this, I mean, I think this ICC reports kind of eyeopening. Yeah. I think that's probably the, the,

Shoshana Weissmann (00:58:44):
Yeah, that's really bad.

Leo Laporte (00:58:45):
That's let me, let me say the number again. An average American has their online activity and location exposed 747 times every day by the RTB industry, 747 times a day. A lot of that information's coming from your phone and from Google or, you know, they don't mention Apple's involvement in this. I'm I'm gonna hope Apple's not involved, but, but maybe apple didn't want to come in or figure out a way to lock out. Yeah. I mean, they don't, you don't have to sell this data on mm-hmm <affirmative> 

Shoshana Weissmann (00:59:20):
Well, apple, I dunno, whenever I stays out,

Leo Laporte (00:59:22):
Go ahead. Shahana

Shoshana Weissmann (00:59:23):
Oh, sorry. Whenever I get anyone's the, I just sell it so, you know,

Leo Laporte (00:59:27):
<Laugh> yeah. Who wants it? I don't need it. I don't need it. Anyway, so that's not the typical kind of data breach and you're right. It's been going on probably forever. Mm-Hmm <affirmative> but the, the magnitude of it is, is kind of staggering.

Shoshana Weissmann (00:59:42):
I really do think the third party doctrine thing is something that's not talked about enough in policy. Like it's kind of crazy to me that there's the moral panic around two 30 while with third party doctrine, they're saying, oh, if someone else also owns your data, you have no interest in it, which is just nuts to me. I, I actually got interested in it through the Gorsuch concurrence and carpenter. I thought that was a really, really interesting I mean, I think all of the opinions in it were interesting, but it's something that we should be thinking about more than like, why did Twitter Ben or not ban this one, dude? You know?

Leo Laporte (01:00:14):
So I'm gonna in a kind of explain to me like a fifth grader, explain this and you correct me if I'm, if I'm wrong, the fourth amendment has a of the constitution has a prohibition against unreasonable search and seizure. You have to have in general, probable cause and a search warrant that's of course slowly been whittled away. But after several Supreme court decisions, this third party doctrine has arisen that if you already are giving information to third parties like your phone company or your bank or your is P, then you have no reasonable expectation of privacy for that information. Is that, is that essentially what you're talking about here? The

Shoshana Weissmann (01:00:56):
Way? Yeah. Yeah. That's basically it. I'm not as deep in it as others are, and it's definitely not my deepest issue, but it is something that's kind of up there for me that we need to shore up whether through the courts or through the legislature or both, because it's not, it doesn't make sense and precedent, like what used to happen in early America was that was not the understanding. But government like its power. So it'll try to like get our information and get around warrants as much as it can.

Ant Pruitt (01:01:22):
Yeah. So let me try to understand what you said as a second grader. You're basically saying, because I have a phone I

Leo Laporte (01:01:27):
Have, because you share that data with other

Ant Pruitt (01:01:29):
Expectation of privacy, just because I own

Leo Laporte (01:01:31):
A phone only for the data you already share with other parties, like your location data with Google mm-hmm <affirmative>, the government has a right to that. You've, you've basically given up your right to privacy in that regard. It's not protected by the fourth amendment. And in fact, get ready for this Bitcoin advocates in 2020, the fifth circuit, our favorite circuit outta Texas found that transaction data with virtual currency exchanges like Bitcoin cryptocurrency are like bank records. So they're not protected either. They are not protected by the fourth amendment. So all the people who say, oh yeah, you know, Bitcoin is private, is secure, not according to the fifth circuit. Yeah, that's a, that's a terrifying thought. So that's, I guess the whole idea of these of these auctions, these data auctions is, well, it's worse is the government doesn't have to collect the information. <Laugh>, you're voluntarily giving it up. Right. They're just giving it up. They just have to ask for it and or buy it if they want on the exchange. That's pretty, that's pretty scary. Do you know, Shahan I understand this isn't necessarily your exact area, but do you know of government agencies that are buying this information?

Shoshana Weissmann (01:02:42):
Yeah, I know what's been happening. I genuinely don't remember offhand which agencies, but it's been something that's become like common practice, which, you know, logistically makes sense. If it's a way they can get around needing a warrant and like due process, of course they're gonna do it if they can. Right. the law enforcement has had that problem forever. It it's, it's kind of wild though, that that there's not as much interest in that, that it's really, you know, Ron, White's really leading here, but that like not a lot of other elected officials or like this, this seems like a violation of rights we might wanna like shore up. So yeah, it's, it's a problem that's actively happening and it's just nuts to me that that it's getting so little coverage.

Leo Laporte (01:03:21):
Yeah. Well, now that we know how much of our information is our data smog is coming off of us all the time. Maybe we should pay a little bit more attention to what who's using that information. And, and as I said, you know, you can argue with me that, well, it's advertisers that's harmless, but I think we all agree if it's government, it's not harmless. Correct. It's not harmless. That's, that's terrible. GE here, Google hired and former apple. Yeah, that was a good story. One of Apple's probably their best known AI guy left apple, cuz he didn't wanna go back to work. He didn't wanna go back to work. <Laugh>

Jeff Jarvis (01:04:02):
In that nice office. We

Leo Laporte (01:04:03):
Built you. <Laugh> some he, he tweeted among other reasons. Mm-Hmm <affirmative> that he, he didn't like Apple's back to work policy, which was by the way, May 23rd. I think everybody is supposed to go back to work. I believe they rescinded. I think they changed it, but Ian good feller because

Jeff Jarvis (01:04:21):
COVID is not over.

Leo Laporte (01:04:23):
Yes. Just to be clear. No, they're right. That's right. Apple's making you wear masks inside the, the campus Ian Goodell act. Apple's director of machine learning tweeted I'm outta here. I don't like this policy among other things. He came to apple from Google in 2019. He's now back at Google. So I think this is pretty common in Silicon valley. There's a, I was gonna say that's the developers tend to do, right? Yeah. Yeah. But he was apparently at apple, one of their, one of their, you know, leading lights in machine learning. Good. Well should should I'm trying to think if this should be a change log I was gonna, well, the the Google allowing you to have your free, no cost legacy G suite with custom it's Gmail. You go explain

Jeff Jarvis (01:05:09):
It first,

Leo Laporte (01:05:09):
Then I'll complain. Yeah. So for you were on it, so you actually were best. No,

Jeff Jarvis (01:05:14):
I'll no. I'll tell you. No, I'm always in exception. I'm always a damn exception. Okay. You explain it first.

Leo Laporte (01:05:20):
Last my popcorn. Dang <laugh> <laugh>. So Google had announced that people, at one point you could sign up, have a, do have email at your domain name mm-hmm <affirmative>, you know, Leo laport.com or whatever. But have Gmail do it. Yeah. For free, for one address then they changed that policy a couple months ago and said, no, no, we're not gonna allow you to do that anymore. Now they've announced after Jeff complained there is going to be a free legacy edition of G suite for personable. I'm sorry for personal use. Jeff, you don't have to be personal.

Jeff Jarvis (01:06:00):
No, you also have to be

Leo Laporte (01:06:01):
Personable. Yeah. That's a problem. That's

Jeff Jarvis (01:06:02):
Why

Leo Laporte (01:06:02):
I fail. Yeah. If you don't wanna pay for workspace, but, and you don't wanna export your data, you can continue for free. So the <affirmative> so that's good news for you, right?

Jeff Jarvis (01:06:15):
No, it's not. Because some time ago I ended up saying, well, I'll pay you cause I wanted more storage or something. I don't know what it was.

Leo Laporte (01:06:21):
Yeah. Oh. And

Jeff Jarvis (01:06:22):
Two of my former colleagues from the company I left 15 years ago, old friends of mine. Haven't talked to 'em in quite a while. Like years they have emailed there and my son has emailed there. So there's four of us on it. And so I, I keep on getting these messages from Google saying, if you don't up upgrade and update by this, at this price, then it's just gonna happen to you. Like some painful process is gonna happen without and anesthesia. And I go to the sites trying to figure it out. And it's always confusing as hell. Cuz I'm just a little old me. I don't think I can downgrade to personal. So I don't know what the hell's going

Leo Laporte (01:06:57):
On. And for you, the main thing is keeping your, my domain,

Jeff Jarvis (01:07:00):
My domain domain.

Leo Laporte (01:07:02):
Yeah. Yeah. You want, yeah, I don't blame you. 

Jeff Jarvis (01:07:07):
So I'll whatever it is, I'll pay it, you know? Okay. Google, you got me, you know,

Leo Laporte (01:07:11):
It's not too expensive. It's

Jeff Jarvis (01:07:13):
Confusing. Well, no, just confusing as hell. Why, why change it?

Leo Laporte (01:07:18):
Are you using it for commercial purposes, Jeff?

Jeff Jarvis (01:07:20):
Oh God, if I wish <laugh>

Leo Laporte (01:07:23):
So as long as it's non-commercial personal use, I think it's it's. It should be free I think.

Jeff Jarvis (01:07:29):
But then there's other

Leo Laporte (01:07:30):
Into my web domain registration with the registrar. You, no that says this, you still have to pay for that. Right? Jeff, you still pay for your,

Jeff Jarvis (01:07:38):
But that's not much by the way. It's also

Leo Laporte (01:07:40):
It's 10 bucks a year or something. Yeah. Yeah. Wall street journal. I like the wall street journal. I always have to take these with a grain of salt, especially in the opinion section, don't try to regulate Google ads, Todd Henderson. I think

Jeff Jarvis (01:07:57):
Shosha will like this

Leo Laporte (01:07:58):
One. Senator Michael has some legislation that would forbid Google and other tech giants to build and operate digital advertising exchanges from owning the tools that help buyers and sellers of online advertising. This has been a long time criticism of Google that it is both. It's both the house and, and the dealer and you know, runs the whole thing. Anyway, the wall street journal, doesn't like it because

Jeff Jarvis (01:08:24):
Well this columnist, this, this

Leo Laporte (01:08:26):
Professor, yes. Not only is this bad policy, but it's based on the faulty policy, but,

Jeff Jarvis (01:08:29):
But he explains it.

Leo Laporte (01:08:30):
Yeah. And that advertising markets are AOUS and analogous to security markets. So do you agree with Mike Lee's legislation? Jeff? Yeah.

Jeff Jarvis (01:08:38):
He says, no, I don't. He says in this case, I, I, well, I don't, I don't know, honest answers. I don't know how rare do I say that? This guy makes a good point, which is that this structure because it could operate so efficiently opened up in, in a shrinking, you know, ad market, it opened up new opportunities. And if you go back to a world where they can't talk to each other, so fluidly, he says, it's, you're gonna lose ad opportunities and media's gonna lose again. And, and, and, and I don't know, but it's the wall street journal. So I don't know.

Leo Laporte (01:09:11):
Well, that's I always, this one time, I see opinion the wall street journal. I have to go.

Jeff Jarvis (01:09:15):
I don't same here. Same

Leo Laporte (01:09:16):
Here for it. Am I again? I

Jeff Jarvis (01:09:18):
Put it in there cuz this one made me think and say, oh,

Leo Laporte (01:09:20):
Professor Anderson does say, if Google offers a bad deal, advertisers, publishers have plenty of full service ad companies you choose from Amazon, Facebook, Microsoft, Verizon. 

Jeff Jarvis (01:09:30):
So advertising is not, you don't, you don't go out, out, out to the golf course with, with your buddy Joe and sell him six months of ads in the sports section. Right. All that is so far gone. Right. It's all. And it's,

Leo Laporte (01:09:43):
It's all done. Automatic. Yeah, yeah.

Jeff Jarvis (01:09:45):
Yeah. In a, in a, in a, in a trading, in a make believe trading for

Leo Laporte (01:09:50):
Art action houses, he say art, he says art auction houses offer tools for buyers and sellers and sometimes even bid in the auctions they host. Hmm. Well, I don't know if that's such a good thing. That's one of the complaints people have had about these NFTs is that a lot of buyers of NFTs are pumping the price up artificially by selling it to themselves. Yeah. And then buying it and then selling it and buying it.

Jeff Jarvis (01:10:13):
I'm not against regulating it. I'm not against, by any means investigating it. I just don't think we know fully yet how this marketplace works. Cuz it's so big. And so complex. Look at that. Prior story about the leak. Look at the volume you're talking about there. Wow. You can't go back.

Leo Laporte (01:10:29):
Obviously the focus on delivering value to end users was the central insight of the Chicago school of antitrust, to which conservatives like Senator Lee used to look for economic insight in making an INAP analogy to the security market. Senator Lee's bill would take us back to a less, less efficient time. I just feel stupid because it seems like a good idea to me, but I don't want to be inefficient for God's sake. Shahan have you covered this at all

Shoshana Weissmann (01:10:57):
A little bit. I mean a lot of the, a lot of the bills, I think aren't really necessary. Like if Google is doing fraud, that's, fraud's already a thing you can't do. I don't think you need regulations on top of it. It it's possible that there's something I'm missing, but but a lot of like leads and others arguments are that there's like no place to place your ad except for Google and Facebook. So they're like a duopoly and I'm like, no, you can, you can put your ad somewhere else. If you choose, you can talk it out with someone, figure out other methods. But but a lot of their argument is that the market's so tight that if they don't like this, they can't go elsewhere. So I think it's still part of that big tech, moral panic. You know, I'm not, I'm definitely not knee jerk against regulations if they make sense. But I think this one is just a little too moral panicky and I tend to think that like, you know, look into it. Sure. But right now I, I don't think there's a strong case that Google's doing anything that needs new legislation. People often point to stuff like we're Facebook inflated, video views. And, but like that was fraud and the FTC was like, this is fraud. You can't do that. And I think that's how it's supposed to work.

Leo Laporte (01:12:02):
There is a mistrust though of regulatory ability to catch companies like Google and stuff like this because it's so arcane and so high speed and it's so O mostly so opaque that it's, it's not clear how regulators would know if there were an issue. If there were fraud,

Shoshana Weissmann (01:12:18):
Then I'm not sure new legislation would fix that though. That true. I do think that wouldn't be government needs to yeah. Government needs to better understand tech and actually one thing our streets advocated for is reinstating the office of technology as to hire experts. Yeah. So that way we can understand stuff better. I'm very open to that. Just more expertise in government. We've also been advocates for more staff pay because while we wanna shrink government, like having a just wildly inefficient government with with no institutional knowledge is not very efficient. So I think there's a lot that has to happen before you can get to that point. But but part of it too, is that I don't trust regulators who don't understand what they're regulating and that, that in itself can cause problems and it can cause regulatory capture problems. And it's something I see quite often where it's like, oh, I don't understand it. I'll defer to the expert who runs this business. And then, oh, wait, they're the only business that exists. <Laugh> that's weird. How did that happen?

Leo Laporte (01:13:15):
<Laugh> yeah, exactly. No, I completely agree with you. New Gingrich dissolved the office of technology assessment and that was a massive mistake that left members of Congress without any objective information about how this stuff works. So 

Shoshana Weissmann (01:13:31):
I don't know. It's worked out pretty well with all the illiterate section two 30 bills that have come out.

Leo Laporte (01:13:36):
I think it's

Shoshana Weissmann (01:13:37):
Going pretty well.

Leo Laporte (01:13:39):
I mean, honestly you know, this just come up with when people talk about Senator Feinstein, who is, you know, clearly towards the end of her abilities, but her, but as the staff does most of the work, right. So it really does come down to how smart your staff is, how good your staff is. Is it and you said Shahan maybe the staff there should be more staff. But staff also should be given tools. Yep. Like TA

Shoshana Weissmann (01:14:06):
Yeah, yeah. Better pay more resources. Yeah. There's all kinds of things that can help, but I, I've known so many incredible staff paid like nothing. I know someone who ended up going back to back to Congress, but when they were when they were working, they'd read all of my work before we met and we became friends because wow of it. But they were paid like $30,000. Yeah. Doing like a wild level of work and really, really trying. So of course they're gonna leave to go to the private sector. Other friends who you know, were weren't making much wanna start a family. I mean, for rent in DC is really high too. It's a really, really expensive city and when you're making it, so either only rich people's kids can afford to work in Congress or or if you're not, you have to leave. If you wanna like move up, that's just not a healthy environment. We should be retaining that institutional knowledge, rewarding, good staff. But to that end though, I think after all my work with government, one big thing that I've really seen is you can really judge an elected official by their staff. People who have really good, strong, knowledgeable teams tend to produce better legislation and and better work. It's something that's really, really important.

Leo Laporte (01:15:15):
That's that is good government, right? I mean, you can't I think people say, oh, well, the senators should be doing all, all the work, but that I think that good government means you, first of all, it's a big job and that no one person can do it. And good, good government means that they're given the resources, they need to get the information they need so they can make intelligent decisions.

Shoshana Weissmann (01:15:37):
Yeah. You have to know what you don't know. There's elected officials who come from the military and know those issues really well. Ah, there's others who come from business like Coldstone and, you know, know that really well, but there's all different sides to it. And it's it's always really frustrating when a politician just wants to knee jerk and not listen to their staff, but the ones who have that like really strong staff, like that's, that's the best kind of stuff. Unfortunately, there, there could be a little more of it in certain cases, but there also is a lot of really great staff. They just like, can't always afford to, to live in DC and work in Congress. Yeah. They lose money doing

Leo Laporte (01:16:09):
It. Yeah, of course. It's really a sacrifice. So thank you to all the, I know we have quite a few members of Congress staff members who listen to our shows. So trying to keep up with what's going on, we thank you for the job. You kudos. Kudos. It's a great civil service. Speaking of which, by the way, we're gonna get we're working to get Matt Cutz to come back former director of the us digital services. He's a busy guy. He's enjoying life on the street. <Laugh> is he in Canada or is he in Washington or I think he's in Canada. I'm not sure. But but I think Jason said soon, soon, I think was the word. So looking forward to getting mad, speaking of great civil servants, getting mad back. Yeah. Our show day brought to you by NA RVA.

Leo Laporte (01:16:56):
Oh, people coming back to work, leaving, coming back, leaving. There's one thing almost, you almost certainly can be sure of in that conference room, that meeting room, that, that, that huddles room, you probably have people in person. You probably have people on the phone remote, you gotta mix and you gotta make sure everybody can hear everybody everybody's comfortable with the situation. Sometimes that means, oh, I'm gonna go spend thousands and thousands of dollars on a traditional system, a traditional conferencing system. What am I saying? Thousands, tens of thousands of dollars. You gotta have design software. You've gotta have experts. You've gotta have ma they come in, they measure the room. You have a dizzying array of DSPs and speakers and, and microphones. And, and it's just, it's just crazy outside technicians who have to come calibrate the thing frequently. It's expensive. It's invasive. It could take your room offline for days.

Leo Laporte (01:17:54):
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Leo Laporte (01:18:55):
They get the power to monitor, manage, adjust the system from anywhere. They don't even have to be on site. And they certainly don't have to go from room to room. The simple installation it's so easy. It's a 30 minute DIY job. If you can install a soundbar, you can install Narva. So that's gonna save on time and cost compared to traditional systems. It looks great. It sounds great. And everybody can hear what's going on this. I don't know why you would choose anything else. Why would you want to go with that costly complicated traditional system? Make the leap to the modern, simple, economical Neva, N you are E V a. You can learn more@neva.com. It's just incredible. You just gotta try this. N U R E V a no reva.com. We thank you so much for supporting our show this week in Google. Thank you.

Leo Laporte (01:19:46):
Ne Reva, Google messages, users in India, drowning in and drowning in ads. This is maybe the unintended consequence of RCS. The rich communication system Google's been pushing on us users are being sent multiple ads a day, even with spam protection on blocking and reporting. The offended accounts doesn't seem to prevent ads from other companies, appearing personal loans, gambling companies, life insurance they're abusing. It seems according to a nine to five Google and RCS feature that's designed to let businesses contact their customers with rich interactive media, sending customers QR code tickets, letting 'em make online orders. Instead, some accounts Google identifies as verified. Businesses are sending users in India, a barrage of ads.

Ant Pruitt (01:20:42):
Oh my gosh.

Leo Laporte (01:20:43):
Here's did you see this tweet? This is if you're wondering how bad the ads and Google messages can get. I got all these in the last seven hours. Oh, rumy circle. Make a blockbuster entry, Baja finance, no cost EMI flip card and offer you can't miss. Can you imagine, can you imagine, is that cost you money? This is on text. Kidding. Well that's a good message. Message. Google messages. No. This is RCS. Well, it might in India. It might I don't, that's a good question. What

Ant Pruitt (01:21:12):
Can Google do about this? So,

Leo Laporte (01:21:15):
I mean, I wonder if it's Google something to be, or if it's the phone company's issues. That's a, that's a really good question. Indian based EAN agar wall whose recent tweets have drawn attention to the issue tells the verge that has been going. The problem's been growing worse over the course of 2022. Android police says the problem's been around for a year, mostly coming complaints coming mostly from users in India. The only way to stop receiving ads entirely is to disable RCS support.

Ant Pruitt (01:21:50):
<Laugh> what

Leo Laporte (01:21:54):
Google did not respond to the verges request for common.

Ant Pruitt (01:21:58):
Oh man. Wow.

Leo Laporte (01:21:59):
Thank you, John Porter from the verge. We we're actually on the, I don't know if anybody, have you been anybody getting an upswell in robo calls and spa calls? Yeah.

Ant Pruitt (01:22:10):
Oh yeah. My gosh cell phone rings and I don't even think about it

Leo Laporte (01:22:15):
Anymore. It's nonstop. Right?

Ant Pruitt (01:22:16):
It used to be a, a, you know, I'm like, okay, well today is Thursday. I'm probably going to hear from my mother. So listen out for phone ringing, you know that a mom, your

Leo Laporte (01:22:24):
Spam, right?

Ant Pruitt (01:22:26):
<Laugh> but now it's just ringing all the time. Now I've just, I don't even

Leo Laporte (01:22:31):
So I can tell you why. I think the FCC we've talked about this before has an authentication caller ID authentication service called stir and shaken, which they're gonna require right now. T-Mobile Verizon at and T all use it. And in theory could reject calls that aren't authenticated. And of course, no spamer wants their call to be authenticated. Of course. Cause they, they wanna hide who they are. Mm-Hmm <affirmative> but there is a loophole. Oh, of course the FCC has been putting this off the commission, granted small voice service providers with a hundred or fewer subscriber lines, an extension until June 30th, 2023. And I guess the re, but of course that's the ones that spamers are using. They're not they're they're using some VoIP service. Mm-Hmm <affirmative> somebody got mad at me. Cause I used to say Trinidad and Tobago. So I'll find a different place out of Aruba. Okay. Out of east Virginia, east Virginia.

Shoshana Weissmann (01:23:29):
Perfect. Don't you dare blame my constituents. <Laugh>

Leo Laporte (01:23:32):
That? Nothing wrong. So the FCC did move that timeline up a little bit. So now if you do not, if you're a hundred thousand subscribers or fewer and you don't have actual buildings facilities, you gotta knock it off June 30th. So it's my theory that these guys say we got, oh my God, we got six weeks left release the house blitz, blitz them. So let's see. But June 30th, it should get better. And then June the 30th, the following year facilities based phone companies, small phone companies, those with buildings like the actual Aruba phone company or the actual east Virginia phone company, they will, they will have to stop as well. And of course, then it's gonna be up to at T Verizon sprint, whoever your T-Mobile, whoever your carriers to reject unauthenticated calls. Just say no, or maybe give you a switch that says, Hey, look, if it's not stir or shaken authenticated, well, given, I don't wanna hear it. Switch is just as inconvenient. That means my phone is still gonna ring and I have to sit and no, you need a permanent, you need a switch that says, just don't let anything unauthenticated come through. Yeah. That would be because your mom's authenticated. Right. anything <laugh> legit should be authenticated.

Shoshana Weissmann (01:24:50):
So legit question here, because I don't do telecom policy as much. I know a little bit, not very much, but like, are there small legitimate services and people who could be affected by this? Sure. Like negatively,

Leo Laporte (01:25:02):
Well, so I think spamers use a VoIP, you know, online, only services. They're very cheap. You can send a million calls for a couple of bucks. Mm-Hmm <affirmative> I think those people probably really need to be stopped, but if, yeah, if you're the small east Virginia phone company, what about the press Democrat trying to do a, a big, well, no, it's the phone company that has to implement it and the press Democrat needs to go through a legitimate phone company that's using stern shaken. Okay. I don't think that that's a hardship. I mean, I, I don't think it's expensive to implement. I'm sure it's, you know, it's a little complicated, but mostly I think these small phone companies are not implementing it because they make a lot of money selling, you know, spam services to companies. Yeah. We've seen, yeah. I was go ahead.

Shoshana Weissmann (01:25:50):
I, I was just curious about the regulatory compliance cost because it doesn't sound like it's that bad here. I mean, I'd love to stop receiving spam calls. I'm just always worried about competition and you know

Leo Laporte (01:26:02):
You know what, you're gonna have to get your friends at RSI to get to work on this. Cuz that's a good question. I don't, I don't know why you wouldn't want to do this, but maybe there is a large cost. It's the, the stir, which is secured telephony identity revisited came from the I E TF. It's basically digitally certificate based. Okay. So the sip, the session initiation protocol would have an, a certificate which would identify you. The first public connection to the system, the VoIP service provider would examines the caller ID, compares it to a known list of IDs. They provided that customer. In other words says, are you a authentic, are you genuine? And then they attach an encrypted certificate to the sip header with the service providers that is in Indiana antitrust value. That seems like a simple thing, not so complicated to do shaken, which is signature based handling of asserted information, using tokens. I hate these retro S <laugh> it's for public switch telephone networks to tell how to them, how to deal with calls that have incorrect or missing stir information. So what do, what do you do if it's not authentic? In other words, and this was, this has been going on the FCC started talking about this three or four years ago because of the epidemic of Rob book calls and spam calls.

Jeff Jarvis (01:27:34):
What caused the cuz it was working for a while. What was working when, when, when you, you did the do not call list. And I joined that list, you know, some years ago and for a while my phone was a phone. What happened? <Laugh> is it because do not call sold something potentially? No, that's that's a no, I don't

Leo Laporte (01:27:57):
Think I'm, I don't know, but I'm gonna guess that because of voiceover internet, it's Dramat it's the same spam is through the roof it's dramatically cheaper to use because

Jeff Jarvis (01:28:09):
You can't, you can't tell who's who

Leo Laporte (01:28:11):
And end do not call works in the us, do not call all of the, the, you know, the prohibitions against spam and robocalls that we have in the us work. But most of these people are outside the us using small right. VO based phone companies outside the us outside jurisdiction, and can't be stopped. You know, there have been a number of notorious spamers arrested and prosecuted. And I think they're in jail now. Mm-Hmm <affirmative> but it didn't make a dent in it because most of the people are over, over overseas, I believe. 

Leo Laporte (01:28:48):
20, 26. Yeah. Right against robo calls, 26 billion calls in 2019, between January and October 46 billion is the estimate in 2020. So it's almost doubled in, in a year. So you're right to say something's going on. And of course the latest thing is, you know, you pose is a local exchange, same area code, same, same three digit exchange. And now the latest, latest one is, comes from your number. Mm-Hmm <affirmative>, it's your number calling you all the time. All the time. Yeah. That's, that's how you know it's right. That's how, you know, that's completely illegal neighbor and, and neighbor spoofing, which is using the same area code or the same area code in exchange is completely illegal. Doesn't stop these people cuz they're not, they're not here. Got it. And but stern shaken would because the Carls wouldn't even go through, they'd say, well, what's your authentication, what's your certificate? And they go, well, I'm not telling you that. Well then you're not going through, but that is gonna rely on the phone companies doing it. And I, I suspect there's money in it. And you know that they may be getting kickbacks who knows, you know? <Affirmative> 

Shoshana Weissmann (01:29:57):
Yeah. I, I bribe them from my extended seat. Yeah.

Leo Laporte (01:30:01):
Yeah. It's you? I thought so Canada has, has already implemented this by the way. So ask your Canadian friends, how much Rob, how much I many robo calls they get. This reminds me of mark Rober on YouTube. He does the glitter bomb. Okay. What do you think of this? <Laugh> so I, I have some qualms about this mm-hmm <affirmative> so mark Rober, famous NASA scientist has been doing this several for, to porch pirates for some years. Mm-Hmm <affirmative> right. Mm-Hmm <affirmative> he makes these, the boxes that look like Amazon valuable Amazon packages. Mm-Hmm <affirmative> fills 'em with, with stink bombs and glitter, glitter, and <laugh> glitter and then, and cameras. So they can get video of the perpetrators, the porch pirates, opening up, up and horrified throwing 'em out the window. So what's the latest, what did he do recently? Well, he got one or two of those call centers in India, shut down.

Leo Laporte (01:30:57):
He sent 'em to call centers. They set up a team and did a lot of recon and apparently was able to pull it through. He sent them not only stink bombs and glitter bombs, cockroach. He sent 'em cockroaches. I'm not honestly, I love, love that. You see, I don't, I feel like, I mean, look, these people are horrible. I, I understand here's the video of them opening the glitter bomb and, and being horrified you know, Calcutta mostly in India, right? Calcutta, India, Uhhuh. I feel bad for these guys. Mark has no compunction. I feel like this is vigilantism. Yeah. 

Shoshana Weissmann (01:31:39):
The city needs a hero.

Leo Laporte (01:31:40):
<Laugh> gosh, he's good. Not the hero we want, but the hero we have. Yeah.

Shoshana Weissmann (01:31:50):
So I I'm genuinely jealous of his success because with the romance scammers, usually what I'll do is when he asks for my number, I'll send him to the FTC romance scam line <laugh>

Leo Laporte (01:32:02):
And 

Shoshana Weissmann (01:32:04):
My knowledge I've asked the FTC to like, I mean, I don't know if they would, but like to like, let me know if they were able to catch anyone from that. And I prize. Yeah. Like I should get like whatever he was gonna steal from me. Like I should earn from like the FTC I feel like. But but I, I was upset cuz I, I don't think I've ever successfully caught them. I've tried. I've been like, Hey, call the FTC, like this have to do something. And it, it, I just don't think it's enough, unfortunately. So I'm very jealous of it's success.

Leo Laporte (01:32:34):
Yeah. Well, it wasn't successful with the law enforcement in these places until he got a lot of attention and then finally law enforcement did start to come in. Yep. And roll these things up, but they'll be right back.

Ant Pruitt (01:32:46):
Look. Yeah, they're fine. They'll

Leo Laporte (01:32:48):
Be bribed. They'll bribe the law enforcement. They'll be right back doing it again in a month. I don't know. I just feel like it's vigilantism I guess if you, I don't know, is it okay? To, to do something horrible to some, another person, if they're just cuz they're doing something horrible to, to other people and do these guys know what they were doing even

Jeff Jarvis (01:33:09):
Mean? The other

Ant Pruitt (01:33:09):
Question is there's some

Jeff Jarvis (01:33:10):
Schmuck who needs a job. Yeah.

Leo Laporte (01:33:12):
And it's not, well, I guarantee with some schmuck who needs a job.

Ant Pruitt (01:33:15):
Well, the way the video played out was the people that are hired. They're going to work for a said company that does whatever customer service for somewhere else. That's what they say

Leo Laporte (01:33:26):
Legally during the day they do customer service, right?

Ant Pruitt (01:33:28):
That's they say paper legally, but there's another floor upstairs. If you will. That's sort of, you know, locked off and everything, but that's where the real money is being made. So the, the, the legal stuff is just the front to cover up the,

Leo Laporte (01:33:43):
Yeah. I feel bad.

Shoshana Weissmann (01:33:44):
Well, I think the morality of the Vigi of the vigilantism I think it boils down to, was it funny? And I think this,

Leo Laporte (01:33:52):
If it's funny it's okay. So you

Ant Pruitt (01:33:56):
Look at this, the screen, the call centers. They're legit call centers.

Leo Laporte (01:34:01):
Yeah, no, I understand. I don't know something about this bugs me. But alright.

Ant Pruitt (01:34:06):
Is it a problem for him delivering glitter packages or putting, deliver glitter packages on the front porch? You, you have a problem with that?

Leo Laporte (01:34:16):
No, for some reason it doesn't bother me.

Jeff Jarvis (01:34:18):
Cause he's a suburban guy who wants to get his packages

Leo Laporte (01:34:20):
<Laugh> no, I, we don't have any porch pirates, but I mean those guy. Yeah.

Ant Pruitt (01:34:27):
Cause I didn't worry about porch

Leo Laporte (01:34:28):
Pirates. Oh, you're right. I didn't bother them for,

Ant Pruitt (01:34:30):
For a long time until I started noticing it. It was picking up in the news. It's like, well crap. So I had to start looking out and put cameras up at our place just to make sure. And, and yes, we have had people wandering into the yard before. Yeah. Like what the hell are you doing?

Leo Laporte (01:34:47):
You make a good point. It doesn't bother me that it did it to porch pirates. Mm-Hmm <affirmative> I just, I feel bad for these poor guys in India who are probably, you know, making 500. What

Jeff Jarvis (01:34:56):
About, what about a or a a disinformation person in Belarus? Pardon? Is that okay if it were a dis disinformation farm in Belarus? You

Leo Laporte (01:35:05):
Okay with? I don't know. I don't know. And, and you know what, I think what Johanna does to romance scammers is perfectly fine. Mm-Hmm <affirmative> I don't know. Maybe it's just me. It's me

Jeff Jarvis (01:35:18):
Breaking news. Google declares. Bankruptcy.

Leo Laporte (01:35:21):
Oh, come on. <Laugh>

Jeff Jarvis (01:35:23):
In Russia.

Leo Laporte (01:35:25):
Oh, okay. Well, no, that's a big deal. Line

Jeff Jarvis (01:35:27):
87. Okay.

Leo Laporte (01:35:28):
All right. Bankruptcy in Russia. What, what, I don't even understand what that means.

Jeff Jarvis (01:35:34):
Their bank accounts got seized.

Leo Laporte (01:35:36):
Oh.

Jeff Jarvis (01:35:37):
And so I think it's also a way to say we don't owe anybody, anything we got, we got no rules. Yeah. So,

Leo Laporte (01:35:42):
So they file an intention to declare bankruptcy after the seizure of its bank account made it untenable to meet financial obligations. Well, yeah. 

Jeff Jarvis (01:35:53):
Hmm. Here's some, here's some McDonald's coupons for you.

Leo Laporte (01:35:56):
Yeah, really? <Laugh> <laugh> speaking of scammers, apparently there are more than a few McDonald's opening in Russia now from, you know, copycat. I think that's hysterical. Hilarious. It's not a big Mac. If it's not under the golden arches, I just want to say,

Shoshana Weissmann (01:36:11):
Do they have all day

Leo Laporte (01:36:12):
Breakfast? Ah, well that would be different if I that's a good point. If I can get it at McMuffin at 4:00 PM,

Jeff Jarvis (01:36:19):
Does the ice cream machine work that

Leo Laporte (01:36:20):
Ice cream machine work, your number is not a McDonald's Soviet union floating machine spins you Chinese internet sensors, try a new trick, revealing users, locations

Jeff Jarvis (01:36:36):
On your, on your message.

Leo Laporte (01:36:38):
Like, okay. So we've seen this before where they shamed jaywalks but putting their picture up on billboards saying jaywalk words, saying you're Jay walkers. Mm-Hmm <affirmative> apparently shaming in China is a very effective tool. Yeah. Displaying social media users, locations beneath their posts. Authorities say the location tags, which are displayed automatically will help unearth overseas disinformation campaigns. Ah, so they're not going after Chinese citizens, just Americans let's say, or Russians trying to publish disinformation in China. Hmm.

Ant Pruitt (01:37:16):
Isn't the same practice in place for like people to write bad checks or, or something

Leo Laporte (01:37:21):
Like that. Well, yeah, they do a lot of social shaming. We know that. Yeah. Yeah. I, this isn't about that though. This is saying, look, this doesn't come from inside the country. This, this, this is coming from outside. Yeah. Huh. Those who appear to be getting online from abroad. Even if they're using a VPN are treated as foreign agitators and spies. So there's a, maybe a secondary benefit that also prevents the use of VPNs. Right. That's interesting. That's that really is. Maybe it IST, aimed outside disinformation after all inside mark Zuckerberg's billionaire lifestyle.

Jeff Jarvis (01:38:03):
It's a little cheap, but I put it up there. <Laugh> his $400. T-Shirts you know, it's just another chance to look at his, at his house. Yeah. Which is fine.

Leo Laporte (01:38:11):
Yeah.

Jeff Jarvis (01:38:12):
And his at his Lamborghini.

Leo Laporte (01:38:13):
Yeah. By the way, mark, you can go to mark suck. We'll go to Buck Mason and get 'em for a lot.

Ant Pruitt (01:38:18):
Yeah. I'm

Leo Laporte (01:38:19):
Like, what gonna do it'd actually be,

Ant Pruitt (01:38:20):
Come on it. It's

Leo Laporte (01:38:21):
Getting him very, that little $400. Why would a t-shirt be 400 bucks. It does. Look. It does look good on him though. It makes him look good. You know? Okay. It's fit nicely.

Ant Pruitt (01:38:33):
A buck. Mason would look better.

Leo Laporte (01:38:34):
I think a buck. Mason, do we?

Jeff Jarvis (01:38:35):
I think we should send him a something <laugh>

Leo Laporte (01:38:37):
Here you go. Mark. He bought seven, seven acres on Kauai. Yeah. We knew that. I love that. I'm jealous as hell. That's nice. Oh yeah. Here's his his

Jeff Jarvis (01:38:49):
Yeah. Pal mansion. I don't think

Leo Laporte (01:38:51):
That looks like a kind of normal house.

Jeff Jarvis (01:38:53):
It's it's a five bedroom house. It's a nice house. It's a big house. It's Alacia mansion.

Leo Laporte (01:38:58):
The, the thing that's palatial is he also bought all the houses around it. Yeah. So we wouldn't have any neighbors.

Ant Pruitt (01:39:04):
My former CEO did that really? Mm-Hmm <affirmative> in lake Norman, North Carolina.

Jeff Jarvis (01:39:11):
It costs a lot less there <laugh>.

Ant Pruitt (01:39:13):
Yeah. A lot less. But he still spent the pretty penny, you know, every, every couple years as someone was trying to move or sell their

Leo Laporte (01:39:20):
Own, I have fantasies of, you

Ant Pruitt (01:39:21):
Know, he was like, yeah,

Leo Laporte (01:39:22):
We live on a dead end of, of just buying everybody's house on the dead end. Then putting up a giant gate. <Laugh> mm-hmm <affirmative> he,

Ant Pruitt (01:39:29):
He lives on the peninsula.

Leo Laporte (01:39:31):
We'd invite you all to live with us.

Jeff Jarvis (01:39:32):
So, so Anthony tear down the houses or just put friends in them.

Ant Pruitt (01:39:36):
One of 'em his mom moved into and the rest of it was all torn down and it, oh wow. Massive piece of land there on the peninsula.

Leo Laporte (01:39:45):
And now it's time for Jeff Jarvis's TikTok list. Ah, geez.

Jeff Jarvis (01:39:51):
Oh, okay. Yeah. Here we go. Here we go.

Leo Laporte (01:39:53):
<Laugh> did you I'm I'm thinking you posted these no musical.

Ant Pruitt (01:39:56):
Oh no.

Leo Laporte (01:39:57):
Musical. The TikTok. None.

Jeff Jarvis (01:39:59):
It's well, not just a none. It's a trend.

Leo Laporte (01:40:03):
Oh boy. It's a

Jeff Jarvis (01:40:04):
To the New York times. Well, anytime two people do something, it's a trend of they

Leo Laporte (01:40:07):
And the times is on it. It's enough.

Jeff Jarvis (01:40:09):
Yeah. The times

Leo Laporte (01:40:10):
Is on. And oh, so these are all different nuns who are on these TikTok. Well that's okay. They

Jeff Jarvis (01:40:16):
Wanna say being a, not as cool. So this nun, I started watching her and I actually kind of got it grossed out. She's telling me about the lotion. She puts up her nose.

Leo Laporte (01:40:24):
Oh no. Don't no. Yeah, but that there nuns are people too,

Jeff Jarvis (01:40:28):
Like a very nice

Leo Laporte (01:40:28):
Lady. Nuns are people too. I think this is like father Robert, right? This is what the church mm-hmm <affirmative>. And they, by the way, they're not all Catholic nuns. There's some there's Episcopal nun in here. This is, this is good.

Shoshana Weissmann (01:40:39):
Why does she put lotion up? Her nose

Leo Laporte (01:40:41):
Is this. Oh, you know, Shahan always getting to the, of the meat and

Jeff Jarvis (01:40:46):
The matter we should listen, maybe we should watch. Not

Leo Laporte (01:40:48):
Which one is that one?

Jeff Jarvis (01:40:50):
That's the sentence. The video right there.

Leo Laporte (01:40:51):
This one? This one right here.

Speaker 5 (01:40:55):
Yeah. So today we're gonna talk about nun pockets. Anybody who went to Catholic school or hung out with nuns or hangs out with nuns who wear traditional habit knows that we have special pockets.

Leo Laporte (01:41:05):
Okay. I don't wanna know better. Special pockets. <Laugh> saving emotion in their, oh, wait. Here's the skincare routine girl, because they, I'm not gonna trust. AANA says girl, drop your skincare routine.

Speaker 5 (01:41:21):
A bunch of really nice ladies have left comments

Leo Laporte (01:41:24):
On. I gotta say she has

Speaker 5 (01:41:25):
Look a lot younger

Leo Laporte (01:41:26):
Skin.

Speaker 5 (01:41:27):
And I just wanna say, thank you. That's really nice. And people have been sending me direct messages asking what my skincare routine is, which is really hilarious to me because I don't really have one. But maybe I think I know what you're talking about. I think I probably have a few less wrinkles than some people my age, because I can't go out in the sun.

Leo Laporte (01:41:47):
She hasn't to be around men. Usually

Speaker 5 (01:41:49):
Since the late 1990s, I haven't been able to go out in the sun. I get migraines from the sun. So I have to walk around. Oh,

Leo Laporte (01:41:55):
Bless her. So how many followers does nonsense have? 163,000 followers. Good for her. She's from New Jersey and Episcopal. None from New Jersey. Okay. Well that's TikTok story. Number one on, we should do it instead. The Google change log. Yeah. Let's get like the, to log roll. <Laugh> all right, Mr. Nien you need to come up with a new one. New bumper spreadsheets are now. Cool. Thanks to TikTok. This is from the financial times. This is so silly watching these mainstream media outlets. I know trying to be hit by. We're gonna somebody do a think piece on TikTok, reach, reach, TikTok, ruins everything. A six flags meal hack.

Jeff Jarvis (01:42:38):
So, so TikTok ruins everything as the headline. Okay. You're gonna click on that. And it turns out that there was a meal hack for the season ticket and when they put it on TikTok, everybody discovered it and did it. And six flags said, whoa, we're losing money on this. Forget it. So the argument is stop spreading this stuff. Let, let, let the privileged few know it. Don't put it on TikTok.

Leo Laporte (01:43:00):
<Laugh> I think it's very egalitarian. I think that's, what's so great about TikTok. Yeah. Talk's new ad product gives creators a chance to partner with marketers on branded content. Tiktok can put up TikTok is starting to share more of its ad dollars with creators. Henry tells me salt. Hank tells me he's

Jeff Jarvis (01:43:21):
Making some money on,

Leo Laporte (01:43:22):
On it. Yeah, he's getting, he's getting a few thousand dollars a month or something from TikTok. Oh God. But he sells ads. That's his, you know, his main thing. Mm-Hmm <affirmative> like, like his, like his pop <laugh> following in my footsteps. Tiktok announced it's launching a new ad product called branded mission that will allow creators to connect with brands and possibly receive rewards for videos. Possibly. See, I wanna get, I wanna get paid for my ads. Not possible rewards. Mm-Hmm <affirmative> I want actual no, definitely. I want actual rewards. Tiktok says eligible creators whose videos are selected by the brands will benefit from a cash payment and boosted traffic. That's better. Yeah. But well, that's, they're gonna get thousands of them saying here. Pick, pick, make, pick me. This is a great way to get a bunch of extra ads for no money. So I guess I have to do the change log let's let's do the change log. I Don you're just so thrilled. Shahan

Jeff Jarvis (01:44:23):
You see? So the deal here is Google change log. It's a show about Google. We do nothing about Google. So this is our obligatory, Google

Leo Laporte (01:44:30):
Obligatory, Google segment, YouTube now highlights the most replayed parts of videos to let you skip the boring parts. So if you, if you thought YouTube videos were, oh, they're just too long. Now you can just skip the boring parts. Wow. So here is for instance, perfect example, a Google, a YouTube video taking the two hour Google IO keynote boiling it down to nine minutes. Well, that's just too long. So I'm gonna, I'm gonna just see the most replayed parts. <Laugh> interesting. Short attention span much. All right. That's fine. Google's new security branding for Android. You'll see. This now is protected by Android dokey protected by Android Android, YouTube channel uploaded a 52nd video about how the OS is all about keeping you and all about keeping you and your information safe. I am all about that. So you can focus on what matters most even they did it in 15 seconds cuz they knew people would skip ahead. Let's let's just see protected by Android. These people look very happy being different.

Shoshana Weissmann (01:45:45):
Can we skip ahead to the most replayed part? I'm

Leo Laporte (01:45:48):
I'm yeah. Yeah. I agree with you. I'm bored already. <Laugh> I'm so bored. You know what it's interesting about this video? There is no most replayed part, right? Cuz there's only 15 seconds is. Nobody wants it. It's done. Okay. Thank you. Bye. Of the, we just skipped to the most replay part <laugh> none. Google's AI powered interview warmup lets you practice answering job questions. Can't imagine anything. I'd rather do <laugh>

Shoshana Weissmann (01:46:20):
That's like me on Saturday nights. Like instead of going out,

Leo Laporte (01:46:23):
Sitting there, man, I, I don't have a date. Maybe I'll do an interview. Warm up. Let's start. You wanna start? Let's start. Let's start practicing. Okay, good. Here we go. What do you wanna practice for data analytics? Ecommerce it support project management. Oh UX

Jeff Jarvis (01:46:35):
Design. They're

Leo Laporte (01:46:36):
They're nice UX design. All right. Wow. Five questions. When you're done. Review your answers and discover insight. I'm joking. People you'll need to use your microphone to answer the questions. Oh boy. Oh boy. This is serious. Has a security problem. Somebody's gonna be listening to this. Let's

Speaker 6 (01:46:50):
Practice an interview for UX design. Can you please tell me a bit about yourself?

Leo Laporte (01:46:59):
I'm a podcaster. The hit. Okay. What else you are? Oh, it's taken a long time to transcribe that

Speaker 6 (01:47:09):
Answer. Okay, thanks.

Leo Laporte (01:47:11):
<Laugh> again. No. let's do another

Speaker 6 (01:47:15):
One. Tell me about a time when you had to act quickly, but didn't have a lot of data to inform your decision. What did you do and what was the outcome?

Leo Laporte (01:47:22):
I, I was crossing. Oh, you gotta hit answer. I was crossing the street and a car was coming at me and I, I jumped out of the way and the outcome was only got part of me.

Speaker 6 (01:47:36):
Got it. Thanks.

Speaker 7 (01:47:38):
<Laugh>

Speaker 6 (01:47:41):
What is the ideal outcome of a design sprint?

Leo Laporte (01:47:43):
Okay. You answer this one. Somebody else. Shahana what is the ideal outcome of a design sprint?

Shoshana Weissmann (01:47:52):
You just go fast. You just go fast and you do it hot. That's a design sprint.

Leo Laporte (01:47:56):
Do it as fast as you can you sweat as little as possible, sweat as little as possible and hope you win.

Speaker 6 (01:48:04):
Got it. Thanks.

Leo Laporte (01:48:05):
You're welcome. I wonder if it's good.

Speaker 6 (01:48:08):
What approaches can you take to create well defined UX research questions.

Leo Laporte (01:48:15):
I asked trash,

Shoshana Weissmann (01:48:18):
Just

Leo Laporte (01:48:19):
Tell me about a

Speaker 6 (01:48:20):
Time you had to develop. You

Shoshana Weissmann (01:48:21):
Could ask him the same question.

Leo Laporte (01:48:22):
<Laugh> how did you approach? Let me ask you that question. That's a good answer. Tell me, let me wait a minute. Can I go back? Let me do that when I add the other, you can, you can redo. Yeah, yeah,

Speaker 7 (01:48:30):
Yeah. <Laugh>

Leo Laporte (01:48:33):
What approaches can you take to create well-defined UX research questions. I'd like to ask you that question. Okay. Thanks. Thank you. Thank you.

Shoshana Weissmann (01:48:44):
You can't even answer you.

Leo Laporte (01:48:45):
You can't it doesn't. It's so boring. Tell me about a time when you had to develop a new skill and tell me about that. I was painting and I wanted to watch it dry <laugh>. And how did you approach that aunt? Very carefully. Yes. And that's the right answer. Thank you. Okay. <laugh> let's see. Congrats. You did it. Let's review. You wanna save these answers? No, no, no,

Speaker 7 (01:49:16):
Save

Leo Laporte (01:49:17):
Them. Okay. Your answer. Okay. What else? You're taking a long time. <Laugh>

Speaker 7 (01:49:22):
<Laugh> okay.

Leo Laporte (01:49:28):
I what's the point? What is the point? Where's the back idiocy? Where's the insight? No insight at no, no terms related to the UX design. Oh, you didn't do SEO of your answer. I used, I used the word was three or more times, but that's not necessarily a bad thing. <Laugh> well, just pathetic. If few suggested talking points for situational questions. Okay. It really has nothing to say. Click the talking points to get tips and see which ones you covered. Experience skills, lessons learned, talking points, not detected. One example results, not detected. Okay. And I guess this is, this would be kind of anyway.

Ant Pruitt (01:50:14):
Yeah. I think I'd rather read termination shock than

Leo Laporte (01:50:17):
Do that.

Jeff Jarvis (01:50:17):
I I found how

Leo Laporte (01:50:19):
Are you doing it?

Jeff Jarvis (01:50:19):
I found video. Yeah. Of you making your, your split decision. Your, your fast decision there on the line. 1 55.

Leo Laporte (01:50:25):
This is 

Jeff Jarvis (01:50:26):
Gotta play the whole

Leo Laporte (01:50:26):
Thing. This is me making decisions fast.

Jeff Jarvis (01:50:28):
This is me making your FA when you cross the street, this

Leo Laporte (01:50:30):
Is, I cross the strip

Jeff Jarvis (01:50:32):
Documentary evidence. Well, keep watching, keep watching. Yeah.

Leo Laporte (01:50:35):
Oh,

Jeff Jarvis (01:50:36):
Oh. And keep watching more.

Leo Laporte (01:50:37):
Oh, oh dude, dude.

Jeff Jarvis (01:50:42):
And then keep

Leo Laporte (01:50:43):
Watching. Keep watching. Oh, <laugh> what he, he had a car catch the car before it hit him. That was brilliant. That was really brilliant. Was that low key? And there he is. He's fine. Is that low key?

Jeff Jarvis (01:50:58):
Yeah, he walks. He walks again. Yeah. It's

Leo Laporte (01:50:59):
He's fine. So this car hits that car for those of you not watching guys crossing the street car hits a car, goes flying at him. He did. He looks like he got hit, but in fact, no, another car had landed on his roof. <Laugh> and he get ready. He comes back to say, is everybody okay? Anybody get hurt? Rather

Jeff Jarvis (01:51:20):
Calmly. I think he just walked back.

Leo Laporte (01:51:22):
I think that was Steve

Ant Pruitt (01:51:22):
Martin from

Leo Laporte (01:51:23):
The squished. Okay. Thank you. This looks

Ant Pruitt (01:51:26):
Like a scene out of that.

Jeff Jarvis (01:51:28):
Okay.

Leo Laporte (01:51:28):
Back to the change lines.

Jeff Jarvis (01:51:30):
<Laugh> yeah. <Laugh> one

Ant Pruitt (01:51:32):
Wonderful distractions.

Leo Laporte (01:51:33):
Next hub max is rolling out. Oh, remember that thing where they showed it at Google. I mm-hmm. <Affirmative> where the woman was doing. She was asking questions of her next hub max. And instead of having to say, Hey, G she just glared at it and it answered the questions. Mm-Hmm <affirmative> that's called look and talk and you can turn it on now. Oh good. Cuz I have a next hub max at home. It's available in the Google home app via a server side update. Cool. The, the feature. And now I understand why she was glaring. The code name of the feature is blue steel.

Ant Pruitt (01:52:10):
<Laugh>

Leo Laporte (01:52:13):
Just go to the Google home app to your desktop hub, max device settings, and a recognition and sharing the features under the face match menu. And you could just turn on, look and talk. See there's a little toggle switch right there for look and talk. I don't do that when I get home. I wonder if you have to really glare at it. Cuz she was, she was like,

Ant Pruitt (01:52:32):
If the glare doesn't work, we want video point to your waist.

Leo Laporte (01:52:34):
All right, I'll try it. Finally. The Google play system updates for may.

Jeff Jarvis (01:52:40):
Oh exciting. <Laugh> oh man. Oh Jason, you have out done yourself with this change log. Ah, ring nearby, shared itself. Use my cardia and check on my AFib here. A re

Leo Laporte (01:52:53):
Redesigned for Google help and more, but we won't. Oh, exciting. And that's the Google changes log here from segment of this show and aptly named website, tedium.co

Jeff Jarvis (01:53:08):
<Laugh>

Leo Laporte (01:53:10):
A list of failed iPods.

Jeff Jarvis (01:53:13):
A little bit of memory

Leo Laporte (01:53:13):
Here. Yeah. This is the Kane Kramer. Oh these are, these are players that never made it.

Jeff Jarvis (01:53:20):
Well, no, no there's some that didn't make it

Leo Laporte (01:53:23):
It's prior, prior art. Big. Yeah. Kane Kramer's IXI designed late seventies. Wow.

Jeff Jarvis (01:53:30):
I didn't know about that.

Leo Laporte (01:53:30):
Yeah. Yeah. I think this probably had to do with a patent lawsuit. Oh actually. Oh, get this. So, so this kid was 23 years old. Did this sketch on paper of an idea for a player in the seventies. That was very much like the iPod. He struggled to move his prototypes past the idea stage due to business challenges. When the time came to renew the patent, he didn't have the money. Years later, apple took advantage of this fact in the lawsuit citing Kramer's work as prior art hiring him as a consultant.

Jeff Jarvis (01:54:05):
Wow. <Laugh> oh, well he finally made his payday. Yeah.

Leo Laporte (01:54:08):
Saying, see, see your patent for the iPod came later. This is the at and T flash pack. Digital music player, a barely released pre MP3 music player kinda looks like a Walkman, right? With flash memory for the mid nineties. 

Jeff Jarvis (01:54:27):
I remember this the audible, it was awful.

Leo Laporte (01:54:30):
The audible had nothing to do with the audible books. It just was the name audible 1997. Audible mobile player.

Jeff Jarvis (01:54:35):
Well, no, no, no, wait, wait, wait, go back. It was audible. This is the, this is the audible one audible words to go.

Leo Laporte (01:54:40):
Oh. Which

Jeff Jarvis (01:54:41):
Was had to use their player.

Leo Laporte (01:54:43):
I do remember that, but it was it called? I didn't realize no, it was the Otis. The Otis was the one I knew about, oh this was no, but then you're right. This was, this was, that was audible. Audible.Com. Yeah. Yeah, there it is. Oh yeah. I didn't have that audio highway listen up player from the late 1990s pre MP3 also that's the problem till MP3 came out. Ah, I had this one. I remember. Well I had the diamond Rio. That's what I listened to my audible books on for a long time. I'm Rio PMP, 300. I also had this, the Arco, remember the Arco jukebox. You're probably not old a fan. This was a big one that had rubber corners. So you could throw it

Jeff Jarvis (01:55:26):
Shahana this is old man. Ronal time. I remember

Leo Laporte (01:55:30):
This, the creative Zen. Remember that? I remember that. And this is kind of fun. Microsoft zoom, whatever

Jeff Jarvis (01:55:36):
I remember.

Shoshana Weissmann (01:55:37):
Yeah. So fun fact with zoom. When I talk to spammers and they ask me what kind of phone I have, I say zoom every time.

Leo Laporte (01:55:45):
<Laugh> and what do they say to that? Yeah.

Shoshana Weissmann (01:55:48):
Yeah. They're just like, oh, okay. We'll open up your app store. And I'm like, so Pam.

Leo Laporte (01:55:53):
Oh yeah. What app were they trying to get you to install?

Shoshana Weissmann (01:55:57):
Usually those are some finance some crypto.

Leo Laporte (01:56:02):
So some, they said that you would transfer money to them ultimately.

Shoshana Weissmann (01:56:04):
Yeah. Yeah, exactly.

Leo Laporte (01:56:06):
Wow.

Jeff Jarvis (01:56:07):
So, so do you remember Leo? I think you were there at south by Southwest. When Kevin Rose was trying to give away zoom players to his audience and they all just basically booed him

Leo Laporte (01:56:17):
And said

Shoshana Weissmann (01:56:17):
No. Oh my gosh,

Leo Laporte (01:56:19):
That's amazing. <Laugh> yeah,

Jeff Jarvis (01:56:21):
We don't want it.

Leo Laporte (01:56:22):
We don't want gonna take it. That's

Shoshana Weissmann (01:56:25):
Hyster. That's so wholesome. They don't mention though. It was like, it was a, a, a young girl craze thing that I had. One of these, it clipped to the top of your shirt. And you had like these tiny, almost like mini albums that you could slip in. And it was like, each one would play for like about a minute, a shortened version of the song. I forget what they were called, but like, it was a big thing for like a month and I wasted like a decent amount for my parents' money on it.

Leo Laporte (01:56:53):
So it was, it wasn't an B3 player. It had little singles that you would pop in. Yeah. Wow. I don't remember that. Anybody in the chat room remember what that, do you remember? The day books? Music was,

Shoshana Weissmann (01:57:04):
It was early two thousands.

Leo Laporte (01:57:06):
Oh my goodness. What chicken? You must be close to the same age as my daughter. She's 30. I don't think she had those, but that's when she, if she'd had it, that's when she would've had it. Wow. So this was popular when you were growing up in Saudi Arabia, where were you? Where did you

Shoshana Weissmann (01:57:23):
<Laugh>? Yeah. On long island, long island. A lot of us got it. And like all the cool girls had these like,

Leo Laporte (01:57:30):
Oh, that's so cool.

Shoshana Weissmann (01:57:31):
Crap things. It was kind of an interesting concept, but like when you're like, oh man things

Leo Laporte (01:57:37):
Move. Oh, we found it. Thank you. I agree. Yes. Thank you. Scooter X, scooter X and Adam told in fact he's not only found it. He's found a place. You can buy one right now. Should we get it?

Shoshana Weissmann (01:57:46):
How much?

Leo Laporte (01:57:47):
Let's see. Let's go to eBay. Let's go to the listing hundred $92, but wait a minute. No, it's not just one. It looks like, is this what you're talking about?

Shoshana Weissmann (01:57:59):
Yes.

Leo Laporte (01:57:59):
And look at all the music. You get Aaron Carter. I want candy. Remember that one? I want candy. Hillary Duff. Why not? Nope. Britney Spears. Oops. I did it again. You can totally identify where the era from this, my, from this Hansen Backstreet boys shape of my heart. Yeah. Oh my pink. Is it most girls? Wow, this is great. All right. $192. Seems a little pricey. A little. Should I just make an offer? Cause I'm gonna, I don't offer don't. You want this trash offered

Shoshana Weissmann (01:58:37):
Him $2. I do. I, I do. So I, I have an N 64. I had a toss. It, it finally, I, I, I didn't take care of it, but I have the controllers. So I, I obviously tied onto my face at one point to make N 95 jokes, you know,

Leo Laporte (01:58:54):
Walking

Shoshana Weissmann (01:58:55):
Without their N 64.

Leo Laporte (01:58:58):
You're terrible.

Shoshana Weissmann (01:59:00):
I know. That's

Leo Laporte (01:59:01):
So awful. <Laugh>

Jeff Jarvis (01:59:02):
Oh my God.

Leo Laporte (01:59:04):
Oh my God. So what, okay, so I get this yellow. Thing's the player. That's what you clipped to your shirt, right? What are, what are these big boom boxes? What

Jeff Jarvis (01:59:12):
Are these little boom boxes?

Shoshana Weissmann (01:59:13):
Oh, I don't remember those. Maybe those were another version of it. Like maybe my parents weren't rich enough to like buy me the real, you know, tiger

Leo Laporte (01:59:20):
X, the real one.

Jeff Jarvis (01:59:21):
Oh, the bitterness still comes out at

Leo Laporte (01:59:23):
Her voice. Oh, wait a minute. No, we can just parents. We could just get the the, the $37 for the red one plus three Simpsons clips, Homer, Bart, and people of Springfield. Oh,

Shoshana Weissmann (01:59:37):
I didn't know. That was an option.

Leo Laporte (01:59:38):
Well, so these weren't very long, right? Two minutes or something.

Shoshana Weissmann (01:59:42):
Yeah. Yeah. About there.

Leo Laporte (01:59:44):
So it's probably just don't <laugh> over and over, over and over again. Wow. This has 17 song clips. Two boombox players. Yeah. Those were the fancy one, two personal players. Wow. Oh, and look Disney even had them. This is Disney's tune kid clips. Tiger. Electronic jungle book, capitalism, retro music player. Wow. I missed this whole thing, boy.

Jeff Jarvis (02:00:14):
Yeah.

Leo Laporte (02:00:15):
Lucky. Yes. Yeah. Yeah. This was a very brief moment in time.

Shoshana Weissmann (02:00:22):
It was really, really the golden age.

Leo Laporte (02:00:24):
<Laugh>

Jeff Jarvis (02:00:25):
<Laugh> who were, what, what band, what, what boy band were you

Leo Laporte (02:00:30):
Into?

Shoshana Weissmann (02:00:32):
So here's the funny thing. I didn't like music then I just wanted them. <Laugh> I, I just wanted geek. I had a, yeah, I had mad. Oh, I've always been a geek, but like you

Leo Laporte (02:00:41):
Hadn't met SpongeBob yet, so

Shoshana Weissmann (02:00:44):
You, it was around that time. Oh, okay. That I met SpongeBob. Okay. But it's I didn't always get into fads, but the ones I did, I was very big on. And like, whether it be Pokemon or that it was, I really wanted it. And it was Madonna. It was, I forgot which song, but I'm like, guess I'm listening to Madonna. I don't like Madonna,

Leo Laporte (02:01:06):
But I do have her clip to my collar.

Shoshana Weissmann (02:01:09):
Yeah. Wow.

Leo Laporte (02:01:10):
Yeah. Yeah. And that's what was,

Shoshana Weissmann (02:01:12):
It was very useful, you know, that minute, minute, 50 seconds every now and then, you know,

Leo Laporte (02:01:18):
Ah, is there anything I missed in the rundowns that anybody really cared a lot about? Cuz God knows. I didn't. <Laugh> <laugh> thanks to my eternal.

Jeff Jarvis (02:01:32):
Well, once you did non TikTok, you know,

Leo Laporte (02:01:34):
Non TikTok really brought it down. I gotta tell you. All right. Let's take a little break picks of the week coming up in just a bit, but first I am going to close out the FCCS. Here we go. This episode of this week in Google is brought to you by HP GreenLake, orchestrated by the experts at CDW to yesterday's infrastructure is not gonna help you meet the demands of tomorrow's innovation. And that now more than ever, you have to quickly adapt to change. The consumption oriented model of public cloud is revolutionized. How organizations think about infrastructure and organizations are now demanding speed and agility of a public cloud experience, but many workloads remain on prem. You know, why complicated legacy applications, data, sovereignty issues, compliance issues. And of course the challenge and gravity of migrating sensitive data. And if you're in the it department, you know, you're caught right in the middle of this, trying to satisfy, you know, demands the growth of your organization while struggling to manage disparate data and expected to do it all at budget.

Leo Laporte (02:02:43):
And I'm sure you've been saying, I wanna go in the cloud, please. Can we move this to the cloud? Well, H P GreenLake and C D w can provide a seamless, scalable cloud experience across your entire organization. So you can easily manage from anywhere no matter where your data and applications live on Preem public and private clouds. Yes. You can have all three trust, HPE and C D w to automate your processes so that you could focus on the next big thing. C D w can help you get the most out of your unique and complex data needs by assessing your organization's needs and designing and implementing a tailored HPE GreenLake solution to modernize your business and meet your digital transformation goals. Once implemented CDW also provides ongoing management, bring up your staff to focus on innovation, seamless cloud experience across all your organization's apps and data.

Leo Laporte (02:03:34):
Thanks to the, as a service model that meets you at the edge scalability that provides instant increase in capacity, giving you the flexibility to match your growth and meet demand and streamlined management of all your data and applications within a single platform, providing simplified operations and accessibility from anywhere, giving you back time to focus on innovation. CDW not only helps assess an organization's needs and build a unique HPE GreenLake solution, but they also remain an active partner and provide support throughout the management process. CDW experts also bring decades of experience designing, orchestrating, and managing strategic cloud solutions that help you unleash the full potential of your investments, giving you back time to innovate and dream bigger for a seamless cloud experience. Trust HP E and it orchestration by C D w people who get it learn more at cdw.com/hpe that's C D w.com/h P the cloud that comes to you. Thank you. C D w and HPE for your support of TWiG. Now, I don't know if anybody warned you Shahan, but we give everybody a chance to pick something they're excited about. It could have been just those clips. If that's, if that's what, you know, rocks your boat. Is there anything else you'd like to share with us to tell the world about?

Shoshana Weissmann (02:04:59):
Well, actually related to the ad, I love automation. I'm having like a grand old time in integral map, automating internal stuff for our street. No one else on my organization has any idea what I'm doing, but it's really, really fun.

Leo Laporte (02:05:13):
So, so automating processes.

Shoshana Weissmann (02:05:17):
Yeah. So like so I had one automation that every time we got a media mentioned or an op-ed, so basically we got an alert that we're in the news somewhere, whether we're creating it or we're in it. So I had an automation that said, okay, does the author match one of our scholar names? If yes, it's an oped. If no, it's a media mention, then I have a reg X to find the name within the media mention if it exists and then it'll tag appropriately, it updates custom fields, you know, throws everything in it's fun.

Leo Laporte (02:05:46):
It's formally ament now called make they change their names, darn them. I use, I use in a more primitive way. I use Zappier to do stuff.

Shoshana Weissmann (02:05:56):
That's mostly what I use. Yeah. I need to use entro slash make for some more complex things because XY is amazing. I'm a huge, huge fan of them. And they've been really helpful when I ask them dumb questions, but and I find it more user friendly, but there are some like data limits that like, even if you have the highest day beer plan, like you're not able to do it, but like I spend, we have like 50 automations that do so many different things and I'm just like having a blast, figuring out how stuff works. And everyone's like have fun, I guess.

Leo Laporte (02:06:28):
So it's like you're using it kinda like a clipping service almost

Shoshana Weissmann (02:06:33):
Sort of. So that's part of it. I do other things too. It sends me reminders. It sends out newsletters and automated emails. It takes data. It organizes some of our internal systems. It's easily like one human at our organization.

Leo Laporte (02:06:47):
So that's this impressive. Are you you and use grip? Are you a coder? Are you a programmer?

Shoshana Weissmann (02:06:54):
No, I'm bad at learning languages. Whether like regular languages or code I'm really bad at it. So I just kind of like figure out what I need. I grab code from like you know, stack overflow and stuff like that as I need, but it's

Leo Laporte (02:07:07):
Fine. Well, that's what everybody does. I was gonna say that's what the pro do. <Laugh> <laugh> very cool. We're gonna say integr. Matt is your pick of the week. Although again, I use Zapier, but that's okay. It's okay. I use Zapier as well. Yeah. We actually use Zapier in a much more primitive way than you're using. It sounds like you're doing some really fancy stuff, but that's how we build these rundowns. When I select stories, Zapier takes it from my my RSS feed or my Pinboard Pinboard puts it into a spreadsheet. And then, yeah, it's really cool. Yeah. I love I'm a big automation fan.

Shoshana Weissmann (02:07:43):
Yeah. It's not used enough. You know, I know that like there's group, there's political groups in America who hate the idea of like automation. They worry, it takes away jobs, but like, for me, my employee gets to do more interesting work, right. Because I automate some of her dollar tasks and then I teach her how to build it for herself so she can build out more stuff. And and she, she sort of understands what I'm doing, but other than her, everyone like understands what is being done, but has no idea how I'm doing it. And just like, lets me which I'm very thankful for <laugh>

Ant Pruitt (02:08:13):
As the CEO that I was talking about earlier that bought that peninsula. He used to say stuff like, you know what, let's let's get automation going because I want the staff to be doing things that require brain power. He

Leo Laporte (02:08:26):
Was, he was, yeah, let the computers do the stupid stuff, the repetitive stuff, the boring stuff so that you can do the interesting mm-hmm <affirmative> creative stuff. That's the whole point of automation. I was kind of hoping you'd come up with a bunch of section two 30 merchandise actually, but <laugh>,

Shoshana Weissmann (02:08:42):
I know I own so much. Oh actually, so for the hairpins, I had enough made that. I think after the second one, the Etsy seller was like, all right, what does S two 30

Leo Laporte (02:08:54):
<Laugh>? And

Shoshana Weissmann (02:08:56):
I explained it to her and she's like, oh yeah, I'm on board with that. Like, that's,

Leo Laporte (02:08:59):
I'm totally that like cool. Yeah. And you give, give me a whole new business.

Shoshana Weissmann (02:09:03):
Well, yeah, yeah.

Leo Laporte (02:09:04):
So she, does she sell it them now on, or you're the only customer.

Shoshana Weissmann (02:09:09):
So she doesn't like, you have to request S two 30, but she'll make it for you. And they're, they're pretty good. You can wear them to normal events like meeting Chris Cox or speaking about section two 30.

Leo Laporte (02:09:23):
Wow. I'm really impressed. That's good. She's custom designed S two 30 hair pins. Very nice. I just got, I'm looking for them on I don't see 'em but I'm looking for 'em on the, on Nancy.

Shoshana Weissmann (02:09:40):
Yeah. You just have the what's it called? Like you, you type in like glitter hair pins or whatever, and then you just ask for a custom and

Leo Laporte (02:09:48):
They'll do it. Yeah, of course. Yeah.

Shoshana Weissmann (02:09:50):
I actually asked for the section symbol. I'm like, is there any way you can like cut two asses?

Leo Laporte (02:09:55):
I just

Shoshana Weissmann (02:09:56):
Wiggled them. Yeah. She was like, I'm not doing that. I'm like, that's fair. Like

Leo Laporte (02:09:59):
That's okay. I'm gonna, I'm gonna get these glitter hair clips. They're from Mingos but I might get, I might like with a pen, right? S two 30 on the way.

Shoshana Weissmann (02:10:07):
Oh, I like that. You Flamingo two

Leo Laporte (02:10:09):
30. Yeah, that'd be good. It'd be, it'd be a S two 30 Flamingo and Pruit your pick of the weeks. <Laugh>

Ant Pruitt (02:10:18):
My let's see. I, I wanted to shout out some value lighting because I, I did a photograph a while back and

Leo Laporte (02:10:26):
You're the king of photographic lighting. You've done some really interesting stuff.

Ant Pruitt (02:10:30):
Thank you. Yeah.

Leo Laporte (02:10:31):
The I really like your, the, you see a lot of these on hop, but also on your Instagram and other places. Yeah.

Ant Pruitt (02:10:35):
Thank you. But the, the go docs or go doc SL 60 w are some L E D likes they're constant light. You have to plug them in, but they, they just flat out work. They're not the brightest

Leo Laporte (02:10:49):
And they're not super expensive. Right.

Ant Pruitt (02:10:50):
And they they're they're right. And it, the, the, they just work. You don't have to spend a gazillion dollars on, on lights all the time. Granted, there are reasons that you need to spend a little bit more, would

Leo Laporte (02:11:00):
These be appropriate for video or video video? Or you could use these for video video

Ant Pruitt (02:11:04):
Or product photography. Right. Cause a lot of product photography just requires enough light that's coming out of that. Right. So what I, I used that to light part of the shot in the next thing in my pick. Okay. Which is, is a, a high key. So I used those with the reflectors to light the background because I needed the background to be nice and easy.

Leo Laporte (02:11:26):
Oh, I love this shot. I saw this

Ant Pruitt (02:11:28):
Shot. Now granted the main light that's on him. That's a more expensive light. And this a Stella pro CLX 10 light. I'm not mentioning that there, cuz it's very expensive and I know most, most people can't buy it, but I just wanted to show that those goads lights they're really good for, for pretty much for,

Leo Laporte (02:11:45):
For highlights, for air, air lights, things like that. Yeah. It looks like they have one with a soft box that might be kind of, I, for

Ant Pruitt (02:11:52):
Video, it has a Bowens Mount on it. So you can put a soft box on the front of it.

Leo Laporte (02:11:56):
Yeah. See, that would be, then you'd have, that'd be good for video then mm-hmm <affirmative> have a nice soft with a

Ant Pruitt (02:12:02):
Grid, something. So the light doesn't spill everywhere else. Like

Leo Laporte (02:12:05):
We use. Yeah. Yeah.

Ant Pruitt (02:12:06):
It's good stuff. And it's all value priced. My last pick of the week is just to shout out to Mr. Derek blanks. He's an amazing content creator and creative designer. And this clip here. It's, it's beautiful. Now granted it's about 40 seconds long, but you have him walking into the, to this rain shot with this beautiful suit. But if you look closer he's gonna pause and you'll get all of the details of the water, cuz he's using a nice high end camera, but watch the water droplets

Leo Laporte (02:12:40):
Off his head. Whoa. Oh, they're going backwards.

Ant Pruitt (02:12:42):
They're going back. But just keep watching the water's starting to recede, but watch the transition from the blue suit team.

Leo Laporte (02:12:49):
Oh look at that.

Ant Pruitt (02:12:50):
He is so good. He and his team they're so good at that's pretty their green screen.

Leo Laporte (02:12:55):
That's very

Ant Pruitt (02:12:55):
Cool in video effects and I can do a morph effect, but that right there, I was like, okay. Alright. You, you, you, I can't touch that. Man's that's nice. That's

Leo Laporte (02:13:03):
<Laugh> that's fine.

Ant Pruitt (02:13:04):
Morph effect and reverse. The rain drops just absolutely beautiful. He's he's pretty inspirational. Every time I see him, I think about the hard head because the hard head sort of acts like him and I've told him, I said, look, he does internships every

Leo Laporte (02:13:20):
Year. Oh, be a good, good internship. So

Ant Pruitt (02:13:22):
Stay on his radar. Yeah.

Leo Laporte (02:13:24):
You know, look at the drops going backwards.

Ant Pruitt (02:13:26):
That's the, yeah. The water is going back.

Leo Laporte (02:13:27):
Yeah. Love it.

Ant Pruitt (02:13:29):
Beautiful

Leo Laporte (02:13:30):
Work. And of course you could follow ants. Beautiful work ant underscore Pruit on the Insta.

Ant Pruitt (02:13:36):
Yes, please,

Leo Laporte (02:13:37):
Please. You really like that? Insta?

Ant Pruitt (02:13:40):
Well, that's it's it's photography. It's

Jeff Jarvis (02:13:43):
Photography.

Leo Laporte (02:13:43):
It's

Ant Pruitt (02:13:43):
Photography. Now. Granted there's a lot more video showing up in there now. So you'll see me shooting more video content on there. But I, I just it's photography. I see a lot of beautiful images there. That's

Leo Laporte (02:13:55):
Nice.

Ant Pruitt (02:13:55):
Thank you.

Leo Laporte (02:13:57):
Thank you, Ant Pruitt. Jeff Jarvis. You got a number for us.

Jeff Jarvis (02:14:00):
Well, first I got a pin. I got this. I'm very

Leo Laporte (02:14:03):
What's that? Is it a section two 30 pin?

Jeff Jarvis (02:14:05):
You can't see it. No. It's a line of type 25 years. Service pen.

Ant Pruitt (02:14:09):
Look at you nerd. Wait

Leo Laporte (02:14:11):
A minute. You gotta earn that man. You can't buy that on eBay. What are you doing with that? That's no good line of 25 years, years.

Jeff Jarvis (02:14:19):
I do a story about nano bots cleaning your teeth. But that was so instead that sounds like this would be funny, but it's not. So I just wanna warn you cause before we have hilarity.

Leo Laporte (02:14:33):
Oh no, this is horrible. Yes,

Jeff Jarvis (02:14:35):
It is GrubHub. Yesterday from 11 to two in New York did a $15 off order warning, no restaurants and they got, or,

Leo Laporte (02:14:44):
Or delivery drivers. They didn't tell any of the delivery people either. Well,

Jeff Jarvis (02:14:48):
Nobody man. So one restaurant lowered down. Buzzfeed article said that, that there were 6,000 orders a minute dude. And one restaurant received 200 orders in the first five minutes. They didn't know what was happening. It was just spitting outta the machine. They, they, they, they were making food. They couldn't get delivered. They were not getting paid. It's

Leo Laporte (02:15:07):
Wait a minute. Now pays the 15 bucks scrub hub.

Jeff Jarvis (02:15:10):
Evidently the restaurant.

Leo Laporte (02:15:11):
What? Oh son. Oh no. Sorry. You don't get to give away $15 of my food without telling

Jeff Jarvis (02:15:17):
You, I guess it might be part of a deal and we can do occasional deals or something. Oh. And they, and because they, they, they fenced it at a given time. Then it was guaranteed to go crazy. And Hey, it's New York. We like a bargain. We know bargains. It's New York. So 

Leo Laporte (02:15:33):
Oh, you should see the tweets currently working front of house at a restaurant in Brooklyn. You guys messed up. Big time. We have over 30 cold orders. Not being picked up by drivers. And our phones are off the hook with angry customers screwing over the entire New York city service industry. Wow. What

Jeff Jarvis (02:15:50):
Jerks? This is really

Leo Laporte (02:15:52):
Jerky and it doesn't come outta their pocket. That's what's really annoying.

Jeff Jarvis (02:15:56):
Yeah. Well they should, there should be a class action.

Leo Laporte (02:15:59):
Cause the restaurant <affirmative> as a restaurant,

Jeff Jarvis (02:16:00):
All the, all the outraged customers. That's that's the worst of it in a way.

Ant Pruitt (02:16:04):
Yeah. Reputation screwed up. Rep restaurants, reputation is screwed up now because of something beyond their control.

Leo Laporte (02:16:11):
Not to mention the food waste

Ant Pruitt (02:16:14):
That. Yeah.

Jeff Jarvis (02:16:15):
Yeah, yeah. Which is offensive at a time of inflation and yeah. Yeah.

Ant Pruitt (02:16:19):
Unbelievable.

Leo Laporte (02:16:21):
That's that's very disappointing. Very disappointing.

Jeff Jarvis (02:16:26):
Well, but, but not, not leave us on a downer. We could talk about bots that are gonna clean

Leo Laporte (02:16:29):
Back Turkey. That's a downer, even in other ways I don't want to talk. Right.

Jeff Jarvis (02:16:33):
Okay. You don't wanna talk about

Leo Laporte (02:16:33):
That. Okay. But I do wanna talk about my latest EBA purchase. <Laugh> oh boy. Oh no. Now

Jeff Jarvis (02:16:40):
<Laugh> oh boy. Oh God. What?

Leo Laporte (02:16:44):
I'm Shahan from a couple of episodes ago, we we discovered that in fact, eBay was a trove of valuable undiscovered, valuable photos. You able to tear that plastics. This is very well protected. Geez. The

Shoshana Weissmann (02:17:00):
Week. I mean, I love eBay. I spent, I love spending time on eBay.

Leo Laporte (02:17:04):
Oh absolutely. Since

Shoshana Weissmann (02:17:05):
I was a kid, it's like a

Leo Laporte (02:17:07):
Problem. And when I found out a

Jeff Jarvis (02:17:08):
Friend, Glen Fleischman tweeted that there were Jeff Jarvis, publicity, publicity photos on

Leo Laporte (02:17:14):
Ebay. When I found out I could learn, love this photo for only $5 and GrubHub gave me a $15 coupon as they is beautiful. I bought a thousand of them. So we're just gonna have them all over the studio. That is beautiful. That's really great. <Laugh> and then I also got this one where he is posing with his favorite comic, Billy crystal. So it's just a, it's a wonderful collection of, of photographic art.

Jeff Jarvis (02:17:44):
So what, I've got a whole box of the first issue of entertainment a

Leo Laporte (02:17:46):
Weekly. Oh, what do you think I for,

Jeff Jarvis (02:17:49):
Yeah. What do you think could be worth? I,

Leo Laporte (02:17:51):
I should shot. What do you think? It's a great photo though. It is.

Shoshana Weissmann (02:17:55):
I don't know. I don't, I don't. I used to start collecting mad magazines and then I decided that was a dumb idea. So, but these said more valuable. I don't know, like start at a hundred thousand. See where it goes.

Leo Laporte (02:18:08):
<Laugh> or best offer that's a

Shoshana Weissmann (02:18:11):
Capital yeah. Or

Leo Laporte (02:18:11):
Best offer or best offer. Yeah. A million dollars or best offer <laugh> I think that's the way to do it. I completely agree.

Jeff Jarvis (02:18:18):
Signed by the editor.

Leo Laporte (02:18:19):
Yeah. if you're a mad magazine fan Sohan, you probably don't know this, but MAD's maddest right at Dickie. Bartolo does a regular show on our network every week. It's beast. Oh,

Shoshana Weissmann (02:18:30):
That's

Leo Laporte (02:18:30):
Awesome. Yeah. And he

Shoshana Weissmann (02:18:31):
Is, I used to love mad TV too. I was the biggest Michael McDonald fan. And like now, since I have a lot of followers on Twitter and I could be friends with like anyone. So I'm like, oh my gosh, this Michael McDonald, I loved you doing Stewart. Like, this is how I spend like my fame, my tiny amount of fame. I'm like, you can be, be friends.

Leo Laporte (02:18:51):
I gotta understand this. You get to be friends with anyone. If you have, how many followers do you have to have to be friends with anyone on Twitter?

Shoshana Weissmann (02:18:58):
I don't know. Just more than they do. I think

Leo Laporte (02:19:00):
<Laugh> <laugh> fair enough. That seems fair. Senator Showana on Twitter. She's your everybody's favorite Senator from east Virginia and sloth committee chair. Wow. I did not know. There was a sloth emoji in the world.

Shoshana Weissmann (02:19:18):
Why? Oh yeah. Yeah. And they chose the right kind of sloth. There's actually six subtypes. She probably. And yeah. Yeah. I tried, I actually talked with the person doing it. I'm like, do you need help? Like, can I like, can I like help move, move this along? And they, they had it down. So I didn't,

Leo Laporte (02:19:35):
I love it. Her location is a pineapple under the C DC. <Laugh>

Leo Laporte (02:19:42):
Shahan it's been a real pleasure to have you on I I'm sorry. The stories were so weak this week, but it was still fun. Thank you. In fact, in fact it's good. You were, you made it fun. Yes. You made it a lot. Thank you. Fun. You're the best? She's the head of R RS. I's digital media, a fellow at RSI in occupational licensing reform, section two 30, social media regulation. A fellow of the God's in words God's is doing God's work. She's an expert at fed S O C R TP. Which is that? Was that the Federalist society? No. Yeah,

Shoshana Weissmann (02:20:15):
It's a regulatory transparency working group. So mostly licensing reform.

Leo Laporte (02:20:20):
Nice. A policy wonk, obviously mm-hmm <affirmative> with a great sense.

Shoshana Weissmann (02:20:25):
Giant nerd,

Leo Laporte (02:20:25):
Giant nerd with a great sense of humor. It's been really fun having you on please come back soon.

Shoshana Weissmann (02:20:31):
Oh yes, please. Oh my gosh. You guys are the best. I, I had such a blast.

Leo Laporte (02:20:35):
Oh, if you like this show, come back. <Laugh>

Jeff Jarvis (02:20:38):
You? What

Leo Laporte (02:20:40):
Are you saying? This

Jeff Jarvis (02:20:40):
Was terrible. Made other shows. <Laugh> you took Glen Fleischman for the, for the, for the big kids' table. Geez.

Leo Laporte (02:20:46):
<Laugh> well, maybe just maybe Shahan will be on the big kids' table. Yeah, that's back you. Whoa. Thank you. Jeff Jarvis. Jeff is the director of the town height center for journalism at the Craig news, mark

Speaker 8 (02:21:01):
Hat, New York Craig.

Leo Laporte (02:21:13):
Oh nine don't two. Thank you for all the good work and good pictures and good fun on the Club TWiT discord boy. That is a great place. Thanks to you. Our community manager, Ant Pruitt. We're having a lot of fun, some big events coming up. I see. Yep. Next Jerry. Oh, we already that's tomorrow. That's tomorrow. Jerry Wagley is coming up. He is believe it or not. I never heard of him, but apparently it's VP of operations,

Ant Pruitt (02:21:39):
The

Leo Laporte (02:21:39):
Snow goat who knew. So that'll be interesting. I have some questions <laugh> tomorrow. 9:00 AM Pacific mm-hmm <affirmative> that Stacy's book club this month as aunt referred to earlier is termination shock. Mm-Hmm <affirmative> are you still reading it or did you give up, I'm

Ant Pruitt (02:21:57):
Still reading it? Well, I, I haven't read it in a couple days because I've been in a bit of a bad mood and I didn't

Leo Laporte (02:22:02):
Think that was it's on my list. I gotta finish the trip nickel interview I'm doing after Steve trip. Nickel's book about apple tomorrow on a special triangulation, one 30 Pacific on twi.tv. We should also have the club in there for that as well. Alex Lindsay asked me anything next month. That'll be fun if you're not a member of Club TWiT, you really ought to join a free versions of all the shows, which shortens them. I might add by about an hour and a half each. So it's worth it just for your time. <Laugh> just for the time savings. You also get access to the discord, which is a great, you know, wonderful community, lots of fun, not just the shows, but all kinds of topics, including crypto currency, anime gaming, ham, radio philosophy, and science beer, beer travel and the trip plus feed, which has stuff that doesn't make it on the show, including Dick deep Bartos fabulous GIZ, fizz Stacy's book club, the untitled Linux show, and a lot more.

Leo Laporte (02:22:58):
We also use the club to promote new shows like this week in space, which we started in the club. Mm-Hmm <affirmative>, we've got a new show coming with somebody, you know, that's gonna be very exciting. We're gonna start that in club, give club members a, a chance to support that before we get add support for it. So it's important. It really helps us out twi.tv/club TWI. And don't forget, we also have dancing sloth in the club. So it's a lot more fun to be in the club than not twit seven bucks a month. Say that fastest, a moving slot. Look at that. No sloth every day. That's just probably sped up. That's over a period of months. Oh, okay. Twit.Tv/Club. That sloth is at the Amazon's store. <Laugh> it does. Doesn't walk out with just a gram paw print, grandma go sloth, which is good.

Leo Laporte (02:23:45):
They only, I'm sorry. You have two, a couple of claws. Yes. Yeah. <Laugh> we do this show every Wednesday, 2:00 PM. Pacific 5:00 PM. Eastern 2100 UTC. You can tune in, watch it happen. Live@Livedottwi.Tv or after the fact twit.tv/twig on the website. We have a YouTube channel dedicated to the show, and of course you can subscribe in your favorite podcast player and get it automatically the minute it's available. Make sure you leave us a five star review. Is this, is this the governor? Is this the governor holding a, a favorite pet?

Shoshana Weissmann (02:24:19):
Oh no. That's Senator Tom Tillis. It was because of the the medicine coth and stuff. And how Tillis kinda like help that, not, you know, how,

Leo Laporte (02:24:27):
What he saying instead of elected instead of cocaine and orgys, he's got a nice puppy instead,

Shoshana Weissmann (02:24:31):
Make it, oh my gosh. So I when I, by

Leo Laporte (02:24:35):
The way, time I, you won, you won Tillis. Tillis did not like Callthorne did he?

Shoshana Weissmann (02:24:41):
No. it, it was the, the orgy stuff, I think through everyone.

Leo Laporte (02:24:44):
That's really what put him over the top. Yeah.

Shoshana Weissmann (02:24:46):
Wow. But it that dog is the cutest dog. I actually visited the office and walked into the office behind Tillis and was like, where's a dog. And then I got it. It's a really sweet dog. Her name's till,

Leo Laporte (02:24:59):
Is she the official mascot of his office to Senate? An office?

Shoshana Weissmann (02:25:03):
Yeah. It's his digital director's dog. She now lives back in the state, but her dog still has an Instagram. That's really worth following

Leo Laporte (02:25:10):
Shoot. What's the Instagram.

Shoshana Weissmann (02:25:13):
Oh, let me check. 

Leo Laporte (02:25:14):
I could probably find the tweet and then I'd be able to I'm sure it's

Shoshana Weissmann (02:25:18):
In your tweet. Yeah, I was just messaging. It's let's see.

Leo Laporte (02:25:24):
So Senator a little relieved.

Shoshana Weissmann (02:25:27):
I'm sure. Oh, the handle is teeny tiny Tilly.

Leo Laporte (02:25:32):
<Laugh> I love it.

Shoshana Weissmann (02:25:33):
<Laugh> it's really cute. It's a really, really cute dog. Yeah. I, I saw, I like anything with a squishy

Leo Laporte (02:25:39):
Thing. This is the kind of stuff we need to cut. Get, you know, across the aisle to make a difference. No, this is the wrong teeny tiny Tilley. Apparently there're more than one teeny tiny tilling <laugh> on Instagram.

Shoshana Weissmann (02:25:50):
Yeah. It's teeny, T E E N I E tiny.

Leo Laporte (02:25:55):
Oh,

Shoshana Weissmann (02:25:55):
Sorry. Sorry. Very

Leo Laporte (02:25:56):
Important that you spell teeny properly. There we go. We need a, I got her, I got her here she is. That's her.

Shoshana Weissmann (02:26:04):
She's

Leo Laporte (02:26:04):
Really cute. Is that a French bulldog? What is, what is that?

Shoshana Weissmann (02:26:07):
Boston Terri.

Leo Laporte (02:26:09):
Terri terrier love them. So cute. So she wasn't a puppy that was full grown. That's how big

Shoshana Weissmann (02:26:16):
Oh, no, that was when she was a puppy. She could fit literally in the Palm of your hand, like Tillis is a tall guy, big hands, but like is, she's still really, really tiny. How could you, there's some really good hill dogs, right?

Leo Laporte (02:26:29):
Really? You should do a book. The hill dogs. That'd be good

Shoshana Weissmann (02:26:34):
Fun fact. Our street has a newsletter that highlights dogs around DC and in politics every, every other week. And it's called bark straight.

Leo Laporte (02:26:44):
Oh my God. So you see, I keep on trying to push Padre. Oh, look at that. Children's books for the VCAs. See how she spelled bark in bark street. Yeah, the capital R Burke. Yeah. Burke it's on brand. Whoa, whoa.

Shoshana Weissmann (02:27:01):
It's really cute. We've highlighted Tilly, Susan Collins' dog. We've had dogs all over the spectrum. Yeah, there you go.

Leo Laporte (02:27:09):
There's the BI Halloween party. <Laugh> oh,

Shoshana Weissmann (02:27:15):
I, I go to the hill to visit dogs like more than you might think. I would as like a grown woman

Leo Laporte (02:27:22):
Really till owns this newsletter, I think, right? Oh, there's Hannah. Oh, good. Okay.

Shoshana Weissmann (02:27:28):
Oh yeah. We have an adoptable dog every week. Oh, right.

Leo Laporte (02:27:33):
Do you have a dog yourself? Shahan

Shoshana Weissmann (02:27:36):
No. So I, I grew up with them and my parents have a dog that I'm still pretty close with, but the, the trouble is I go hiking a lot and I really wanna P so one, I wanna breed pugs at altitude, so they will be born altitude adjusted. And the breathing problems for hiking will be less. Yes. And I'm gonna name it. Pug Ducey

Leo Laporte (02:27:55):
<Laugh>. And on that note, we thank you all for joining us. <Laugh> on this weekend, Google. Thank you. Han take care. Bye-Bye everybody.

Speaker 9 (02:28:06):
Hey, I'm rod pile editor of ad Astra magazine. And each week I'm joined by Tarek. Mallek the editor-in-chief over@space.com in our new this week in space podcast, every Friday, Tarek. And I take a deep dive into the stories that define the new space age what's NASA up to when will Americans, once again, set foot on the moon. And how about those samples from the perseverance Rover? When do those coming home? What the heck is Elon must have done now, in addition to all the latest and greatest and space exploration will take an occasional look at bits of space flight history that you probably never heard of and all with an eye towards having a good time along the way. Check us out on your favorite podcaster.