This Week in Google 658, Transcript

Please be advised this transcript is AI-generated and may not be word for word. Time codes refer to the approximate times in the ad-supported version of the show.

Leo Laporte (00:00:01):
It's time for TWIG this week in Google. Jeff Jarvis's here. Ant Pruitt, Stacey Higginbotham the Bridger musical wins a Grammy and we could thank TikTok for that. Elon Musk is on the Twitter board. What's going on there and the edit button, Twitter edits you according to Kevin Marks. It's all coming up next on this week in Google

Stacey Higginbotham (00:00:26):
Podcasts you love From people you trust. This is TWiT.

Leo Laporte (00:00:35):
This is twig. This Week in Google episode, 658 recorded Wednesday, April 6th, 2022. You can't edit this. This episode of this week in Google is brought to you by Melissa. The US postal service processes more than 98,000. Address changes daily. Make sure your customer contact data is up to date. Try Melissa's APIs in the developer portal. It's easy to log on and sign up and start playing in the API sandbox. 24 7 get started today with 1000 records claimed for free at melissa.com/twit and by HPE GreenLake orchestrated by the experts at CDW to help deliver a seamless and scalable cloud experience that comes to you. Learn more at cdw.com/HPE and by cachefly. Cachefly Is giving away a complimentary detailed analysis of your current CDN bill and usage trends. See if you're overpaying 20% or more, learn more at twit.cachefly.Com. It's time for TWIG this week in Google the show we cover the latest news from Google. I think it's gonna be a little bit of Twitter today. Stacey GBA from Stacey gig is here. You're your name has too many syllables for me, Stacey. Higginbotham from Stacy on Iot.com @gigaStacy on the tour. Hello, Stacy.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:02:05):
Hello? Y'all I missed you.

Leo Laporte (00:02:07):
We were you gone again last week?

Jeff Jarvis (00:02:09):
Yeah. Leo, you and I were the only ones working hard. You know, the two of them just take off. Hey, see, y'all missed me too.

Leo Laporte (00:02:16):
Excellent. I guess I really missed you too. Anyway, welcome back.

Jeff Jarvis (00:02:19):
I want know that I was here. I was working.

Leo Laporte (00:02:21):
Jeff Jarvis is here. I just, And he's still

Stacey Higginbotham (00:02:25):
Here.

Leo Laporte (00:02:25):
Well, don't feel like it's we try to get rid of him every week. We can't.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:02:29):
You don't, you

Leo Laporte (00:02:29):
Can't. He is officially Thelen top professor for journalistic innovation at the Craig

Leo Laporte (00:02:38):
Newmark, graduate school of journalism at the city. University of New York. Hello? Jeff?

Leo Laporte (00:02:45):
Ant Pruitt is also here. I know you had the week off. Yeah, I was it your birthday? No, sir. Just for fun.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:02:51):
It was just for fun. I'll just put that in. Oh, that's right. You lied and said it was his birthday and we all believed it.

Leo Laporte (00:02:58):
Not my birthday. Anytime anybody takes vacation here at TWI, I say it's their birthday. I guess that way. Sure. Wasn't

Stacey Higginbotham (00:03:05):
Next week is my birthday.

Leo Laporte (00:03:06):
Yeah. See.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:03:07):
So should I take, should I take next

Leo Laporte (00:03:09):
Week off? Take next week off because actually I think you are anyway. I think you're. That was the plan. Wasn't it? Yeah,

Ant Pruitt (00:03:14):
That sounds right,

Leo Laporte (00:03:15):
Because I think Kevin Marx is coming in next week. No, I'm out next week. Oh, you I'm okay. That's right. Kevin Marks is coming in next week

Ant Pruitt (00:03:21):
Attempt to see a track meet with the hard heads and little

Leo Laporte (00:03:26):
Weirdo. Kevin is unhappy about the edit button and he'll explain why next week. Well, I can do a little bit of that this week. He's also gonna be on tech news weekly tomorrow to explain that. But before we get into that, I want just congrat you for listening to this show because did you know, according to the guardian podcast, listeners are likely to be more curious and less neurotic. This is research. What about host host? Yeah, no, no, we're the opposite. We're neurotic. So they don't have to be, this is from a study at the queen Queensland university of technology, I guess in Australia survey of 306 peoples from more than 10 countries on their podcast, listening habits on a podcast listeners, those who scored more highly on the trait of agreeableness were more likely to form parasocial relationships with their favorite podcast hosts.

Leo Laporte (00:04:22):
I think that happens right now. Oh, parasocial relationships associated with listening for longer and listening to podcasts by known hosts. The more you listen, the more you socially engage and feel like the favorite host is a friend. There you go. Also, I should point out podcast listeners, less likely to score highly for neuroticism, the tendency to experience negative emotions. And oddly enough that's quite different from social media use. There's a positive association between neuroticism and social media, of course, negative emotions. That's what, that's what social, media's all about of podcast listeners though, much less neuroticism, much more perceived intimacy, finding that people felt more empathetic and persuadable and hearing podcasts through headphones compared to through speakers. That's why our so podcast

Stacey Higginbotham (00:05:16):
Listeners are are, are dupes themselves what

Leo Laporte (00:05:20):
You're saying? No, they're not do they're more curious. Stop it. And more op podcast listeners, people billable, no, a people who listen to podcast are this is the ad line are more likely

Stacey Higginbotham (00:05:35):
To life and have to

Leo Laporte (00:05:35):
Have one through. Sure. Podcast, more open to experience and less on average. Thank you very much. Congratulations. Because you are listening. Maybe you didn't know that to a podcast right now, so you, yes. You used to be, you're a good person. Yeah. That's why I changed the names so that you could be less you could be more agree, less neurotic.

Ant Pruitt (00:05:56):
I wonder if, if there's a conversion of the folks that are SU super, super active on social media, and then you get them into listening to podcasts

Leo Laporte (00:06:04):
And they do less social media. Well, they do less social media. Do they become less neurotic? I wonder if, if there's a study in place for that

Stacey Higginbotham (00:06:12):
You

Leo Laporte (00:06:12):
Have, because

Ant Pruitt (00:06:12):
Some people you hear, I don't, I can't listen to podcasts. I don't get it They would rather watch Netflix,

Leo Laporte (00:06:17):
Or they can only handle 140 ideas at a time, 140 words of,

Stacey Higginbotham (00:06:21):
I would rather watch Netflix than listen to a podcast. Depend depending on what's on Netflix.

Leo Laporte (00:06:25):
Well, nowadays on Netflix, it's mostly shows about podcasts, oddly

Ant Pruitt (00:06:29):
Or hustle culture or

Stacey Higginbotham (00:06:31):
Something. I was about to say, no, I've got, I've got Bridgeton.

Leo Laporte (00:06:35):
Okay. That didn't chest.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:06:38):
Yeah. Shadow. You

Jeff Jarvis (00:06:39):
Had David. I had Dave Weiner in our class this week. Sorry. Sorry. Oh,

Leo Laporte (00:06:42):
Nice.

Jeff Jarvis (00:06:43):
Yeah. So Dave was, was speaking to our class this week. We had him go through the history podcast and of course it started with 

Leo Laporte (00:06:50):
Adam Curry,

Jeff Jarvis (00:06:52):
Adam Curry MTV star and Adam was talking to

Leo Laporte (00:06:56):
Stars, a big radio that

Ant Pruitt (00:06:58):
Actually everybody didn't have MTV. He's a VJ

Leo Laporte (00:07:02):
VJ.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:07:03):
He looked like a star

Leo Laporte (00:07:03):
He did though. He had that line.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:07:05):
So Dave said he almost missed it. He wasn't listening enough to Adam advocate said, I want radio. And Dave was saying, he can't get sound it's too. Internet's too slow. No, not gonna work. And then he thought about it and thought about it and thought, oh no, I get it. You, you, you, you can download it. And then you can listen when you want. Oh

Leo Laporte (00:07:24):
Yeah. Adam was encouraging Dave, who was one of the authors of RSS to add one little feature to RSS the ability to include a binary file in the RSS feeds. Instead of normally what it is, is the text from your blog. Right. But in addition, that one little thing that said, oh, and there is this binary blob associated with the RSS feed. That blob is this show. Congratulations. so yeah, thanks to Dave Weiner. We have that. And, and Adam Curry, who is often called the pod father for this, Adam wrote a very early podcasting client that red RSS feeds and downloaded the audio which was superseded, cuz it was just a kind of a experimental lab effort.

Jeff Jarvis (00:08:08):
Dave also said it took time. Interestingly he said, what he wanted more than anything else was users, cuz people weren't doing it. They thought, oh Adam Curry, he's a, he's a VJ. He knows outta this professionally and, and a few things there were out. They or were like that. And so Steve Gilmore was kind of podcasting in a sense before then. And then he said that Dave said he just went on and just kind of turned on a mic and just started talking and wanted people to realize that anybody can do this right.

Ant Pruitt (00:08:34):
Well, well how does he feel now about today's standard because everybody's doing podcasts now, as long as you have a following.

Jeff Jarvis (00:08:41):
Yeah. The students did. He didn't, he he's. I, I think that, that, I mean, he, he, he says that, that I don't wanna quote Dave here. I'm sorry, Dave, if you're watching, we'd love to have you on so we can quote you directly. But just to answer your question, I think that, that he cares about the structure of it, of you can listen anywhere. And that's why Spotify and Rogan in his view clearly is not podcasting. Ah, at all good point,

Leo Laporte (00:09:04):
Nor is YouTube.

Jeff Jarvis (00:09:07):
Yeah.

Leo Laporte (00:09:08):
But they they're complementary. I don't think it may not be podcasting, but it's the idea to me. And this is why I didn't lever never liked the word podcast. The idea really is just it's content over the internet, audio video text doesn't really matter. The it's internet distributed content and it is important that anybody can do it. I, you know, shortly after that happened that happened in, I think September of 2004, October of 2004, I put my radio show on a R and RSS feed as a podcast. And I think Dave's right, is that because it was RA it would tended to be, you know, professionals initially who had the gear and the, you know, the content to put out, although da you know, I have to say Adam's show was he sounds professional, but it wasn't a radio show. It was just the daily source. It was just you know, him talking.

Jeff Jarvis (00:09:58):
He said one of the first people to do it was Chris Liden who was w GB, H, Boston, who really, who always sounds like he's NPR, even if you're just sitting with him in the conference. Yeah. Chris sounds NPR. Yeah. So that kind of intimidates people. Yes.

Leo Laporte (00:10:10):
I think, yeah. I think Chris actually was one of the very, even before RSS, he was doing that and there was it conversations. There were yeah. The early days. But it didn't take long before. Well, it did, it took a decade truthfully before people really caught onto it because it was hard. And that's why it was called a podcast. You had to have a iPod and a program to download it and then put it on your iPod for it to be a podcast. Well,

Jeff Jarvis (00:10:35):
It preceded the iPod, right? It podcasting preceded the iPod. I think the

Leo Laporte (00:10:39):
Name, no, it did not.

Jeff Jarvis (00:10:41):
Hold on here.

Leo Laporte (00:10:42):
Ipod came out in 2001 podcast in

Jeff Jarvis (00:10:46):
2004. Okay.

Leo Laporte (00:10:47):
All right. So it did not, and that's why it was called a podcast podcast. And you'll see some, you'll see some people doing kind of a retro retroactive a play on demand is what P D stands for. That's not what it's it's for putting it on, on your IPO. Put that iPod device. I know I was there. But yeah. Yeah. Good. I'm glad you had him in. I think that's a really,

Stacey Higginbotham (00:11:10):
He was, he really, really enthrall the students cuz this is guy who's built so much. This is, this is a class Doug Rushkoff and I are doing and redesigning the

Leo Laporte (00:11:17):
Internet. Oh neat.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:11:18):
And trying to get the students to understand they

Leo Laporte (00:11:20):
Have the,

Stacey Higginbotham (00:11:21):
I'd love to say that and responsibility to do so. Yeah,

Leo Laporte (00:11:24):
We have just so you know, we invite Dave on pretty much weekly.

Leo Laporte (00:11:30):
And I've known Dave, we got, since the very beginning,

Stacey Higginbotham (00:11:33):
Dave, Dave, Dave said, he'll do anything for you.

Leo Laporte (00:11:35):
Yeah. He's a great guy. So the big story of the week though, is none of that. None of the above TikTok turns out, no, there is no tick to no, no two starting in January, Elon Musk quietly started buying up shares of Twitter and it finally became public last week that he had bought 9.2% of Twitter, outstanding Twitter shares becoming the biggest stakeholder in Twitter by far Jack Dorsey who just left as Twitter CEO only as two point something percent. So two, 9 billion later, Elon Musk has 73 million shares. And this was a filing that was made March 14th since Elon has updated the filing, which is kind of interesting. Maybe, I don't know, maybe he thought maybe it was a little sloppy. I don't, he's reclassified himself in the filing as an active investor. And I, you know, of course shortly after this the CEO of Twitter sag, Arawa a gro wall announced that Elon was gonna have a board seat. He took a seat on the board. Now I think there's a reason why when you're on the board, you can only buy up to 4.5%. They prohibit you from becoming an owner.

Ant Pruitt (00:13:04):
Okay, well

Stacey Higginbotham (00:13:05):
He's limited to 14.9% to

Leo Laporte (00:13:07):
15. I'm sorry. Did I say five? Yeah. 15. He already has for 9% limited to 14 and a half percent. So cause I think this is a bear hug. I think that what this really was, was we don't want him, we think he might be actually angling to buy Twitter. He has the money easily. Oh yeah. Hundreds of billions. So and by the way, he's already made money. Twitter's stock price went up 27% after he did this. If he were just interested and by the way, that's how Elon must use Twitter. Yeah. To pump stock,

Ant Pruitt (00:13:42):
Pump it up and dump

Leo Laporte (00:13:43):
It. If you were interested just making money Trump too. Yeah. He could have dumped it, but he didn't. And I honestly think this is on the whole, on the heels of Elon's saying, well, I think Twitter, you know, free speech, should we make a new Twitter? Cuz there's not enough free speech on Twitter, which is ironic. Cuz no one's healed him. But I guess maybe he's thinking of the former president. I don't know. Then on Monday he put up a poll that said, do you want an edit button? Although it was tongue in cheek because as you might notice the poll misspelled. Yes and no. So in a way it's like, see if we had an edit button, I could have fixed this. But look at that 73.6%. Yes. 4 million votes.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:14:32):
This followed Twitter having set on April fools day that they were working. Yeah.

Leo Laporte (00:14:36):
Well and in fact they said, no, it wasn't in April fools. We've been working on for a year and we're gonna do it. So this is a big week for Twitter news.

Ant Pruitt (00:14:45):
Can, can you go over the timetable again? Was the board seat offered

Leo Laporte (00:14:48):
That was after he bought after 9.6

Stacey Higginbotham (00:14:51):
Ounce he bought

Leo Laporte (00:14:53):
So what did somebody say yesterday? Keep your friends close and your enemies closer. Giving him a board seat.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:15:00):
Yeah. This dude should not get any, this pisses me off so much. I'm like, this is just a person who behaves badly, who behaves unethically, people venerate him. It drives me absolutely up the wall. Just from a standpoint of what does they really have to offer? Do you want someone on your board who is gonna possibly taint your brand and do things that are illegal? I like Twitter. I wish they didn't bow and cow tell to this sort of play acting and bad behavior disguised as I'm just kidding. Like ah,

Ant Pruitt (00:15:38):
Ah, how soon do you think wed that they invest were

Stacey Higginbotham (00:15:41):
In, in a bond? I'm sorry. Yeah, I hear,

Stacey Higginbotham (00:15:44):
I think, yeah. I don't know. What an, what did you ask?

Ant Pruitt (00:15:46):
I was, I was saying, how soon do you see an investigation happening from like the SCC or one? Because it, it just seems weirdly time.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:15:54):
I'm sure the S SEC's gonna do something. Elon is doing a great job showing how little teeth the S E actually have. Oh, okay. Or maybe it's just their willingness to go against him. Well,

Leo Laporte (00:16:06):
I don't think there's any law he's broken at this point.

Ant Pruitt (00:16:08):
You don't think so. He did

Stacey Higginbotham (00:16:10):
Prep

Ant Pruitt (00:16:11):
Previously. 

Leo Laporte (00:16:12):
You're allowed to buy shares in a company you like? Yes. Warren buffet eats a, you know, but what McDonald's every morning has an egg McMuffin. He is also a major shareholder, not illegal. Right. I like egg McMuffins. I think I'll buy some stock.

Ant Pruitt (00:16:30):
Yeah.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:16:31):
Well that's, that's his Mo, but right. From a ownership perspective. And when some of this was reported, I believe there are questions about that.

Leo Laporte (00:16:38):
Oh, really?

Stacey Higginbotham (00:16:38):
That's the securities issue.

Leo Laporte (00:16:40):
Okay. And El dash agrees with you. He said when he saw the tweet from praga while saying that Mr. Musk is on the board, he said, yeah, that's bad. Wish they would've taken any of the many other suggest of active users who could have been added to the board over the years, including those who are developers or experienced creators of healthy communities. Ane who's great has a point, which is Twitter has had a very checkered history of the developers, mostly negative. Mm. And, and yet it's the developers and users who have push the platform along if it weren't for Chris and his hashtag. Huh? Right Chris, what's his, I can't remember his last name now. Who invented the hash, sorry. Macina

Stacey Higginbotham (00:17:27):
Messina. Right. Chris,

Leo Laporte (00:17:28):
Chris Macina who invented the hashtag was users who created the at reply. That was an Hawk solution that Twitter eventually incorporated Twitter would be a very different platform. So I think in Neils is absolutely right, but money talks. And I think,

Stacey Higginbotham (00:17:44):
I think Stacy's really, really right here too, is that, is it? I think, I think Twitter was kind of stuck in a bind in ear. It's a bear hug and that's all true, but it doesn't look good for the company because they, they do this and, and, and they're gonna allow someone to bully them into, I, I, what my fear about this is that is that it's this fake free speech cancellation talk where the they're gonna be compelled to carry noxious speech and, and that's gonna create an invi. I mean, you, you think you promise on social media now, imagine if they were forced by a billionaire or by right wing government, either one, both of which are talking about this, I'm saying you must carry hate speech. You must carry.

Leo Laporte (00:18:27):
According to Mike Isaac at the New York times, Twitter was already discussing, having Musk be a more active participant, according to two people with knowledge of the conversation,

Stacey Higginbotham (00:18:38):
Why you believe that, but why you believe

Leo Laporte (00:18:40):
That? Well, cuz he has 80 million followers and tweets several times, several dozen times a day. That's

Stacey Higginbotham (00:18:47):
Not the real Twitter. You know, the real he

Stacey Higginbotham (00:18:49):
Tweet uses their platform to break the law. And he also seems to embody what is most noxious about the platform in the terms in, in the way he uses it,

Leo Laporte (00:19:00):
Casey new

Stacey Higginbotham (00:19:01):
Way, people engage

Leo Laporte (00:19:01):
With him, calls Elon Musk, a mischievous trickster, God ALO key.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:19:06):
I mean, in a way he is he's puckish

Leo Laporte (00:19:09):
Ish. Yeah. In fact Casey says I likened it to Lokey buying an ant farm. That's exactly what it is. Yeah. So it's, you know, so this is interesting cuz Casey Newton on his platform or newsletter talks about the timeline, which actually, if you, you need this timeline to take it all into context. So you remember that Elliot management, which was an activist investor group, took a 4% stake in Twitter two years ago. And at that time they were very unhappy with the, with how Twitter was doing and they wanted Jack Dorsey out cuz the stock price was stagnant. You user growth was stagnant. Elliot. The, the activist investors left the board a year later, according to Newton, apparently satisfied with Twitter's progress. But as a condition of leaving set, aggressive goals for the company grow the user base by a hundred million people, accelerate revenue growth gain market share as a digital advertiser, none of which Jack Dorsey was able to do. Casey thinks. And I think this widely agreed that that's why Dorsey left is that he could not make the changes Elliot wanted. And then of course he put a Twitter CTO in charge bar agro wall and AAL wall has done nothing to, by the way, hit those marks either. In fact it lost money, but

Stacey Higginbotham (00:20:39):
He's only been how long's he been there?

Leo Laporte (00:20:41):
Well, more than a, more than a quarter, couple of quarters, he's lost money in the last quarter. Okay. And added 6 million new users during his tenure, not a hundred. So that's Casey saying Twitter remains vulnerable to activist investors who might work to force out agro wall or once. But then we

Stacey Higginbotham (00:21:02):
Get into this attention economy and what, what do you want to build? So if once a hundred million users, the easiest and fastest way to do that is to engage people with trollish behavior, right. Is to piss people off. It's kind of the Facebook playbook. So is Twitter saying with this they're planning on going down that playbook because growth at all costs matters. That's what it looks like.

Leo Laporte (00:21:24):
Well again, quoting Casey Musk's presence on the board will help them fight off activist investors cuz now he has such a big stake and he's on the board. You know, he can, if single handedly say to the shareholders, I will beat Elliott's offer or anybody else's offer. Oh my so his status is both the platform's largest shareholder and most influential board level member will likely give him soft power that exceeds his technical authority. It did help the stock price up 27%. So shareholders will like that and it, by the way, it's continuing to go up. It hasn't, it wasn't just a bump it's continuing to go up. They Casey thinks that he might be right. That Musk is a supporter of the decentralized platform that Dorsey was talking about before he left and AWA still wants to do kind of the fed averse. That

Stacey Higginbotham (00:22:18):
Is what makes me, that would be interesting. Blue sky happens.

Leo Laporte (00:22:21):
Yeah. Then that makes me very happy. And that would be one way to answer that criticism of, you know, censorship is well just as on Macedon anybody can, each

Stacey Higginbotham (00:22:31):
Is

Leo Laporte (00:22:32):
Is, is a body layer. Yeah. So in fact, gab is on Macedon truth. Social's running on Macedon. It's not part of the fed averse, but it's running on the Macon software. So the most important thing though is that Musks really kind of first official act as a board member was to put that edit poll button up. And and, and, and a gro wall said, okay, we got an edit button. So the edit button will roll out, I think over the next few days. But there's been some complaints about that too. In fact, my wife asked me, well, I know you're gonna play devil's I advocate on twig today. So what's your real opinion on the edit

Ant Pruitt (00:23:14):
Here it comes.

Leo Laporte (00:23:17):
And, but I I'm gonna wait and hear guy, what you all say

Ant Pruitt (00:23:19):
I'm I'm

Stacey Higginbotham (00:23:20):
Well, Twitter's

Leo Laporte (00:23:22):
Go

Stacey Higginbotham (00:23:22):
Ahead. And Stacy, sorry, Twitter. Twitter's always pointed out that the edit button makes it hard for people. You can go back in and change what you said, which is an athe meta kind of what the platform was designed to do.

Leo Laporte (00:23:33):
Yeah. Lisa said Facebook's got an edit button. My blog has an edit button. Why shouldn't Twitter have an edit button? What do you think? A

Ant Pruitt (00:23:41):
I'm I'm sort of half and half on this. I like the, the premise of it not being editable because of context and things of that nature. But at the same time I use Twitter blue and I enjoy that aspect of, oh crap. I have a typo in there. Let me fix that real quick and then hit send. Right.

Leo Laporte (00:23:58):
Well, and that's not really later has that too. And I do too. Yeah. It's just a wait, look at it again. You got 30 seconds, but that's good. I think to me, that's a good solution. I

Ant Pruitt (00:24:08):
Dig

Leo Laporte (00:24:08):
That they I said that the Twitter blue folks will get the first shot at the edit button. So keep an eye.

Ant Pruitt (00:24:15):
Am I the only person still using Twitter? Blue? I still like it.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:24:18):
No, I still use

Leo Laporte (00:24:18):
It. We're all Twitter. Blue members, three bucks,

Stacey Higginbotham (00:24:21):
All Twitter, blue subscribers too.

Leo Laporte (00:24:22):
We're all blue. What about you Jeff? Edit it. Button pro or con.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:24:26):
So a few thoughts. One is I think that an edit button with no record of it is a mistake cuz it it's it's it's another tool for disformation. Oh yeah. But an edit button that shows you clearly what has been changed? I think has real benefit. It can say I made a mistake. You can say I'm stupid and I made a typo, but here I, I am. I recognize that I think that would actually improve the ethics.

Leo Laporte (00:24:48):
How would you show there?

Ant Pruitt (00:24:49):
Same way you would. Same way you do it inside two

Stacey Higginbotham (00:24:51):
On, on word. You know, you can do a cross out or you can do a different color for adding in.

Leo Laporte (00:24:55):
Maybe I would argue, maybe I would argue that that's kind of what Twitter has right now. You just do another tweet saying, sorry, typo. And you do another

Stacey Higginbotham (00:25:04):
Tweet's already gone out. It has to be in your real tweet. You have to change your

Leo Laporte (00:25:09):
Real tweet context.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:25:09):
So let me, let me keep going

Stacey Higginbotham (00:25:11):
Now. I wonder if you could do an alt text.

Leo Laporte (00:25:13):
Yeah. You could address that.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:25:16):
Would that work Jeff? Yeah.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:25:17):
Yeah. I think, I think it would. I think there's a few options here. So another thing that I product guy at Twitter came on today is give me suggestions. So I wrote like four tweets suggesting things. I think another way to look at this is as an update, not a, not an edit that I could attach something to a tweet and say, oops, I made a mistake or here's a fix or, or, or whatever. The problem I think that they're facing here is the architecture of it that RSS the tweets go out and they're out of the control of Twitter. They're on somebody else's reader now on rotten, the rid of a lot of that, but it still has that. I think that essential RSS architecture, not calling RSS, not exactly where it's out there. And especially if you go to blue sky API, things are in a federated world where they're stored in a hundred places, you know, are you gonna have to update it in a hundred places that becomes a technical challenge? I think, which is really interesting to consider. So there's one, there's one is there's the transparency and truthfulness challenge of not being used for misinformation and, and, and, and, and try to fool us into thinking somebody said this, but they didn't say that get's critical. But the second then is the technical challenge of how would you implement this? And I don't think it's as easy as people think.

Ant Pruitt (00:26:26):
I like to edit tag showing up on there just as if I were looking at slack and, you know, someone type something to me that they had a typo and they go in and fix a typo and it shows edit right there. And

Leo Laporte (00:26:38):
I get it. The thing at Twitter would tell you is that it's not designed to do that. It's exactly, as you said, Jeff, once a tweet goes out, Twitter in effect loses control of it. Yeah. So any edit is gonna be imperfect cuz we can't fix what's already happened. Yeah. So an up, even an update would have to go back, get that tweet men it, and that's just not the architecture at all. Yeah. I think there's also the sociological issue, which is what is Twitter. It's not Facebook, it's not a blog it's real time. And so when you say something, you say it and it's out there and it's done and it, it's not editable because it's in effect live.

Ant Pruitt (00:27:23):
Shouldn't say it's not a blog yet. There are many people that try to use it as well.

Leo Laporte (00:27:27):
Maybe they're misusing

Ant Pruitt (00:27:27):
Micro blog with that whole thread and feature.

Leo Laporte (00:27:30):
Yeah. I think the real issue is kind of comes down to what, how you think of Twitter. And I think because for instance, politicians use it, which makes it a matter of record. You can't have, it's really a big problem with this editing the past, the official accounts. It's an official account. Whether you like it or companies

Stacey Higginbotham (00:27:50):
Do actually. Yeah.

Leo Laporte (00:27:51):
It's become an official account. So I am dead set against it. I think it's a huge mistake. It's not what Twitter is all about. And if you want that, put it on Facebook, put it on LinkedIn, put it somewhere where you candidate, but Twitter is it's about being live in real time. Now Kevin Marks and we're gonna have him on next week and he'll also be on T w tomorrow. So I'll let him speak for himself. But on his Kevin marks.com blog, he raises another very interesting issue. Over time. Twitter has changed the way you embed a tweet on your blog in the past, people would copy and paste. Yeah. Or the, they would take a picture, a screenshot of it and put it on their blog. Twitter doesn't want you to do that. In fact probably says somewhere deep in their terms of service, you're not supposed to do that. Yeah. What they want you to do is embed and fact a JavaScript linked back to Twitter. So that the, that, and in a way it's a good thing to do, cuz it authenticates it. It says, no, no here's the tweet you could see it's the same. I haven't modified it. But, but Kevin says with all the fuss about Twitter's promised edit button and how they might design it, we're missing a disturbing development. Twitter is using its embedded JavaScript to edit other people's sites. So this is different

Stacey Higginbotham (00:29:03):
From an edit button. This is a whole separate problem.

Leo Laporte (00:29:05):
Well, but an edit button would in fact requires it. Doesn't

Stacey Higginbotham (00:29:08):
How it's implemented, but it could. Yes.

Leo Laporte (00:29:10):
Cause otherwise yeah.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:29:11):
If, if it implemented, so it didn't tell you that it's been edited. That would be a problem on your site if you did it to prove something. And then

Leo Laporte (00:29:18):
Right. And if people are using copy and paste or screenshots edit all you want it's, it's not gonna change on those one sites. So, and Twitter's strongly encouraging you. You not to do that, to use the JavaScript, which would be kind of a requisite of having an edit button. You can't edit it unless you can get pull yank bank, all of the versions of that tweet that exist out in the universe, fix them and put them back out there. And that's the only way you could do this is with a, an embed, not a with a, does

Stacey Higginbotham (00:29:47):
A tweet have Ari.

Leo Laporte (00:29:49):
It does.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:29:50):
So in that case, I could imagine implementation where to go to Ann's point about the, the, you know, Hey, this was something was changed here. Button. There's an update to this in a sense, if you could a, that, that you'd have to require clients to show that. But for a given I, there is an added piece of data that says, you know, a bit that says on and off, this has been updated or not.

Leo Laporte (00:30:11):
Yeah. so there's a long article on Kevin's blog, which I recommend. And this is, this is I'm gonna show you the screenshot from his book log, an example of why this is a bad thing. These are tweets from Donald Trump. If you show my screen, these are tweets the war on. So this is an article from Vox about the, the, the war on James Comey, quoting tweets from Donald Trump, except that that's a blank. Those tweets are gone.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:30:45):
It used to come with playing text above the embed.

Leo Laporte (00:30:50):
This is what the embed looks like now from Kevin's you get a block quote you do get this text, but then you also get the HF and then the JavaScript renders it. There's the JavaScript there that renders it. So the href is that link, as you said to the canonical actual tweet, that's important too, by the way, if you don't have that link then there's no one to ver no way to verify on the Twitter site. That what you're saying is true. Yep. True. if you use the embed though, you get these in embeds like this, which are pretty and most sites use them now. Yep. But if, but it has the negatives you can see of disappearing once that tweet is disappeared. And by the way, it doesn't just have to be Twitter, you know, banning somebody, it could be just Donald Trump taking those down, which he did in fact. Yeah. So now by the way, this is the cited text. This is how that article could look, which is the original little tweet content. So I think if you're gonna consider Twitter, Twitter an important part of the public record, that's another reason not to allow editing

Stacey Higginbotham (00:31:55):
Because, oh, it's your real opinion or your 

Leo Laporte (00:31:58):
This is what I told Lisa. I said, okay. I was maybe a Littley

Stacey Higginbotham (00:32:01):
We confirm that please.

Leo Laporte (00:32:02):
I was a little salty. I

Stacey Higginbotham (00:32:03):
Said, I don't Leo editing his opinions

Leo Laporte (00:32:05):
For, I said that tweets is a terrible idea. I understand why users want it. Cuz there's a typo. Or I said something

Stacey Higginbotham (00:32:12):
Typo. I feel like an idiot. Yeah. You look like an idiot.

Ant Pruitt (00:32:15):
That's why I would want this because of the typos. But I get it. I'm I'm thinking about people that are harassed and they need that record the shows, Hey, Hey, I, I was harassed by this person on Twitter and if they go to delete it that's

Leo Laporte (00:32:28):
Well and interesting because who would like that best the harasser. Right? Well, would you say Elon Musk might be somebody who would benefit from editable tweets. Hmm. Right. And what the CC is investigating those tweets. Yeah. It's no record of those tweets. Right? The, the effect has already been, you know, felt yeah. He says, you know, I'm gonna, I'm all in on do coin, do coin, goes up. He sells his DOJ coin and then they go to tweeted leases. Tweet it's gone. It should not. I think Twitter should be a permanent record. It's it's a li it's a live just like our live stream is a permanent record. It's live. Now we edit actually we had a I'll give you a little inside baseball. Cause we had an issue last week where one of our hosts said, can you cut that part of the show out? Cuz I said something I wish I hadn't said. And without asking me our editors, they respect him, took it out and I hit the ceiling and I sent them a number of links. Jeff backed me up on this. And you too Stacy, you're both you know, trained journalists, two

Stacey Higginbotham (00:33:31):
Things we've said,

Leo Laporte (00:33:31):
No, you train journalists, journalists. I said, once it's part of the public record, you can't just amend it. Right. At the very least you have to put

Stacey Higginbotham (00:33:41):
You can't, you can amend it. You just can't erase it.

Leo Laporte (00:33:44):
Right. Yeah. So at the bottom you have to say correction. Right, right. Something like that, a date

Stacey Higginbotham (00:33:51):
I will say. So with blogging, it's changed a little bit and even like venerable publication, such as fortune. If you do like what is an accepted typo, you know, like, so not a misspelling of someone's name, but if you put like, I don't know, you, you just like spell no, instead of all before E wrong. Yeah. Or yeah, those kind of things you can correct without like we would correct typos without making a fuss over it. But we ever like if that typo was in someone's

Leo Laporte (00:34:22):
Name, typo different context. So, so what I did is I sent I sent the staff this from the university of Southern California Annenburg school their online journalism review, an article rewriting history should editors delete or alter online content. And I think it's a kind of a very, very good example of what happens and why it shouldn't happen and how it should be handled appropriately. And it's a very good long piece. So

Stacey Higginbotham (00:34:47):
Do you, do you think the right to be forgotten is, is wrong?

Leo Laporte (00:34:52):
Well, it's a, so that's an interesting question. Yeah. I mean, I, it is wrong. I'll tell you why. I think it's wrong, which has nothing to do with this is it doesn't go to the source. It doesn to the original article that you're trying to get rid of. It goes to Google and why is it Google's responsibility? They're just the search engine. It should be the, if you don't like what somebody said about you in the past and or you wanna vary, you gotta go to the source. You don't go to the search engine. So that's the, what's wrong with that?

Stacey Higginbotham (00:35:17):
Oh, I'm curious to hear what Stacy's pick says about this, but all of you, there was a discussion on Twitter recently with journalism, ethics, people believe it or not, they exist. And about the idea of basically doing right forgotten with newspapers that someone comes and says, listen, I was arrested 30 years ago for something that comes up in search. I wanna go to the source. I wanna go to the newspaper and I want this taken down. What's your, and, and, and you know, I've lived a perfect life since then. I made a stupid mistake 30 years ago. 

Leo Laporte (00:35:46):
No.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:35:47):
What do you say? No.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:35:48):
Okay. So I actually think this is actually one of the things that I think is really important and I would love to see legislation actually on this, which is, is under a certain age, maybe 18, maybe 21. I think you should be able to do it. Yeah. And I say that because I feel like kids

Leo Laporte (00:36:06):
That's, that's enshrined in, in 

Stacey Higginbotham (00:36:08):
Hold up. I know, but it's, but it's not on social media. It's not the Case's. So if

Leo Laporte (00:36:14):
I was among law in the law, of course.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:36:17):
Right. So I think that's okay. But 30 years ago, if you ran over someone's cat and someone wrote a story about it and you now want to work for the SPCA and their, your name comes up as a cat killer. I'm sorry, buddy.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:36:30):
It was very elaborate there, Stacy. I was like, I was quite a yard. You just told,

Stacey Higginbotham (00:36:35):
I didn't wanna, I didn't

Stacey Higginbotham (00:36:37):
Like It is its

Stacey Higginbotham (00:36:41):
I'm just trying to think of a crime that wasn't, I mean, it was bad, but

Stacey Higginbotham (00:36:44):
It's why you have a dog, not a cat Stacy for the rest of

Leo Laporte (00:36:47):
Your life.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:36:48):
You know, you can confess to it. No,

Stacey Higginbotham (00:36:49):
No. There's no history of cat murdering. I just, I don't wanna,

Leo Laporte (00:36:53):
No, I agree.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:36:55):
Sorry

Leo Laporte (00:36:55):
Is minor. This is something completely get a good point. But minors is something completely separate. Yes, of course. But what if you, I, and by the way, the law does have also provisions for expunging your record, even as an adult,

Stacey Higginbotham (00:37:06):
But not the newspaper, that's the

Stacey Higginbotham (00:37:08):
Law, but not a

Stacey Higginbotham (00:37:09):
Newspaper. The law can't tell the newspaper,

Leo Laporte (00:37:10):
But it's interesting that we do.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:37:12):
And there is, there is a category right now about mugshots. So if you get arrested and have a mug, those can be published online and follow you forever, even if you're not convicted of crime. So then the burden becomes on you to explain what happened. And there are people who are like, is that really fair?

Leo Laporte (00:37:33):
I, I honestly think the public record's a public record, but I, I agree with, I think there also extend you awaiting circumstances and there's history. Maybe there should be a statute of limitations on social media posts. Honestly, every social media network lets you delete stuff. 

Stacey Higginbotham (00:37:53):
And some people go through and delete all of their tweets, just

Leo Laporte (00:37:56):
The past. As a matter of hygiene, I do that. I deleted everything, you know, except for the last two years or something, just a matter of hygiene, not cuz the problem is that looks like a guilty action that

Stacey Higginbotham (00:38:09):
Wasn't yeah. So in journalism, your lawyers will tell you like for notes, for example, never whatever note taking strategy you have actually they're like, if you, you have to strategy and stick with it, so you don't make you're guilty. That's right. So my strategy is to keep my notes for two years. Right. And then dump all of them.

Leo Laporte (00:38:26):
Right. Okay. But you have to be consistent that way.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:38:29):
Yeah.

Leo Laporte (00:38:29):
Yes.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:38:30):
NBC. And so that, I mean, if you're consistent yeah. With your tweet deletions, then you're fine.

Leo Laporte (00:38:37):
Here's

Stacey Higginbotham (00:38:38):
But if you suddenly wake up one day and

Leo Laporte (00:38:39):
Here's what I also sent our staff from the globe and mail, which is the big Toronto newspaper, the globe mail generally does not unpublish content or remove details such as names from our websites and archives other than for legal reasons. But it does correct. And update articles as necessary if there's a significant factual area. And there is though, and interestingly there's an appeal process and you have to make it in writing to the public editor and then a committee of editors and lawyers will review the request and they'll be a response. I think it's probably a good idea to have some sort of appeal per process, you know, procedure. Cause there are, there are cases where you shouldn't, you know, there's there's stuff you did when you're 20. Maybe you're a legal adult, but you're, you know, you're 65 now and that cat would deserve to be killed and what no, just being oddly, if it, once again,

Stacey Higginbotham (00:39:38):
I'll give you an example of something we actually on, on my blog we unpublished a story for the holiday weekend, not too long ago. That was president's day weekend I believe. And we had published something, it went up on the site. Then I got in a frantic email from the CFO of the company. I was like, Stacy published, this it's so wrong. You could burn someone's house down. So it became a safety issue. I was like, okay, well I can't cats. I can't just, yeah, I can't delete the story because we don't unpublish it. Right. He's like, I was like, so need to fix it, but I need to know how to fix it. So, and he's like, I'm getting on a plane. I can't. And so what happened was for there, I actually unpublished the story for like a day while he got back to me with, and I, I hated doing it, but I was also like,

Leo Laporte (00:40:31):
You don't want to cut. I

Stacey Higginbotham (00:40:32):
Don't wanna burn anyone's house

Leo Laporte (00:40:32):
Down. Yeah. You don't wanna cuts house fires either and

Stacey Higginbotham (00:40:34):
It's fully in your, in your power to do something. Yeah. Right. But it was, I mean, it's, it's an off use case and you know, we, we basically rewrote the entire story and then had to append an update that was like, Hey, we screwed this up, blah, blah, blah. And it's horrifying when those things happened, cuz you're like, oh I screwed up. But at the same time you, yeah,

Leo Laporte (00:40:58):
Gotta all the point is by the way, Patrick Delehanty, who was our engineer here and our coder and knows these things says you can delete it. But all you're deleting is this is in the, the discord, all you're deleting is the public record. Twitter can still see deleted tweets. So if if law enforcement wants to see him, they're still available. Yeah. I do think the fact that Twitter allows deletion is a, that's a form of editing. I mean, that's just deleted, so yeah.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:41:27):
But they also tell you that like, you'll see that the response to this has been deleted. So they tell you that something has been deleted. You can't

Leo Laporte (00:41:36):
Not, can't not so not a full tweet. So if I just do a tweet

Stacey Higginbotham (00:41:40):
And no one responds to it. Sure. Yeah. But

Leo Laporte (00:41:42):
Oh yeah. If there's a response you're right.

Ant Pruitt (00:41:44):
You had to say, this has been deleted by user. That's

Leo Laporte (00:41:46):
Probably why Twitter keeps a copy of it coming to think of it. Yeah, you're right. It that's right. But if there are no responses and I delete, so if a tree falls in the forest and there's no one there to hear it, it doesn't, it's gone effectively except for Twitter.

Ant Pruitt (00:41:59):
Yeah. Except for the,

Leo Laporte (00:42:00):
And I just want everybody to

Ant Pruitt (00:42:01):
Eye.

Leo Laporte (00:42:02):
I had, I have never murdered any cats ever

Ant Pruitt (00:42:06):
Dogs. Me

Stacey Higginbotham (00:42:07):
Too. I have never murdered any cats. I did once run over a turtle while driving to Austin. And

Leo Laporte (00:42:14):
Thank you. It was really bearing your soul on our show for that. That's good. Yeah. So if you, yeah, so now actually now that people are mentioning this thing if you allow deletions, why wouldn't you allow editing? Well, because I think you shouldn't allow deletions come to think of it. Isn't the theory of Twitter is this is a

Stacey Higginbotham (00:42:35):
No, you have to allow deletions. Like cuz if I can't credibly edit something, like if I put that tweet, like my, my burn, your house down story in a tweet, I had done that at a tweet. Right. I can't edit it in the tweet. And so what if someone retweeted the inaccurate information, that's why you have to delete.

Leo Laporte (00:42:55):
Okay. And okay. That's interesting question.

Ant Pruitt (00:42:58):
So still an edit.

Leo Laporte (00:42:59):
So it really is, is Twitter a kind of a special kind of social media and I've always thought of it as kind of a real time social media, but,

Ant Pruitt (00:43:09):
But okay. Let's look at Facebook. Facebook is still pretty, Daum big and active of all day long yet they have these edit functions and people put all kinds of outlandish information on that.

Leo Laporte (00:43:22):
The

Ant Pruitt (00:43:22):
Edit

Leo Laporte (00:43:22):
Feature that your Facebook post lives only on Facebook, right?

Stacey Higginbotham (00:43:30):
Yes. It's a lot easier.

Ant Pruitt (00:43:32):
Really?

Leo Laporte (00:43:32):
There's no third party clients. No yeah. Facebook

Stacey Higginbotham (00:43:37):
Doesn't allow you to like invest.

Ant Pruitt (00:43:39):
Oh, so they don't have a bid.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:43:40):
You have to go back to Facebook.

Leo Laporte (00:43:42):
Oh, I didn't put a link to it.

Ant Pruitt (00:43:43):
Didn't know that. Okay. I don't use Facebook either though, but

Leo Laporte (00:43:47):
Yeah, I don't either, but I think that's the right. So that's the, and that makes sense because that means 

Ant Pruitt (00:43:51):
There's no cost to it.

Leo Laporte (00:43:52):
There's no, yeah. There's no cost. They, you know, they change, they change it and that's changed forever.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:43:57):
Here's an interesting thing. Kevin's problems raised too here, which is that if these things are gonna disappear, I saw journalists say, well, what's gonna happen is newspapers are, are gonna stop embedding tweets. And instead they're gonna do screen screen grabs. Yeah.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:44:10):
Screen grabs tweet. Right.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:44:12):
And, and that's an ethical problem people have because it doesn't include the link back. You can't see the original,

Leo Laporte (00:44:17):
Well, you could make it a link. You could make a screen grab plus a link. Right? That's easy this note, but that

Stacey Higginbotham (00:44:22):
Doesn't

Leo Laporte (00:44:23):
Now

Stacey Higginbotham (00:44:23):
You have to go to a lot of effort to do that. No,

Leo Laporte (00:44:25):
No more effort than a lot of

Stacey Higginbotham (00:44:27):
Material journal. It is. Journalists are notoriously in a hurry and lazy. I'll give you that.

Leo Laporte (00:44:32):
And I have to, I was just looking to see how far back my Twitter stream goes. I did delete the first six years, but it start, but 2012 is here. So I guess I better get, I didn't I'm not consistent. That's my oldest tweet now. I kind of regret deleting my first tweet.

Ant Pruitt (00:44:49):
Yeah. Well it was your first

Stacey Higginbotham (00:44:51):
It's in the library of Congress. That's the other thing.

Leo Laporte (00:44:53):
Oh yeah. That's another thing. Proposal. It lives forever. Doesn't it? As a, in the public record,

Ant Pruitt (00:44:58):
Internet archive.

Leo Laporte (00:44:59):
That's your

Stacey Higginbotham (00:44:59):
Public, your public. We, I, I wrote about this in public parts long ago is what we have to do as a society is learn to be more forgiving of stupid mistakes. We're not there yet.

Ant Pruitt (00:45:10):
Oh no. Again, I still think about like the harassment side of things. And especially when it comes to teenagers or whatever that are using social media and they get some harassing message from another teenager and they go to report it and that other teenagers like, well, it, this doesn't exist. I deleted it. But yet I have a screenshot of it. It's there's gotta be a line somewhere where we can keep this stuff and keep people safe too.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:45:39):
Indeed.

Leo Laporte (00:45:41):
Now I wanted to lead all my old tweets. Oh, I'm sorry. I was,

Stacey Higginbotham (00:45:45):
I thought you wanted to keep them like 20 seconds ago. You said you wanted

Leo Laporte (00:45:48):
To keep them that's until I read them and oh geez. How did you go? How

Ant Pruitt (00:45:52):
Do you go about mass delete and tweets? That's that's

Leo Laporte (00:45:55):
Such a, it's a script. You have to it's a script cuz it there's no built in tool to do it. Oh,

Ant Pruitt (00:46:01):
Okay.

Leo Laporte (00:46:01):
So yeah, in effect it has to load and delete load and delete load and

Ant Pruitt (00:46:05):
Delete. It's

Leo Laporte (00:46:06):
Not a very good system. Yeah. Twitter does not you any way to do that. Isn't that interesting? Yeah.

Ant Pruitt (00:46:11):
I know. It's hard to like delete direct messages. I have direct messages that I try to just clean up something, feel pain it, but it's a pain in a butt. Just the leak

Leo Laporte (00:46:21):
Those.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:46:23):
So can I ask a question? No. So come blue. No,

Stacey Higginbotham (00:46:28):
Yet you started anyway.

Leo Laporte (00:46:33):
You're canceled. Jeff. You are just, you are so canceled.

Ant Pruitt (00:46:38):
Sorry, Mr. Jarvis.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:46:41):
I'm not sorry.

Ant Pruitt (00:46:44):
Go ahead sir.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:46:46):
Killer.

Leo Laporte (00:46:47):
Ah, I think you have that's a chilling effect. I think

Stacey Higginbotham (00:46:53):
It is. I'm chill. Censorship.

Leo Laporte (00:46:57):
Come on Jeff. Go ahead. Ask the question.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:46:59):
So architecturally, if you think about blue sky or you think about discord or Mastodon and you want to kill something, you're gonna get in trouble for it. You were wrong. Whatever is it, is it harder? Is it impossible? Do you have to kill at a hundred places? What, what is the architecture of these, of these federated distributed things look like just the things that we already have.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:47:25):
If it's truly federated, you can't get rid of it. I don't know if Twitter still has that architecture though. So like when you were talking about that, I was like, oh man, do they still have that? I really thought they rearchitected. Well

Stacey Higginbotham (00:47:38):
Isn't tweet deck a client. Separate client.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:47:41):
Yeah. But you can, I mean, you can control things like, is it truly federated or are they just serving up an API? Well,

Leo Laporte (00:47:48):
There are, they're

Stacey Higginbotham (00:47:49):
Setting up an API

Leo Laporte (00:47:49):
Tweet takes a bad example cause it's owned by Twitter, but let's say a third party client. Yeah, they're getting, I don't know because you know, one of the reasons I like third party clients is cuz I get the chronological feed and I don't get ads. So yeah. I guess they're using the API, but they're just getting the tweets.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:48:07):
So then cuz once you, the API, once it's deleted, they would get it. Cuz that's not actually, I mean an API isn't federated. So that's I just don't know though. So I can't really say anything. Otherwise I'd be like, well

Stacey Higginbotham (00:48:19):
Just, just theoretically of, of what's the world we want IM ask it differently here. Do we, cause Leo's, Leo's arguings regularly for the it's the record. You said it in public, that's it live with it it's there and then you

Stacey Higginbotham (00:48:33):
Would wanna put it on something like the blockchain and I I'm not,

Leo Laporte (00:48:36):
It's always, well the blockchain is no deletions. Yeah.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:48:39):
Yeah. Well that's what I'm saying so well and if you try, like, even if you deleted it on a client side, you would have a record of it being that that's still accessible. Right. Is that scary? Even if you made it harder to find? I don't know. I mean, it really depends on the tool sets that we have available to access it. Right? Cause in some cases it'd be like the equivalent of saying, Hey like, like if back before the internet, if I murdered a cat and the newspaper wrote an article, eventually that article makes a back to the micro Fe section and nobody really looks it up right on the internet. That's not the case because the microfiche is just a search away. So if you had something that was like on a blockchain, but not accessible, it'd still be available to people who knew how to look. It just wouldn't be available to like someone, some random person who's Googling your name. Does that make sense?

Stacey Higginbotham (00:49:32):
Yeah. It's but it, these are, these are important. This is to your point often Stacy, about, about, we gotta talk about it before we do it. Yeah. These are important decisions to be made design decisions, to be made about what we think of the public record. And, and as a journalist, I generally agree with Leo that it's out there, it's out there. I, and I don't like right to be forgotten for that reason. But you know, you have an exception for young people. There could be an exception for the, you know, a mistake being made. There could be an exception for being found innocent.

Leo Laporte (00:50:05):
Honestly, if you're on Twitter, I think I would like to see it be part of the, the that if you're on Twitter, you know what you're doing and you're handling a loaded gun. We've just given you the loaded gun. If you shoot yourself in the foot, you shoot yourself in the foot. Not my problem.

Ant Pruitt (00:50:21):
Yeah. Then there's the same aspect of Twitter giving you the option of protected tweet, Sue. Like what is, what are the, what's the word? 

Leo Laporte (00:50:30):
It's you can't, can you protect a tweet or just your whole account? You

Ant Pruitt (00:50:34):
Can't well, it's your whole account, but I mean, you're still using this can't tweet that platform

Leo Laporte (00:50:40):
Only people mention this tweet. Oh that's can only, they can respond the threats

Stacey Higginbotham (00:50:44):
Reply.

Ant Pruitt (00:50:44):
Yeah. That's for replies. But I'm saying if someone does, it does an account, that's not public anymore. They just totally lock it down, which

Leo Laporte (00:50:50):
I have done.

Ant Pruitt (00:50:51):
And so are they allowed to delete their tweets? Are they allowed to delete their tweets and what's

Leo Laporte (00:50:56):
Oh, that's

Ant Pruitt (00:50:57):
Interesting. I mean, it's a lot of different angles. That's

Leo Laporte (00:50:58):
A good point.

Ant Pruitt (00:51:00):
Cause the protecting it because they want it to be so called private. Right?

Leo Laporte (00:51:05):
I don't think Twitter should allow private account. See,

Stacey Higginbotham (00:51:08):
Well maybe Lisa has waited

Ant Pruitt (00:51:11):
On Twitter. She's been on Twitter

Leo Laporte (00:51:12):
Is Lisa tweeting. Yeah.

Ant Pruitt (00:51:13):
She's

Leo Laporte (00:51:13):
Tweeting. Am I being subtweet now

Stacey Higginbotham (00:51:16):
She waited. She said, if you can delete a tweet, then you should be able to edit it. Just show the before and after limit it to one edit that would work for me. I think that's a good idea.

Leo Laporte (00:51:25):
Oh, that's

Ant Pruitt (00:51:26):
Good. The one

Leo Laporte (00:51:28):
It with a record

Stacey Higginbotham (00:51:29):
And, and show the before and after. So yeah, I was an idiot. I made a typo or I learned a lesson or I was wrong or I don't want your cat house to burn down or whatever.

Leo Laporte (00:51:39):
Good for Lisa. That's the right answer. You better believe it says, says her husband. I love, I love the the tweet and response from the VP coms at SubT. Did you see this whole story?

Stacey Higginbotham (00:51:57):
I put that up

Leo Laporte (00:51:58):
There. So Lulu Chan a survey who is the ver vice president of comms at SubT stack tweet, SubT stack is hiring.dot dot. If you're a Twitter employees considering resigning, because you're worried about Elon Musk pushing for less regulated speech, please do not come work here to which on Subec Alex Perini. I don't know if you've seen this responds as VP of comms for the newsletter company. It's really important. They make sure everyone associates our brand with being a huge unaccountable

Ant Pruitt (00:52:33):
Dip stick dip stick.

Leo Laporte (00:52:35):
So this is obviously a parody post on sub stack, well written by Alex. He says, and this is for saying, is in her voice and not to brag, but I think I'm pretty good at my job, which is why so people understand our company is about conflating the conflict of the concept of free and up and debate with being a brain jackass all the time. One way we get this message across is by having a bunch of brain Jack asses on our platform. But as a comms professional, I assure you, this is not enough. There were a bunch of brain Jack asses on blog spot, but no ever thought of that as a platform specializing in bringing Jack asses and making my job even harder, our platform is not exclusively home to bringing Jack asses, lots of thoughtful, intelligent, conscientious people use our platform and even rely on us for their livelihoods. My job is to make sure no one in the broader internet using public associates, the work of those people with our corporate brand every day, I log in with one mission to ensure that people understand that we here at the newsletter company do not just provide a platform for and trolls dip sticks, but the dipsticks and trolls are an essential part of our corporate culture.

Leo Laporte (00:53:50):
Anyway, it's a very funny parody of this I don't

Stacey Higginbotham (00:53:55):
Know, hill dash killed his sub stock account because of that,

Leo Laporte (00:53:58):
Because of the tweet, the Lulu Chan original tweet. Yeah. So what, so why did he kill his account? What is it, so why is this a, he

Stacey Higginbotham (00:54:08):
Would kind of wouldn't say, cuz he just, he didn't even, he referred to it only as a sub. He SubT tweeted it. They didn't give him the full rationale. Yeah.

Leo Laporte (00:54:15):
But I, I think there's always been a lot of criticism of SubT stack because of the kinds of people they intentionally pay to be on SubT stack. They, they like Twitter apparently seemed to have want this

Stacey Higginbotham (00:54:28):
Hank green responded to Mike tweet. I said, SubT stack reveals its essence layer by layer Hank green responded. Disagreement is not tolerated on our pro free speech.

Leo Laporte (00:54:41):
Yeah. I honestly, if, if Elon Musk really does start to direct what happens to Twitter? I think the real risk is that it will be the end of Twitter.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:54:52):
Yeah, I think so too. He could ruin it and maybe that's his desire. Maybe it's maybe it's Peter te time, maybe this, I mean, that's the other thing about this? This is, this is very rich people. This is part of what Stacy said earlier too. It's rich people, rich boys who can throw around their weight. And I just finished an amazing book called the newspaper axis about the six press barons Hearst McCormick Roth, me Patterson Patterson, and one other, I, I forget who supported Hitler, who that

Ant Pruitt (00:55:21):
I was getting ask was that Aika I just saw on there.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:55:24):
Yep. This is about world war II and supporting in some cases supporting Hitler in some cases supporting fascism and in most cases opposing entry into world Wari, a terrible antisemitism out of the New York daily news, for example. So those were, you know, rich people who could own the barrels, an ink and could do what they wanted to. So the issue here, I, I was called by the FA times about this story today. And the issue to me too, is not so much about censorship. It's about compelled speech. What we're gonna find is if, if Elon forces Twitter to carry things that Twitter in its own ethical standards would otherwise not under the guise of free speech, then it's compelled speech and it's not free speech and it's gonna ruin the environ, all of us. That's what I worry about.

Ant Pruitt (00:56:10):
What did Dorsey

Stacey Higginbotham (00:56:11):
Have to? So we go also to Jack Dorsey. I'm sorry.

Ant Pruitt (00:56:14):
Yeah, that's what I was gonna ask. What did Dorsey have to say about all of this? Cuz he was tweeting here recently about the platform and how he seems to have a part in all of this.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:56:22):
I, I wonder if he knew what was going on here cuz when he regretted in that, it's a good question, Anne, is he regretted helping to create a centralized rather than decentralized internet?

Leo Laporte (00:56:32):
I thought that was such an

Stacey Higginbotham (00:56:33):
Interestingness

Leo Laporte (00:56:34):
Of it. We talked about that on the Sunday. Do you think he kind of knew ahead of time what was going he must have had

Stacey Higginbotham (00:56:40):
To, I think this is a problem with the is you can take over decentralized. You can't take over decentralized. Yeah, you can, you can fill it with crap, but you can't take it over to our prior.

Leo Laporte (00:56:51):
So do you think one of the things Musk might do for instance is reinstate Donald Trump's account?

Stacey Higginbotham (00:56:56):
That's what I fear

Leo Laporte (00:56:59):
Be good. You know what? It'd be good for business.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:57:02):
That's why the stock yep.

Leo Laporte (00:57:04):
Be good for business. That's probably what the market was thinking. Right?

Ant Pruitt (00:57:07):
Well who's next on the board's why Rihanna? She's got 80 million followers. She's gonna be on the Twitter board next.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:57:13):
Yeah,

Leo Laporte (00:57:13):
Really? I would enjoy that. Actually. She'd do a better job,

Stacey Higginbotham (00:57:16):
Honestly.

Leo Laporte (00:57:19):
All right. Let's take a little break Han versus Elon Musk. Bring it. I'd like to see that

Stacey Higginbotham (00:57:25):
Back versus Donald Trump. Bring it. Yeah.

Leo Laporte (00:57:27):
Oh boy. Yeah. more to come in just a bit. Oh, let me just, before I do that, let me read the because we referred to it. We didn't say what the tweet was from Jack Dorsey. This was on April 2nd. So this was four days ago. By the way, he by then might well have known that Elon Musk was buying up stock cuz that was reported on March 15th. The days of Usenet, that was the the kinda the open message boards. And the only days of the internet IRC, we still use that by the way, is our chat room. The web even email with PGP were amazing. Centralizing discovery and identity into corporations, really damaged the internet. I realize I'm partially to blame and regret it. It's kind of an GY.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:58:15):
It really is. It really is. Wow.

Leo Laporte (00:58:18):
Wow. Power

Stacey Higginbotham (00:58:18):
To him.

Leo Laporte (00:58:19):
It

Stacey Higginbotham (00:58:19):
Might, you have a message. Leo. I just noticed you have a message. That could be very important.

Leo Laporte (00:58:24):
Twitter.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:58:25):
I always read those messages. That's

Leo Laporte (00:58:26):
Is it my wife?

Stacey Higginbotham (00:58:27):
Very important.

Leo Laporte (00:58:29):
Am am my wife calling me? Oh my God. Wait a minute. Hold on a second. How do you see? What do you, what do you mean? A message. How do you see that? I don't understand

Stacey Higginbotham (00:58:41):
Mailbox. It says message. It had

Ant Pruitt (00:58:42):
One he's talking much a

Stacey Higginbotham (00:58:44):
Someone's sending you a direct message. That's very important. Leo. You could be, it could be you wouldn't in the lottery.

Leo Laporte (00:58:49):
Yeah. Know Lisa wanting to know what we're gonna have for dinner tonight. All right, right. No, she does not message me on Twitter by the way we don't. We're not that we're not animals. No,

Ant Pruitt (00:58:59):
She just comes and yells at you for about Feet way. Just right over there. Hey, she's

Leo Laporte (00:59:05):
Home. We're from home right now. So,

Stacey Higginbotham (00:59:07):
Well my, my joke interrupted. Do you think, do you think that the Jack's right that the, the centralized internet,

Leo Laporte (00:59:13):
I think there's a lot, you know, we talked about this on Sunday. I mean a good panel on Twitter for this. There's a lot of nostalgia about the good old days. I look, look back. I look back with the, at the early days of Twitter with great nostalgia, but then I realized it's kind of elitist it's cuz it was just me and my friends.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:59:31):
You were number one on Twitter.

Leo Laporte (00:59:32):
Again, it was a small group. It was just, you know, that's why it was fun. It was, it was just us.

Ant Pruitt (00:59:39):
No, we haven't add yet. Miss Stacy.

Speaker 5 (00:59:42):
I know I'm like what is happening?

Leo Laporte (00:59:49):
I'm sorry. This

Stacey Higginbotham (00:59:49):
Is an ad for truth. Social Stacy. We're talking about how

Speaker 5 (00:59:52):
Yer is terrible.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:59:54):
I'm like, okay, go, go. Did

Stacey Higginbotham (00:59:56):
You, did you get a waffle or not?

Stacey Higginbotham (00:59:58):
I did put it in the toaster of it. Nothing

Leo Laporte (01:00:00):
Important. Nothing important happened. Do you remember though, Jeff? I don't remember if it was 96. The, they was, they called the summer of AOL where we had the internet to ourselves and then America online and asked that they were gonna give everybody an AOL access to the internet and, and all of us were gonna all crap.

Ant Pruitt (01:00:20):
No, we don't want

Leo Laporte (01:00:22):
That. God real people are coming. Wow. So I'm gonna tell

Stacey Higginbotham (01:00:26):
Snobby we were all SNO.

Leo Laporte (01:00:28):
So there's a certain amount of snobbery when you say,

Stacey Higginbotham (01:00:31):
And again, I'll recommend this last week bamboozle with the revolution, which is, is kind of the story of that is big media coming in and invading the internet, ruining it. Yeah.

Leo Laporte (01:00:39):
Yeah. But let's face it. Social group is best when it's small and it's it's friends and people you like, and it's always gonna be better.

Ant Pruitt (01:00:48):
I remember they said that about Instagram coming to Android. Oh

Leo Laporte (01:00:52):
Wow. Right's

Stacey Higginbotham (01:00:54):
Right. People. That was a classic thing.

Leo Laporte (01:00:56):
That's careful right? That you're right. I forgot about that. Our show today, go get your waffle, our show, a brought to you by Stacy, not the rest of you. You stayed right there in your chair. Crap brought to you,

Stacey Higginbotham (01:01:11):
Brought

Leo Laporte (01:01:11):
To you by Melissa to ensure your business is a success. You need to have good records, right? Records of your customers, records of your suppliers. You need to be able contact people with the right phone number, the right email, the right address. Well, here's the bad news. Your, that data is Withing away. Even as we speak people, move addresses, change names, change, emails, change, phone numbers, change. That's why you need Melissa, a leading provider of global data quality and address management solutions. 37 years. They've been doing this. I think that's probably means that they go back to the zip plus four days, you remember you'd enter the zip code and then it would tell you, well, what's the plus four, something like that. Or even maybe just zip codes. But over the time, they've become much more than just zip codes. You can verify. Address is emails, phone, numbers, even names in real time with Melissa, it's a global address verification service that works in 240 plus countries and territories.

Leo Laporte (01:02:16):
I think it's kind of amazing more than 10,000 businesses call Melissa the address experts and a renewal rate of 92% says, yeah, people are pretty darn happy. Maybe it has something to do with the fact that the typical return on investment for Melissa customers is 25%. By the way, big year, last year, they had a record at Melissa. They CA off by reaching a milestone 30 billion with a B north American address lookups in the year. That's the most in its history. I bet you that bill beat that in 2022, Melissa can also eliminate duplicate customer information, your database. That can be almost as bad as having the wrong information, send two catalogs as the same address waste of money waste of time. And frankly it annoys the clients. Your customers Melissa's data matching helps eliminate clutter and duplicates and ensures the accuracy of your database.

Leo Laporte (01:03:10):
They can do batch address cleaning fact. You can even upload it to their FTP site and then download it. That's one way. One of many ways you can use Melissa, you can also do it on pre with your own, you know, client right there on your own computers. There's a web service there's software as a service. They even have an app on iOS and Android to do address name and other lookups. It's good. Good name for it is lookups look, ups app. So go ahead and get that on your device. A lot of people use Melissa for identity verification. It's got a security impact too. You'll reduce risk, ensure compliance, keep customers happy by making sure they're the right person. They're the actual customer. You can do. Geocoding convert, addresses the latitude and longitude, and you can remove up to 95% of bad email addresses from your database.

Leo Laporte (01:04:00):
And don't worry. Your data is absolutely private and secure. Melissa knows that's important to you. That's why they continually undergo independent security audits to reinforce their commitment to data security and privacy and compliance requirements. They are SOC two HIPAA, GDPR compliant and great support from really nice people. In fact, if you sign up for a service level agreement, you can get 24 7 support from their global support center. Melissa goes above and beyond. They're really great data quality magic quadrant. Second year in a row from Gartner G2 crowds, 2022 report ranks Melissa as a leader in both address verification and data quality. So software make sure your customer data is up to date. Try Melissa's APIs and the developer portal. It's easy to log on. Sign in, start playing in that API sandbox 24 7. In fact, you can get started today with 1000 records, clean free melissa.com/twi, Melissa, me L I S S a.com/twi. Thank you, Melissa, for supporting this in Google. Thank you for supporting us by using that address. Melissa.Com/Twi T w I T. Thank you, Melissa. Woohoo. Woo. What kind of waffle Eggo Lego. My oh she's muted. She didn't want us to hear the,

Stacey Higginbotham (01:05:25):
Instead of a waffle. I am doing a, what

Leo Laporte (01:05:30):
Are they called? Stroop

Stacey Higginbotham (01:05:30):
Waffle. You'll see. In a second,

Leo Laporte (01:05:32):
A NA cake. It's

Stacey Higginbotham (01:05:33):
A,

Leo Laporte (01:05:33):
It's a, a fun cake.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:05:36):
Protein cake.

Leo Laporte (01:05:37):
Love our new June oven by the way. Protein cake protein cake.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:05:41):
Yeah. They're like Kodiak. That's

Leo Laporte (01:05:43):
So awful. Pasti pierogi

Stacey Higginbotham (01:05:48):
You'll see it a second. They're gonna come. I I'm getting a delivery once it's finished.

Leo Laporte (01:05:53):
I used to get a pierogi every day before work. Mm. So somebody said you're starting to look like a Piero mine, their own business. I no, no. I immediately cut off all pierogies.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:06:10):
I mean, it is the best car loading option. There is.

Leo Laporte (01:06:15):
Well, when you put it that way, maybe

Stacey Higginbotham (01:06:18):
Not like potato,

Leo Laporte (01:06:19):
Potato pasta wrapped in pastries. Jose Andres, who is in Ukraine right now, I guess, to help 

Stacey Higginbotham (01:06:29):
In Poland,

Leo Laporte (01:06:30):
I think. Oh, he is in Poland. Okay. But he's helping out, well, maybe

Stacey Higginbotham (01:06:33):
He maybe Ukraine too. I'm

Leo Laporte (01:06:34):
In people. He's

Stacey Higginbotham (01:06:35):
He was in Ukraine, but I think he may have left by now.

Leo Laporte (01:06:38):
He was using apple maps. Apparently he said apple maps keep sending me into a Russian controlled territories. No, I think that that's asking a lot, given that the, the changing, you know, status as they come back, go back and forth to say apple maps, you should know that you're rounding me through Russian controlled territory. You

Stacey Higginbotham (01:07:00):
Might want some better intelligence in that.

Leo Laporte (01:07:01):
Yeah. apple did not immediately respond for con or a comment. He did say that he likes the translation technology built into WhatsApp.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:07:17):
Google's is even better. Isn't it?

Leo Laporte (01:07:19):
Oh, actually, no, you know what? That's it? He says he wants to see language translation built into WhatsApp. So he doesn't have to keep going back and forth with Google translate.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:07:28):
So I've been reading telegram, the, the Ukrainian government telegram account. Oh, which course not in English and I have to, and I wish it had translate built in. Cause I, I have to do paragraph at a

Leo Laporte (01:07:40):
Yeah. I actually really like telegram, but I dunno, I dunno. It's just messy. You don't know what, ah, eh, encryption, they don't, they don't have encryption except for group chats and you have to know how to turn it on and it's not very good. And then there's also this issue of it's a Russian, you know, por was Russian. Oh, I dunno. I don't know that. Yeah. I mean, he's living in Dubai now, but in fact, you could make the case he's Andy Russian because they forced him to sell his prior company.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:08:10):
I was gonna say, you might be. I mean, don't paint Russians

Leo Laporte (01:08:13):
Just cause he is from Russia. Doesn't mean he is pro Putin.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:08:16):
You kind of can't tell that's the thing about,

Leo Laporte (01:08:18):
I can't tell Fortnite good on them. They raised $144 million for Ukraine relief by pumping all their profits for two weeks

Stacey Higginbotham (01:08:30):
For

Leo Laporte (01:08:30):
Them into all the proceeds along with their, by the way from Microsoft to humanitarian efforts, following Russia's invasion of Ukraine, 36 million the first day alone,

Ant Pruitt (01:08:45):
That's amazing.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:08:47):
Howard works amazing.

Leo Laporte (01:08:48):
It is amazing league of legends developer riot games raised 5.4 million by selling, selling a I guess in league of legends, probably DLC and stuff, a bundle of nearly a thousand games on IO. That was pretty amazing. I saw that they ended up taking in more than 6 million for Ukraine relief in 24 hours, $10 minimum donation. But you got a thousand game Ames. That's pretty cool. Humble bundle 20 million. They've always sold stuff for charity, man.

Ant Pruitt (01:09:23):
Humble bundles. How long have they been doing that?

Leo Laporte (01:09:25):
They're cool. They're pretty cool. Aren't they? Wow. Yeah. They were a long time. Yeah. So every everybody's pitching in

Stacey Higginbotham (01:09:37):
The story above about, about the emails I found fascinating is that that a psychology professor tied together with a Norwegian computer expert to get 550,000 volunteers who have sent 60 million emails providing details of the war in Russia. Oh, wow. Was trying to get a, around the blockade and, and with help about how they should be written to convince people. This is real. Of course they could say those damned Americans are

Leo Laporte (01:10:02):
Spam. Yeah. It might look like spa spam. Yeah. Yeah.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:10:05):
But it's an interesting way to say, okay, if you're in a completely media blocked country, can you use the internet to get around it? Russians do it does,

Leo Laporte (01:10:17):
Is think this will be a case though, of people who already believe that will believe the email and people who don't won't

Stacey Higginbotham (01:10:23):
Probably, but that's life. Yeah.

Leo Laporte (01:10:25):
That's life. Yeah. 

Ant Pruitt (01:10:28):
But that's also why it was 60 million of them.

Leo Laporte (01:10:31):
If you if you speak Russian, I get, I guess you'd probably wanna speak Russian, but you can go to mail u.org. Now 75 million emails sent Jesus. Wow. Mail, the number two u.org. This service is built to send messages from your own email account. That's how they can, you know, keep from getting blocked to a batch of Russian email addresses with the help of thousands of volunteers around the world. We're urging Russians to learn about the war in Ukraine and get access to independent news. So You could also do it with me with messenger. And then they have, I guess, a list of Russian emails so that, but they also say, if you get bouncebacks let let them know, let us know so we can take them out of the list.

Ant Pruitt (01:11:26):
Good on them.

Leo Laporte (01:11:27):
Yeah. Somebody asks, are we putting people in danger by sending them these emails? Nah, we're just sending unsolicited emails. It may take some risk responding if their outgoing mail is read by the Russian government, but they can't be blamed for our email, simply appearing in front of our eyes, right. Their eyes. That's a good point. You know, I don't know if, if, how the

Stacey Higginbotham (01:11:53):
Be blamed for opening them.

Ant Pruitt (01:11:54):
I wondered. Yeah. I wondered just how many people actually seen 'em because it's it. I think you and I are only people to even use email nowadays. Right.

Leo Laporte (01:12:07):
I barely,

Ant Pruitt (01:12:08):
Oh, wait a minute. Just me, just

Leo Laporte (01:12:09):
You. I think it's just you a big boy. This is a little, little triggering, so close your eyes. But I thought it was a really interesting use of technology. You may remember that Russia was in a Ukraine town called BCHA for quite a while. And then they got beaten out of it. And then of course, Ukrainian soldiers found a lot of, of Ukrainian citizens. Some of them bound at the risks, some of them apparently tortured and showed that to the world. The Russian said, ah, no, no, no, they weren't dead. When we left. They, they, this is all propaganda from the Ukrainian government. So New York times examined satellite images and was able to fall on many of these bodies weeks before the Russians left.

Ant Pruitt (01:12:58):
Thank you technology.

Leo Laporte (01:12:59):
So I, I won't go any farther than that, but an analysis of satellite images by the times, rebuts claims by Russia, that the killing of civilians in BCHA suburb of Keve occurred after its soldiers left town. Not so we've got the pictures, Not a hoax, not a hoax. And let's see, let's move on because I know you can't wait to see the unofficial Bridgeton, TikTok musical, that one Grammy,

Stacey Higginbotham (01:13:34):
Grammy. This is amazing. I know this is crazy to me.

Leo Laporte (01:13:38):
A Grammy. What? Beating out Andrew Lloyd Weber.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:13:46):
I mean, feels really good. That's fine.

Ant Pruitt (01:13:48):
Miserable.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:13:49):
Yeah, exactly. Exactly. Stacy,

Leo Laporte (01:13:51):
The girl from the north country,

Ant Pruitt (01:13:53):
Is it really good or is it just, well,

Leo Laporte (01:13:56):
Let's hear it at won a Grammy.

Ant Pruitt (01:13:57):
Just hip. What? We

Stacey Higginbotham (01:13:59):
Probably, I put it here. I knew you'd ask that ant. So I put in some music so you can hear it.

Leo Laporte (01:14:07):
Here's a, just a little, just a little, this is a version. This is, I burn for you. You ready? Music video from Bridgeton, by the way, Stacy, you watch this show. Maybe you explain what's going on.

Speaker 6 (01:14:20):
This is what you call the honeymoon. Pacing Randall step running from our elaborated rooms where

Leo Laporte (01:14:29):
Wait a minute. This is two good for TikTok. This is super professional, right?

Stacey Higginbotham (01:14:34):
It is. It is.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:14:35):
There are high quality people on TikTok. These

Leo Laporte (01:14:38):
Are like, this is a pro studio she's in.

Ant Pruitt (01:14:41):
Please

Speaker 6 (01:14:42):
Forgive me. Your grace.

Leo Laporte (01:14:43):
Maybe not it's it's her house.

Ant Pruitt (01:14:47):
Norman in there. Listen

Leo Laporte (01:14:48):
To her voice.

Speaker 6 (01:14:52):
You kissed me

Ant Pruitt (01:14:54):
Listen to the score.

Leo Laporte (01:14:56):
It looks like it's all synthesizer, but it sounds like an

Ant Pruitt (01:15:00):
Orchestra. Like a,

Speaker 6 (01:15:03):
I don't understand. No, you forced

Ant Pruitt (01:15:07):
Who wrote this? This is like Broadway. Are they gonna get kicked off of TikTok?

Speaker 6 (01:15:12):
The same,

Ant Pruitt (01:15:13):
Not being within the spirit of TikTok?

Leo Laporte (01:15:15):
No, this is great. Wow. That's impressive. This

Stacey Higginbotham (01:15:17):
Is great for

Leo Laporte (01:15:17):
Them. And they win a Grammy.

Ant Pruitt (01:15:20):
No, that sounded

Stacey Higginbotham (01:15:20):
Grammy. It's just unbelievable. It's wonderful.

Ant Pruitt (01:15:22):
That sounded good. I just don't like,

Stacey Higginbotham (01:15:26):
Oh, whoa. It has the, an seal. Oh,

Ant Pruitt (01:15:28):
Approval. I just don't like musicals that's but I, but I always respect talent,

Leo Laporte (01:15:33):
You know, Barlow and bear. You can listen to it on a variety of services. It's all on YouTube as well. Wow.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:15:44):
Yeah. They just use TikTok as a place to get their stuff out. Yeah. I mean,

Ant Pruitt (01:15:48):
No,

Stacey Higginbotham (01:15:48):
I get what's interesting to me is they're building on content. I mean, to me, this is like what fan fiction or exactly the point of remix culture is right. So, okay. In Bridgeton is sh Grimes. I have no idea how she feels about copyright and everything else. She

Leo Laporte (01:16:04):
Should be thrilled. I mean, and in no way really is this it doesn't use

Stacey Higginbotham (01:16:09):
No, no. It's

Leo Laporte (01:16:10):
Anything of words. I, so she should be, it

Stacey Higginbotham (01:16:12):
Adds completely to

Leo Laporte (01:16:12):
This. Yeah. But remember Lucas always hated fan fiction. Here's the official the unofficial official hello

Speaker 6 (01:16:20):
Together

Leo Laporte (01:16:21):
Music video. So they, they spend some time, they get some places to shoot. They got, this is steady cam. This is some pretty serious stuff here.

Ant Pruitt (01:16:32):
And

Speaker 6 (01:16:32):
She's just out of,

Leo Laporte (01:16:35):
But you

Stacey Higginbotham (01:16:36):
Can do it going around the gatekeepers.

Leo Laporte (01:16:38):
Right. So you, you introduced us to the Bridgeton, the TikTok musical some time ago.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:16:43):
I think

Leo Laporte (01:16:44):
So. Yeah, but I didn't realize how good this was. Yeah.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:16:48):
Although I, there was also, there was rati

Ant Pruitt (01:16:51):
Rat, TikTok,

Leo Laporte (01:16:52):
Rati. They did not win

Ant Pruitt (01:16:54):
Grammy. They did

Stacey Higginbotham (01:16:55):
Not, but they were on Broadway. But now, now TikTok is funding the guy behind the, the creative force behind the rat TUI musical. They're funding him to make another new musical now.

Ant Pruitt (01:17:08):
Oh, good artists getting paid. I have no problem with that.

Leo Laporte (01:17:13):
So run down,

Stacey Higginbotham (01:17:15):
You can see the the, the, he talks through the plot and some songs and other things. Now we can still try

Leo Laporte (01:17:21):
Emily bear and Abigail Barlow. Emily bear said, Abigail and I, this is a think in her. Thank you. Speech have seen the power of TikTok for years and decided to invite fans, to watch our writing sessions in real time and give their suggestions on the creation of the unofficial Bridgeton musical Barlow ads. The immense success of this project was definitely in the fans, hands, 15 songs put together for the album and they win a Grammy award. Yeah.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:17:53):
The greatest it's

Leo Laporte (01:17:54):
Fantastic.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:17:58):
This could be the future of creativity. This is it's possible.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:18:01):
I'm really curious how Shara rhymes feels about it.

Leo Laporte (01:18:03):
Well, the only, you know, I mean they used the Bridget, the word Bridgeton is the only, and I guess some of the idea and characters,

Stacey Higginbotham (01:18:10):
The name of the woman who wrote the books, the Bridgeton books is a,

Leo Laporte (01:18:15):
Maybe they're based on a series of books.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:18:17):
Yeah.

Leo Laporte (01:18:19):
Well, is Bridgeton a modern series? No, I mean the TV show is the books.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:18:24):
The books are, I think it's Julia Quinn.

Leo Laporte (01:18:27):
Julia Quinn. Yeah. You're right. Yeah. Julia Quinn's novel. But when did the Julia Quinn novels come out?

Stacey Higginbotham (01:18:34):
Oh, like in the news

Leo Laporte (01:18:35):
Recently? Yeah. She's she was born in 1970, so, huh.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:18:41):
Yeah. So these are not the duke. And I came out, which is what the first one was based on. It looks like that came out in 2000.

Ant Pruitt (01:18:48):
Hmm. No, nothing about it. So I didn't know, find any

Stacey Higginbotham (01:18:52):
Rhymes.

Leo Laporte (01:18:54):
I, I, I mean, I remember George Lucas for a while was really upset by actually I don't think it was George. I think George probably liked the fan fiction, but the owners of star wars didn't Lucas was kind of notorious for suing and putting out a business, people who did fan fix stuff. Hmm. But I think any Mo Shonda RHS is modern enough to understand this in no way hurts bridge. It makes you wanna watch

Ant Pruitt (01:19:18):
The show, lifting her up. Yeah. Lifting

Stacey Higginbotham (01:19:20):
Up the well, and partly, I feel like Shondra rhymes would be all for it. I mean, I feel like she'd be like, yeah, bring those guys in.

Leo Laporte (01:19:26):
If I were her, I'd say let's put this on Broadway.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:19:28):
So one of my students is working on fanfic for the redesign of the internet course. And I didn't realize this, that Garfield loves fanfic and he did Garfield without Garfield.

Leo Laporte (01:19:40):
Oh fun. So

Stacey Higginbotham (01:19:41):
People could add it in and do all kinds of other things that they they're they're namely it engaging with it. It's just really cool.

Leo Laporte (01:19:47):
Wow. Wow.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:19:51):
But there's also a porn. Gar Garfield.

Leo Laporte (01:19:54):
Tiktok is funny.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:19:55):
The Garfield where a car backs up and kills the

Leo Laporte (01:19:58):
Calf. Oh no,

Stacey Higginbotham (01:19:59):
But we don't wanna talk about that. Okay.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:20:01):
Tiktok. And it was driven by Stacy. Thanks.

Leo Laporte (01:20:05):
Tiktok is funny. Its first musical from the creative lead behind TUI, the TikTok musical, they are now gonna put it on Broadway. Another Broadway. What? This amazing TikTok is amazing. I mean, I just think of how well Henry has done. Yeah. It's

Stacey Higginbotham (01:20:20):
Creativity.

Leo Laporte (01:20:21):
It's incredible.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:20:22):
And it's not just what this is. We have

Stacey Higginbotham (01:20:24):
These conversations about YouTube way back in

Leo Laporte (01:20:28):
The day. Yeah. I guess that's true. I

Stacey Higginbotham (01:20:29):
Mean

Leo Laporte (01:20:29):
Youtube,

Stacey Higginbotham (01:20:30):
But this has a bit of structure to it. Doesn't it? This you've gotta, you've gotta work within a creative limitation. A and B there's an expectation of collaboration in it and C there's the social piece to it. So it just, it adds a few layers, which is interesting.

Leo Laporte (01:20:44):
Yeah. You're

Stacey Higginbotham (01:20:46):
Not wrong. Creative. So my, my brother has a cat. His name is what's the cat's name G Willers no Willers. And he is, he's taught it to fetch. And I love that cat. My parents had a cat that they rescued.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:21:01):
Yeah. Some of your best friends are cats. Yeah, yeah,

Leo Laporte (01:21:03):
Yeah.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:21:03):
Exactly. My best friends are cats. You love a good kitten for a cat.

Leo Laporte (01:21:10):
Patrick says we should call this Schrodinger's episode cuz it's we never know if the cat's dead or not.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:21:18):
I was trying to think of a horrible, but not, you know, as horrible crime

Leo Laporte (01:21:24):
It dead. Was this beautiful. You look. No, I don't wanna look, look 

Stacey Higginbotham (01:21:32):
Oh wait. Here's my here's my snack. The latest snack things that have been working

Leo Laporte (01:21:36):
For me. It's a cup of muffin.

Ant Pruitt (01:21:38):
Oh, Kodiak cakes. Okay.

Leo Laporte (01:21:40):
Yeah. It's a power cup ABL. So it looks like it's a cup of noodles, but really it's a cup of muffin.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:21:48):
If we see piece of

Ant Pruitt (01:21:48):
They have pancake bag. Oh

Stacey Higginbotham (01:21:50):
Yeah. Sorry.

Leo Laporte (01:21:51):
And you micro it, make it in. You micro it. And it turns, it turns into a muffin. If,

Stacey Higginbotham (01:21:56):
Yeah. If you've ever had like a mug cake, it's that consistency. But I like 'em cuz I have a lot of you

Stacey Higginbotham (01:22:00):
Make fun of my KA pepper.

Leo Laporte (01:22:01):
I would just buy a mug, just get a mug. And you could put, make a mug,

Stacey Higginbotham (01:22:05):
Buy a mug

Stacey Higginbotham (01:22:06):
Point. But a mug cake requires much more time. This is, and this has 12 grams of protein.

Leo Laporte (01:22:12):
I make my mug, keep people full the whole with the almond flour. And it has a lot of protein. It's quite good.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:22:17):
Yeah.

Leo Laporte (01:22:18):
Okay. Mug cakes are pretty easy. That's the whole point of a mug cake.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:22:21):
Well I know, but like it's, it's not as easy as a full ad basically.

Leo Laporte (01:22:27):
Oh I begged to differ. I think I can a mug cake in, in the fall look challenge. Here's a fun FEI mug cake.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:22:35):
Oh yeah. My daughter made those last like a few nights ago rather.

Leo Laporte (01:22:39):
Wow.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:22:40):
They're they're fine.

Ant Pruitt (01:22:41):
Yes. I need to get better MOS cuz right now my cups are the only thing that really get hot. The microwave.

Leo Laporte (01:22:48):
All right. And now a picture of John's cats. Aw, Aw.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:22:54):
You know fluffies

Ant Pruitt (01:22:55):
They run the house.

Leo Laporte (01:22:56):
Are they run? Are they watching the show? It looks like they're

Stacey Higginbotham (01:23:00):
Not anymore.

Leo Laporte (01:23:03):
This is cat killers in there. Washington post opinion piece D Dana Millbank tried. Trump's true. Truth. Social. So you don't have to. He says, I don't know honestly how he got in it's it's still waiting, listed.

Ant Pruitt (01:23:23):
Mm.

Leo Laporte (01:23:23):
So here are, are a few of the things you missed because,

Ant Pruitt (01:23:26):
Because, because they're depressed the members of the press, they may have gotten an in,

Leo Laporte (01:23:31):
Oh maybe. Yeah. I endure weeks on the waiting list for the Donald Trump created Devon newness run attempt at a Twitter killer and I suffered through a series of technical glitches rights mill bank. But eventually I gained access as a result, I've come to be in possession of the following new pieces of information about the war in Ukraine. Hunter Biden is involved in building and running Biolabs in the country. The CIA and the national Institute of health are both deeply involved in the Ukrainian Biolabs. The Russian invasion of Ukraine was set in motion by a CIA false flag op funded by George Soros. The COVID 19 pathogen originated not in China, but in Nia, a village in Ukraine, the bio weapons developed in Ukraine specifically target the Abrahamic bloodline on, on and on and on

Stacey Higginbotham (01:24:27):
What is the Abrahamic? Bloodline Jewish people. Is it Jewish people, Jewish

Leo Laporte (01:24:32):
People.

Ant Pruitt (01:24:35):
Unbelievable.

Leo Laporte (01:24:36):
And you might say, it's not a text story. It kind of is. But I have to say it just shows you, I mean, remember before this was launched, everybody said, boy, if Donald Trump ever launches a Twitter, it's gonna be worth hundreds of millions of dollars. They need

Stacey Higginbotham (01:24:51):
Libs to yell at as the general theory. And they don't have any libs to yell at. So it's no fun.

Leo Laporte (01:24:55):
Nothing, nothing to yell about.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:24:57):
Plus people are leaving plus. Yeah.

Leo Laporte (01:24:59):
Oh you, I see. So it's more fun in Twitter cuz you've got people to yell at. Yes.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:25:04):
Yes they get, they get frustrated with you. They interact with you.

Leo Laporte (01:25:07):
Right.

Ant Pruitt (01:25:07):
And echo chamber, no fun.

Leo Laporte (01:25:09):
It's no fun. They've lost. And you have the only technical people as far as I can tell who worked. There are both gone. Josh Adams and Billy Boozer.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:25:20):
I'm sorry, but that

Stacey Higginbotham (01:25:21):
Is, that is a name you have to escape

Leo Laporte (01:25:22):
Product. The company's chief of technology and product development.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:25:26):
At least stay William Boozer is

Leo Laporte (01:25:28):
Billy Boozer. Yeah. He's really leaning into it. Isn't he? Yeah, he is. Yeah. owns it. Yeah. Both have resigned. Their senior posts at a critical juncture for the company's smartphone app release plan. They, they only have an iOS app. They're trying to get an Android app. Of course. That's a huge part. 40% of the us market. Boozer declined to comment and Adams did not respond to a request so we don't know what's going on, but it's not been good. And of course it was going to be a spec and they had, I think, close to a billion dollars. I pledged investments in the spec. That's almost all disappeared. Now. People going, Ooh, maybe not, maybe not.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:26:15):
Huh?

Leo Laporte (01:26:16):
Are you ready for drone delivery in Texas? You better be alphabet.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:26:21):
I'm not there anymore. But yes, Dallas,

Leo Laporte (01:26:23):
Dallas Alphabet's wing is bringing drone delivery to Dallas wings. It's near, it's near Dallas, Frisco and little Elm. They're in the Dallas Fort worth multiplex metroplex Metro

Stacey Higginbotham (01:26:37):
Area.

Leo Laporte (01:26:37):
Yeah. Walgreens is the primary partner. Drones will be picking up health and wellness products, pet meds from easy vet. First aid kit from Texas health and ice cream. It's raining ice cream from blue bell creamers, little hot

Stacey Higginbotham (01:26:57):
For that there

Ant Pruitt (01:26:59):
I dig it.

Leo Laporte (01:27:00):
I wanna set clear expectations, says the CEO, not everyone who lives within the range of our drones will be able to order on day one. We're going to invite customers in groups to make sure everyone has a good first experience with drone delivery. By the way, you could already do this in Virginia Helsinki, Canberra and Logan Australia. Ooh. 200000Th delivery was last week. Do they drop it?

Stacey Higginbotham (01:27:28):
I thought they

Leo Laporte (01:27:29):
Do. They land

Stacey Higginbotham (01:27:30):
Well, the Amazon ones drop it. I don't know if the Google ones drop it. I mean, Texas makes sense. They're

Leo Laporte (01:27:39):
Really

Stacey Higginbotham (01:27:39):
Well laid out planned communities with open space. You know, you're not dealing with alleys and inner city kind of issues, but

Leo Laporte (01:27:47):
Or anybody of the Abrahamic persuasion. No, I'm just kidding.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:27:52):
I'm pretty sure they're Jewish people

Leo Laporte (01:27:53):
In Dallas. I really wanna see a video of this alphabet wing delivery. Let me see if I can. Yeah.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:28:00):
I am curious how, how

Ant Pruitt (01:28:02):
They do it. Dropping it is is doable either

Leo Laporte (01:28:04):
Way. Thank you YouTube. Here we go. Tech from tech first.

Speaker 7 (01:28:10):
We're not gonna replace the majority of ground delivery that

Leo Laporte (01:28:13):
Oh, this's the interview. I won't but I, I just wanna see a picture. Here we go. Here it is. But I see a muffin here comes a muffin.

Speaker 7 (01:28:21):
I think they wish that we were in more

Leo Laporte (01:28:24):
Quite as you know, it's all be. It's all stock footage. B roll. I marketing name, name, name. Oh, wait a minute. Here it is. Here's a fake delivery. Some toast. I'm gonna turn off the sound. So I can narrate this unhindered by facts. Here's facts. Here's a guy. He's got some toast. Okay. He's run out of Marmite or sorry, mite.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:28:51):
Oh

Leo Laporte (01:28:51):
God. He is in Australia. Threes three,

Stacey Higginbotham (01:28:52):
Even

Leo Laporte (01:28:53):
From himself mite three minutes out. So he drops the toast. Here's the nice clerk. He

Stacey Higginbotham (01:28:59):
Had the mite in front of

Leo Laporte (01:29:00):
Him. I know it was empty. It was empty. And you know, if you, oh, look at that. It drops it on a string. Wait a minute. What? Oh no, that's the drone coming to pick it up. It picks it up. The clerk puts a bag on the string. The drone goes around and then a small child runs out. That's exactly what you wanna do. And then gets the, a vem dropped in his head. Here comes. No, it comes down in his strings. So you gotta be ready for it. Cuz the drones not just gonna wait for you or maybe it is. Oh it released it.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:29:31):
Oh yeah. It unhooks it. Okay.

Leo Laporte (01:29:32):
Nice. And the small child runs out and dad has his Vegemite. This poison

Stacey Higginbotham (01:29:36):
For the child. Oh no.

Leo Laporte (01:29:37):
Don't eat. Eat that Vegemite. It's beer byproduct. Oh. Oh, okay. Oh, So you can see it's obviously was launched first in Australia coming to Dallas. It won't be mite. What will they be delivering in Dallas? Caso.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:29:56):
Barbecue.

Leo Laporte (01:29:56):
Barbecue.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:29:59):
I mean, so not Caso.

Leo Laporte (01:30:00):
Yeah. RO yeah. Yeah.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:30:05):
Breakfast tacos. That's what I want.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:30:08):
They don't have this in Dallas.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:30:10):
Well they know that's just an Austin thing.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:30:12):
It's not just an Austin thing, but it is. I don't,

Leo Laporte (01:30:16):
I mean, we are gonna be in Dallas for a podcast expo. This summer is Dallas in. Oh,

Stacey Higginbotham (01:30:22):
I I'm gonna be in Dallas in me.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:30:24):
Oh ho ho. Hold

Leo Laporte (01:30:28):
Is it's not too hot. Is it? It's hot, hot, hot. So I figure that the podcast movement is gonna be in Dallas August 23rd because hotels are cheap.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:30:39):
I was about to say it's cheap.

Leo Laporte (01:30:40):
Yeah.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:30:41):
But you know what? You don't actually have to. The nice thing about summer in Texas is you never actually have to go outside.

Leo Laporte (01:30:48):
You don't go outside. Right. In fact, we're gonna stay at the hotel. So we don't have to walk in.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:30:54):
You can say hi to Andrew.

Leo Laporte (01:30:55):
Is Andrew going?

Stacey Higginbotham (01:30:57):
I'm sure he is. Oh,

Leo Laporte (01:30:58):
How exciting? He goes to podcast expo over year or I'm sorry. He's podcast. You call a podcast. It's podcast movement, right? Yeah. He has a podcast business.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:31:07):
Yeah. He's got a whole site called podcast guests where you sign up to be an expert and you can find guests for your shows.

Leo Laporte (01:31:14):
Oh, that's cool. I didn't,

Stacey Higginbotham (01:31:16):
Yeah. He's all entrepreneurial stuff. Y'all

Leo Laporte (01:31:20):
I think I've heard of podcast guests. How many

Stacey Higginbotham (01:31:21):
Different things does he run?

Stacey Higginbotham (01:31:24):
Well, he runs the business side of my business. He runs his domain publication. Right. He runs podcast guests. And then at any given time, he's probably experimenting with something else, but I don't, I don't pay attention to them until they become like your

Leo Laporte (01:31:38):
Rep reput until there's money to be had

Stacey Higginbotham (01:31:40):
That tri

Stacey Higginbotham (01:31:42):
Well, no, I mean, cuz he, you know, he, he, he comes up with stuff and I mean, when for as long as I've known him, he's had a side hustle. So like when we met, he was selling old beer signs. He'd go to like flea markets in Texas and sell these 10 bear

Leo Laporte (01:31:57):
Signs. I want to hang with Mr. Andrew. Yeah. Yeah. Was this his first business when he was in college, he sold beer, old beer, rusty out beer signs.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:32:06):
No, when he was a kid, he used to bring candy to school and sell it. You know, he'd buy it at the candy store and then sell it to his classmates for yeah. He's

Leo Laporte (01:32:15):
He's oh, he's entrepreneur. That's neat. Oh,

Ant Pruitt (01:32:19):
I want to hang with him.

Leo Laporte (01:32:20):
If you called an Uber in San Francisco or New York and a yellow cab showed up, would you be disappointed? Yes. That's the future. That's the future? Uber

Stacey Higginbotham (01:32:31):
It's like the worst of both worlds. Yeah.

Leo Laporte (01:32:34):
Yeah. This is, I mean, this is really interesting. This is exactly what Uber was created to avoid. They signed a deal in New York city to put all New York city cabs on the app. Now they've signed a deal with yellow cabs, San Francisco and flywheel technologies, bay area passengers who this is the blind that kind of confused me who someon an Uber ride might see one of the city's taxis show up to ferry them in the coming months. So I assumed I saw the New York city on the app that, that you would have a choice, black car, you know, cab. But it sounds to me like Uber is just gonna send whatever's nearby and it might be a cab.

Ant Pruitt (01:33:17):
I don't know about that. I, I actually like my Uber experience, even though most of the time I just use Lyft, but I like that experience of the actual person Uber's just casually doing it. Yeah. You know?

Leo Laporte (01:33:31):
So this is probably in response to the pandemic.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:33:35):
I, they can't get enough drivers.

Leo Laporte (01:33:36):
You can't get drivers. I've seen. Yeah. and it also plus,

Stacey Higginbotham (01:33:41):
Well, plus the cabbies are en range. They own these stallions that they can't get any value out. So it's a way to classify that fight.

Leo Laporte (01:33:49):
However, the difference is it will not be a metered rate cabs. Usually, you know, you drop the flag and you get meter. Uber is gonna be a flat, upfront fare. So that's interesting. Little more than a dozen cab drivers spoke out against partnering with Uber during the San Francisco municipal transportation agency, board meeting while four drivers and four cab company owners spoke in support of the idea saying it would generate much needed new business.

Ant Pruitt (01:34:20):
So if this had didn't have happened, what would've happened with with the Uber, because you said there's a driver's shortage going on and it's probably a driver's shortage because of the Daum fuel cost nobody's earning

Leo Laporte (01:34:32):
That could be, or yeah. People don't wanna drive for Uber. I wouldn't blame. So Yeah. I don't know how this solves it, except that a cab, I guess, is already doing actually rides through Uber will cost the same as an Uber X ride.

Ant Pruitt (01:34:46):
The more expensive one. Sorry.

Leo Laporte (01:34:47):
No X is the cheap one, which is calculated

Ant Pruitt (01:34:51):
Expense is the expensive.

Leo Laporte (01:34:52):
Yeah. Right. Base fair plus trip time and distance taxi drivers will know in advance, which RTS come from Uber and what they will be paid and they can accept or reject it, reject it without consequences. I could. I mean, it's good for cabbies. It's good for them. I don't know if it's good for Uber though, in the long run. Well see, it might be, maybe Uber had to do it right. They couldn't get drivers. I don't know. It's a good question. What would've happened? This deal? I don't know. I don't know. Speaking of San Francisco, you may remember a company called fast, raised 120 million to do one click shopping. They're gone.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:35:34):
So the most interesting thing about this story to me was Dan Peck over at Axio Snell. He wrote in his newsletter that he says, he's like, this story in and of itself is, you know, surprise. It is too soon yet to have the, the death watch for these companies. But he feels like that time is coming. Because this story is one about, you know, basically blowing through your money to get in market share, and then not being able to raise more money. Yeah.

Leo Laporte (01:36:01):
I'm

Speaker 8 (01:36:01):
So familiar.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:36:03):
Yeah. We've lived through this twice. Now you remember the

Speaker 8 (01:36:05):
Wonderful site F

Leo Laporte (01:36:06):
Company. Yep.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:36:07):
Oh yeah. All

Leo Laporte (01:36:08):
That put that that's put started,

Stacey Higginbotham (01:36:11):
But he did something else after that.

Leo Laporte (01:36:12):
Oh, he did a lot of stuff. I remember he was a lot of stuff. Yeah. Puts an interesting character. Philip Kaplan. So fast, I guess, despite raising 120 million only made 600,000. Oh fuck.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:36:25):
Oh

Leo Laporte (01:36:25):
Yeah. So yeah. That's interesting. I guess this is the logical conclusion of having so much free money floating around that. You know, at some point you're gonna have to do something with,

Stacey Higginbotham (01:36:38):
It's kind of like a game of musical chairs. Like if you, if you're not doing great, you can sell to a company. Great. But at some point in time, you do actually have to create value. Right? I know it's so old school of me to think that, but it's still true.

Leo Laporte (01:36:53):
Old school, old school, like putting in a cup. We're gonna take a break while take while, while Stacy pops another muffin in the micro to talk about our sponsor. We'll have more with this week in Google in just a bit. This episode brought to you by H P Hewlett Packard enterprise HPE GreenLake orchestrated by the experts at C D w of you yesterday's infrastructure is not gonna help you meet the demands of tomorrow's innovation. And now more than ever, you have to quickly adapt to change the consumption, or this is fits right into what we were just talking about. The consumption oriented model of public cloud has actually revolutionized how organizations think about infrastructure and organizations are now demanding the speed and agility of a public cloud experience, but many workloads still remain on prem. Maybe they're complicated legacy applications, there's issues of course, with data sovereignty or compliance and just, you know, how serious it is, how tricky it is to migrate sensitive data to the cloud and you and the it department are caught right in the middle, trying to satisfy the demand and growth for your company that while struggling to manage disparate data and expected to do it all at budget.

Leo Laporte (01:38:11):
Well, that's why you need to know about HPE GreenLake, C D w. They can provide a seamless and scalable cloud experience across your entire organization that you can easily manage from anywhere, no matter where your data and applications live on prem public cloud, private cloud trust, HPE, and CDW to automate your processes so that you can focus on the next big thing. C D w can help you get the most out of your unique and complex data needs by assessing your organization's needs and designing and implementing a tailored HPE GreenLake solution to modernize your business and meet your digital transformation goals. And once implemented CDW also provides ongoing management, freeing up your staff to focus on innovation, get a seamless cloud experience across all your organizations, absent data, thanks to the, as a service model that meets you at the edge scalability that provides instant increase in capacity, giving you the flexibility to match your growth and meet demands, and get a streamlined management system for all your data and applications all within a single platform, providing simplified operations and accessibility from anywhere, giving you back time to focus on innovation.

Leo Laporte (01:39:25):
CDW not only helps us assess an organization's needs and then build a unique HPE GreenLake solution. They also remain an active partner and provide support throughout the management process. CDW experts also bring decades of experience designing, orchestrating, and managing strategic cloud solutions that help you unleash the full potential of your investments, giving you back time to innovate and dream bigger for a seamless cloud experience. Trust HPE, and it orchestration by CDW people who get it learn more at cdw.com/hpe that's cdw.com/h P E. Let me thank you so much for supporting this in Google and you support us by going to that site. Cdw.Com/H P E was that enough time to make a muffin survey says,

Stacey Higginbotham (01:40:23):
Survey says I did not need a muffin. There was enough time to finish writing my podcast post.

Leo Laporte (01:40:27):
Wow. Wow. You're that good? Huh? She's fast. She's

Stacey Higginbotham (01:40:31):
Well, no, I just, I just had to write one more paragraph and got

Leo Laporte (01:40:34):
Multitasking. Thanks to scooter X in our chat, actually in our, she at this tweet from Christina Warren. All right. I'm gonna need you all to help me get a fast hoodie. Cause guess she collects the that would be, that'll be a, a collector's item, right? Hoodies have failed startups.

Ant Pruitt (01:40:53):
That and shoes is our thing.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:40:54):
I used to have a bunch of those.

Leo Laporte (01:40:56):
Yeah. Who doesn't and you

Stacey Higginbotham (01:40:59):
Did a they're all real old now.

Leo Laporte (01:41:00):
Yeah. You did a review of the olive pro earbuds last year. Did you like 'em?

Ant Pruitt (01:41:08):
Yeah, they're really, really neat set of earbuds because yeah. You can into your music and phone calls or whatever, but if you're someone that have issues with like hearing impaired issues, you can hear things better in loud environment. Like I tested 'em out. I went to the casino and just popped them in and I can hear things. I can actually hear conversation next to me versus all of the rumble and house going on around it. They're really, really, really nice, nice city

Leo Laporte (01:41:36):
Here. We're gonna have to get a pair of these. These are the success or the olive max two and one hearing aids. They're actually calling them hearing aids. They double as earbuds. They look pretty

Ant Pruitt (01:41:48):
Cool. 'em Hearing aids.

Leo Laporte (01:41:49):
I think. Well, you know, the well,

Ant Pruitt (01:41:51):
Because they didn't call the yeah.

Leo Laporte (01:41:52):
The FDA doesn't want you to call 'em there's no, they're still not over the counter hearing aids yet. Okay. even though they were supposed to be going back four years now, five years, hearing helpers, hearing helpers,

Ant Pruitt (01:42:04):
Assistant hearing

Stacey Higginbotham (01:42:05):
Hearables is what they

Leo Laporte (01:42:06):
Call them hearables. Yeah. so the olive max at they call, they say it's an F D a class two hearing aid. But now while my hearing aid cost $6,000, and that's pretty typical for hearing aids, you go to an audiologist, you get 'em fitted and all that stuff. Right. And tuned. These started $299. They'll start shipping in the fourth quarter. I bet you they're, they're figuring the FDA, which is the roll out of over the counter hearing aids for some time will finally say all right. All right. Just

Ant Pruitt (01:42:39):
Do it. I

Stacey Higginbotham (01:42:40):
Think they did set it. I, I think did

Leo Laporte (01:42:42):
They set a date?

Stacey Higginbotham (01:42:43):
So hold on, let me, let me give you the accurate information. Yeah, so Biden did an executive order last summer that said we need to get on. And because their regulations were already there this, okay. So yeah, they implemented a rule in October that basically says there was a law, the over the counter hearing aid act that was in 2017, the order finds order from the summer did a timeline for, and now the FDA has issued a proposed rule. So now it should be doable. 

Leo Laporte (01:43:22):
That would explain it

Stacey Higginbotham (01:43:23):
That proposed. Yeah.

Leo Laporte (01:43:24):
So this is the first expect a flood. And I wouldn't even sorry, apple at some point starts to say, Hey, you know, AirPods pro can be used this way. Right? Yeah. As well. I

Ant Pruitt (01:43:34):
Think it be that stuff or health kit

Stacey Higginbotham (01:43:37):
Once Get the hearables, like turn into hearing aids. You can also put a lot of really cool sensors in there, like galvanic skin response or stress. You can put body temperature, you can track heart rate. You can actually track a lot of stuff in your ears. In a way that might be interesting, especially for people who can't afford an apple watch sleep, or you're not gonna sleep with your hearing aid in. So you've gotta think of things where it's intermittent and you would want,

Leo Laporte (01:44:05):
And these only give you about eight hours of, so you're gonna take 'em out after eight hours, put 'em in the case, we they'll charge some more just like AirPods do anyway, olive max sounds like it's kinda like the pros that you reviewed. Maybe it looks cool. They, they have the auto, a voice auto focus feature, which will focus in on the voice automatically. And a new sound engine. They say that lets you to detect voices better and is better at reducing and filtering background noise. How did the pros do when you had that? It,

Ant Pruitt (01:44:36):
It was ridiculous. It that the app has, you know, pretty much the EQ on it, and you can tailor it to fit even better than what their AI is already doing. Nice. You know, we, we would have the hard heads running around and the dogs running around and I could still listen to the television. Clearly, even though there's all of this mess going on in the kitchen and things like that, it was, it was really impressive.

Leo Laporte (01:44:58):
Nice.

Ant Pruitt (01:44:59):
And they didn't look like hearing aids. It just looked like, you know earbuds that you'd listen to music in

Leo Laporte (01:45:05):
Google, like many companies struggling with the return to office. They are now bribing employee he's with free electric scooters from a, not a scooter, but a scooter subscription

Ant Pruitt (01:45:18):
Subscription.

Leo Laporte (01:45:19):
Oh, you don't get the scooter. Just the subscription. You quit, you lose scooter. Oh, it's called rides. Scoot in which most of Google's us based workers can get reimbursed for the full cost of a monthly subs to a NA's stylish model. One scooter. If you were to buy it, it would cost $990. It's a dual motor scooter. It's top speed of 20 miles an hour range of 15 miles. I guess this is smart. Right?

Stacey Higginbotham (01:45:48):
I mean more scooters thing that we scooters are apparently a big thing right now out because of the gas prices. So people are turning to scooters. Oh, this could get you. Oh, I know. I'm having a hard time. Staying awake too. The

Leo Laporte (01:46:01):
That's so nice. Actually. I don't understand what's wrong with bicycles?

Ant Pruitt (01:46:08):
No one wants to, You know, oh,

Leo Laporte (01:46:11):
No one wants to get electric bike then. Yeah. Have an electric bike. I, I wouldn't, you can't 'em Google. You still

Ant Pruitt (01:46:16):
Have to pedal on de bikes

Leo Laporte (01:46:17):
Too. Yeah. But you don't have to pedal hard. Yeah. These will fit above you on the, on the, on the Google bus. Oh, that's true. You, you, you scoot to the bus and get on the bus. Oh yeah. That's makes sense. That's the idea. That's the idea. And then you scoot once you're off

Stacey Higginbotham (01:46:30):
On campus,

Leo Laporte (01:46:31):
Google is just built a lake house. Well, that's not, that's kind of a misinterpretation of this story, but I kind of prefer it. Google cloud just built a data Lakehouse on big query. Now I'm less excited about that story. Google has band apps with hidden data harvesting software. Well, duh

Ant Pruitt (01:46:56):
Well from governments.

Leo Laporte (01:46:58):
Oh,

Ant Pruitt (01:46:59):
Okay. I catch that part.

Leo Laporte (01:47:00):
The consumer facing apps are tied to the us national security contractors. Oh, Oh. A Panamanian company wrote the code. It's linked through corporate records and web registrations to a Virginia defense contractor that does cyber intelligence network defense and intelligence intercept work for us national security agencies. That code ran a of Android devices, Dozens of apps on the Google play store, including Several Muslim prayer apps, a highway speed trap detector. One of these have in common, a QR code reader and a number of other popular apps.

Speaker 9 (01:47:52):
Wow.

Ant Pruitt (01:47:53):
Our government,

Leo Laporte (01:47:56):
Wow. Measurement systems, paid developers to incorporate its code surreptitiously collecting data from the users, Stacy.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:48:09):
This was old. The, we knew about the Muslim prayer app collecting data and then selling it to government officials.

Leo Laporte (01:48:15):
But Google

Ant Pruitt (01:48:16):
Getting rid of it is new. Right.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:48:19):
I, I thought they did get rid of it, but maybe they found more. Hmm. Like this feels very familiar. So I'm like, oh, I feel like we've covered this, but okay.

Leo Laporte (01:48:28):
Two two security researchers, their findings in March last month with Google, which initiated an investigation resulting in the ban, The apps containing measurement system software were removed from the Google play store as of March 25th.

Ant Pruitt (01:48:44):
I wonder what's the procedure for Google to go through its store and, and see this stuff. Because I mean, there's a gazillion apps out there and how, how are they checking? Oh, they know. Yeah. The call. Well,

Leo Laporte (01:48:55):
And if you've already installed the app, it doesn't matter. They removed it from the store. You've got it on your phone. It's working. Yeah. Hmm. Wow. Hmm. I guess, I guess all you could do, if you were Google is to monitor outbound traffic, right. It has to upload to some servers somewhere. I don't know. That's not

Stacey Higginbotham (01:49:15):
Great. Well, I feel like it didn't, I can't remember how that got nevermind. I can't remember. Hmm.

Leo Laporte (01:49:24):
So

Stacey Higginbotham (01:49:25):
We are all terrible today. So

Leo Laporte (01:49:27):
I wish I'd had a couple muffin.

Ant Pruitt (01:49:30):
I need to do some squats.

Leo Laporte (01:49:31):
What do you think about ubiquity, the router company suing Brian Krebs, a security journalist for 425,000 in dollars in damages because ubiquity says that he misled intentionally has to be intentional, right? Intentionally misled the public about a data breach on Ubiquity's hardware and a subsequent blackmail attempt. Ubiquity said, Kreb said they covered up the cyber attack. Ubiquity says, no. We, we sent an email out, immediately told customers to take additional security, protect precautions. Then we noticed notified the public and the next filing made with the S E they claim Krebs intentionally disregarded.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:50:12):
That's

Leo Laporte (01:50:12):
Not true.

Ant Pruitt (01:50:14):
Is there proof

Stacey Higginbotham (01:50:15):
Or, or saying that, oh, we told the SCC is not the same as telling the public. I think they should not have sued Brian Krebs. That's just a dumb thing to do.

Ant Pruitt (01:50:23):
Yeah.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:50:23):
For a bunch of reasons. Yeah. because I mean, he's not

Leo Laporte (01:50:28):
A bad actor. They say his only, yeah, I agree. He said, they said his only source was the company employee who leaked all this information in the first place. He was later charged with stealing confidential data and extorting ubiquity while posing it as anonymous hacker ubiquity knew the sole source had been indicted for his criminal and involve in the attack, but he published a Krebs, published a story on the blog. The next day, Krebs knew doubling down on his accusations against ubiquity. Doesn't matter. It does get, you have to prove malicious intent in a lawsuit like this, right? Mm.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:51:05):
Yeah. 

Stacey Higginbotham (01:51:05):
Still as long as Sullivan stole the case, a live

Leo Laporte (01:51:08):
Suit. Yes. Yeah. It's just a bad look if you ask me for ubiquity, but I, I guess they feel like they've got a case.

Ant Pruitt (01:51:18):
If they can prove they actually did that communication to the public. I did.

Leo Laporte (01:51:22):
They did send out an email. Yeah.

Ant Pruitt (01:51:24):
But did they send it out three years later? Some other company and they

Leo Laporte (01:51:27):
Didn't talk like wise, did they didn't wait,

Stacey Higginbotham (01:51:30):
But did they, did they clearly, I, I mean, like, I guess I would like to see the email they sent out to be. Right.

Leo Laporte (01:51:36):
I have it somewhere after I can read it to you.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:51:39):
Oh, that's right. Cuz you're a ubiquity customer.

Leo Laporte (01:51:42):
I am it was, it was kind of and kind of an Aine email that said, you know, it'd probably be a good idea if you were to change your password right now.

Ant Pruitt (01:51:56):
Okay. So that's not,

Leo Laporte (01:51:57):
They weren't too clear about exactly what had happened, but doesn't matter. They did. Do I, you know, I that's the question. And does, does you yeah.

Ant Pruitt (01:52:10):
Cause, think about saying,

Stacey Higginbotham (01:52:11):
I think if you tell someone, Hey, lock your, if you send someone an email that says, Hey, by the way, you may wanna lock your door, you know? Versus Hey, you may wanna lock your door because we have noticed that there is a robber roaming around trying all the door locks in your neighborhood, right? Those are very different emails, right?

Ant Pruitt (01:52:29):
As the email, as what I've seen from other vendors that say suspicious activity on your account change,

Leo Laporte (01:52:36):
Here's the, or

Stacey Higginbotham (01:52:37):
Change your password. We've had a data breach. Yeah. Here's

Ant Pruitt (01:52:39):
Something like that. Not this whole.

Leo Laporte (01:52:42):
So the data breach happened J December 5th. No, wait a minute. So the justice department, I indicted a ubiquity developer for causing the breach December 5th. Ubiquity on March 31st of last year, said as security experts identified no evidence, the customer information was accessed or even targeted. 

Leo Laporte (01:53:15):
And then in January 11th. So about a month later, they sent in an email and this is what the email said. We, dear customer, we recently became aware of unauthorized access to certain of our information technology systems hosted by a third card party cloud provider. We have no indication. There's been unauthorized activity with respect to any user's account. I remember getting this email, but as a precaution, we encourage you to change your password. We recommend you also change your password on any website where you use the same ID password. Okay, well, this there's a button that says that covers it here. You can change it. We apologize deeply regret That covers it. This is kind of Ironically from the Brian Krebs story of which came out March 30th of last year. What Krebs, according who ubiquity did not reveal as his source for these stories was the hacker. And that Krebs should have known it was actually the hacker, but did not reveal that. Oh,

Stacey Higginbotham (01:54:18):
Did did Krebs know? So they're suing him because they think, or because Krebs admitted that he knew it was the hacker.

Leo Laporte (01:54:24):
Well, I guess that's what the, what the, what the trial will.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:54:28):
Cause. I mean, like if a half comes to talk to me, then as long as I don't know it,

Leo Laporte (01:54:33):
Right?

Stacey Higginbotham (01:54:34):
I mean,

Leo Laporte (01:54:35):
The complaint said only one source propped up Kreb's story against ubiquity, Nicholas Sharp, the ubiquity employee behind the cyber attack. By the way, we'll never, we won't get Brian's side of it. I have huge respect for Brian. We, we use his work all the time on the shows. But he, his lawyer on advice of his lawyer, he's not commenting. Yeah, smart. It's the right thing to do. Smart. so on December sharp was charged Krebs, allegedly UBI. What he said, Krebs allegedly reviewed the press release, knew that old source had been indicted,

Leo Laporte (01:55:10):
But the indictment said, Krebs published a story on his blog the next day, doubling down on his accusations and intentionally misleading his readers into believing his earlier reporting was not sourced by sharp. So that's yeah. So this, so this is like defamation, basically what they're going the key, correct me if I'm wrong, Jeff and Stacy know the rules, but the key is you have to show knowledge that it was wrong before you published and you have to have malice. Okay. You have to, it has to be intentional. Okay. And that's so that's why the, the, the lawsuit says, look, he knew he intentionally published it anyway.

Ant Pruitt (01:55:46):
Okay. We'll

Leo Laporte (01:55:47):
We'll see. I it's a bad look. Anytime a, a company sues a journalist over stories that don't make it look good because it makes you look bad,

Ant Pruitt (01:55:59):
Even worse.

Leo Laporte (01:56:00):
And it's a strike saying effect.

Speaker 10 (01:56:03):
Yeah.

Leo Laporte (01:56:04):
So anyway, I, I kinda, I'm gonna, I'll have to see more. I'm gonna, my, my tendency would be to, to say, Brian did nothing wrong, but we'll see.

Ant Pruitt (01:56:14):
Just sounds like he reported

Leo Laporte (01:56:17):
Well, but it sounds like he reported based on a source that he knew was the bad guy you would, that would be wrong, right? Or no.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:56:27):
Well, not necess. I mean, if he's reporting that there's still an issue, right. I mean, just because the person, I mean, it's not ideal. Like, but if someone called me up and it was like, I murdered my family, I would still publish a story about them murdering their family.

Ant Pruitt (01:56:44):
Is this sort of a cap? Is this sort like snowing. Right. You know, cuz a lot of people consider Snowden the government bad guy. But yet what he reported was stuff that the public needed to know and deserved the right to know. Right.

Leo Laporte (01:57:01):
Yeah. But his sole source here is the guy, the bad guy, maybe Krebs is fooled by that. Oh, I don't know.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:57:09):
I, I really don't know. We're we're gonna have to wait I guess. Yeah. I, I don't have enough information. I'm sorry.

Ant Pruitt (01:57:15):
Yeah.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:57:17):
Yeah. I'm not willing to be a pundit that doesn't know on this one.

Leo Laporte (01:57:20):
Right. Right.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:57:23):
I can't like, I mean, as a journalist, I'm like, I wanna be, I wanna be like, he did nothing wrong, but I also know that this could be confusing. Yep. But I, I don't believe he was malicious.

Leo Laporte (01:57:35):
Get ready for this baseball opening days tomorrow. And the major league baseball officials are saying pitchers and catchers can use a new anti sign stealing technology during their regular season. This has historically been a problem. Catchers would signal to the pitcher, using fingers. What pitch to throw. Now they have a little thing on their wrist. Looks like a little black barrier, a calculator that goes to an ear piece of the pitcher's ear that tells him what pitch to throw, you know, watch this video. You could see the catcher is entering in the pitch.

Ant Pruitt (01:58:12):
You know, what's coming next, right.

Leo Laporte (01:58:13):
There's no way, no way to steal those signs

Ant Pruitt (01:58:16):
Man in the middle attack.

Leo Laporte (01:58:17):
Oh yeah man. You know, what's coming next. It's technology is based on it's called pitch com using a pad with, but the wrist of the gloved hand, a catcher could signal pitches type and location to the pitcher through a listening device, up to three teammates of the pitcher and catcher will also have access to the signals available in Spanish and English, which helps the field.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:58:40):
It can be hacked,

Ant Pruitt (01:58:41):
Dude. Those, these team owners have billions of dollars that they're disposing.

Leo Laporte (01:58:46):
You gotta use encryption. You gotta use strong encryption.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:58:52):
Just, just text them. Just take a phone outta your pocket.

Leo Laporte (01:58:54):
It's kinda like you're texting him. Yeah. It's a big problem. Sign stealing. And it, it is illegal. I part of the game. No, no, no, no. It's illegal. No, no, no

Ant Pruitt (01:59:05):
You shouldn't cheat. Cause

Leo Laporte (01:59:07):
Cause normally the only person who could see that is the picture. Unless you've got a guy in the outfield with binoculars or you know, a camera trying to steal it. 

Ant Pruitt (01:59:19):
Even a guy in short, it could potentially see it, but he, the, he would have to yell back, Hey, to getting ready to do something. So, you know,

Stacey Higginbotham (01:59:27):
He could have his own signal. I see. I I'm sorry. I'm an American baseball is just the most boring damn sport there

Stacey Higginbotham (01:59:33):
I, I am. So I don't agree on.

Leo Laporte (01:59:36):
So in the 2017 world series, the Houston Astros, you, your team, well whose team your team, you're from Houston, they're your team officially your team.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:59:49):
You must own them.

Ant Pruitt (01:59:50):
They're they're like the you're responsible team.

Leo Laporte (01:59:54):
We're determined by the baseball commissioner's office to have used a sign stealing system through the use of a TV monitor set up behind the Astros dugout. Yep. As a result, general manager and manager of the team were suspended and then fired the bench coach was, was suspended. So it's a, it's a fairly serious charge.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:00:20):
The New York times had, I think it was New York times, Washington. One of them had a ridiculous oped this week saying baseball is failing. The government should take baseball over.

Leo Laporte (02:00:28):
What? Why? Oh

Stacey Higginbotham (02:00:28):
My God.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:00:29):
It's it was absurd. Waste space.

Leo Laporte (02:00:31):
That's crazy. That's crazy. Talk. I am very happy to say that the company that owns my radio show is building a new NFT network for, I

Stacey Higginbotham (02:00:43):
Put this just for you. I thought you'd be getting your

Leo Laporte (02:00:46):
FTS out. Oh gee, iHeart media is pouring several hundred thousand dollars into purchasing the rights to roughly a dozen NFTs to create a new NFT based podcast network.

Ant Pruitt (02:01:00):
You knew that was,

Stacey Higginbotham (02:01:01):
Have you been saying on your show that NFTs are BS?

Ant Pruitt (02:01:04):
Yes. You knew that was coming.

Leo Laporte (02:01:05):
I have

Leo Laporte (02:01:08):
Iheart media currently talks to make 10 to 15 investments in crypto punks, mutant ape yacht club, world of women. It's ING work from emerging NFT creators, such as quirky, cryptos and loot for adventures. You know, I remember when they hired somebody who was an expert in this, I thought, oh, this, this is not gonna end well. But I don't understand how you turn it into a podcast. Yeah. I don't either. Here we go. Conal burn. Who is the beloved CEO of iHeart media's digital audio group that he came to iHeart media when they bought how things work, how stuff works. The idea is to combine IP from the various NFTs. It acquires into a content collection. It will call the non fun squad universe. Can't wait to join that one. The non fun squad Connell says we can world build for that. I'm creating narratives around them and bring those stories to life via podcasts

Stacey Higginbotham (02:02:03):
World build

Leo Laporte (02:02:04):
No one will listen to the first commercial manifestation of that universe. A podcast network called the non fun podcast network

Stacey Higginbotham (02:02:13):
Or with what made up monkeys. What's it gonna

Leo Laporte (02:02:15):
Be? The podcast will be hosted by voices that portray the NFT characters.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:02:22):
Hi. Oh, board.

Ant Pruitt (02:02:29):
I don't know where they're gonna go with this, but you knew this was coming though.

Leo Laporte (02:02:32):
Oh yeah. Right? Totally iHeart medias invested aggressively in building out its podcast business. Yes. I know that we tried to sell to them. They wouldn't buy us. It spent hundreds of millions of dollars on people other than TWI Acquiring right to various podcasts and audio, eye tech companies in all seriousness like Spotify, like Amazon, I guess like apple, YouTube, Facebook these companies really wanna own casting. So they're spending a lot of money buying. You just

Stacey Higginbotham (02:03:02):
Had FPS Leo and it'd be okay. You'd be snapped up. Oh gosh.

Leo Laporte (02:03:07):
This is really pushing the envelope to pressure test the assumptions we have around what is IP? What is a host and what is talent said? Co burn.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:03:18):
What is our company?

Leo Laporte (02:03:19):
What, what are we doing? Am I a

Ant Pruitt (02:03:21):
Host?

Leo Laporte (02:03:22):
No, you are an NFT. Oh,

Ant Pruitt (02:03:24):
Okay. Are you talent? Thanks. Thanks for clearing that up. Geez.

Leo Laporte (02:03:30):
Oh, wait a minute. There's more burn says iHeart media plan to test five to 10 of its existing podcast shows as I, for dos a kind of crypto driven, you know?

Stacey Higginbotham (02:03:42):
Ah, so, so the podcast will be a democracy then.

Leo Laporte (02:03:46):
Yeah. You can't buy a Dow for this show. No. And I wonder why they never bought us. How about this? This is all, it's all my fault. This is all. This is right up your alley.

Ant Pruitt (02:04:00):
This one is enter

Leo Laporte (02:04:02):
Street photography. It's a new book of street photography, but it's not of people. It's of the screens of their smartphones. I like this one. The nun said it's okay. Here's one. This is from NYC courtesy of Jeff Mermelstein in Mac Mac 2020, a fatty tumor. I'll take him Wednesday. When I get home from a run that I have question for you. I had sausage links in my fridge and the door didn't close all the way Sunday. So they basically got room temperature. By the time I realized I closed the door. If I then closed the door and they got cold again, can I cook them for soup? Or would I vomit? You know, this is why it's probably good not to read over people's shoulders.

Ant Pruitt (02:04:50):
You know which street photography. There's a lot of controversy because people are concerned about their privacy so forth, but depending on where you are, you know, a photographer can literally just walk up and snap your photo.

Leo Laporte (02:05:02):
Ah, but yeah, but snap in your

Ant Pruitt (02:05:04):
Smart,

Stacey Higginbotham (02:05:05):
How do you define street photography?

Ant Pruitt (02:05:07):
Pardon?

Stacey Higginbotham (02:05:08):
How do you define street photography specifically?

Ant Pruitt (02:05:11):
Anything out in the public, whether it be people, whether it be buildings anything out in the public. Okay. But what gets me with this story is it says right there at the top, they took the photos of these smartphones up close and personal with the iPhone. I

Stacey Higginbotham (02:05:30):
Presume with permission.

Ant Pruitt (02:05:31):
Right? So I'm, I'm, I'm assuming there's there was permission there, but what if there wasn't can you imagine just walking up to someone and say, Hey, I I'm a photographer. I like to take pictures of you texting right now of your phone. That is, I don't know if I could get away with that.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:05:46):
There's a big question.

Ant Pruitt (02:05:48):
Charismatic and charming. But I don't think I pull

Leo Laporte (02:05:51):
That off. I have to say, though, there is a certain voyeuristic appeal in these pictures. I can't stop looking at it. They are,

Ant Pruitt (02:05:57):
They that's the thing. There are great stories. When you look at it first, you look at this

Leo Laporte (02:06:01):
Completely added context,

Ant Pruitt (02:06:03):
The text that's on there. Yeah. Then you look at the actual device itself. Yeah. Then you look at the screens. Are the screens clean? Are the screens chippy, lot of cracks cracked. Then you look at their hands. Are they manicured? Are they female? It's I love this, but I'm just bothered by the aspect of someone literally walking up and just snapping the picture of my phone without my consent. No, no,

Stacey Higginbotham (02:06:24):
No, no, no. I had a guy once in Chicago who came running up behind and then he came by and he snapped up a picture right below my face and then went going, I pissed was pissed off

Ant Pruitt (02:06:35):
As hell. Yeah. And, and, and a lot of places you can legally do that, you know, it's totally vine.

Leo Laporte (02:06:40):
Well, they cuz they didn't contemplate that you would be holding a phone with all of your life.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:06:46):
Does it say anything about permission in there or

Leo Laporte (02:06:49):
All of the photographs themselves taken a very close range with an iPhone, which the photographer Jeff Mermelstein has been shooting with exclusively since 2016 after decades of using a Leica.

Ant Pruitt (02:07:04):
I saw nothing about consent when I read it.

Leo Laporte (02:07:07):
Yeah. It's just he's you know, you, you don't have to, you could do this surreptitiously

Ant Pruitt (02:07:15):
Dude. Those are focused. Pretty sleazy. Those are in focus. Yeah.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:07:18):
Those I don't. How could you do that at like aunt? Is that a reasonable? How far would you have to be? To take a picture

Leo Laporte (02:07:24):
Like that? You get that picture.

Ant Pruitt (02:07:25):
You can get that. Okay. Standing two, two feet, two feet behind

Leo Laporte (02:07:28):
Two feet outta a hold up in front. Like

Ant Pruitt (02:07:30):
Again mean that's again, that is in focus. That's the thing, you know, I,

Leo Laporte (02:07:35):
Let me see. I'm gonna, so

Ant Pruitt (02:07:36):
We're two feet away.

Leo Laporte (02:07:38):
Yeah. Yeah. I would need to, I can zoom in, but,

Ant Pruitt (02:07:43):
But that takes an

Leo Laporte (02:07:44):
Effort I'm still pretty close. Yeah. You would know that I'm taking a picture of your shoulder. I mean, I, I was able to get that. So I mean I'm able to get, well,

Stacey Higginbotham (02:07:52):
Stand behind your shoulder.

Leo Laporte (02:07:55):
I mean, I, you know, I was far enough, but I was able to that's pretty

Ant Pruitt (02:07:58):
Much the

Leo Laporte (02:07:59):
Where's the camera. Where is it over that shoulder here? I got it. John, go ahead. Do it again.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:08:03):
No, no, no. I meant stand, literally stand behind aunt's shoulder and see

Leo Laporte (02:08:06):
What it looks like. Yeah. But, but this is what I was interesting, John, what is that? John. John. John push the button. You ahead of the second.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:08:15):
John's sleepy too. If we're sleepy,

Leo Laporte (02:08:17):
John's

Stacey Higginbotham (02:08:18):
Having fun. He's like I gotta liven this up. Come on.

Leo Laporte (02:08:21):
Can you get this shot over here? You had it a second ago. The PTZ?

Ant Pruitt (02:08:26):
No, that was over here. Wasn't PTZ. Okay.

Leo Laporte (02:08:29):
Okay. Well anyway,

Stacey Higginbotham (02:08:31):
I, Jesse Leo, there we go. You stood up you mind and you can, you

Leo Laporte (02:08:36):
Can. I saw how that's pretty much the same quality as the image on the screen I'm seeing. So let me do it over his shoulder.

Ant Pruitt (02:08:41):
All right. So two feet away.

Leo Laporte (02:08:43):
By the way, with my Samsung S 22. No problem. I got 10 feet optical zoom,

Ant Pruitt (02:08:50):
10 X fancy.

Leo Laporte (02:08:51):
So it's a little harder with an iPhone.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:08:54):
An is there on the street concent trading on sending a message to his mother and you walk up behind him. Okay. And we see an X on the floor

Leo Laporte (02:09:02):
Show the shot. I'm pretty far behind him. All right. You wouldn't would you, if I, you probably, if you were, if you were doing a text and you weren't really paying attention, that's pretty, good's the same quality

Ant Pruitt (02:09:17):
Stuff. That is pretty good.

Leo Laporte (02:09:18):
That's the same quality as I've seen on this book.

Ant Pruitt (02:09:22):
Oh boy. That's pretty good.

Leo Laporte (02:09:24):
Yeah. And that's, that was a couple of feedback. So yeah, I would submit you can

Ant Pruitt (02:09:30):
I thought ITD been a lot more difficult to get focused that clear,

Leo Laporte (02:09:34):
But well, you gotta be

Ant Pruitt (02:09:35):
As good as got tools, right?

Leo Laporte (02:09:36):
Gotta

Stacey Higginbotham (02:09:38):
Hell of a street.

Ant Pruitt (02:09:39):
If you're real report, this is no problem.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:09:43):
Computational photography, especially if it fills in the,

Leo Laporte (02:09:46):
That's actually a pretty good picture. That's pretty good. I gotta say the other thing is it's kind of an interesting picture with your hands and there's a thing thing. Yeah. There's an icy, there's a voyeuristic. So this would be at actually not so hard to do with an iPhone and with a, with an S 22, be a lot easier.

Ant Pruitt (02:10:02):
It says a lot about me just looking at that screen.

Leo Laporte (02:10:04):
All it says is a VPN is on VPN connected. That's one story to Los Angeles.

Ant Pruitt (02:10:09):
That's one story. But then there's my background.

Leo Laporte (02:10:13):
Yeah. Which is looks like fireworks going off after some sort of event. Can you see that, John?

Ant Pruitt (02:10:21):
Anything else?

Leo Laporte (02:10:23):
There's your fingerprint weather, the weather. There's your, I know there's a lot. What is the event? That's Clemson. Of course. I see orange. Of course. So this is cleansing winning the wor the us championship two years ago.

Ant Pruitt (02:10:37):
No, it was actually in death valley.

Leo Laporte (02:10:39):
Oh, okay. Nevermind.

Ant Pruitt (02:10:41):
But it's still, it's a story

Leo Laporte (02:10:42):
There. It's a story. I guess what I like about that? This is actually, yeah. That's

Ant Pruitt (02:10:46):
Why I like

Leo Laporte (02:10:46):
That kind of a cool street photography

Ant Pruitt (02:10:48):
Article, but I

Leo Laporte (02:10:49):
It's a little out of focus because of our camera. Not because out is outta folks shots. Actually. There we go. Yeah. Zoom in zoom center. Yeah. Your

Stacey Higginbotham (02:11:02):
Cameras on the other hand,

Ant Pruitt (02:11:04):
Mr. Jamer BS back,

Leo Laporte (02:11:06):
Hey, let's make another picture. Picture of me holding the picture of him holding

Stacey Higginbotham (02:11:10):
Fingers on fingers.

Ant Pruitt (02:11:13):
We're cursing.

Leo Laporte (02:11:14):
Now that tells a story.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:11:17):
Yeah. You're that is sharp on your fingers there, aunt.

Ant Pruitt (02:11:20):
It's not hard.

Leo Laporte (02:11:21):
It's not hard. These are good. These phones. We, we

Stacey Higginbotham (02:11:23):
Also know that aunt has clean fingernails, which

Leo Laporte (02:11:25):
Is very nice. Nice to see. It's good. You can see a little bit of blood from when he punched me, but that's okay.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:11:31):
How's that aunt that work out

Leo Laporte (02:11:33):
There. Oh, there's this? There's the zoom in. Yeah, honestly. I think those are good images. Well, you just took a picture of me taking a picture of you.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:11:42):
You

Leo Laporte (02:11:42):
Didn't know it. No, that's good. See, I didn't even

Ant Pruitt (02:11:44):
Notice. I didn't even know.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:11:45):
Yeah. Even though you have cameras all around on the monitor,

Ant Pruitt (02:11:48):
Just a good thing. I normally have my head on a swivel when I'm out and about.

Leo Laporte (02:11:53):
I, I have very mixed feelings about this. I think this is, these are great photos and its fascinating. Yes. And I think it's a total invasion of privacy, but you can get the book. It's hashtag NYC from Jeff Mermelstein published by max

Stacey Higginbotham (02:12:06):
And, and you can always put a, what are those called screen reflector thing on your phone. So people can't see

Leo Laporte (02:12:11):
It. If you can see it, they can see it.

Ant Pruitt (02:12:14):
And, and again, the photographer's not outta line. They can clearly do this. I, I just wouldn't

Leo Laporte (02:12:21):
Do it. Look, it just tells the story. Doesn't it? What's interesting. They made 'em all blue, which I don't know if I agree with, but stylizing it. Yeah, it's a style. But I just love to see the broken screens and it, it totally tells the story

Stacey Higginbotham (02:12:33):
And fingernails.

Leo Laporte (02:12:34):
Yeah. Some, this is a great one. This is hysterical. Guy sends a text saying there's there isn't much of a future in this country. Everybody is stupid, lazy and fat. The world is leaving us behind. And the response the guy's typing in is strawberry strawberry.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:12:50):
I think that's hysterical.

Leo Laporte (02:12:53):
I love it. And this is hysterical. This is, is a great commentary. Love this book, but I'm still a little.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:13:00):
So would you buy it and thus support the author and

Leo Laporte (02:13:02):
It's yeah. It's a good question. Privacy

Stacey Higginbotham (02:13:04):
Invasion techniques.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:13:05):
Well, give the title in case somebody else wants to.

Leo Laporte (02:13:08):
I did hashtag NYC published by Mac. Jeff Mermelstein is the photographer.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:13:13):
I forget where I found that I put, that's

Leo Laporte (02:13:15):
A re interesting story.

Ant Pruitt (02:13:17):
We talked about street photography on my show, hands on photography with miss Christ Johnson. And she was in New York and she pretty much spoke about that experience of being in New York. You can just do that. Willynilly even to the point where some of the folks are like, okay, they're used to photographers walking around. So maybe that's the case here or they're like, okay, yeah, go ahead. Just take the, it

Leo Laporte (02:13:41):
Doesn't just take

Ant Pruitt (02:13:42):
The photos.

Leo Laporte (02:13:42):
Honestly, if I'm doing this, it doesn't look like I'm taking a picture of you. Nope, sure. Doesn't it looks like I'm looking at my, so

Stacey Higginbotham (02:13:48):
What did bill Cunningham do? Did he ask people's

Leo Laporte (02:13:51):
Yeah. Think built so well known. Yeah. And, but the other thing is he had a camera. Yeah. So his camera, he had a like us, so it looked like,

Stacey Higginbotham (02:13:57):
Yeah. He add it up to your, he add it up to your face.

Ant Pruitt (02:13:59):
That's a different story.

Leo Laporte (02:14:00):
Yep. Yeah. This is really this is really kind of, I,

Stacey Higginbotham (02:14:04):
I wait, I wait, the moral panic privacy violation presume privacy and public stories. That'll come in the New York times and the Washington

Ant Pruitt (02:14:11):
It's coming.

Leo Laporte (02:14:12):
Oh no, it's art. Nobody cares. And now ladies and gentlemen, it's time for

Speaker 11 (02:14:21):
The Google change log.

Leo Laporte (02:14:24):
We'll make this quick. I got a Muff and a cup waiting. Google maps is adding to road prices, toll road prices, more map details. Apple watch improvements is more big, big update to Google maps, especially if you're on iOS. They announced this yesterday a new pinned trip widget on your watch, you could pin a trip, the option to get directions on Google maps directly from your apple. Watch. They, this is a feature really apple has owned up to. Now. One of the reasons I only reason I use apple maps is because I can have directions walking directions is my watch convenient. Or even while I'm driving. I know I have the map over here, but my watch will buzz at me and I, and I know I'm gonna make a turn and stuff. I, I love that. That's a really nice thing to add. I guess I thought maybe it was apple keeping 'em from doing it, but maybe it's just Google. Doesn't get around to it. You'll also get toll prices for the first time on Google map.

Ant Pruitt (02:15:19):
S cool.

Leo Laporte (02:15:21):
The toll prices will be provided by local tolling authorities. But you can even see. So now instead of just the mileage of a trip, you'll see the cost of a trip, right?

Ant Pruitt (02:15:34):
Okay.

Leo Laporte (02:15:34):
Ah, this will be nearly 2000 toll roads in the us, India, Japan, and Indonesia, more countries coming soon. You'll also see, there'll be features that will make it less stressful to drive on unfamiliar roads. They're gonna add traffic lights, stop signs, building outlines, areas of interest. So more detail as you're driving down the road to help you kind of understand that this, yeah. That's where I am. I see that new iOS updates to make it easier to use maps on the go. I mentioned the pins trip widget. So you can pin your trips into your go tab, right from the iOS home stream screen. You'll see your arrival time, the next departure for your transit trip and suggested route if you're driving. Oh, I see. This is for the the widgets on the smartphone, the iPhone. I get it like that. Oh, that's nice. So now you can have a widget for school going to school. Nice improvements. Google has Google maps, you know, it's nice to see them putting some effort into it and Google docs. Now I know you've been waiting for this. Can have emoji reactions right there in the Google doc. Can you see editors

Stacey Higginbotham (02:16:45):
With this? Someone, someone I knew was so excited it by this. And I'm like, what are you doing in Google docs that you're like, yes. Emoji reactions, Hey,

Leo Laporte (02:16:57):
I just added color emojis to my EEX. So there

Stacey Higginbotham (02:17:03):
I can use it for my students

Leo Laporte (02:17:04):
Now. Yeah.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:17:06):
When I do their stories. Yes.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:17:08):
Oh, that's true. Cuz they think good grammar sometimes is aggressively angry. Right? So now you can put periods in happy, but you can also put a smile face, happy

Leo Laporte (02:17:16):
Face, happy face. Remember Google was going to cut off legacy G-Suite users and make them pay. Google is gonna put that off and they'll also be a waiting list. A no cost waiting list. So Google announced in January GSU legacy free edition account would have to start paying this year, but that's gonna be slightly delayed. You will have until May 1st to select a new workspace plan. That's not for very long. Yeah. Well, if you don't billing, won't start until July 1st. After that your Google workspace subscription will be suspended until you set up billing. So you have in a way till July, right? It was June. Yeah. It's not, not a big difference.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:18:03):
That's my fault. I put that in there. That's not worth, that's not, that's not up the standards of change. Google

Leo Laporte (02:18:06):
Said it would offer a no cost transfer option that moves users to a free G mail account. So that's good. Nice. That's good. They were talking about it last night and all about Android pixel six April update is out fixes some camera problems on the pixel six wireless charging issues. If you've got a pixel six phone update it now come on yesterday. Woohoo. Google translate can now auto switch G board of the appropriate language. So you can type back in that language. And Google hardware gets unified security reward program that's for pixel nest and Fitbit.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:18:45):
What is that?

Leo Laporte (02:18:47):
So it's like a bug, a bug bounty.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:18:51):
Oh, okay.

Leo Laporte (02:18:53):
It's an ex I thought

Stacey Higginbotham (02:18:54):
They've always had a bug bounty program.

Leo Laporte (02:18:55):
Yeah. The now brings nest and Fitbit into the fold with pixel. So I guess they didn't have it for nest and

Stacey Higginbotham (02:19:03):
Fitbit. Well, they had a bug bounty program for nest devices, but I guess now it's just the same program maybe as a different one.

Leo Laporte (02:19:09):
Maybe they're all United now into the Android and Google device says security reward program. All right. Anyway, these are good things. This is this is something that keeps, keeps us all safe.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:19:20):
All right. Moving

Leo Laporte (02:19:20):
Right along. And if Wises had had this, maybe they wouldn't have been three years, three da of years that we'd had an insecure. So

Stacey Higginbotham (02:19:28):
We talked about this on the show and I have a question about that. So the, I, I know that people are outraged over this, but the exploit required you to be on the person's actual wifi network.

Leo Laporte (02:19:42):
So that's what I thought. And that's what wise said, but I asked Steve GIBS in this and he said, no.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:19:50):
Oh.

Leo Laporte (02:19:51):
So I, all I know is say more things, 80, 80, right? It's not clear. I'm not, it's not clear. And Steve would under Steve understands this better than I do. I think what happened, I'm guessing what happened is sure. The initial exploit was in fact open to any, and then they made some slight changes that made it, that you would have to be on the network. But Steve said, no, it could be launched from the internet

Stacey Higginbotham (02:20:20):
Originally. Or if they changed that

Leo Laporte (02:20:22):
Didn't

Stacey Higginbotham (02:20:23):
Fix the

Leo Laporte (02:20:24):
I'm unclear.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:20:25):
Cause this was, I was like, so the

Leo Laporte (02:20:27):
Were a story wise rebutted and the verge had an update that said, oh yeah, but I'm still upset about it. But yeah, it had to be remote. But I think that may not be the case. I think wise may not have may not be completely, really clear about this. So as I said, I asked Steve and he said, no, you do not have to be on the victim's network, which is bad enough. I mean, that means there's a, you could have an evil made attack or somebody could sit on your curb on your wifi. But it does mean it's not as bad as it sounds. I mean, it's own, you know, somebody somebody'd have to connect to your home wifi either.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:21:13):
Well, and there were, I mean, we had the, what are those called? The Wemo devices for years had, was it a security flyer? Was it their design? I mean, they argued that it was their design that did this, but if you were on the person's wifi network and had the app open, you could act, actually control their devices. Yeah. And that was by design. So I kind of looked at why is treating this kind of like that, because that's what it sounded like.

Leo Laporte (02:21:37):
Yeah. And in fact in an update to his article I'm done with wise Sean Hollister, quote bit defender saying that it is online, likely that somebody outside your network could get it. The remote from outside the network attack requires an initial camera ID that can only be acquired if present on the same network as the device it's completely random and a non predictable string. It's kinda like a, a really good password. It's random. Yeah. So somebody would have to get on your wifi, get the token. And then later, now that you've got the token, you can go, so you can drive off with the token in hand and then it then get into your camera after that.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:22:21):
So yes, but that assumes they had access to

Leo Laporte (02:22:23):
Your network. They would've according to bit defender, that's the case. Okay. That you would, well,

Stacey Higginbotham (02:22:29):
That's

Leo Laporte (02:22:29):
Not, that's not as bad. Right. I, I agree.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:22:31):
It's possible, but that that's a pretty targeted attack. That's right.

Leo Laporte (02:22:36):
That's right. So maybe I should have gotten Steve to clarify, but it, so, or maybe Steve

Stacey Higginbotham (02:22:44):
Misunderstood, you were actually talking about something totally different, but it was a tangential that I was wanting to explore. Cause

Leo Laporte (02:22:50):
No, we hadn't really talked about it. This broke, you were on literally a minute or two after we ended the show last week. So we hadn't talked about it on the show yet. And I think it's an important thing to talk about. There's two I, in my mind, there's two questions. Why did bit defenders sit on it for three years? Cuz they knew about it. And normally in responsible disclosure you tell a company, look, you're gonna get three months to fix this. And after that, we're gonna tell the world bit defender apparently was told by wise we can't fix it. There's not that wise says there's not enough memory in the camera for us to patch it. And bit defendant decided, well, since it's unfixable, we won't force them to disclose. And obviously, because as soon as you disclose, you're telling hackers how to do it in effect. So they, everybody decided well, since it's an unfixable thing, we'll just be mum about it. Nevertheless wise, continue to sell those cameras. Sure did. For three years they shouldn't. If they should have, in my opinion, they should have, if they can't fix it, they should have offer said to told everybody of the flaw and said, we'll give you a discount on another one. It is also

Stacey Higginbotham (02:23:57):
Is wise. It doesn't really design the things themselves. They just

Leo Laporte (02:24:00):
Buy. No Chinese camera wise does do the software though. So they are responsible for the flaw. The other problem is it's a $20 camera. So

Ant Pruitt (02:24:09):
What do you expect?

Leo Laporte (02:24:11):
Yeah. And wise probably could not easily afford to replace those.

Ant Pruitt (02:24:15):
And that's the Google change log.

Speaker 12 (02:24:19):
Whoa,

Leo Laporte (02:24:20):
Whoa. That's a good point. Thank you. We left that hanging didn't we it's like a hanging part.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:24:28):
I don't know if there was more in the Google change. I was what I was apologizing.

Leo Laporte (02:24:32):
I was like, oh no, we were done. I thought

Stacey Higginbotham (02:24:34):
The brakes on the train just went.

Leo Laporte (02:24:38):
I really have to quiz Steve then more. And maybe that he, when he said, no, no, you don't have to be local. He meant after you get the key. But he was, I, my sense is he was of the impression that you, you know, this was, you were vulnerable. Even if the hacker was not on your curb which would be a very different issue.

Ant Pruitt (02:25:07):
Yeah. I thought I heard, well, yeah, it was someone trying to go after an FTP server pretty much the same way.

Leo Laporte (02:25:13):
Right. And it was open. So I mean the main points still stand. There was a security flaw wise knew about it. Bit. Defendant knew about it. Both conspired not to tell anybody about it for, for three years, why's replace the camera in January without saying much about it. This is the message they sent out. Hey friends, it's a new year. And that comes with some important updates protecting you. And your security is always top of mind for us to do that. We need you to update your wise app to at least 2.27 and update your wise cam firmware. And for those of you with wise cam version one, they didn't say anything about that. Burn it. But

Speaker 13 (02:25:54):
Yeah.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:25:55):
Well they've been waiting for version one to go. I mean, they update these things every few years,

Leo Laporte (02:26:00):
So they can now, by the way, they can now update the firmware. So So why says these vulnerabilities require some form of local network access? So you would either had to open your network. Maybe that's what Steve was talking about. If you put your cameras on the internet, then somebody could attack you, but you'd have to put your cameras on the internet. Most people have their cameras inside a firewall. Right. And let the wise hopefully software share it. Hopefully. Yeah. Despite extensive efforts stretching into 2022, we found that wise cam V one, again, this is wise talk last sold in March, 2018 could not support the necessary security updates, the limited camera memory. They

Stacey Higginbotham (02:26:53):
Didn't keep selling it. Then

Leo Laporte (02:26:54):
They stopped selling it in March, 2018. That's right. But still that was, there were a lot of people including me that had V yeah. That's why they created the wise cam too, because we couldn't patch.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:27:08):
Okay.

Leo Laporte (02:27:10):
We were transparent with our customers and then disclosed our inability to continue to offer the necessary security updates in an email announcing the end of life for this product. So they said we can't update it. What they did neglect to say is even though there's a serious flaw For a security reasons, we again, chose to remain prudent about the specific reason why until now to limit the risk to all of our affected users across the affected models. Does that limit the risk? That's the question?

Stacey Higginbotham (02:27:38):
Well, what might be more interesting is if you're on that version one, you can't actually subscribe to any of their subscription services. So may they were just trying to push people from using those cameras anymore. Right. If I'm being, if I'm being my most C cynical, maybe

Leo Laporte (02:27:52):
Like, you know, it isn't as bad as we initially thought, I think that's correct.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:27:59):
Okay. All right. Nevermind. Carry on my friends.

Leo Laporte (02:28:02):
Carry on. Well, I'll tell you what we're going to do right now. We're take a little break. There is much more to talk about, but we just have run out of time

Stacey Higginbotham (02:28:12):
Or steam. I feel like we're all a little laggy today.

Leo Laporte (02:28:15):
Y'all are not me. I'm good. Oh, I feel good too. I just did a hundreds

Stacey Higginbotham (02:28:18):
Pushups

Leo Laporte (02:28:19):
Before the show. All right. Let's take a break. And when we come back picks of the week and you shame me into having one this week, so there it's all your, this week we're brought to you quite literally by cash, our content delivery network. I know cash lies amazing. Cuz I've been using 'em for more than a a decade to bring you the shows you love both the audio and the video. In fact, I am eternally grateful to cash fly. We started with him. We were just audio. I remember when we started video and we had this concept saying, should we tell cash fly at the time? You know, when we first started, we were spreading out our bandwidth all over the place. We asking people to use bit to torrent cash. I saved our bacon, but here they were hosting our audio. And now we're gonna host video, but you know what?

Leo Laporte (02:29:12):
They're great. We put the video on. We greatly increased the amount of data we sent through the cash line networks to petabytes a month without a squeak, without a whimper with NA quail or a qualm, they have been fantastic. And now cash lies offering ultra low latency, video streaming cash. The CDN with the best throughput in global reach will now put your video in front of your audience with sub one second latency you could stream to up millions of users go live in hours. Ditch that unreliable web RTC solution for their socket live video workflow. You're gonna love cash. Ultra low latency streaming 50 locations around the globe means your content is closer to your customers. So it will outperform local CDNs. Take a load off your origin server, reduce your S3 bills. This is something we do with cash life storage optimization system. You store your content on their network.

Leo Laporte (02:30:09):
Reduce bandwidth, increase your cash. Hit ratio to a hundred percent eliminate the load from your origin servers and those S3 bills fully managed CDN solutions mean you will get V I P treatment with cash elite managed packages. That's 24 7 support response time in less than an hour. Ask him about it. A managed package, cuz I'll tell you what it's great. So to reiterate ultra low video streaming lightning, fast gaming, mobile content optimization, multi CDN for redundancy and failover actually in the 21. And actually the last 12 months cash has had a 100% availability record. They weren't down once, not at all 30% faster than other major CDNs and 98% cash at ratio. A hundred percent. If you use SOS and 24 7, 365 day a year priority support. Now, you know why we love cash. Fly. Get a complimentary detail analysis of your current CDN bill and usage strengths. You may be overpaying by as much as 20%. Learn more@twi.cash.com twi.cash.com. Thank you. Cash line. We really appreciate it. Time for Stacy's thing of the week.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:31:27):
Okay. It hasn't arrived yet. So I can't show it to you, but I just purchased something called the turtle. T E R T I L L. It is by CEO of the company is the former co-founder of iRobot in.

Leo Laporte (02:31:44):
Wait a minute, let me guess. Is it a garden tilling robot?

Stacey Higginbotham (02:31:49):
It is a weeding robot. Weeding is a solar powered Roomba look and robot that weeds your garden with laser. Tell me it's laser. It is not laser.

Leo Laporte (02:32:03):
Oh, this wheels

Stacey Higginbotham (02:32:04):
Has

Stacey Higginbotham (02:32:06):
It's it's $349. There are some limits to know. So this is, this is not for, this is for someone who likes to play with things and they know that it's got the sensors on it, so it won't bump into things. It basically the wheels on it disrupt the soil enough that it's gonna prevent the weeds from popping up. If they do pop up, it has a little, it looks like the Roomba little spinner thing. It's a weed whacker and it just chops down the weeds. It avoids things that are over four inches high. So if you've got seedlings, you're supposed to put like physical wire barriers that come in that they have that come with it or you can build your own. So it'll bounce right off of those and anything taller. So, and if you've got weeds that are four inches or more high, you need to pluck those and then let this live. It only weeds for about two hours a day. Oh, here is the little weed whacker

Leo Laporte (02:33:02):
Thing. Little is right. Wow. So it looks like it has solar.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:33:07):
It does it's so it's solar operated, so it basically lives outside. It, it charges, it, it runs it wax and then it goes and hangs out and charges for a minute. And then, so it only can do like 200 square, which is kind of a small amount. But so there, there are lots of caveats here, but it's adorable. And I can't wait for mine to arrive.

Leo Laporte (02:33:30):
I, I feel like it's kind of a little bit like a toy.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:33:34):
It is, but so back when Roomba's first launched, they were also kind of like toys, right? So I, you know, this is, to me, this is like a pretty, what is

Leo Laporte (02:33:45):
The one that,

Stacey Higginbotham (02:33:48):
Yeah, well, I feel like it's my job to do that, you know? And if you, I mean, if you have, if this is of interest to you, oh

Leo Laporte (02:33:57):
My gosh. It's probably something that you

Stacey Higginbotham (02:33:58):
Would be like to play with.

Leo Laporte (02:33:59):
So what kind of garden will you be? Tur tilling.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:34:02):
So I have a raised bed herb garden that I also plant my tomatoes and like stuff in, so I'll put it in there.

Leo Laporte (02:34:09):
Yeah. Perfect. It's pretty cool. Seeing a little weed whacker on the bottom. Cute.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:34:13):
Isn't it? I know. Isn't it so

Leo Laporte (02:34:14):
Cute. It's pretty little. I mean, my, our weeds is not gonna do much with, but

Stacey Higginbotham (02:34:20):
Well, you have to, we More time right before you put it in there. Right. And then it'll prevent them from popping up and if they do pop up, it'll whack 'em right. And it'll just keep running throughout the season. And so the idea is you won't have to weed again.

Ant Pruitt (02:34:34):
Yeah. Do one, one last flush and clean if you will.

Leo Laporte (02:34:38):
Yeah. Proven as effective as hand weeding by the Cornell school of architecture,

Ant Pruitt (02:34:44):
There is an endorsement.

Leo Laporte (02:34:46):
Wow.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:34:47):
The school of architecture or agriculture.

Leo Laporte (02:34:49):
Well, that's the problem. I was gonna say it's agriculture. I got it wrong. Oh.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:34:56):
I was like great.

Leo Laporte (02:35:03):
My approved for use and weeding by the military cadets at west point at

Ant Pruitt (02:35:09):
West point

Leo Laporte (02:35:12):
Tel T E R T E R T I L L like pronounce turtle. It's got a little turtle logo and it looks like a little green

Stacey Higginbotham (02:35:22):
Turtle. It looks like a turtle. It looks like a Aruba, a green RBA based on the solar

Leo Laporte (02:35:26):
Panels on top. Apparently it fertilizes as well.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:35:29):
No, that is a separate product that they have. Oh, you can. And this is actually really useful if you're into that sort of thing. You can send them a soil test. They'll send you back an appropriate fertilizer for your particular

Leo Laporte (02:35:44):
Completely unrelated in subscription service. Oh, that's interesting. Yes. Okay. Turtle, weeding robots and soil testers. And now it's time for Jeff Jarvis number of the week.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:35:56):
So I'm gonna do something special in a second, but first with a little late breaking number here. So it Washington post reports that Elon Musk was 11 days late, publicly declaring that he'd amassed more than 5% as is required by law as a Stacy, he doesn't much care. So he was able to continue buying stock from 5% up to 9.2% at $39 a share versus the $50 a share came out when the news came out, meaning that he made just from that Delta there 156 million.

Ant Pruitt (02:36:27):
So who else got paid?

Stacey Higginbotham (02:36:28):
See, this fan is dodgy.

Leo Laporte (02:36:30):
I, you know,

Stacey Higginbotham (02:36:32):
We kicked off the board for this.

Leo Laporte (02:36:33):
Why isn't the S E finding this fellow? Yeah.

Ant Pruitt (02:36:36):
Somebody getting paid.

Leo Laporte (02:36:38):
So the law, which by, by the way, is an old law requires that as soon as you go over 5% stake in a company, you have to notify March 15th. He reached that, but he only made the public disclosure on Monday. Well, that seems like a

Ant Pruitt (02:36:54):
Isn't a

Stacey Higginbotham (02:36:54):
Violation,

Leo Laporte (02:36:55):
Especially since you could see how he made money because of it. Yes.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:37:00):
Auto lighter note.

Ant Pruitt (02:37:01):
I bet nothing to happen.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:37:03):
Leo. Don't I'm gonna, I'm going go to pictures here, but don't show the last picture until I come to the end of the fascinating story.

Leo Laporte (02:37:08):
Okay.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:37:09):
But while you guys were off, you know, taking time off leaving the show, Leo and me here alone, you know, trying to do our, I

Stacey Higginbotham (02:37:15):
Was at a tiny machine learning conference.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:37:19):
I went out, I went out and I decided to do a reporting trip for the sake of

Leo Laporte (02:37:23):
The show. Oh, good man.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:37:26):
Price,

Leo Laporte (02:37:26):
Journalism happening right here.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:37:27):
Exactly. Exactly. I read a story and I found out it was this, this thing that was technology based was nearby in Jersey city. I left Manhattan. I drove to Jersey city. I went to look at it. There is a robo burger maker, a burger vending machine. Stay on, stay on this picture for a second. Oh boy. And so you see this, this box here and you can put in the money and, and decide your condiments and get your you the next one. Now one

Leo Laporte (02:37:54):
More. And I gotta give you a clicker.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:37:56):
Here's their story. It's based in Jersey city. The founders did this. I thought this is wonderful. I'm gonna go, cuz I wanna do a video of this for the sake of the show. So I go and I try to find it it's in the food court. No, it's not in the food court. So I asked the nice guy, one of the things, not selling burgers, himself, selling something else. I said, can you tell me where this Rob burger thing is? He said, well, yeah, the record it's over there off the record. It sucks.

Leo Laporte (02:38:19):
Oh, they've been working 16 years.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:38:23):
15 minutes. Okay. And, and you go over there right over there to the BK, the dollar menu. It's better. But I said no for the sake of the show. Yep. I'm

Leo Laporte (02:38:31):
Gonna

Stacey Higginbotham (02:38:31):
Rob, I'm gonna sacrifice my stomach. I'm gonna go. So I go over and I find the machine. Now the third picture.

Leo Laporte (02:38:37):
Yes.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:38:38):
It's closed up. Be closed.

Leo Laporte (02:38:42):
It looks like it's got Billy Eilish. His head though, which is interesting. I

Stacey Higginbotham (02:38:45):
Know it's only open to

Leo Laporte (02:38:47):
3:00 PM. Oh it only works. 11:00 AM 3:00 PM. Monday to Saturday. How would there's a guy in there? Obviously there's there's a purse inside the robot. That's so obvious.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:39:00):
Like ground meat is pretty persnickety. So maybe it's a food I assume.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:39:05):
Oh, you're so nice. I have have a friend you're too nice.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:39:08):
Oh, I have a friend who

Leo Laporte (02:39:09):
Refrigerators.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:39:11):
I know. But once you start touching it to other things, unless the whole thing is refrigerated to a certain

Leo Laporte (02:39:18):
Level. Do you think somebody has to come out like a MC Flury machine and, and adjust and tweak it and clean it every day? Otherwise.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:39:25):
So I tried guys, I tried to go report on the robo burger for the show. Cause I knew it would

Leo Laporte (02:39:30):
Be, well, I want you to go back Monday through Saturday 11:00 AM. I'm not going,

Stacey Higginbotham (02:39:34):
I've done my thing.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:39:35):
So one of, one of my good actually covers food robots. He's familiar with this. So if you have questions, Jeff, I can give you his information and he will tell you,

Leo Laporte (02:39:47):
Does he know about salad bot?

Stacey Higginbotham (02:39:50):
He does. He knows about all the bots, all the bots, common bots, pizza bots, all kinds of bots.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:39:56):
All that's about. I used to go in Sans. I loved when I lived there, I would go to Moscone, not Moscone said before that it was the civic center and they'd have all these, you know, industrial shows. And my favorite was the food industry show. And I'd go find things like sausage extruders and all this great stuff. I love food technology. It's wonderful.

Leo Laporte (02:40:14):
Well, let's take a look at the video of the robo burger when it is at work

Speaker 14 (02:40:20):
Burger robot in a box, a robot. Should

Leo Laporte (02:40:24):
I just wanna point out burgers? It's big enough to hold a human. I'm just, I'm just gonna say, I'm

Stacey Higginbotham (02:40:29):
Just saying,

Speaker 14 (02:40:30):
Just say it. Robo burger is, see

Leo Laporte (02:40:33):
How big that is. Miniature. There could easily he's going

Stacey Higginbotham (02:40:37):
In

Leo Laporte (02:40:39):
Toaster

Speaker 14 (02:40:40):
Refrigerator all in just a 12 square foot format. Now you can get a freshly grilled burger.

Leo Laporte (02:40:48):
Somebody wasted a lot of money,

Speaker 14 (02:40:50):
Less than six minutes.

Leo Laporte (02:40:54):
Guys

Stacey Higginbotham (02:40:54):
Have almost 15 minutes.

Speaker 14 (02:40:55):
Step cooking process.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:40:56):
7 95

Speaker 14 (02:40:57):
To what chefs use in a restaurant.

Leo Laporte (02:41:00):
Similar to what chef use the in a restaurant

Speaker 14 (02:41:04):
Is the selected condiments, assembles the burger and delivers it. Piping hot. What? How does it taste? Well you see the bread looks good. We select only the highest quality ingredients.

Leo Laporte (02:41:19):
Oh please. There's a human. How did they choose this narration point? This is the worst. It's a cuz it's an April fools joke. That was like American wagon. It's an April fools joke. I honestly think so.

Speaker 14 (02:41:32):
Now everyone can have a freshly cooked restaurant, quality

Leo Laporte (02:41:37):
Meat. That's not restaurant. Where's the lettuce, tomato,

Speaker 14 (02:41:40):
My hospital waiting rooms or at 1:00 AM in the airport. No,

Stacey Higginbotham (02:41:46):
Not at one. Am the

Speaker 14 (02:41:49):
Beverages more conveniently the ATM money on the, and now robo burger brings

Leo Laporte (02:41:59):
Us

Speaker 14 (02:41:59):
Access.

Leo Laporte (02:42:00):
They need aromatic right next to it.

Speaker 14 (02:42:03):
Anytime, anywhere

Leo Laporte (02:42:06):
Or a taco truck with taco well Future you're right.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:42:09):
Whatever happened. The taco truck on every corner. I'm I'm I'm mad. We don't have that.

Leo Laporte (02:42:13):
Well that's what we got now is Rob boat burgers son.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:42:16):
I tried guys. I tried.

Leo Laporte (02:42:17):
Wow. Okay.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:42:19):
I didn't surprise you with the nice video. I thought you had a little hilarity and then

Leo Laporte (02:42:23):
Nothing. I was excited, but no, Nope, Nope, Nope. I wanna show you real quickly. And we were talking about Twitter earlier and you know, I'm not a huge Twitter fan. You no, but there is a new Twitter thing. It's gonna be a buck a month. You can try it free for the first month. Bear tweets, B a R E TTW. The idea is it doesn't have pictures. It doesn't have, it's just any tweet with out of text. No media, no URLs, no social media. Engagement's

Stacey Higginbotham (02:43:02):
The boring stuff.

Leo Laporte (02:43:02):
It's just the boring stuff. Exactly. And actually it is just the boring

Ant Pruitt (02:43:14):
Point taken,

Stacey Higginbotham (02:43:15):
Sir. Please read.

Leo Laporte (02:43:21):
Geez. Okay. This sucks.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:43:24):
The same guys who brought us robo burger.

Leo Laporte (02:43:27):
God, I really thought this was gonna be a good It's

Ant Pruitt (02:43:34):
So Horrible.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:43:37):
Well, I'm glad I had a good picture.

Ant Pruitt (02:43:40):
You telling your terminates

Stacey Higginbotham (02:43:41):
Better is yes you did. It's

Leo Laporte (02:43:46):
Just a lot of Bernie Sanders tweets basically. Okay. Hey, what do you got aunt?

Stacey Higginbotham (02:43:54):
Not gonna be hard to follow that a back then. Yeah. Go on aunt. You'll do great Twitter.

Leo Laporte (02:43:59):
Just the bad parts. Oh,

Stacey Higginbotham (02:44:01):
Just the boring parts. Oh my God,

Ant Pruitt (02:44:06):
Man. That is so bad. Oh,

Leo Laporte (02:44:08):
Oh

Ant Pruitt (02:44:09):
My my pick try to do these quickly. First one is a book. Guy I know who knows the author that wrote this book. Little Steve And I quizzed him on it. I was like, look, you know, it's, it's cool that people are writing books about Steve jobs and his journey and whatnot, and trying to keep teach kids about the, the beginning of personal computing. But Hey is wise mentioned in this and he was like, yeah, I totally get that. So there is another book coming out on the same aspect of this little Steve, that's gonna be dedicated to Steve wack as well. So I thought little,

Leo Laporte (02:44:44):
Little Steve. Didn't like to play ball instead. He invented big and small read long and you'll surely how the apple company came to be

Ant Pruitt (02:44:55):
Apple company, apple

Leo Laporte (02:44:57):
Company, apple company came to be the story of the Mac, iPad and iPhone reimagined for kids to bring into your home. Entrepreneurship is quite a big word. But with the little founder series, it will surely you be heard

Ant Pruitt (02:45:14):
Such a great narrator.

Leo Laporte (02:45:15):
They should have given this to Elizabeth Holmes,

Ant Pruitt (02:45:18):
Such a great little

Leo Laporte (02:45:19):
Steve,

Ant Pruitt (02:45:20):
But yeah, that's little Steve that's and then a WOSC version is coming soon.

Leo Laporte (02:45:25):
Well, it sounds like they're gonna do a lot of entrepreneurs. Like it's a series of little founders

Ant Pruitt (02:45:30):
Next

Leo Laporte (02:45:30):
Part of little founders

Ant Pruitt (02:45:31):
Next up. We have freedom. Lets if you watch hands on photography last week where I was talking about shooting in log L O G, that is a flat profile when you're shooting video and you need to apply a look up table L UT LUT to help bring that image back to life based on the data that's provided. Well, Skyla, as we've mentioned previously on the show is in Ukraine and they make a great piece of software called Luminar for photography and they are selling lots to help support them over there during this time, as well as offering up some support for some of the charities and things over there. And I think they started $30. So this

Leo Laporte (02:46:11):
Is really cool. So these are essentially filters. You can apply to your photos based on cities in Ukraine, which is there's a ESA Keve Sumi. That's really neat.

Ant Pruitt (02:46:24):
That's pretty cool in this photos or video you can apply it to. And today Plata pot, I just saw this this morning cuz I use a Pada pod. They announced a new Plata pod and it's already a Daum success on Kickstarters, the Plata pod at stream. I use one to help get, get shots in, in the landscape that's really, really low and keep the, the camera steady or, or heck I've hung it up on a tree or time or three to get some photographs. But now they added some extra tools with it to make it a little bit more convenient and more portable and heck they've already fulfilled their Kickstarter. 

Leo Laporte (02:47:03):
So it's a tripod for the ground

Ant Pruitt (02:47:06):
For the ground or if you want to do like I've, I've put my camera in the refrigerator and set it on a tripod honey where it looks like I'm opening the refrigerator and you can see me, you know, just creative uses for it.

Leo Laporte (02:47:18):
Cool. The Plata pod

Ant Pruitt (02:47:20):
Plata pod. And lastly, this comes from the show. I don't remember having this conversation, but apparently you and I did. You were, I did, we did. You were, I guess you were looking at some shoes and I said, do they have a size 14? And apparently they did. And they sent me a size 14.

Leo Laporte (02:47:41):
What?

Speaker 15 (02:47:42):
Yeah, it was so nice.

Ant Pruitt (02:47:44):
What I was like, I don't remember this conversation, but thanks.

Leo Laporte (02:47:47):
Adam's sneakers.

Ant Pruitt (02:47:48):
So Adams, thank you so much. And I get a little photo of the shoes since they were kind enough. But yeah,

Leo Laporte (02:47:55):
Adams atoms.com. So it's just like a little tiny, you know, mom and pop sneaker maker kind of do you like 'em?

Ant Pruitt (02:48:05):
Yeah, they're pretty nice.

Leo Laporte (02:48:06):
Let me 

Ant Pruitt (02:48:06):
They're actually look really nice. They're they're they're really nice for me. I'll say they at cuz I'm I'm not thatto

Leo Laporte (02:48:14):
Oh, that is really 

Ant Pruitt (02:48:14):
When I set up a little fashion. Oh

Leo Laporte (02:48:16):
I

Ant Pruitt (02:48:16):
Like those in the garage.

Leo Laporte (02:48:18):
Oh they're really, they're kind of, they're not like athletic shoes. They're like casual shoes,

Ant Pruitt (02:48:22):
Casual lounge shoes.

Leo Laporte (02:48:24):
Yeah. They look good. They look really comfy

Ant Pruitt (02:48:26):
And

Leo Laporte (02:48:26):
Then, and they have 'em in your size.

Ant Pruitt (02:48:28):
Yeah, they have size 14. Nice. And they feel good.

Leo Laporte (02:48:31):
Is this the, is this your shoot? Yep.

Ant Pruitt (02:48:33):
That's what I

Leo Laporte (02:48:34):
Oh wow. They deserve you should send that. That's nice. Yeah. Wow. How do you, you gotta to fly.

Ant Pruitt (02:48:41):
That's called fishing line.

Leo Laporte (02:48:44):
So it's really cool.

Ant Pruitt (02:48:46):
I tied it to fishing line onto a sea stand and I stuck a light behind it and wow. Just Played a around with

Leo Laporte (02:48:52):
It. Have you ever done the hands on photography and product shots?

Ant Pruitt (02:48:55):
We will soon.

Leo Laporte (02:48:56):
I hope you too.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:48:57):
Oh, you've done. You've done gadget shots.

Ant Pruitt (02:49:00):
I've done. I did food and

Stacey Higginbotham (02:49:04):
I swear you did GA I I've watched your thing about shooting. Yes,

Leo Laporte (02:49:08):
That is so cool.

Ant Pruitt (02:49:10):
Well

Leo Laporte (02:49:10):
Thank you. Well, thank you Adams.

Ant Pruitt (02:49:12):
Yeah. Thank you Adams. Appreciate it. Wow.

Leo Laporte (02:49:14):
A T O M S 

Ant Pruitt (02:49:17):
And I told em, let me know if they want to do something because I know a model that will really also know as hard heads that would really help those shoes. Cause he likes to model he's all in the fashion.

Leo Laporte (02:49:30):
They need you to give them some product shots is what they need to do. That is really neat. Thank you. Good job. They're from Brooklyn.

Ant Pruitt (02:49:39):
And when I dug into 'em a little more, they support creative artists. They've been trying to do a lot for helping out other creators across the history. Neat.

Leo Laporte (02:49:48):
Good

Ant Pruitt (02:49:48):
Stuff.

Leo Laporte (02:49:49):
Good pick. Thank you. Did I show you the only the good tweets thing? Oh yeah, I did.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:49:55):
Okay. It's time to go.

Leo Laporte (02:49:57):
Boring tweet. Only a dollar month for just the boring tweets.

Ant Pruitt (02:50:01):
I think I'll just keep my Twitter blue and leaving as it is.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:50:05):
There's Twitter, blue and Twitter boy, Twitter

Leo Laporte (02:50:08):
Bo it's bare, but it's pretty boring. They call it Zen, like, but I guess that means you're sleeping or something. I don't know. Stacy, you gonna bother Stacy on iot.com. Don't forget the IOT podcast she does with Kevin TOFL every week. Subscribe to her newsletters, check out the events. Anything else you wanna plug Stace?

Stacey Higginbotham (02:50:31):
No, I think

Leo Laporte (02:50:32):
Is that everything

Stacey Higginbotham (02:50:33):
You're doing great. Yeah. Sign up for the newsletter. Listen to the podcast

Leo Laporte (02:50:36):
Book club. Coming up.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:50:38):
Oh yeah, aunt did we? Oh, it's April 7th. Oh,

Ant Pruitt (02:50:41):
Right, right, right. No, no.

Leo Laporte (02:50:42):
You mean, you mean tomorrow? April 7th.

Ant Pruitt (02:50:44):
The vote is closing tomorrow, but this

Leo Laporte (02:50:45):
Vote is closing

Ant Pruitt (02:50:47):
This a landslide,

Leo Laporte (02:50:48):
But we already know, know what we're gonna be doing. Huh?

Ant Pruitt (02:50:49):
I've already got the auto version. I forgot the name of it, but I know it's like 22 hours long. It'll

Stacey Higginbotham (02:50:57):
Be a surprise. It's termination shock by Neil Stevenson then termination.

Ant Pruitt (02:51:01):
Oh,

Leo Laporte (02:51:01):
I love Neil Stevenson, but I haven't read that one. Yeah.

Ant Pruitt (02:51:04):
I've already started it cuz

Leo Laporte (02:51:06):
Yeah, you're gonna need the time. Yeah. So but it's not too late. If you wanna stack it in the, in favor of the shorter story, you can help Anne out by going

Ant Pruitt (02:51:16):
With it is not gonna happen.

Leo Laporte (02:51:17):
It's for club numbers.

Ant Pruitt (02:51:18):
I think think

Stacey Higginbotham (02:51:19):
Termination stock was all of that.

Leo Laporte (02:51:22):
Well why'd you put it on the list?

Ant Pruitt (02:51:23):
I think the most, well,

Stacey Higginbotham (02:51:25):
Because I wanted to give everybody was so excited about

Leo Laporte (02:51:27):
You should have the best Neil Stevenson book, maybe the best book of all time. Crypto noon on the list. Well,

Ant Pruitt (02:51:34):
Otherwise Jamer B was talking about

Stacey Higginbotham (02:51:35):
Noon was a terrible book.

Ant Pruitt (02:51:37):
No, what was it?

Stacey Higginbotham (02:51:38):
I don't like Neil Stevens.

Ant Pruitt (02:51:39):
Seven Eves seven Eves.

Leo Laporte (02:51:41):
I loved seven Eves.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:51:43):
I

Leo Laporte (02:51:43):
Read that book. Okay. Nevermind. Stacy's book club. Jeff Jarvis's fireside chat is a weak from tomorrow. That's right. 9:00 AM. Pacific noon Eastern. Now how you might ask, how can I listen in and hear more of that? More of Stacy's book club, more of the untitled living show more of the GIZ fizz. Well, there's only one way you need to join club TWI seven bucks a month. Woohoo gets you ad free versions of every show. You don't even hear this ad. That's how ad free it is. Plus access to the fabulous discord where we have all these events, aunt PRS, a community manager there. So, you know, it's a lot of fun and the TWI plus feed where all sorts of stuff that doesn't make it. You knows stuff from the cutting room floor shows. As I just mentioned and shows we're working on pushups, pushups, all of that, all you have to do is go to twi.tv/club, TWI $7 a month.

Leo Laporte (02:52:38):
And you know, in all seriousness, it really helps us out. Indeed. we now have enough members that is effectively another advertiser, which really helps in those slow times. And honestly, if we could get it to four or five advertisers, we'd probably just eliminate advertising entirely. So you know, thank you for the support, keep it up. We appreciate it and tell others, tell everybody, yeah, twi.tv/club TWI, you know, one way you could support us. We have a number of corporate members. Do you know how many corporate members we have now? It's three or four I think. Wow.

Ant Pruitt (02:53:09):
It's like four different ones. Yeah, but there's a couple hundred seats

Leo Laporte (02:53:13):
Amongst yeah. All together. So if you are in a company that you think would benefit, one of them, they just want everybody to hear security. Now they just want to hear, you know, every week they want 'em to hear security. Now all you have to do is go to twit TV slash club tweet. You'll see there's information about corporate members as well as individuals. And thank you from the bottom of my heart. Thank you in advance. Jeff Jarvis is well of course I have it here right down written down. It's the director of the, you knows the town night center for, you know, entrepreneurial journalism, you know, at the Craig Newmark graduate school of journalism,

Stacey Higginbotham (02:53:51):
Newmar,

Leo Laporte (02:53:52):
Newmark city, university of New York, you know, wake up in the

Stacey Higginbotham (02:53:54):
Middle of the night, doing that of that. I suddenly wake up and sit up a bolt upright and say, Newmark, Newmark, Craig Newmark,

Leo Laporte (02:54:00):
Please join us. For his special ask me anything a week from my tomorrow. That'll be a lot of fun. I Pruit hosts hands on photography that is at TWI TV slash hop. Sorry. It really is a fantastic photographer and person and human and our community manager in the club as well. Thank you, sir. And produces a number of shows for us as well is just great. And of course, a regular right here on twig. Thank you all for being here. We do twig every Wednesday, one 30 Pacific, I'm sorry, two Pacific five Eastern time. 2100 UTC. If you wanna watch us do it live, you can@livedottwidottvchatliveatircdottwi.tv. That's our community IRC. That's open to all. We also have a discord open to anybody who play seven bucks a month. Yeah, yeah.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:54:50):
I was like to some,

Leo Laporte (02:54:52):
To some, not to all, but you can chat in there as well. We'd love to see you there. After the fact on demand versions of this show at twit TV slash twig, all of our shows are on the website as well as on YouTube, every show as a YouTube channel. And of course you could subscribe cuz we're a podcast RSS baby. You could subscribe in your favorite podcast player. And if your podcast player supports reviews, leave us a five star review. That would be great. Thanks for joining us everyone. We'll see you next time. Another tweet is in the can. Bye bye.

Speaker 16 (02:55:27):
Hey, I'm Rod Pyle editor of Ad Astra Magazine and each week I'm joined by Tariq Malik the editor in chief over at space.com in our new This Week in Space podcast, every Friday, Tariq and I deep dive into the stories that define the new space age: what's NASA up to? When will Americans, once again set foot on the moon? And how about those samples from the Perseverance Rover? When are those coming home? What the heck has Elon Musk done now? In addition to all the latest and greatest in space exploration. We'll take an occasional look at bits of space flight history that you probably never heard of and all towards having a good time along the way, check us out in your favorite podcast app