MacBreak Weekly Episode 803 Transcript

Please be advised this transcript is AI-generated and may not be word for word. Time codes refer to the approximate times in the ad-supported version of the show. 

Mikah Sargent (00:00:00):
Coming up on MacBreak Weekly. Yes. Leo is on vacation, but don't worry. I am here with your regular panel of ReneRitchie, Alex Lindsay, and Andy. And NACO, we've got a lot to talk about. First. We talk about Apple's Q1 earnings <laugh> they earned a lot of money. Then we get into the really interesting details of the next version of I O west 15. It's in beta right now, but there are a lot of fun features coming out, including new emoji. We talk about the potential future of authentication and unlock on our devices and say goodbye to Harry Potter, wizards unite. It's all that plus so much more coming up on MacBreak Weekly.

... (00:00:42):
Podcasts you love from people you trust. This is TWIT.

Mikah Sargent (00:00:50):
This is MacBreak Weekly episode 803 recorded February 1st, 2022 mug break weekly. This episode of MacBreak Weekly is brought to you by zip recruiter. According to research, 90% of employers plan to enhance their employee experience this year. And if you need to add more employees, there's zip recruiter, zip recruiters, technology finds qualified candidates for your job, and you can invite your top choices to apply. Try zip recruiter for free today@ziprecruiter.com slash MacBreak and buy Wealthfront to start building your wealth and get your first $5,000 managed for free for life. Go to wealthfront.com/MacBreak and by cash fly cash is giving away a complimentary detailed analysis of your current CDN bill and usage trend. See if you are overpaying 20% or more for CDN, learn more@TWIT.cash.com.

Mikah Sargent (00:01:52):
Hello, it is time for MacBreak Weekly, the show where we talk all things, Apple, Macintosh computers and well, everything in between. And sometimes some nerdy stuff too. I of course am not Leo Laporte. If you are watching or listening, you can probably tell in both cases I am Mikah Sargent filling in for Leo who is on vacation, but don't worry because we've got the full panel here to get you started. Let's kick things off with youtube.com/ReneRitchie's ReneRitchie. Hello Renee.

Rene Ritchie (00:02:25):
Hello, Mikah. I made the mistake of trying to do an I an iMessage video and it, it went like 30 minutes long. So I'm about halfway editing it and I haven't stopped editing it yet. So I'm gonna be a little bit loopy, infinite

Mikah Sargent (00:02:34):
Loopy for the show. UN infinite loopy understood, understood the blue bubbles and the green bubbles. It's an ongoing conversation. I want teal bubbles. Can't we all get together with teal bubbles. Just be friends. I, I like that. I like that. Also joining us today it's Alex Lindsey, head of office hours.global oh nine. Oh.Media. I, I don't know. Do you call, do you consider yourself the head? At least the founder of office hours,

Alex Lindsay (00:02:59):
Chief trouble maker. I, I like that. I like chief trouble maker. <Laugh> I dig it. I dig it. Yeah. How are you today? Yeah, so we're yeah, we're doing, we're doing well. Yeah, we had we actually had someone on this morning, you guys to check out it's called stream voodoo. It does kind of what zoom does, but it's built for production. So we, so we've been but it seems that we got a lot of lot, I having a lot of fun. Yeah.

Mikah Sargent (00:03:20):
Awesome. Yeah, definitely. Go over to office hours. Dot global. I think some of the, some of the most common questions Leo and I have gotten on the tech guy show during the weekends, it's like, well, office hours.global. I be able to help you out with that streaming question. <Laugh> joining us as well. The ever jaw, the the always what's the word I wanna do the, the, the, the always metaphorical WGB H's own Andy and NACO. Hello, Andy.

Andy Ihnatko (00:03:52):
Long as you don't call me Buckethead. I'll take it. Thank you. <Laugh>

Mikah Sargent (00:03:55):
No buckets today. No, always always metaphorical. I think, although you yourself are not metaphorical, I just, you, you have some very good conceits

Andy Ihnatko (00:04:05):
I've I always part of my, exactly. I was gonna say exactly that I've, I've always, that that's been my, my aim in life, but, you know, we, we, I am, but an imperfect vessel to hold the universe's perfection.

Mikah Sargent (00:04:16):
<Laugh> all right, folks, let's kick things off today with earnings earnings in and of themselves can be kind of a, a boring topic. Take it from someone who has spent time transcribing said earnings calls in the past. Oh, sorry. <Laugh> you get some tidbits in there? That, that are interesting, but the, the overall is mostly just, Hey, here's this ridiculous amount of money we made. Would you call ridiculous Tim bits, the money we spent Tim bit. There you go. Tim bits. That's very good. Renee, can you tell us kind of the highlights of Apple's Q1 earnings, which ended December 25th, 2021?

Rene Ritchie (00:04:57):
Yeah. I mean like, well, first when you said that, I was like, did we have earnings? Oh, that was last week. And it, it seems like an eternity ago. Yes. Like as much as 2020 took forever, it was a week. It was a year of, of Tuesdays in March. I, I keep saying like this this year is going by like the, like the whispering angel, actually the weeping angels and Dr. Who, every time I blink another week is gone by <laugh>. So, but, but yeah, the interesting thing to me was, was twofold. One was, is that Apple made a phenomenal amount of money as they always do record breaking quarters, like after another, but that they were still constrained that they could have sold more. They could have given the people more. And that constraint is not on the leading edge note, not on like the, a 15 bionic and on the M one, but that's on all these legacy nodes.

Rene Ritchie (00:05:39):
And it just reminded me how dependent Apple is on. Cause we always talk about how, you know, Apple is so advanced. They have all this Silicon and it's all custom, but they still have a bunch of dependencies on much older technologies. And they sometimes have to pick and choose like, is supply gonna go to the iPhone? Yes. Is it gonna go to the iPad mini after the iPhone? So they had really robust sales of a lot of products, not as much as they wanted and the iPad mini was sort of left behind because they just, they just could not make enough to fulfill demand.

Mikah Sargent (00:06:06):
Do you think this is one of these opportunities? Well, if we can call it that it's a learning opportunity. It, the, the idea that you know, when the pandemic was kind of kicking off at first that became an object lesson of how our internet infrastructure needed work because more people needed to be able to work from home, learn from home and everything in between. And now we're seeing the supply chain is, is this one of these situations that that financial analysts, investors, et cetera, are going to be asking more questions about going forward and making sure that a company has protections in place to make sure that they don't have to divert the chips that they have here or the, the, the displays that they have there. Or is this kind of one of those we we'll let it move on. It's it's

Rene Ritchie (00:07:00):
Two years after introduction and you still can't go to the store and get a PS two or an Invidia, or like a real Invidia GPU. And there's very few fabs and those fabs had to close down and they were fires at some of them. And we just, and now Intel's gonna build another huge fab, but they're gonna license to TSMC in the meantime. And I, Alex is gonna explain it to me cuz I don't know what's happening in the world anymore.

Alex Lindsay (00:07:19):
<Laugh> well, I, I, I think that the, what it's really shown is how good Apple is at this and what you can do when you have a lot of money. So so they bought a lot of this stuff ahead of time and they are the number one client for most of their, most of their suppliers. And so when they say we want the first stuff off the rack, they're probably gonna get it. And so so the fact that Apple's been impacted has been interesting, the fact that they still pulled off a record, profit shows you how much control they have over their their whole system. And so it's, I think it's a fascinating thing to look at. I mean, in my world we have production that are shut down basically for a year. Mm-Hmm like the, the, the weight on some of the mixers that we've been looking at is over a year, you know, like to, to buy a, any, you know, like, you know, and, and so this is, this is so Apple being able to continue to operate maybe a little bit sluggish, but this is like saying, well, the guy ran a 4, 4 40 and not a 4, 3 40, you know, like it's not, when everyone else is running a four, eight or five, you know, so, so it's, you know, so they're, they're doing very, very well for what, for what they have.

Alex Lindsay (00:08:19):
They lost, they, they, they, they lost it, but also those are those that revenue is probably pent up. So it's not like someone's, they couldn't buy an Apple product. So then they're gonna go buy another product. So most likely they'll recover most of that in the next quarter. Yeah.

Mikah Sargent (00:08:33):
Now there's always the opportunity, again, Tim bits for some Tim bits in this. And one of the things that was brought up was a conversation surrounding the metaverse surrounding, you know, augmented reality. I think Tim would rather not have had a question about the metaverse in particular. But certainly a response to that. I'm curious in the past Tim cook, I can remember on several occasions talking about how AR was an important future for them. And did we get much color on AR on, on the AR initiative or VR initiative this time around

Rene Ritchie (00:09:14):
Do, can I just sneak in and say real quick that the like, it, it was so nice how he dodged Katie's question. Like she was all in on metaverse and he was like, I am never gonna enter the, mention the name metaverse one, because mark Zuckerberg wants to own it. And two, because it is so cringy, like cyberspace and information, super highway, it's what your parents use in the wall street journal, trying to think about what their kids are doing and not what the actual kids use. And then he just, he just went right into Apple to, I thought it was well

Andy Ihnatko (00:09:35):
Done. Yeah. Well, he'll see also mentioned like, Hey, we are, we have 14,000 AR kid apps in the app store, which is kind, which was kind of, kind of hinting at we, we, we can't talk about anything that we haven't announced, or we haven't, we're not preparing to ship immediately. However, we are saying that when we, we, we are not we're, we're not starting out at zero here. We've been actually shipping these kind of apps and creating these kind of APIs for the hardware for years now. And so as soon as we get something stupid that people will willingly strap on their faces for $3,000 we're gonna, we, we, we're gonna clean up.

Alex Lindsay (00:10:08):
And I, I also think that the metaverse is an edge, is it, it may turn out to be something very big, but it's still still an edge case. You still have to be a very vertical mark could have the kind of person I think Apple is not, that's not the market Apple's looking at for AR AR is something that everyone can use. When I I'm looking at getting a new stand under my TV and I went to Amazon and it just said, would you like to see that the stand that we have here in place? And I just said, sure, I clicked on it. It popped in at scale lit am I end up over top of the one that already sitting there? And I go, well, I kind of like that. And that's the kind of thing that Apple's looking for is how do you incorporate AR into everyday life, not how do you escape life to go into something else.

Alex Lindsay (00:10:50):
And I think that that's and I, and I think that the metaverse is very much driven from ready player one. And I think that I found ready player wanted to be a little bit dystopic <laugh> so, so I think that, I think that there's some folks. So I think that some folks are kind of like, well, maybe that's not what we want. And so but again, I think that the metaverse has that I'm working on things that are related to that. I think that it has, it potentially could be a huge market of how people interact, but it's still a long ways off be for, it becomes kind of common, you know, the common ground where the average person is going to be using it. Apple's building something. I think that, that, you know, their target market is typically what will 90% of the people want to do 90% of the time, not what will 10% want to do 10% of the time? Well, their, and the metaverse still, their vision is so different. Not 90, 90. Yeah.

Rene Ritchie (00:11:35):
Like their vision is so different too. Like mark literally wants people to live V the metaverse because he's tired of people closing tabs on Facebook and shutting the WhatsApp app on their phone. He wants it on your head so that you are immersed in it for your entire life. And you look up at your kid's school and you see his toilet paper ad floating above it. Where I think Tim just wants you to put it on, play a couple games, watch a movie, then take it off and do something else for him. It's another endpoint, the way the Mac was, the Mac book was the iPhone. The iPad were the Apple watches. Now, like they'll be the VR and AR end points it. He doesn't feel any need to sort of own your entire existence where I think Facebook really wants us to be living, dreaming, eating, sleeping, buying, and doing everything at else in VR all the time. Do

Mikah Sargent (00:12:14):
We think that this category or this, this product is going to be more of an earner like the iPhone, or is this product a way for Apple to make more money in services in a services category? Is this a that that's, that's what we think that this was all about out of ramping. Oh, okay. Well, yeah,

Andy Ihnatko (00:12:36):
I'm not, I'm not sure because nothing earns like the iPhone. I mean, the, every time we get a quarterly result, especially the quarter that is right after a new product release, we see exactly how big that slice of the pie is. Apple Apple has more than, more than more than thoroughly dismissed. The idea that without the iPhone, they couldn't be a profitable company because services is services is really the only, pretty much straight uphill line that they've got in, in their quarter results. It's, it's the one that doesn't have peaks and valleys. It's not like, it's not like how much money we're waking off off of China. Depends on the pH L levels of our political relationship right now. Well, how much are we, how are we, how much are we making on max? Well, we started to turn things around when we come out with a product that people like they respond to it services is the one that's just quarter after quarter after quarter.

Andy Ihnatko (00:13:28):
However, I, I do it's, I, I think I see it more of a, more like the key, middle of role of the iPad or fitness, because there just isn't an emphatic reason yet for anybody to have one of these, it, it, it, and I, I suspect that it is gonna be like the idea of an app like Instagram that made absolutely no sense until we have a, we have a mobile have mobile devices that have really good cameras and have really good internet connections everywhere. And not all of those things were in the control of the person who is writing the Instagram app. And I think that VR AR is gonna be exactly the same thing. I think that it really is gonna take, this is one part of a one part of a four-legged stool. We know what we know for sure. What one of the other legs is. We think what we know what the third Legg is, the fourth one is still a mystery. You even to a 2 trillion, two, $3 trillion company.

Alex Lindsay (00:14:19):
Yeah. Well, I haven't, well, I don't know anything about the Apple one. I, I have had the opportunity to look at AR and VR at a pretty high resolution, not stuff that's publicly available and it's pretty compelling. So if Apple actually follows through with what we're talking about, where we're, you know where we're talking about eight K a per I, 120 frames per second, or even 60 frames a second at that resolution it will, number one is that's why you would probably need two M M one chips to make that run. But, but also it really, you real at 120 frames, if it actually does 120 frames per second at a hundred at, at eight K as a VR goggles. Cause I think VR will be the first thing that they do. It really is compelling like that resolution and that frame rate becomes like a window into what you're looking at.

Alex Lindsay (00:15:04):
And it's a much different experience than anything we've seen in, in, in VR so far. So I think that it's gonna be a really interesting to see where they take that. I also think that I still feel like what we've done is what Apple's done is they're slowly rolling out tools. And I, and I think that those tools actually probably point towards, even though I, my, I wanna see it this year. I think that we're probably looking at next year because some of those tools aren't completely done yet, but what they're doing is very carefully rolling those out. And so I think that, I think that the first, this is gonna be a very slow role. I mean, I think that we see it maybe this year, probably next year, and then it'll be a hobby. Like everything else, it'll be a $3,000 unit that a handful of people buy.

Alex Lindsay (00:15:41):
But at some point it's, I think I, at some point, I think AR just based on the stuff that I've worked on in the last decade with AR and VR, that it'll be bigger than the phone, you know, over time. It just won't, but it necessarily have to be a metaverse to get back to what we were talking about before. It's something you throw on and experience and then take off and do something. I don't think you have to spend. I don't think I would not recommend medically anybody doing that for a long period of time. <Laugh>, you know, more than more than the length of a movie, cuz I don't think, I don't know. We don't know what's gonna happen with people's eyes when they do that. And so, so I think that that's, you know, that's one of the challenges there as far as software goes, I mean, it'll definitely make money.

Alex Lindsay (00:16:13):
I think the real question, and I think that a lot of the legal proceedings that Apple has right now may affect that may affect what that store looks like. You know, Apple may decide like for instance, if we get all this side loading and all the other stuff, Apple may decide, well, it's better for us just to do a closed system. Like we won't have any app developers, like we'll just, we'll just contract it, you know, much like we see with consoles, you know? And, and just, and, and because it's easier to do that at the beginning than to pull it back later. So they may, you know, so I think that as we watch all these things roll in how it may just be a subscription service to have access to all this stuff. And it may not be something that is an open platform. And I think that a lot of the legal proceedings right now will, may affect that decision

Mikah Sargent (00:16:50):
Renee. One of the things that you touched on or you've touched on multiple times is how some of the things that Apple does in public end up being part of the technology that's used in devices that come later or used in implementations that come later, is there stuff right now that Apple is doing in public, say the accessibility features with the Apple watch and grip movement that you think could become part of its AR VR hardware later on down the line, have you been kind of paying closer attention to anything that Apple's working on right now that could be part of that experience?

Rene Ritchie (00:17:32):
Yeah, I mean, for sure. And I think a lot of it is not always plan. Like sometimes people think that Apple has this grand plan and they're laying all these these eggs for, that are gonna hatch in three to five years. But a lot of times it's just opportunistic, like iOS eight introduced, continued and extensibility, and then a few years later they're like, we need some way to transfer Apple logic and interface between the watch and the iPhone. Oh, Hey, we have extensibility let's let's use that. And it seems like it was a genius move that they introduced it years ago and everyone adopted it. And sometimes they do lay like lay grain, work, like groundwork, like with size classes, you know, like, oh, suddenly you can make resolution independent apps. I wonder why. Oh, because now every single iPad and iPhone have completely different screen sizes.

Rene Ritchie (00:18:09):
But with this stuff, I think like the extensibility is still gonna be important because the, the glasses are gonna make the original Apple watch look beefy in terms of compute power. And it's gonna remain that way for a couple years. The ability to transfer app logic back and forth is gonna be really important MI emoji and, and an emoji. I mean, those originally were like, like just for fun, but it's, it's still people in the idea of having an avatar, like having a, an AR person persona and how Apple spread them to where we were talking about the other day or the other week that they animate and get mad at you. If you put your if you put your, your password in wrong <laugh> and that just lets people who aren't comfortable with the whole idea of having a virtual presence, just like, oh, that's just my emoji, you know, like really just boils the water around people.

Rene Ritchie (00:18:49):
And then you add in all the AR kit things that they've been developing for years, which required a lot of time from LIDAR sensors to you know, occlusion to just like the, the, the way that they can do vertical and diagonal and all these different vertices right now, all that stuff is gonna give them a huge advantage over a company that just tries to land a product and do it, you know, all out in pump. Look, I think there's just is a plethora of technologies that we're seeing. Yeah. and SD Z for Alex. <Laugh>

Mikah Sargent (00:19:17):
Absolutely. Don't forget the us D Z. We are gonna take a quick break before we come back with loads more news, including the latest betas, which are bringing a whole lot potentially of new features to iOS and Mac OS, including one I know Andy is excited about, but let's take a quick break so I can tell you about zip recruiter. So they've done some research according to the latest research, 90% of employers plan to make enhancing the employee experience a top priority 2022, after all a happy workplace is key to attracting and keeping great talent, a few ways to make your employees happier, could be by making your employees feel more valued, such as asking them questions, focusing on company culture, offering more learning opportunities, allowing for more flexibility and work schedules, showing more empathy, huh? Like making time to connect. And if you need to add more employees to your team, there's zip recruiter right now, you can try zip recruiter for free@ziprecruiter.com slash MacBreak , zip recruiters, technology finds the right candidates for your job and proactive presents them to you.

Mikah Sargent (00:20:33):
You can easily review these candidates and invite your top choices to apply, which of course encourages them to apply faster. So it's no surprise that zip recruiter is the number one rated hiring site in the us based on G two ratings. In fact, I know several gigs here at TWIT were found through zip recruiter, find the right employees with zip recruiter, try it for free for free folks at this exclusive web address. Zip recruiter.com/MacBreak that's zip recruiter.com/m a C B R E a K. And of course, thank you. Zip recruiter for sponsoring this week's episode of MacBreak Weekly. All right. Uso I mentioned this,uon iOS today this morning, in fact, Rosemary orchard. And I went into abso loop depth and detail about the new features for iOS,u15.4 iPad OS 15.4 betas. And so you can check that out if you want super in depth.

Mikah Sargent (00:21:35):
But a quick thing is that iOS 15.3 came out not too long ago. And that was all about fixing things. It was kind of setting things up for what was to come next, Iowas 15.3, fixed a vulnerability in safari and basically a bunch of kind of security improvements and other fixes there. But that update, you know, I think people probably just let that role in the background with that automatic update setting turned on let's hope Iowas 15.4 is the real fun. It is currently in beta. And so they of course have talked about some of the new features that folks can expect, including one that I think a lot of people are going to celebrate given the conversation that always happens whenever we talk about face ID with a mask unlock right now if you have an Apple watch and you put on the Apple watch and you type your little code in on the Apple watch and the Apple watch stays on your wrist, then the Apple watch can pretty much assume that you are you, then it can con converse.

Mikah Sargent (00:22:43):
So to speak. It can communicate with the phone and say, Hey, as long as this Apple much stays on this person's wrist, I can authenticate it. It's this person. And if you are wearing a mask, then looking at your phone, it will communicate with the Apple watch and say, yeah, definitely still this person they're still wearing the watch. They haven't taken it off it's them can unlock the phone and let you into it. You get a little buzz on your wrist and it says, Hey I, and unlock your phone. You can tap on that button to say, no, no, no, that wasn't me lock my phone at which point the passcode will have to be typed in. Folks complained that that's a great feature. Super cool, but that means that you gotta have an Apple watch. If you want to use this feature.

Mikah Sargent (00:23:24):
What if I don't have an Apple watch and I'm wearing a mask as is my duty. So Apple has, has introduced a new version of face ID that lets you unlock your phone while you are wearing a mask. I think Renee, one of the things that that people have to be aware of is that it does Apple kind of notes, that it is using less information. So in that way it's less secure because it's not using all of the details. But on the whole, it is still a very secure thing. It'd be like maybe my brother and I both wearing a mask looking into it. There's what a, a very small chance that his eyes and, and upper bone structure would be able to unlock it. But for the most part folks can do this. And then there's also the option for glasses. Are you pumped about being able to wear your glasses in your mask and still unlock your phone up there in the wilds of Canada?

Rene Ritchie (00:24:23):
It's interesting because like security it's like we, we think of it as an absolute, as a binary state, but it it's really like a threshold. And this is sort of like, let's say something happened in the world and everybody had to start wearing a bandage on the bottom of their index finger. And so all of a sudden touch ID couldn't get a full fingerprint anymore. And you'll like that, that's what we're dealing with here is that we're touch ID, sorry, face ID traditionally needed enough facial geometry data, enough points of facial geometry data to confirm a match. And that was everything from your eyes in a triangle down to your mouth. And now we started covering that whole bottom of our face. So it, it could not get enough data. And what Apple's doing now is biasing towards the eyes. It's trying to collect more data from around your eyes.

Rene Ritchie (00:25:02):
So it doesn't have to rely as heavily on the data from the him of your face, which is not getting at all anymore. Like it, it was joking previously. They said like, if you're an identical TWITn, they couldn't stop you getting in a face idea. Now it's like, well, you know, if you're a non-identical TWITn, <laugh>, you know, you'll probably get in too. So it's like, it's, it's just sliding that threshold a little bit. And that's one of the reasons for the glasses, because if your glasses are foggy, then it starts to not be able to the eye detail that it needs to compensate for the mask detail and the likelihood of your eye glasses being foggy goes up when it's cold and you're wearing a mask. So like all these things they have to juggle. And the point is and Steve Gibson says this way better than I ever could.

Rene Ritchie (00:25:40):
You have security and you have convenience. They are perpetually at war. And what the company's job is when every company's job is, is to give you the greatest security they can with the greatest convenience. Because if it's too secure, you yourself will get locked out. And if it's too convenient, everybody else will get in. So it is just finding that sweet spot. Will this be as secure as like full face face ID? No, but it will be good enough for most people most of the time. And it'll be way more convenient. I think a lot of people are gonna really appreciate it.

Andy Ihnatko (00:26:06):
Absolutely. Apple was already, already claiming that face ID was a multiple times more secure than fingerprint touch ID. They, they, they, you can't fault them. However, they, they have a, they got themselves into a problem that they didn't anticipate which is again the pandemic. But the, the, of the idea of, well, how do you unlock your phone when your face is partially obscured, that was gonna be a problem that, but that was gonna be an edge problem. And now they're stuck with phones that don't have any kind of fingerprint ID whatsoever. So you have to make a face, unlock, adapt to whatever the, the current situations of society are. It's also a little bit beguiling that this is a problem that everybody's trying to solve, not just Apple altruistically, trying to make sure that people can still use this very, very a biometric unlocked feature.

Andy Ihnatko (00:27:00):
That's gonna be way, way more secure then forcing you to remember a passcode. That's gonna be probably easy to copy, but also all the people who are in like invasive security, they're also working to solve this problem as well. People who are basically selling all those $20,000 cameras mounted on polls that are pointed towards activists activist aggregations. They wanna make sure that they, and see they can do face ID based on just the, just the top half of the face as well. So this is a, this is, this is gonna be a problem. That's gonna be solved much, much better as, as time goes by. And oddly enough, I think that it's gonna re yield a much, much better face ID. The winter is the winter is the one time that I really, really, really wish that I had face on lock on my phone.

Andy Ihnatko (00:27:43):
Yeah. All the, all the other, because again, it's like, I don't wanna have to pull off a glove during my walk, in order to, in order to do something. But all the other times of the year, it just feels more natural to just whatever the angle of my phone is, as long as I can, as long as I can find the, the, the scan pad, the touch pad for my thumb or my finger. It just simply unlocks. I, I think that we're gonna start to see a better balance between where does, where is this a better solution because it requires less interactivity. And where does it make less sense? Because you're forcing people to basically be the, <laugh> basically say, mirror, mirror, iPad, iPad on the wall. Please let me in right now, right now, please. I, you know, which is what I go go through with my iPad pro all the time.

Alex Lindsay (00:28:26):
Well, and, and a lot of it has to do also also with the cameras you know, what, what those cameras are seen and what they're using them for, you know, for instance, almost all of us, while a lot of us have geometric features, almost all of us have a heat map that is unique to us. And I don't think that Apple's cameras right now would see that, but it's, it's been used for a long time. So, so, you know, so that heat map is, is you know, is, is pretty accurate at distance. And so, so it, it is so I think that that's also whether they add more to those cameras as we move forward to, you know, cuz you could, theoretically those, those heat recognition systems can see through cloth. So it's, it wouldn't need, you know, so that might be something they update down the road. <Affirmative>

Mikah Sargent (00:29:07):
Speaking of this sort of idea of, of multiple means of authentication and being able to just tap the phone in some cases using your walking gate there's a patent that Apple has applied for over on patently Apple for its AirPods. And the idea is that due to the, the microphones and the acoustic computation that, that happens with those AirPods, it would be able to determine the unique structure of someone's ear canal and use that as a means of helping to authenticate that device. So now suddenly I can use my Apple watch to unlock my phone while I'm wearing a face mask or use face ID with the new way of doing things or even my AirPods are also being used to authenticate. And Renee, you talk a lot about that. Ambient authentication, future passive authentication. Yes.

Rene Ritchie (00:30:10):
Think with your Apple watch, you don't have to do anything like once you've unlocked it, as long as it's on your wrist, it is just unlocked. It has a trust date. That trust date is like, it's on the wrist. It's open with these other devices. Like I have pixels and with thumb and with face IDs, I have iPhones with thumb prints, face IDs, Samsung used to have Iris scanners. I sneakers my voice is my passport ath authorized me. Like they, they have so many ways of collecting data, like from, they're already doing the acoustic modeling, like you said, they're already doing gate analysis just to establish a, a threshold. And if you're fairly certain it's me, don't prompt me. If it ever goes below threshold, then forced me to do an active authentication. But otherwise like it's, it's their job to do the heavy lifting, not

Alex Lindsay (00:30:46):
Mine. Well, and, and over time when you have a lot of these devices that you're interacting with it, it can make it comp it can error, correct. Based on all of them going. Yeah, yeah. That one doesn't look as good as we thought it was, but we've got all these other things that, that would reduce the variables to almost zero because it's your heartbeat, your heart rate. Is it your behavior, oftentimes your be your behavior what, what you're doing, your, your all of those things are, are things that are, are within a range at any given time. And, and the advantage that Apple has is you're wearing them and using them all the time. So its sample rate is very high, so it can see the trends. So you may not be the same that you were six months ago, but you're the same as you were yesterday, you know, are similar. And so that's the, and, and so those, and, but this is also why Apple's so intense about privacy is because they're pulling up stuff. That would be a gold mine to, to a lot of the companies that are trying to pull data. And that's why their business probably will never be around data because they're gathering all this biometric data. But it also means that your phone will be the most secure thing you own.

Mikah Sargent (00:31:43):
Yeah.

Rene Ritchie (00:31:43):
You asked them Alex and you asked them again, and then you ask them again until they tell you to stop asking them. That's what Steve said.

Mikah Sargent (00:31:50):
<Laugh> oh my I did wanna mention something for folks who are considering upgrading or updating to the beta. If you use Dropbox or Microsoft OneDrive or other applications, those are kind of the most popular that make use of a kernel extension. That will be deprecated in the next version of macOS. Then you will not want to get on this beta because you will not be able to use these. Apple says is my straw K Micah? My keyboard MYR is

Rene Ritchie (00:32:22):
Myro still okay. No Myro for dropped. I didn't even think about that.

Mikah Sargent (00:32:26):
So what I, my understanding is that Dropbox and Microsoft OneDrive aren't all together, but the beta version of Dropbox and the beta version of Microsoft OneDrive will work. Dropbox lets you get in on the beta, but Microsoft OneDrive does not have that beta. So that's just something to be aware of. Now scooter X in the chat is saying that Dropbox is working fine for them in 12.3 beta one. So I guess take that as you will, but Apple did confirm to IMO that these, it breaks the kernel extension. So just be aware of that, that you may have trouble. It says in this, in the case of Dropbox, third party apps can no longer open online, only files. So if you're using that Dropbox sync method where you have files that just exist online then you need to be aware that that will not let you then open those files. So you'd have to download them first and then be able to use them, which that's just something that I do anyway. I typically

Alex Lindsay (00:33:28):
Just, yeah, I was gonna say like that, that would affected me a lot 10 years ago, but I haven't taken, I haven't let Dropbox do that automatic thing for a decade. It's it's made me crazy because it just, you know, suddenly a my drive's full, you know, and I know that this is leaving them online, but I just stopped it all together. I was like, I'm just gonna use, I just use it in the web. Yeah. Yeah. And if you

Rene Ritchie (00:33:47):
Have the advance plan, you can put like literally unlimited stuff on Dropbox. I was talking to a photographer who has like 70 terabytes of his archives on Dropbox, getting

Alex Lindsay (00:33:56):
It, getting it up as easy, getting it down is not like it's, it's really like, like I don't put anything else on Dropbox, any, anything new because I'm still trying to get all the stuff that I have in Dropbox down. They're making a lot of money on me just because I can't get all of it off one time. It's, it's such a disaster. Like, and, and I would never use them again except for the bad go, but you can't get out. Yeah, you can go. Yeah. So just know that when you start putting so on the web there it's yeah. It's not trivial to get it off.

Andy Ihnatko (00:34:22):
Mm Micah.

Rene Ritchie (00:34:23):
Oh, yes. Renee. No, I, I don't Andy.

Andy Ihnatko (00:34:27):
Oh no. I just, just before we get back to, to the beta, one thing that was kind of interesting about the new editions of of of one drive they announced support for for, for packages, for, for file bundles. So for instance, famous Scrivener saves its project files as app as, as packages. So because there's so much data in there, it's, it is one file, but technically it's a folder that contains lots and lots and lots individual files. And that's why there isn't a really easy way to sync files VI through the cloud. However, if the, the fact to OneDrive is about to support this, this unusual, here's a file, that's actually a folder, but we're gonna be sort of wink, wink, nudge, nudge about it. Hopefully that means that a lot of Mac apps like Scrivener will be able to sync a lot more reliably and a lot more easily through OneDrive than my, through any other cloud service. I

Rene Ritchie (00:35:19):
Look up pro does bundles too.

Andy Ihnatko (00:35:22):
We really,

Rene Ritchie (00:35:23):
Yeah.

Mikah Sargent (00:35:24):
Sorry, Renee. You were, you were about to bring up something. I was gonna,

Rene Ritchie (00:35:29):
I was just gonna make a multi face emoji joke because that was just

Mikah Sargent (00:35:32):
So on 0.0, that's thats next that's next. But before we get there,

Rene Ritchie (00:35:36):
That was the perfect time to introduce that because this is how I feel now after hearing about Dropbox.

Mikah Sargent (00:35:42):
I do wanna, there's a really interesting conversation in the chat that I am curious to hear folks take on. So the conversation surrounds biometric authentication. We were, are just talking about these sort of ambient means of biome biometric authentication, and you will hear security folks who choose not to use any of this kind of thing, face ID, touch ID all sorts of methods of biometric authentication. What is the reason why you feel comfortable sort of using these methods of getting into your phone versus someone who is a quote security expert not working for alphabet agencies like

Rene Ritchie (00:36:31):
Alex Lindsay does. That's basically reason

Mikah Sargent (00:36:33):
That's and that's, that's what I figured. I just wanted to, to sort of have that conversation loud because yeah, for, you know, for me I, I think it's also important to talk about where that data is stored because you know, to this day, I still have to occasionally educate on the secure enclave on the iPhone and in some of these different devices where your face recognition data is stored versus where it's not and your fingerprint data, all of that kind of thing. Oh, can

Rene Ritchie (00:37:05):
I just, and again, real quick, I don't wanna get rendition. I was just making a agents of shield joke about Alex. Please do not rendition me. <Laugh>

Alex Lindsay (00:37:11):
<Laugh> yeah. The, the I, I don't think that, I think this is why Apple is so like, they'll let you do what you want to do in the, if a government asks for something in the cloud, they give 'em, they give 'em something in the cloud. But one of the reason, examples, so careful about the phone is because they're keep, they're keeping this many reasons, but one of the big reasons is because they're keeping all this biometric data on the phone. They're not putting it anywhere other than the phone, the phone has, has it sitting there. And, and so like, for instance, I, you know, I'm not I'm no, I'm no longer a target of state actors. So so the so as, as a result, I'm a little less, a little less worried about it. When I, when I was, I, I definitely didn't let, let it do anything.

Alex Lindsay (00:37:50):
The, but the, the main thing is, is that that, that you do wanna be careful with the phone, you know, like it's, it's one of those things. It carries a lot, it's a really powerful tool, but like, for instance, mine turns off, I've got a very long code, long login, and mine turns off immediately, like thir, you know, 30 seconds or 15 seconds or whatever. And I, and I have it by habit when I set it down, I just turn it off. And so, so I think that you get used to the fact that you're gonna stay secure and the, that someone could probably do something with that, but it would be very difficult, like, you know, and, and, but it is the one place that I, that I, I'm probably the most careful about what I, you know, what I do with it.

Alex Lindsay (00:38:29):
So I do think people have to be conscious of it. I do think that if you're not, if you're boring, <laugh>, you know, you probably have to worry about it less, you know, I'm, I'm at this point pretty boring. And so I, I, I don't work on anything that would put me in that, in that position anymore. And so, so I think that it's, it's, it's one of those things that if you're, if you're an exciting, you know, if you have an exciting life, then, then you have to pay attention to all of those things. You know, like all of those things become important. I think if you're boring, probably a little less.

Rene Ritchie (00:38:56):
Yeah. And of course, Apple doesn't store the actual images that they take. They don't store the biometric data. There was this problem for a while where like Samsung and HTC were storing the actual photos in world readable directories, which was bad, but Apple converts them into math and then only stores the math and then only stores the Delta files for face ID changes. And it is non-trivial my understanding is it's non-trivial up to like heat death of the universe to reverse engineer that mathematical transformation.

Andy Ihnatko (00:39:22):
Yeah. Cause one, because the thing is the, the biometrics are great because you carry 'em with you all the time. They're terrible because you can't really change them. So that if, if, if my bank said, Hey, we got this great new, now you no longer even need it, carry your card around, you know, you carry a phone, just let us take a 3d scan of your face and just, you know, as soon as soon you're standing there, it'll make sure it's you who's using your account. But that's the point where I get paranoid saying, okay, but who is having control of who's having control of that scan? Are you storing just a check sum or you storing the actual data? Because the, honestly the things that drive me outta my mind are when there's the old joke at NASA about the astronauts at the top of a Saturn, a Saturn rocket saying, it's, it's you try not to think about the fact that every part in this rocket was built by the lowest lowest bid.

Andy Ihnatko (00:40:10):
And the same thing is true of security where a bank is not gonna say, well, well, what are we gonna go for the best tightest? Most, no, here's someone who just said, whatever, whatever the lowest bidder does will underbid 'em by 10%. Yeah. They're the people who are gonna be basically storing a JSON file on, on Dropbox or on, or on an unprotected container on on Amazon web services. So with, with all my biometric information, so that borrowing, borrowing, getting into a car accidents and disabling the airbags, I am not going to be able to protect that counter.

Rene Ritchie (00:40:42):
It's been really quick story. It's like, I was, I was going through customs and I, I have a nexus card and I went up and in order to get into the us, it's like fingerprint or retina scan. And it, it just did the retina scan. And I walked up and the person, the customs guy who was like, you know, very like, it was like, why are you going to the us? And I said, I'm going for a meeting with Apple. I was like, I hate Apple. They stealing all our face data. Like you just saw me scan to get like, and I'm sure that's going to like the company who's who just announced a hack three days ago. It was like, that database is not secure. And then when I came back, I like, I had to go through the, I had to do a very brief trip recently during like the lulls. And I went up and it didn't even ask for it. Like it used to make you scan your passport, scan, your fingerprints, do the rein 90. It just looked at my face and said, ReneRitchie and had all the information about everything. Like I never gave them a face scan. Like, where did this come from? It was, but it was so fast that I

Alex Lindsay (00:41:32):
Almost didn't care. Well, and, and almost, and the thing is the thing is, is that once you, once you know, how deep the rabbit hole is, you stop wor you stop worrying about it at some degree, because you, you know, like the you know, when you stand in front of an ATM machine, you are identifying yourself in front of a camera. Yeah. You know, and, and so, and, and, and they don't tell you what kind of camera or what that does, but it, you know, it could potentially identify you by your Iris by your heat map, by your, by your geo geometry, all of those things while you're pulling 20 bucks out. So, so the thing is, is those kinds of things are, that's probably the ATM, which probably the most dangerous, you know, like, because it, because it has a sure fire you're, you're saying, I am me, I'm gonna type of code that proves that I'm me.

Alex Lindsay (00:42:11):
And I'm standing right in front of where I get a clear shot of the face, you know? And so the thing is, is that those are the kind of things that, you know, but we don't think about those. <Laugh> like, we, we just kind of like go get our money, you know? And so, so those are the things that I think a lot of people are kind of unconscious to that they're that, that are around them all the time. And so you can worry about these things, but they can take you down a path of paranoia that is probably, oh, we are applicable to most of us. If, if you are a reporter that are, is reporting on the Saudis and, and, and are negative, you need to pay attention to absolutely. Every possible thing that is, is there, I mean, like, I just wanna make sure there are people that need to be, you know, they need, they need proper trade craft and, you know, like to, to, to ma you know, manage what, what they're doing, but, but if you're an average person, you know, most of us aren't, aren't getting hacked because is not interesting.

Mikah Sargent (00:42:56):
<Laugh> right. Right, right, right. We do, we should talk about a few other features. The one I mentioned earlier that I think Andy would be excited about is one that you talked about before, after all this time of being promised that at some point we would see universal control. We didn't even get it in the betas of testing it over the summer, anything like that, but it has finally hit the beta's universal control is in existence. Andy, tell us what universal control is. If somebody listening doesn't know 

Andy Ihnatko (00:43:26):
It's, it's, it's one of those brilliant features. That's just so very simple. If you have, if you, if you have max and iPads and they're within proximity of each other, and you've turned on these features, basically the keyboard and mouse in front of you, it leaves the screen of your Mac, and it simply enters the screen of your iPad. And if you have texts that you've selected on your iPad and you drag it off the screen of the iPad, you can drag it into the screen of your Mac. And it's not like you're just using it as an external display. It's still an iPad, and you're still interacting with all the apps of that iPad as iPad apps. But now they're just simply working together as one harmonious whole, and now suddenly it makes a lot more sense that all the stuff that I certainly was complaining about, or excuse me, skeptical about five years ago about, oh God, but they're, they're making the, I don't know if it's a, if it's a really great bargain to be making the Mac interface looks so much like the iPad interface, but they're creating that single seamless thing.

Andy Ihnatko (00:44:20):
And the great thing about this feature is that it's not, if you have this one, if you have the Intel Mac and the Intel based I'm sorry, Intel Mac God, if you have the Apple Silicon max, and if you have the Apple Silicon M one based iPad works together, no works with a whole bunch of Intel and Apple, Silicon max. It works with a fairly recent vintage and the best thing of all, the reason why I wasn't, although this is a feature that I've been looking forward to since it was first announced last year, I wasn't terribly disappointed when, and it was delayed. It didn't show up in betas because it has to work. It can't be like the Bluetooth speaker that sometimes sometimes connects sometimes doesn't, it can't be like the TV tuner that I've got on my network. That's sometimes my DVR can find it.

Andy Ihnatko (00:45:05):
Sometimes it can't, it has to be something that EV I get home. I take my iPad outta my bag. I put on the stand next to next to my Mac and without doing anything else, simply it's part of my workflow for the Mac. And I, unfortunately I don't have enough copies. I only have one Mac that it will work with. And so I can't sacrifice that one on the beta on, on a beta yet, but I've been veraciously devouring, every single video of people using it. And it does look like it works as advertised, which I'm hoping is gonna be the FA the fact I'm sure. I'm sure Reneand Alex might have tried it. I,

Rene Ritchie (00:45:39):
I did, but I think you need a T2 Mac if it's Intel, because I think it, or I dunno if you need it, but if you have it, it does all the acceleration that you would get off Apple, Silicon, cuz T2 is essentially an a eight chip from an iPhone anyway. So you have tried. I, yeah,

Andy Ihnatko (00:45:55):
Just quickly. I have it in front of me, MacBook MacBook pro 2016 and later MacBook 2016 and later MacBook error, 2018 and later iMac 2017 and later iMac late 2015 IM pro IMC many. Right, exactly. Ipad compatibility, any iPad pro iPad, a third generation later, iPad six generation later. <Laugh> I feel like, I feel like I'm announcing school closures. <Laugh> <laugh> blue brutal vocations mask were closed. <Laugh> all par public and parochial schools and the IMEC and the iPad, many fifth generation later. So wide sweat of hardware and

Alex Lindsay (00:46:28):
The Apple TV. Like I was like, it just shows up at add display office. I was just like, okay, so that's,

Rene Ritchie (00:46:37):
System's good.

Mikah Sargent (00:46:39):
Renee, what have you, what do you think about, I, I unfortunately have to use Dropbox every single day, so I was not able to install it on my system. But I am curious cuz I did, I have an iPad that I did install the beta on and in general I think it's airplay and handoff settings. There's now an option to toggle on yeah. The mouse and cursor option. So I did that and just sat there kind of one day <laugh>

Rene Ritchie (00:47:05):
No, I mean, it's it like, it's really cool. I was using side car anyway, because like I have like, it's a weird world we live in, I have a mini L E D HDR just display on this M one MacBook pro and that I'm editing in final cut. And now I can have like the full thing of on a mini L E D HDR, iPad pro next to me. Mm-Hmm <affirmative> so I have like a full HDR workflow that would've been not impossible, but like, like not like Simpson's level impossible, but like $80,000. There's some ridiculous amount of money just like five, six years ago. And now that's just like an escalation, because with sidecar, you were just giving your iPad over to the Mac. It's the, it ceased being an iPad anymore, but now you can have like, you need a Mac to start it.

Rene Ritchie (00:47:46):
You can't start it on iOS device yet. That just for, because of idiosyncrasies and how that all works. But as long as you have a Mac, you can have two other iPads, two other Macs, an iPad, and a Mac. And it, it, it works just like you think it, it detects which direction your, your cursor is going in. If you go beyond these, if you keep pushing beyond the side of the device and it detects another device, like it'll just go right over in that direct and you just control it. Like, it's so weird to describe it because it is so simple and describing simple things is so difficult, but it like you're, it is if you, they are distinct devices, but you are controlling them with one device. And it, it, I hate to say it it's like the most cliche thing. It just works.

Rene Ritchie (00:48:26):
You're opening things, you're closing things, you're doing things you're doing, you're doing IOY things like on the IOE things, Mac things, opening windows, closing windows, launching things, typing things. And I, I like that. There's both because sometimes I really just want an extra display, like even like an Apple TV, like I'll, I'll just turn that next display, turn an iPad and extra display. Watch my videos, a different sizes and different ways to, to like look for mistakes. But as distinct vices, it is so nice that I could be doing this and not add extra any burden to this device. Like no extra GP or nothing have an iPad over here, and I can go and quickly write a message without taking my eyes off you, Micah, and then go back and act like I'm paying attention again while I'm doing this, but still like sending that sarcastic message to the TWIT discord, you know, like it is just, it is. So I don't wanna say magic cuz it's not magic. It's just really clever app. Really clever application of compute technology.

Andy Ihnatko (00:49:17):
Yeah. It also works Mac to Mac, doesn't it? Yeah. I, right now I have it. The, my third monitor is my Mac mini. Yeah. So that's that's exactly. So that's exactly one of the things I'm anticipating in the near future. Renee, the idea of, I, I can have my three, four screen set up. My, my Booton wall of sound like exactly my, my, my wall of monitors, but just, just as you say, when I'm ripping a, when transcoding a DVD, I don't necessa, I don't know that this, I don't know that it's running on its own Mac mini, however, that's what it's actually doing. It's not like one computer that's has four screens onto it. It's like on this screen, everything will be done by its own isolated set computer. And that's, it, it really, it, this is part of the payoff.

Andy Ihnatko (00:50:03):
We, we don't always get such an explicit payoff for investing in the Apple ecosystem, but this was one of the reasons why I pulled the trigger on on the iPad pro last year that I, because it's, I can't spend $1,100 $1,200 with just Willie nilly. However, the fact that yes, but I could be able to use this as a separate display on my desktop when I'm traveling all the times where I've I'm, I've got a deadline, I've got a research project. I wanted an extra monitor on my MacBook, but I certainly can't bring a second, a second display with me. And now universal control, knowing that this is going to be, this is not gonna just be the thing that I use when I'm gonna be spending three or four hours in Boston for the day in meetings and stuff. This is to be something that enhances all of my workflows in the office. This is why you have to mitigate. Yes, there is, there is an Apple tax on a lot of things, but sometimes the intangibles are actually make, make make up for the expense. And then some

Mikah Sargent (00:51:03):
That of course is all about universal control. I am pumped to get, to give this a go, whenever it comes out, I'm using sidecar right now to be the computer, the display that I use to monitor what's going on. It's where the zoom goes. Cuz I can put it right up beneath my webcam, which is handy. There are a, a lot of other

Andy Ihnatko (00:51:25):
Can I say, can I say one last thing? I'm sorry. I, I forgot to say one, one thing that's super exciting though, is that I'm hoping to see a lot of developers use sidecar, not to exploit sidecar, not just as an external display, but as an external user interface control surface. The idea of having an iPad flat on the desk that is like, here's my color picker here is a, a scrubber controller for, for video. I really think that's a huge opportunity that the, the, the control bar kind of slapped at this, but the idea of having an iPad mini that you're just using for buttons and, and, and knobs and controls, that is pretty. That would be pretty slick.

Mikah Sargent (00:52:03):
That would be delightful. All right. So a few other things that are coming in well should be coming in iOS 15.4 include a bunch of new emoji, including his Ren Renementioned earlier, the melting face emoji. The one that continues to make me incredibly uncomfortable, which is the lip bite emoji and invisible. What is fossil with the lip emoji? Ah, stress is, are there worse than feet? No, nothing's worse than that. So that's, yeah, lip, bite's pretty bad, but nothing's worse than that. And I think one that I, I will definitely be using a lot of, which is the invisible person emoji. It's just got an outline of a person and it's reminiscent of comic books where the artist would show that a person was either invisible or kind of undetected by drawing an outline around the person. And we all feel invisible sometimes. Micah. Exactly. So when I'm in the group chat and everybody else is not paying attention to the thing that I said, I can just send that emoji and oh, passive, aggressively aggressive emoji. We're finally get to that point in the development. Yes. That's precisely what it is. Or maybe

Speaker 6 (00:53:11):
You wanna be, maybe for me sometimes I just wanna be invisible. I'm like, I don't want

Mikah Sargent (00:53:15):
To, that's great too. I, I can think of a, if you have like a roommate or something and they are chatty, maybe I've had this experience in my past is what I'm saying. A very chatty roommate. If I could just sent that emoji right there, <laugh> if I could have just sent that emoji and, and been like, this is the time when I just want to go into the kitchen and get the beverage I was trying to get without having a three hour conversation before I go back to the space that I was in. It's just like invisible emoji, which

Rene Ritchie (00:53:44):
Is a TV. What does the beverage say

Mikah Sargent (00:53:45):
About you? Any other iOS, 15.4 tidbits worth

Andy Ihnatko (00:53:52):
Talking about? Can, can we, can we mention the most interesting and I think positive one of the most positive ones is they've added a pregnant man emoji, or it's being called the pregnant man emoji, which is a, a human with a male, secondary sex characteristics who also has what appears to be a pregnancy belly, which is yes, it could be, yes, it can be funny for, oh my God, I can't believe I ate 15 calzones, but I won the hat and the t-shirt woo. But also it kind of reflects that there are, there are for instance, transgender men who might be carrying a baby, there might be it's it's, it's, it's, I've always every time that there is a, a new, new emoji proposed, that's always a really fascinating thing to dig into because it always speaks to what society is going through at that time, new awareness, new new tamping down of ignorance society changes like, okay, well now now AVAC now a needle does not mean like I'm withdrawing blood.

Andy Ihnatko (00:54:50):
A needle probably means I'm receiving a vaccination. So we need, we need to change that emoji. Now we actually need people with with breathing masks as an emoji, because that's part of what society is going through. So I that's, it's such a fascinating window. I think that of, and a thousand years from now, that's gonna be a really, it's gonna be like the ice core samples that we see that then people take, say, okay, here's what, here's what was going on in 2021, because we can see what did the, one of the few true international methods of communication is the emoji. And here is part of the language that we needed to add. Here's the lexicography that missing that we had to add in 20 21, 20 22. And I just thought that was very, very interesting. Of course, Fox news is, is a, is a bit upset about it because apparently the tech industry is continuing to try to Gaslight real America, but, oh, well

Mikah Sargent (00:55:42):
Well, I am not going to Gaslight real America when I take this break. Before we come, before you go to the break mic, can

Rene Ritchie (00:55:48):
I just yell out 1, 1, 1 last beta

Mikah Sargent (00:55:50):
Feature? That's interesting. One last feature. It looks like you can have it be better support

Rene Ritchie (00:55:54):
For progressive web apps especially for notifications for progressive web apps, which a lot of people are excited about on the same day we lose world. Yes. I understand the irony of all of this, but you know, the universe at the universe acts way, the universe acts

Mikah Sargent (00:56:08):
That was very very interesting to see how kind of different people reacted to that. In fact, I've got a, we, we might chat about that a little bit later but the, the progressive web apps, yes. Push notifications on iOS, like they are on Macs as well as Apple has introduced the M what is it? MX? Yeah. Or excuse me, XR. That's what it is. The XR API, so that websites can take advantage of AR VR applications. Yes. with their website sites. So right now there's not really a headset that would work with iOS. So that would be something that could potentially be coming in the real room. Right. Right. And then also it gets a little bit easier for you to choose the icon that shows up whenever you, you, as the developer to choose the icon that will show up for some one, whatever they add your app or your website to the desktop.

Mikah Sargent (00:57:07):
Yeah. I remember reading this page of like, you have to name this file, this file, this file, and this file, and they have to be named just like this. They need to be in this part of the HTML tag. They need to have this yeah. We have to format. You have to do. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. And it's like all these different kinds instead of using the standard, which is just an image that's labeled icon now safari is, or the, I guess the system is using the, the standard one. So that will be good. As well, now we will take that break and we will come back with lots more to talk about and go, including a conversation Renerecently had with Apple's head of user privacy. But first this episode of MacBreak Weekly is brought to you by wealth front.

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Rene Ritchie (01:00:05):
Yeah, it's Eric, no wonder. Who's head of I think is technically director of user privacy, but like Apple has different kinds of directors. It's like marketing people, engineering people he's clearly like a high order bit nerd engineer because he gets his hands dirty on architecting and deploying all of this stuff. And it's fascinating app. It was world privacy day. And you know, he wanted to talk about the things that they were doing with mail. Namely like hide my email and mail privacy protection because that is such an old system and it was never architected to have any understanding of security and privacy. And people have tried to grasp various levels of security and privacy to over the years. But it's hard because everyone uses different clients and every implementation is different. And Apple is doing these things where you can supply sort of like burner emails to any company that you sign up for and then manage them.

Rene Ritchie (01:00:54):
But also a, a version of private relay where if an, if an email comes in, marketing companies use these things called tracking pixels. And basically of there's like a little invisible pixel that's included with the email. And when you open that pixel, because it's stored on their server, they get a ping from it. And then they know where you are geographically based on your IP address when you opened it, how many times you opened it, all this information that maybe you don't wanna supply to them, like even just validating that your email is real, that someone, that someone opened it and that makes it valuable when they resell it to the next, you know, mailing list company, all those things. So now what happens is, as it goes, as it goes to you, Apple uses a private relay service, which means they have no knowledge of what it's doing, but it basically opens all the email for you at random times.

Rene Ritchie (01:01:37):
And it random IP addresses so that nobody has any idea when the, a like, whether you actually saw it because all the get as an Apple relay back or, you know, what time it was, where you were, any of those data points. He also really kindly touched on a lot of other stuff that Apple's doing in general and their philosophy and what it's like working for a company where everybody from Steve jobs in that famous interview with wat Moberg and car Swisher went on about privacy to Tim cook saying, it's a human right to Craig. Federici just superhero three point stance dropping into the back cave of every Apple park, WWC presentation to where they keep Eric you know, and the other privacy people hidden in the dark. It looks like most of the time. So it was just fascinating to hear their, their philosophy, like, cuz they really believe in building this stuff in like a feature gets proposed and they think about the privacy applications from the beginning.

Rene Ritchie (01:02:27):
They, they can't like just, she slack it on at the end when they want to kick the product out the door, it has to meet these privacy goals along the entire development process. And you know, just the responsibility. And I'll talk to a little bit about like, when will make these statements, we're gonna hold them to account. And he thinks that's a good thing too. Like I think everybody knows they're gonna, they're gonna stumble. They're gonna follow it sometimes. But having that, those, having, making those statements means that we get to like hold them into account way more than a company who just comes out and says, yeah, we're, we're tracking everything you do. Can you please put our goggles back on for another hour?

Mikah Sargent (01:02:59):
Yeah. That's that, that part I think was particularly good to hear, like why that is important. So passionate, what power it gives us. Yeah. Yeah.

Rene Ritchie (01:03:09):
And one of the things I think that some people forget, like when we, and I, when I spoke to Tom and Tim about Apple Silicon and their love of the Mac, I got so many comments, people saying, you know, it's really ratifying gratifying to hear this at Apple who still love the Mac because honestly I was worried, you know, and that's fair enough. <Laugh> because like you like, they, they, you really didn't see that passion for a while. And the same thing, like it's easy to get into philosophical arguments about things like is data repatriation. Okay. When it's France asking, versus when it's China asking or is data encryption important when the us government wants a door key or you know, are child advocacy groups, right. To push Apple for CS, a filtering when, you know, privacy advocates are saying that this is the beginning of the end, like all of these. And one of the questions I had for him that I'm most fascinated about is you have people who are adamant that their position is the extreme correct position and that everybody else is wrong. And yet his job is to balance this, not only between those different viewpoints, but between the usability that we need as the end user of that product. And, and it's not an easy job, but I was just fascinating to hear how he, how he approached it.

Andy Ihnatko (01:04:12):
Yeah.

Mikah Sargent (01:04:14):
Everyone should go check that out. Youtube.Com/ReneRitchie, go ahead, Andy.

Andy Ihnatko (01:04:18):
I, I was just gonna say, I, I saw the interview I thought it was really, really great as usual great stuff from you, Renee. And, and also as usual, you can always tell what is part of the culture of a company when they talk about that thing? What is PR what is crisis management? What is, okay, I guess this would be nice things for us to dabble in right now when Apple talks about security, when Apple talks about privacy, as for NA says, they they're, they can be a little bit inconsistent sometimes there's, and sometimes you can expect that like any big company they're gonna fumble, but you can't com you can't really doubt that their interest in this is absolutely sincere and it's baked right in you can't, you just can't separate that from the identity of the company. And so it's, it's always, that's why it's always interesting to hear hear interviews like this, where you basically get to see, you know, the, the, the, the lights on behind the eyes turned up an extra 10 to 20% when they're talking about something that, you know, that they're really, really passionate about and that they spend so much of their time thinking about.

Alex Lindsay (01:05:17):
And I, and I think that some of that might come from the fact that everyone's always trying to get their data <laugh>. So I think that they, they they've been, there's a certain paranoia, you know, people trying to hack into their servers and find you know, what's, what's the next thing. And, and so they've been under that attack for the last 20 years. And so I think that there, that creates a also kind of affects that culture. It's not like the it's a theoretical thing for them. It's a, everyone's trying to get our data all the time. All of our employees, everyone, I mean, you have to worry about, you know, you build a it's, it's great to build a big glass you know, headquarters, but then you have to worry about the windows and, you know, and, and, and, you know, all of those things are, are things that you have to think about. Yeah, exactly.

Mikah Sargent (01:05:57):
Yeah. All that, that's a, that's a really good point. I just was thinking about the, whenever the was first being built and those drones flying over and how they had to deal with that. And,

Alex Lindsay (01:06:07):
But, but that's not even the thing. I mean, the biggest problem is really cameras seen through the windows. If you, if you start writing your, you know, your algorithms on the, on the, on the whiteboard, you know, someone with a big, big enough camera, can you, you know, so you have to, but, so that's the kind of pressure that they're under all the time, you know? And, and so I think that they're under the pressure of needing to be private and needing to be secret all the time. So I think that that greatly amplifies this is a real world problem for them every day. And that, that I think affects how they view it.

Andy Ihnatko (01:06:36):
Yeah. It's, it's really gotta be dis illusion. When you, when, when you're working at Apple, you've been given this really, really high profile project with lots of staff, lots of budget, lots of everything. And you have those moments of doubt about whether it's working correctly or whether Apple really supports it. And at that point, you really have to ask yourself, is this one of those fake projects that they're making, making me do so that other people will like not look at the actual project? Aw. <Laugh> yeah. Which of the 500 patents? There is no hover card are wrong and which one is a real line mix? I really think that a digital hat would be great. All right. Maybe you don't believe in me Mr. Cook, but

Alex Lindsay (01:07:14):
You know, with a lot of these big companies, so many things end up at dead ends at some point, you just about the craft, you know, like you just worry about you're just gonna work on the thing and they may cancel it right at the very end. Yeah. But they may not, it may not come out. I mean, I talked to someone who used to work at Apple a long time ago, and he said, there's products that got all the way to the end. And, and they just decided there's not enough big enough market, or this is gonna be a, this is gonna be a distraction. It's not gonna generate enough revenue. And then he, and he was like, I would've put that. You know, I would, would've used that every day, you know, like, and, and, and it was just one of those. So it's, it's a, it's a, it's a hard, you know, puzzle in the sense that that, you know, Apple is so disciplined in that area where they'll just kill, kill a project with hundreds of millions of dollars into the, into the process to to protect the brand and protect, you know, their focus.

Andy Ihnatko (01:08:00):
Yeah. It used to, and it used to be a much larger problem for hiring than it used to be. Because there was a time where, again, you're an engineer, you're, you have an expertise. You, you were hired away from another company where this was going to be you're, we're gonna be using your expertise and your research to build an actual working thing. Apple hired you away to develop their version of it. They decided after four years, eh, no. And unfortunately you can't tell anybody about it. You can't tell anybody what you, you can tell people V vaguely what your job was and the sort of technologies you were working with. But you can't say here is the, here is what I was doing for four years and use that to to springboard the next generation your career AI research for instance, was one of the biggest football links. One, I think that's one of the reasons why Apple started allowing the researchers to publish white papers, because it's a hell of a thing to ask a researcher to do research, but not share that research, not publish it, because at some point you are, you're not gonna be of any use to Apple anymore, and you're gonna have to be able to, here's what I've been doing. Here's, here's the papers I've published here are my credential. It's

Alex Lindsay (01:08:59):
There. There's also though a lift of, of, of when you, when you can't say anything, like you say, I used to work at Apple and they say, what do you do? I can't say anything that has a certain, you know, there's some juice there, you know, like, like there's a little bit of juice, you know? Cause I mean, I had a company that, that, you know, we big game company and they were, they were like, they, they were looking and having us through streams and they were like, who have you worked for? And I said, I can't tell you, well, what projects I can't tell you? Like, I just was like, I can't tell you anything. He's like, how do I know to hire you? And I said, well, who, who someone recommended us. He said, cause we don't even have a webpage. We didn't have a webpage that even talked about it. And, and and he said, well, you have to trust him. And, and, and then we got hired, but, you know, but I, I am

Andy Ihnatko (01:09:34):
So gonna play that card. So I swear to God,

Alex Lindsay (01:09:37):
It so works it, but, but it was it, and it was true. I couldn't show anything, but, but it was, but it was, it was really effective. So I think that the, the reason I bring that up is because you know, Apple, I think once someone, if you see Apple on someone's LinkedIn and especially the ones that have Apple and don't say anything, <laugh> like, you know, like I work at Apple, like, and, and there's a lot of 'em like that. And you're like, okay,

Mikah Sargent (01:10:01):
Mail clerk started 20 years ago and has never been updated.

Alex Lindsay (01:10:03):
<Laugh>. Exactly. Exactly.

Mikah Sargent (01:10:07):
All right. Couple of more things Apple, this is February and February is both heart month and black history month. Yes. we do get the shortest month of the year for some reason, but they are spotlighting black voices during black history month. And also spotlighting some very interesting resources with heart month. Now I wanted to talk about both of them because I think there's some re cool stuff here for heart month. There are some nice Apple fitness plus features that are specifically for cardio energizing workouts for heart month, as well as some unique challenges for the Apple watch that you can get with the badges. And then some really interest thing books that have been highlighted, including heart history which talks about kind of how we have over time doctors have over time learned more about the heart and been able to kind of understand how it works and what we can do to help it.

Mikah Sargent (01:11:16):
And then also some updates that they've provided on the ongoing heart and movement study. So if you're part of, if you have the Apple research app and you went ahead and signed up to be part of that heart and movement study, there's some information there worth checking out. And then the other thing is that for black history month there's some really cool Apple music campaigns that involve music around healing Apple fitness plus, which also has some special workouts with playlists that feature black artists. And I like to the, there are some really neat time to walk conversations. So time to walk is an app for the Apple watch. That's part of the fitness plus feature set that lets you listen to someone while you walk. And so you, and typically the person that's also there will talk to you and walk with you as you're doing it.

Mikah Sargent (01:12:12):
So it's just, you, you kind of feel involved with the process and then the very, very cool Apple watch, unity lights face is out folks can get that. It's I'm gonna read this. The band is complimented. Well talk about the band in a second by the unity lights watch face, which is designed using 2d Ray tracing a technology never before were implemented for a watch face each pixel on the screen, simulates the light and shadow falling across it. And the movement of the clock hands simultaneously reveal and hide the light changing dynamically throughout the day. The unity lights watch face can be customized to be a full screen, are circular dial and includes a black and white option tick marks and up to four complications. I love this watch face. It's so cool looking. It's J it's just really neat and that what I love about it is as you look at it throughout the day, the way that it changes and you see the shadows is really cool.

Mikah Sargent (01:13:07):
And then of course I think this is Apple's second. Renecan probably correct me. Apple's second black unity watch band. I this one is the braided solo loop band, which features the colors of the Panafric flag. So I of course picked that up as well. Cuz I, I try to be a collector of the pride edition and now the black unity edition bands which are very neat. And of course, Apple old donates a portion of the proceeds to some different organizations. So yeah, just wanted to highlight those things. You can check out the news, the, the press releases, which I'll include in the show notes that has all sorts of information about these different initiatives and highlights that are there. So you can check of that stuff out, but wanted to give that a little brief highlight

Andy Ihnatko (01:14:01):
I'd love to see how they put together the uni unity lights watch face because my first impression was that, wow, what a, what a interesting flex about how powerful the, the process were inside the, the Apple watches, but then immediately, like if they're actually calculating things, how is that affecting battery life? And I'm sure. And I'm sure it's not affecting battery life. So I've love to, I've love to, to hear about like exactly what went into this and how they, how they handle rendering dynamic watch faces in such a way that it doesn't, that it doesn't have an appreciable effect on the battery. I mean, I come to think of, it's not as though it's a good, it's probably not always on watch faces it. Oh,

Mikah Sargent (01:14:40):
That's a good question. I, let me swipe over to it and see if it's, but it hides the second hand when you're always on road. Got it. Yeah, that is I, I would love, love to hear about that too. Andy, that would be interesting to hear what it's not updating the screen except for once every minute, if it has to how they went about developing this with the Ray tracing. Cause yeah, the last time I heard conversation about Ray tracing, it was about the PlayStation five and the Xbox one has whatever. So yeah, right. The fact that I happening on my Apple watch is pretty impressive.

Alex Lindsay (01:15:15):
Yeah. And, and I think that the it could be something that's cashed too, you know? So, so it doesn't have to, you don't have to actually render it. And, and Ray tracing has become Ray tracings pretty efficient. You know, when you have a single point and you're not animating it, it's, it can be pretty efficient about it. Doesn't have to count. Cause it doesn't have to update everything. It just has to update what's changing. And so you can, it can become a lot more efficient. It's still more, I'm trying to find it like this is the unity one gotta go to the new face.

Mikah Sargent (01:15:41):
You gotta go to the new faces

Alex Lindsay (01:15:42):
And tell yeah. New faces and I added unity, but it's I don't see what I'm looking at. That's Ray tracing. It's got the green in the red. Yeah.

Mikah Sargent (01:15:49):
Are, are you looking at the old unity face? No, it's just not. 

Alex Lindsay (01:15:54):
Yeah. So that's the one with the green on top and the red on the bottom, but there's another one that I'm missing. That's the one I'm looking for or that's the old one. John,

Mikah Sargent (01:16:02):
Can you pull up the, the newsroom page? Yeah, I think you got the right one Alex row 29. I

Alex Lindsay (01:16:10):
Sent see those hands. Yeah, yeah, yeah. The 10. Yeah. I don't know. And then yeah, go. I wanna take up the

Mikah Sargent (01:16:18):
No, no, that's okay. Cause

Alex Lindsay (01:16:19):
I am, I'm kinda 10 and the nine, that, that part, I don't understand, like that doesn't look like anything that doesn't look like rate tracing to me. That's what I got when I got unity and I when I did the unity watch face, I got that 10 and nine that we see in the thing where I see go to the bottom, John.

Mikah Sargent (01:16:36):
Yeah. I'm not sure why it's not showing up. Cuz I think that he's talking about that. The, the one from last year Renewhere it's just like two splotches of color.

Alex Lindsay (01:16:44):
Yeah. And that's why that's what shows up on my watch. Maybe I need to update it maybe.

Mikah Sargent (01:16:48):
Yeah. That's probably what it is. It just, hasn't

Alex Lindsay (01:16:50):
Sorry for all the listeners listening to, to Alex. Like I don't, I stand almost,

Andy Ihnatko (01:16:55):
It's the one you're looking for, but the, the, the new unity face, the ones with, with the Judy re yeah. Here's what I'm holding up.

Mikah Sargent (01:17:04):
Yeah. Oh, Renee's got it on the screen.

Alex Lindsay (01:17:07):
I ran the update. I ran the update before the show and I just forgot. I just went to my phone. I was like, why is this not new? And it turns out it's because it's a I didn't hit the approve, the new legal, whatever. Oh yeah. So yeah. So that's, that's why I was like, it's not there anyway. Nevermind. All right, folks.

Andy Ihnatko (01:17:26):
I'm sorry. Do we have time for, for quick set?

Rene Ritchie (01:17:28):
Quick thing you, you have a quick sec. Yes.

Andy Ihnatko (01:17:31):
Okay. Sorry. I'm I'm I, I would be, it would be amazing if Apple created an API for this kind of thing, like really super dynamic watch faces that aren't just simply complications, not just simply, oh, well there's a little animated person on it. Like there's a, there's a, a, a dust designer by the name, but had to look up the name Martin boss, who like 10 years ago came up with a, an art series called real time where they're they're clocks. But it's a video projection. So that like, there's a, one of these installed in the train station airport station at, in Amsterdam where it looks like there is just a guy behind round panel of frosted glass who is just simply drawing in like the letter drawing in the hands, scraping off the paint from the old one drawing in the new one.

Andy Ihnatko (01:18:15):
And he makes, he makes, and he makes versions of this, like in all kinds of different articulations. And imagine I, I would, I would be okay with having an Apple watch that doesn't work with my Android phone. If, when I tell the time there's just like a pair, there's a, a dude behind the watch face that is like physically with a Sharpie drawing in the hands and you're racing them once a minute. And that's, it's the exactly, it's the sort of stylish thing for Apple to enable this sort of time-based moving art on your wrist that I think Apple would just really, really dig. So it would be wonderful that came up with a low power API for it.

Rene Ritchie (01:18:48):
There's something so weird about them because they've had a tool for years that makes all these animated backgrounds for iPhones and, and, and iPads. And they just, there there's no public way to use it. Like I would give anything to have like Brad Ellis and all these talented designers have access to this tool and make us like a bunch of, it's not like Apple makes a ton of animated wall, but we got like two years,

Alex Lindsay (01:19:06):
Maybe we, we can't design any really, we can't really get any design watch faces. <Laugh> like, like regardless of the animated version, I just want the watch. I just wanna be able to design, watch faces. I, I just wanna be able to, yeah. I mean like, like I don't, this is definitely a world that I, I feel like there's something about there's something there that must be really important that they won't let me let people build their own watch faces. Like it's just, and I get that there might be a power consumption, Calvin. I lawsuits. Yeah. There's something, there's something because I'm just like, I, I can't understand why I can't, cuz I have very specific things I wanna put on the watch base like seconds and I don't want the sports one. Everyone always sends me tweet tweets when I say that, but I just want seconds on a bunch on and some, some data and I wanna be able to design that.

Alex Lindsay (01:19:47):
And the fact that I can't design something simple you know, on my watch face just makes me same. So I'm just kinda giving up. I just use it for timers. <Laugh> find like, I, I, because I can't have the watch face, I just kind of really got into my watch. My watch is still better than what I had before, but I'm not as excited about it because, because I can't, if, if I was able to design watch faces I'd and do it exactly the, I want, I think I'd, I'd be much more passionate about my watch. It's it's something that I use, but I don't reco I don't like I'm not over in the moon about it.

Mikah Sargent (01:20:16):
I always, I also use mine for a timer most of the time. I, I do like that, but I like, that's the

Alex Lindsay (01:20:21):
Number one, number one use number one use for my watch is, is timers

Andy Ihnatko (01:20:27):
For, for me, for me it's that? And eh, no, it's not, not worth, not worth like reaching over the beds. The nightstand to answer that <laugh> yeah, yeah, yeah.

Alex Lindsay (01:20:34):
I do like the fact that I can turn the, the alarm off snooze on my, on my S turning off snooze from, from your watches. You

Mikah Sargent (01:20:42):
Pausing my Apple TV as well. If I've gotten up and I'm across the room and I want, oh, I, I wanna be able to see whatever it is then I will pause it. So yeah, there are a few of those kinda lay day features that I like to use as well as the fact that it's always tracking my bio or my health stuff. All right. We are gonna take a quick break before we come back with the rest of the shoe. But I wanna tell you about cash fly. Guess what this episode of back break weekly is literally brought to you by cash. How do we know the cash is amazing? It's because we've been using them for more than 10 years now. And it's been pretty awesome. Deliver your video with cash, the best throughput and global reach, make your content infinitely.

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Just for TWIT listeners. Cash is giving away a complimentary detailed analysis of your current CDN bill and usage trends. See if you are over paying 20% or more for CDN, learn more@TWIT.cash.com. That's TWIT.cash.com. Thank you. Cash fly for bringing everyone this episode of MacBreak Weekly. We appreciate it continues to be awesome. All right. We're holding up a lighter, a candle pouring a bit of butter beer out. I'm trying to think of other Harry Potter references. I don't know a whole lot about it, but Harry Potter wizards unite has been discontinued. This was a Pokemon go style G aim. That was Harry Potter themed. And I'm just curious Renee, I think you still play Pokemon go. What are your thoughts on, on yes, exactly. I think, yeah, you are you and her are the people who are just like keeping that game alive. What are your thoughts on sort of the life of Harry Potter wizards unite and maybe why this one ended up dropping off before Pokemon go did. And if we're gonna continue to see these kinds of real world sort of AR experiences,

Rene Ritchie (01:25:02):
I mean, I'd like to think that it was just because a lot of people decided that JK rowings was tolerable and we're never gonna play a again, but I think it's much more likely that it was just the worst parts of, of Pokemon go's gameplay made into one single app for for, for like, it was like the most annoying exasperating arduous aspects of Pokemon go all packaged together into like what looked like a cheap franchise grab. I think people see through that kind of stuff. It was, it wasn't a good game at the end of the day. And doesn't matter what your IP is, if you're not a good game that people enjoy and wanna play. And I think Pokemon go benefited from being novel at the time, but also being a beloved franchise and having interesting, like, not, it, it is annoying, like there's many aspects that are running at Pokemon go, but also a lot of fun parts too. And I think it was just way better balanced.

Mikah Sargent (01:25:49):
Hmm. I played Harry Potter wizards unite for longer than I played Pokemon go, but I still ended up giving it up. I, I don't, I don't I don't really play any of those. They, I dropped it in a trash can outside Chicka and I never looked back <laugh> exactly. But anyway, I just wanted to give a little moment for that. 

Alex Lindsay (01:26:13):
I think the kingdom rush is amazing. <Laugh> sorry. That's the only game that's always, every time I see a game I'm like, well, I only play one level on one game, but I've been playing the same level for the last six months. <Laugh> I'm

Mikah Sargent (01:26:26):
Getting better at it. What about you, Andy? Do you have any mobile games you play?

Andy Ihnatko (01:26:31):
Honestly? my mobile game is Lightroom mobile. It, it, it feels exactly the same role that, and that a mobile game on my phone plays, which is that when I have some downtime, whether I'm waiting for, for a, or whether I'm just, you know, trying to not do actual work, I will go through my Google photos or my Apple photos real. I will find a photo that I took a a day ago, a month ago, a year ago that I'd never did anything with. And then like the next time I check the time's like, oh, 53 minutes have gone by and I've done like three eight different ITER of this four of which I think are really, really cool. So that's, I have to say that that really, that really is my game.

Mikah Sargent (01:27:11):
Nice. alright. Let's talk about this, this rumor, and then we'll head into the picks of the week. I wanted to talk about this report from mark Garman. This one is not as far as I can tell I've scoured the page and this one is not a newsletter article, but is instead just an article Apple to rival square by turning iPhones into payment terminals. So the idea here is that you could just use the iPhone itself or an iPad even thanks to the NFC chip that's used for Apple pay to create a little payment terminal system which I would quite like, I think if there was the ability to create a little, you know, store that you wanted to create at a, at a farmer's market or a popup or something like that. And to be able to just tap my phone, Apple, pay to someone the cost of whatever it happens to be.

Mikah Sargent (01:28:17):
Of course it's unclear yet what exactly this could look like how exactly this is going to be released, but in the R Garman said Apple may begin rolling out the feature via a software update in the coming months, the company is expected to release the first beta version of iOS 15.4 in the near future, which is likely to see a final release for consumers as early as the spring. So this could potentially come as early as the spring. It could be later, but I'm just curious your thoughts on this, a potential feature in general. And if you see Apple, like, is this a space that Apple would wanna be in sort of business, small business payment processing, and this would go into the services category, right?

Alex Lindsay (01:29:01):
<Laugh> well, the, I think that the thing, the interesting thing is, is the Apple pay makes it relatively easy for them to implement. They just have to, you know, ID the connection between folks and make that a little bit, reduce some of the friction, the real challenge with char charging people. Isn't really making the charge. It is managing that charge. Okay. Where do that money come from and what do they buy and what do they, you know, know, that's the thing that square, you know, when you have a square terminal, there's a lot more to it than, than just I can, you know, validate a charge between two phones. It's, it's keeping track and, and managing it. So if Apple is able to do that and will be able to, it has to either integrate with something that can manage that, but it has, it's the entire charge history.

Alex Lindsay (01:29:38):
That's gonna be important to that retailer. And we don't know what looks like yet, but as far as being able to casually what this sounds like it's doing, and it's different is I can give money to a stranger. Like right now we can text money, you know, to folks, but I can basically, you know, do that. And of course I, the question also is, is, is will this only work with iPhones or if you're gonna make it a teller system, you kind of have to have be able to support Android well, so that, that can work. And how does that work? You know, and maybe you say, I can only do iPhones, but it does become much harder if someone walks in and say, I can't take your money because I need an, an, I need an app iPhone. Yeah. Only to America who probably play.

Andy Ihnatko (01:30:15):
Yeah, this is, this is also interesting. If you think way, way in the future, more and more governments are starting to look into digital currencies just as regular legal currency as, as Fiat tender. And we're not talking about Ethereum, we're not talking about, you know, do, do you know that <laugh> a character from the office is is, is creating their own like cryptocurrency, that's gonna wind up really what, right. But yeah. Oh God, this is, was, what was his name? Is, is one of the salesmen. He was always doing a crossword puzzle. Oh, Stanley Hudsons Stanley. Thank you. That's it? Because there was, there was a joke in which the Dwight fruit was like, was temporary manager. Hey, my mode, actually, you get your earn fruit. Oh, it's Stanley Nichols. Right. So, so he was doing a crypto like that. That's not gonna end well, but but actually even the, even the us government the, the fed has actually just released like a long, long paper, I think just a week or two ago saying that we're looking into this, we're gonna go cautiously, but we are definitely investigating this.

Andy Ihnatko (01:31:18):
Here are the problems that we think we'd like to address before we start thinking about a digital dollar. And we're all we're opening up like the, the phone lines for, for, for comments, from people who are invested in this. But you could imagine what happens if five years from now this becomes even bigger thing than it is right now. And that the, a phone is, is kind of required to be a wallet for cash, not just a, a, not just a, a, an allegorical wallet, that this is how I pay. This is how I take money out of my wallet and give it to you. Whether it is like Ethereum, whether it is a federal currency. And you think that this is, I don't think that this is necessarily what Apple is doing. I think one of the questions is that, is this something that anybody, any Apple phone user will be able to set up point to point, or is this simply something that if you are if you are the creator of PayPal, if you are the creator of another payment process, or you can actually access this API, if you have the, the right permissions, but it would be interesting to see if Apple, if five years from now phones have to have that ability to be able to do that kind of point to point transaction, to exchange digital, digital currency just on a regular basis without having to go through any sort of a payment processor as a middleman.

Alex Lindsay (01:32:33):
And I have to say that my, for 90% of my transactions, when I'm out of the house, it's all through Apple pay. I, I don't, I don't even use my credit card or anything else I just use. I just put money into my Apple pay all the time. So I just have, you know, that's my wallet, you know, and I walk around and, and if someone won't take it usually I'm, I go somewhere else. So, so, you know, so, so the so that usually is, I mean, at first it was an experiment and I'd prioritize, but at this point I, you know, I don't carry cash, you know? And so so that, that, you know, I have to be able to do that. And so it's, it's a really I think for a growing number of people, it's become that where you're not really, you don't really wanna touch the cash <laugh>, you know, with COVID, you know, like you just kinda like, I don't really wanna touch that and I don't want, I don't want to handle it. And so that, so it is become that for me. I know when I go to groceries, gas, even, even at this farmer's market, I walk around with my phone and just, they, everybody has something that you can do that with. Yeah.

Andy Ihnatko (01:33:27):
But it is, it is going to be this, this is another topic that could be an hour conversation. Cause it's so interesting, but it, it it's the, the, the weakness of those kind of payment systems, whether it is Apple pay, whether it's PayPal, whether it's any sort of a tap to pay system, is that at some point a credit card company has to go through it at some point the user has to have a bank account, not all people have access to banking and the ability to exchange digital currency as easily as they could exchange cash cash, the ability to receive money as easily as currency, without having to have a fixed address without to show up at a bank without having to prove to visa, MasterCard, American express that, yes, please give me a $500 credit limit. And let me have, let me have a credit card. So I can have those digits that will allow me to access these services. That could be extremely transformative.

Alex Lindsay (01:34:15):
Well, and, and the thing is, is there's parts of Africa that, that people are using their mobile phone right now to pay for almost that everything, you know, like. And so, so the, you know, and they have, you know, it's actually an access is a magnifier for them. Because they, you know, they can't get the cash, they can't get those things, but they can pay each other back and forth in mobile and buy things and sell them and everything else. And so that, that is a, it's already become a huge access enabler for you different parts of the world. Yeah.

Mikah Sargent (01:34:45):
All right. Let us move into the final stage of the show, which is the picks of the week. I think Andy, we will start with you tell

Andy Ihnatko (01:34:56):
Us about your pick of the week. Mine is is a set of lock picks. It's the covert instruments Genesis lock pick set which you can go@covertinstruments.com. A lot of you are pumping your fist in the air. Oh, oh yes. The lock picking lawyer, the lock picking lawyer. Yeah. That's the lock and picking lawyer is one of the, a great channel on YouTube where he is an expert locksmith lock picker and locksmith. And he will spend these videos of just two or three minutes in of the same format in which he will show you this incredibly impressive lock. And then he'll give you like a 22nd tour of it. And then he'll like take out like one of his lock picking tools and say, okay, good. And try to pick it, say, okay, good, good, good sound of one, nothing outta two, nothing outta three false set on three.

Andy Ihnatko (01:35:43):
Like, and, and he'll, he'll get it open. And so this is, this is one of the reasons why whenever you're buying a lock, particularly if you go into home Depot right there in the store, go hold your phone and do search for a lock picking lawyer. And then the name of the lock that you're looking at, cause chances are excellent that like a, like I did, I'm putting in a smart lock partly to test out smart locks, but also because it'll solve a problem for me. But the first thing I did was after getting the features like, okay, well, see what the, what the pick resistance it is. And he was able to open it in like five seconds. And the, the con if that's not a concern, if it's this guy who has had thousand and thousands of hours of expertise, and sometimes he will bring out a tool that he and a partner built specifically to defeat this kind of lock.

Andy Ihnatko (01:36:25):
What you worry about is when there is a common lock picking tool that you don't need any expertise whatsoever to use. And even, I, I haven't, I haven't done anything with lock picking or, or safe cracking since CA I think every, every, every nerdy kid has a, has a story either about how they got into magic hacking or lock picking, because oftentimes they're all the same thing where people believe what they want to believe. And our existence is en largely a collective illusion. The moment that if you're like 17, 18, 19, and you learn that all locks are a lie that will change your outlook on a lot of things in life. But so so I've got, I just ordered this as like 25 bucks. It contains a, a set of set of simple picks and levers to like put pressure on the lock as you're trying to pick it and have not used this tool ever.

Andy Ihnatko (01:37:15):
And I won't point out which one it is, but it's like a very simple tool. And within about 20 or 30 seconds, I got this lock open. And after actually watching a video and how to use that tool, which is a description of maybe two or three sentences, I was able to start opening it in like five to 10 seconds. So the, the, the news is not all bad. I'm, I'm glad that I found out about this. It it's I'm gonna basically take the, the, one of the reasons that I picked this lock is because you can just basically take out the core, take it to a locksmith and say, hi, this is garbage, sell me one that is like more pick resistant. But it does go to show that if you have one of these, not only is it fun to basically learn lock, picking, but also just get this one specific tool, this one little lever test out a lock that you're trying to buy.

Andy Ihnatko (01:38:02):
If you're, if securities a really big issue, find out how quickly this just someone with no experience can open it, because I, I don't worry about the pros when it comes to stuff like this. I worry about the, the, and knucklehead, the people who like might have seen a video like this. And like, so now they've got one of these in their pockets saying, Hey, it's good, boy, it's rain outside. Hey, maybe I can like pick open this door. Rick, Rick, Rick, Rick, Hey, look, I'm inside. Now that I'm here, let's see what cut, what the person got. They've gotten in their mail today. So that's the sort of stuff that you kinda wanna protect against it's only 25 bucks. The, the, the whole site is really cool, but this is a good starter set that comes in a nice case. They're very, very well made. And unfortunately it's, it's, it's, it's it, it will open your, open your eyes to a much larger world. Once you start taking a look at this stuff,

Rene Ritchie (01:38:48):
Did you share a price? I forgot.

Andy Ihnatko (01:38:50):
I'm sorry. I think it's $25. I could be if it's Enis lock pick said yes, it's, it's exactly 25 bucks. All right.

Rene Ritchie (01:39:01):
Reneritchie, tell us about your pick of the week. So I was complaining on TWITtter, which is something I do really, really frequently because final cut pro is terrific tool. I love it. It's the fastest thing to get work off of SD cards and onto YouTube for me, but it's, perplexingly missing some features like it needs, like if I drag stuff around, it doesn't align the way it does in keynote. And also there's no strip silence, which is a great feature in logic pro that'll just go through and automatically put cuts for you wherever dialogue ends and begins. So then you can just go through and eliminate all that stuff, or it'll actually eliminate it for you, but they don't have that in final cut. You have to do that all manually. So Rafael, I get his last name wrong, but well known YouTuber.

Rene Ritchie (01:39:44):
Rafael recommended to me this app called time bolt, where it's not a plugin for any existing editor, although it'll export X ML for a final cut and premier and resolve and all those things. And all it does is in just the video. And then you set the parameters like for how long the attack and, and release is. And it'll go through and cut out all the silence in your video. And I believe it'll do audio as well. I was only, only paying attention to the video part similar to how logic pro works. And then you can either edit in that app. If you're only doing something really simple, or you can go and export that ML loaded into final cut, and a lot of the grunt work in editing a roll or voiceover is done for you. It, it's not exactly what I want because I prefer to edit inside multicam or compound clips, because that way, if I make a change to the the root clip, it'll propagate across every cut that I make for that clip, where with this, it'll just give me the end result of all those cuts.

Rene Ritchie (01:40:42):
So if I wanna color correct something, I have to do it on cut by cut basis, which is just not how I like to work. Ooh, but I love the idea of this. And if there was if you are just doing things where you are cutting single clips, or you're cutting voiceover, or you're cutting a roll and you don't care about compound or, or multicam, it is a phenomenal, a phenomenal time saver. The pricing is a little bit like there's a subscription you can get for like 20 bucks a month, a hundred bucks a year, or you can pay once 300 bucks a lifetime. So you gotta figure out the value prop for you, but for a lot of people, especially when you're editing time is, you know, you can make more money. You can never make more time. So it's worth, it's absolutely worth looking into, and it it's M one compatible and the people I know who use it really, really like it.

Mikah Sargent (01:41:24):
Nice. All right. Time bolt at time, bolt.io, Alex Lindsay, your

Alex Lindsay (01:41:30):
Pick of the week. So I, I wanna thank ho homo Gaja from South Africa who sent me this case to play with. And I was like, I was like, I'm gonna take a look at this case. And he, he's not part of the company. He just, he just is a friend of mine. And anyway, so he sent it and it's so great. So so what it does is this is peak designs and you, you can see that I can, this ha this pops off. So this is the wallet part. He, one of the, of the things we talked about on office hours at some point was that the I have to have a wallet with my phone because other I'll lose the phone or I'll lose the wallet, but I never lose both of them when they're together. And so I, I always have phones with wallets.

Alex Lindsay (01:42:06):
And so anyway, I've had it for the last five or six years. So anyway, this one, but I've always wanted to be able to attach it to a tripod as well, and be able to attach it to other things. And those don't mix well together. So what this one has, it's got little Mount that you'll see here and it's magnetized. So it goes, this pops on, and this is my credit cards that are in here that are there. And so this is something that I can just kind of carry around. It's a wallet, it's a phone, it's, you know, those things, but what's cool is that it also has, this is a tripod Mount, so this is a tripod mountain now. And I can just simply, I mean, it works really well. It just snaps in, and now it's, you know, it's on.

Alex Lindsay (01:42:42):
And it's, I mean, I, I don't know if it would survive a, a 9.1 earthquake, but probably a six <laugh>, you know? And and so, but it's, you know, it's, it's on, it's on there, you know, and so now I have this and, and it locks got this little once the magnet guides it and gets it in there, but then it it's really, I mean, I I'll damage the case before it comes off. I have to push down here to, and then, and then it'll pull off like that end. That's cool. Is that when you pull it down, like this it's, the magnet keeps it from just falling off. So the magnet's enough to hold it, see if I pull it down, the magnets have to hold it, but so it's, it's not like you, you, you, you do a quick release and your phone falls on the ground.

Alex Lindsay (01:43:20):
So it's, it's, it's got kind of a nice setup and they've got a bunch of different mounts. They've got mounts for your, so it, it really is on it's mechanically connected, not magnet, mag, ally connected, but the magnet makes it just pop on anyway. And so, but it has once for your bike, it has ones for your car. It has, you know, lots of other ones. These are the ones that I, sorry. Could you say that again? Oh, series talking series, like anyway, so it's really cool. It's a really cool case. I had it for, you know, and, and and it's anyway, that's, that's my pick.

Mikah Sargent (01:43:52):
Yeah. That's a really cool pick. I think I think we may have talked about this, this line before but actually seeing it in use there, especially that sort of lock in mechanism. That's very easy

Alex Lindsay (01:44:06):
And stand. So you, can you gonna open up as a stand as well? So your friend

Mikah Sargent (01:44:10):
Send it to you and say, ah, come man, Alex, I've got this case for, you've got the ticket that been using it for Yas and Yas. It's a very nice, Casee

Alex Lindsay (01:44:17):
Just <laugh>. Yeah. He just, the funny part. It was he, yeah. That's what my address was. And it just showed up and he was like, I, I didn't know what was coming. Like, it was just you know, so it was that's. It was great. Yeah. Yeah. It's big by this. Casee Weve been, we've been friends for a long time. So anyway, so I just wanted to call it out. So anyway, it's a really, really cool case

Mikah Sargent (01:44:37):
Car Mount a bar, Mount, a bike Mount motorcycle, Mount

Andy Ihnatko (01:44:41):
It's peak design it's like peak design is just one of those names where if they announce something, I just wanna know about it. I don't know if I'm gonna need it or not, but I know that it's gonna be really well made and extra are extremely well thought out. I, I have so much lust for their travel tripod. I've come so close to pulling the triggers to, to, to buying it. Say you have compact tripods. I know, but I don't have that one. I know, but you're doing fine. Maybe you want $340 in the bank more than you want a travel tripod that you're not gonna quite use that much. Yeah. But it's so well done. I, I wanna I'm, I'm supporting the designer. I'm supporting small business. Oh God, Andy. Now you really are desperate. <Laugh> you are, you are a small business. You are the smallest possible business. You are a freelance journalist in a rapidly collapsing market. They should be buying things from you. <Laugh>

Mikah Sargent (01:45:33):
My pick of the week I read far too many stories in 2021 about people swallowing the AirPods they had in their ears. <Laugh> and so I began to get paranoid. I think TWITce I woke up and the AirPod had fallen out of my ear and I was genuinely concerned that I, you know, I checked my breathing. I'm like, am I having trouble breathing? So TWITce was enough for me to say, I've gotta try out something else. I I have a partner and so there are two people that go to bed. And because of that, I the way that I fall asleep is by listening to audiobooks from audible.com not currently a sponsor of this show, but certainly the network. And so that helps me focus the part of my brain that wants to spin up on a thousand different things.

Mikah Sargent (01:46:21):
It, it just focuses on that. And then the rest of me can fall asleep. So because there's someone else in the bed, I obviously don't wanna play that audio book out loud and disturb their sleep. So I choose to listen to it. I was before you using just one I'm a side sleeper. So I would just put one AirPod into my ear and lay down and be able to listen to the audio book. It's super low volume. But after all that paranoia and me sort of scrambling every night or every morning going, did I swallow at this time, I decided to invest in something else. This is called the acoustic sheep sleep phones, I guess these are called the acoustic sheep sleep phones. And essentially what it is, is a headband that wraps around your head. So you just put it over your forehead and then it loops down over your ears.

Mikah Sargent (01:47:06):
Kind of like one of those ear, my, of formers and inside of the sleep phones band, there's a speaker on one side and a speaker on the other, and they're just sort of loose in there, but they are sewn into this really, really, really soft felt. And then the wire leads to the Bluetooth module that has the battery in it. And this sits at the back of your head. And so you turn it on with this and it does the standard, like connected. I feel like that voice is very common with any third party, Bluetooth headphones. And from there it connects to your phone and it plays music or, or in my case, an audio book very well. And yes, as a side sleeper, I was concerned, okay, I'm gonna be laying on a speaker. Is that going to hurt me?

Mikah Sargent (01:47:58):
No, it's very soft. <Laugh> I've had no problems with it. And then that means also that I'm listening out of both ears instead of just one. And it's, it's just, it's delightful. It's quiet enough. That, cuz that was the other thing is that I tried a bunch of different options, ones that maybe stuck in my ear better, but the problem was the Bluetooth, profiler, whatever it was, it would not let me make the music or, I mean, excuse me, the audio book, quiet enough, which is what I need, I needed to just be at a very low volume. So it was kinda like, I'd get, it'd still be too loud, I'd hit the thing again and then it would go completely off. It would mute. So this has plenty of space to turn up or down the volume as you need to.

Mikah Sargent (01:48:40):
And it is, it's great. It, it works for me as a side sleeper. Occasionally I'll sleep on my back and in that position, it's also nice and the fabric's very breathable too, so it doesn't make me too hot. Cause I was worried if my ears were covered that I was gonna get too warm, but the fabric is super breathable. So that hasn't been an issue and yeah, it's solved my problem and I don't have to wake up with the anxiety of yeah. Breathing in an AirPod which is quite nice. So,

Andy Ihnatko (01:49:08):
Oh my God, Micah, you, I saw, I saw when you're scrolling, when you're rolling over the, all the different options, there's a purple one. Cuz you should buy one because you would so totally look like prince. Like when he was, when he was wearing that headband <laugh>

Mikah Sargent (01:49:22):
That's true. Maybe I should, when I was younger, one of my, one of our family friends always used to say, you have to go as prince for Halloween one year you have to go to prince. Cuz she very much liked you were like, is

Andy Ihnatko (01:49:33):
Micah prince has to mic you don't I mean you don't can I just say you don't look like prince, but you've got all the, all the architectural foundations that if you made up like prince people would be like, oh my God, that guy looks exactly like prince <laugh>.

Mikah Sargent (01:49:46):
You say there's all, there's also a wireless charging option for folks who are bougie and love the wireless charging option. <Laugh> the one that I have was expensive enough at 99 95 there's a wired version where you just plug it into your phone or what have, I guess you got an iPod shuffles still, you could clip it on the side of the headband, which is much less expensive. So yeah, their most expensive model is completely wireless and you just pop it onto this little charging puck whenever you need to, I've found that it lasts several days before I have to recharge it. And then afterwards it's just USB what is it micro on the, the side to plug it in and get it charged up. So, all right. That is that, that brings us to the end of this episode of MacBreak Weekly.

Mikah Sargent (01:50:39):
Of course you can tune in to watch the show live, which records every tuesday@aelevenampacifictimeorroundaboutthattimeatTWIT.tv slash live. I think the best way to get the show though is by going to TWIT.tv/m B w because when you do you get the show via audio or video in whatever podcast or audio listening application you want to, you just click, subscribe to audio, subscribe to video, you choose Apple podcasts, Google podcasts pockets, whatever you want to do, you can get it there and make sure that you get the show. As soon as it's available, it's kind of the best way to do it. I should also mention club TWIT, TWIT.tv/club. TWIT is where you go to that out club. TWIT is the very awesome club where for seven bucks a month, you can get every single one of TWITs shows ad free. That's a, a feed that has all that awesome content ad free.

Mikah Sargent (01:51:41):
You also get access to the TWIT plus bonus feed that has extra content. You won't find anywhere else. Outtakes behind the scenes today. A there'll be a, a little clip about bragging, about hats and mugs and other flexing we did before the show kicked off and access to the members only discord, which is where you can hang out with your fellow club, TWIT members while the show's going on. And even when the show's not going on. And also those of us here@TWITareoftentheresevenbucksamonthforallthatatTWIT.tv slash club TWIT. Awesome place to go to check that out. And I do want to briefly mention one other thing, which is that our survey is now available. Our audience survey. It is the way that we get to know who all of you are out there. Who are you? What are you talking about? We wanna know what you're into what you like. And that survey helps us make sure that we understand our audience. It's at TWITt TV slash survey 22. It'll only take you a few minutes. We were testing it before. I think I took it eight times. It only took me a few minutes to do it eight times. So should take you even less time to do it. TWITt TV slash survey 22. All right. It is time to thank our awesome guests, Alex Lindsay, office hours.global. What do you have coming up?

Alex Lindsay (01:52:58):
Oh, it's, it's great. We, we, to we, we had a big discussion about digital events on Monday. Today, we, we were talking about stream voodoo, which is another kind of point to point connection tomorrow we're talking about photogrammetry. So so the how to turn, you know, photos into models and then Thursday, we talk about our new launch of all the, the big, big video system that we're building. And and then on Friday we have Microsoft on talking about teams and broadcast and stuff like that. So it's a busy week. <Laugh> busy week at office hours. It always is. Wow. And of course we do education on, on Saturdays, which we don't broadcast to YouTube. So you have to be there in zoom to see it, but it's an unbelievable conversation among educators of just talking about the issues that they're dealing with. And there's, some of it is philosophical. Some of it is technical. It's just an incredible two hours. And so that's on set eight o'clock in

Mikah Sargent (01:53:47):
The morning. Brilliant. Andy NACO of course folks can listen to you on w GB H but yeah. Anything you wanna plug?

Andy Ihnatko (01:53:57):
Yep. I'm on 1230 in the afternoon on Friday this week go to WGB WGB H news.org to stream it live or stream it probably about eight hours later, cuz they usually break out my segment, my weekly high tech, Heidi ho <laugh> as a separate thing. But yeah, WGBH news.org.

Mikah Sargent (01:54:16):
Excellent. And Renerich, youtube.com/ReneRitchie. What do you have to plug today?

Rene Ritchie (01:54:23):
Oh, I mean go take a look at Eric interview. He was really great to talk all about Apple and privacy and hopefully by either later tonight or tomorrow, I'll have my really long how Apple can annihilate SMS video up.

Mikah Sargent (01:54:38):
All right. I am@micasergeantonmanyofsocialmedianetworkoryoucanheadtochiwawadotcoffee…, or I've got links to the places I'm most active online of course here iOS today or recorded earlier today. As well as tech news weekly, which records on Thursdays and soon after everything gets back to somewhat normalcy, I'll rejoin Leo Laport on set days for the tech guy. Thank you all for tuning in to today's episode of MacBreak Weekly. I believe this is the time where I say get back to work. Cuz break time is over. Bye everybody.

Jason Howell (01:55:24):
The world is changing rapidly so rapidly. In fact that it's hard to keep up. That's why Mikah Sargent and I, Jason Howell talk with the people, Macon and breaking the tech news on tech news weekly. Every Thursday, they know these stories better than anyone. So why not get them to talk about it in their own words, subscribe to tech news weekly and you won't miss a beat every thursday@TWIT.tv.