Ask the Tech Guys Episode 1978 Transcript

Please be advised this transcript is AI-generated and may not be word for word. Time codes refer to the approximate times in the ad-supported version of the show.

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (00:00:00):
It's time for as the tech guys. I'm Leo LePort coming up, Sam Abul, Sam, our car guy, explains why Elon's winning. And I'm Micah Sergeant and we take a look at, it might be an older device, but is the Kindle Oasis still worth the cost? Then can you charge your e-bike at a car fast charging station? It's as the Tech Guys next podcasts you love from people you trust. This, this is Twitch twi. This is as the Tech Guys with Micah, Sergeant and Leo Laport. Episode 1978, recorded Sunday, June 11th, 2023. It's made of People. This episode of Ask the Tech Guys is brought to you by Brook Linen this year. Dads deserve a good night's sleep. They deserve the best rest. And Brook Linen has their comfort covered with a lineup of home essentials made for relaxation. Visit brooklinen.com today and get $20 off plus free shipping on orders of $100 or more with the Code Tech guy.

(00:01:06):
And buy Melissa more than 10,000 clients worldwide. Rely on Melissa for full spectrum data quality and ID verification software. Make sure your customer contact data is up to date. Get started today with 1000 records clean for free at melissa.com/twi. And buy thanks Canary. Because thousands of ignored alerts help nobody. When somebody's in your network, you'll get the one alert that matters for 10% off on a 60 day money back guarantee. Go to canary.tools/twi, enter the code twit in the how did you hear about a Box and buy Miro. Miro is your team's online workspace to connect, collaborate and create together. Tap into awe to map processes, systems, and plans with the whole team. Get your first three boards for free to start creating your best work yet at miro.com/podcast. It's time for ask the tech guys the show where we take your questions live on air we look at them, we examine them, and then we go, maybe we can answer them.

(00:02:14):
<Laugh>, I am one of your hosts, Micah, Sergeant and hey. Hey, hey. I'm Leo LaPorte. Hello. Hello. And we have, we're gonna just, we have a, we have a new mission mm-hmm. <Affirmative> to take as many questions as we can. We have voicemails, we have calls, we have have 8 8 8 7 2 4 2 8, 8 4. We have zooms at, called twit tv. We have emails at atg, twit do tv. It's a busy, busy day. We're gonna as many calls as we can. Samsam is coming up. And and that's pretty much the show. Yeah. That's it. Locked in. Did anything at all happen this week? <Laugh>? Well, this is, as I was driving in, I thought, wait, that was this week, wasn't it? It's been a heck of a week. You know, what happened? What happened? Exactly what I predicted would happen, which is once Apple announced the, and they're calling it the Vision Pro.

(00:03:12):
They're, you know, they're nerd goggles. Yes. The nerd goggles. The first day you were at the event mm-hmm. <Affirmative>. So I'm, I would love to know how that was. But the first day and the second day, people were singing its praises like crazy. Right. Going crazy cuz you try, anytime you try these on, whether it's the Quest Pro or the first Oculus Rift or the HTC five, when you try 'em on the Magic Leap, the HoloLens, all of these, it's like, wow. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>, the world is about to change, computing is about to change, and then about 24 hours later it wears off. He sober out. Right. I don't know if you s saw, but like Wired had, I thought I was negative. Wired had the most <laugh> like negative thing I've ever seen. More and more reviews are coming out where people are saying, yeah, it's cool, but mm-hmm.

(00:04:02):
<Affirmative>, what's your thought? So I'm, I'm there. I actually, I was surprised at the number of people who, as we were walking away from the event, were saying that very thing. Yeah. It was cool. But the people that were surrounding me, the, the other press folks were in that mode. And then some of them did, as you point out get to try it, you try it on, you go always really cool, and then whoa, you know, but then that sobering happens again. That sobering takes place. I think that the biggest thing here is that yes, this is an amazing device. Yes. It's got great hardware. Yes, it's all appley, et cetera, et cetera. But ultimately you're still left wondering who exactly is this for? Who outside of very sort of appley geeky folks are going to actually use this. Yeah.

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And it, it, to, to call it the future is perhaps a little bit off the path. And it's 3,500 bucks and it's not available like till next year. Right. <laugh>, who knows, you know what that means? Early next year, it could be May 3rd, it could be somebody, somebody asked one of the, the guy who was actually Mike, I believe is his first name, and I wish I could remember his last name, but in charge an Apple exec who's in charge of this Vision pro. And they said, what does early next year mean? When is it coming out? And he said, it's coming out before late next year, <laugh>. Well, that's a good answer. Yeah. notice none of the Apple executives were shown wearing it. I think that's the first time Apple's introduced a new product where they didn't act. You know, Steve didn't hold the iPad.

(00:05:37):
Right. You know, it's like maybe that's cuz it really isn't like close to Don. The especially so something that I learned about the lenticular display on the front of it. So on Wednesday, by the way, I predict when it comes out, they will not have creepy eyes. Oh really? Yeah. They're gonna dump that cuz it's a terrible idea. Here's why I don't, they're gonna dump it. I don't think they will, because I think that they did too much engineering to not do that. It's gotta be an expensive part. Yes. That's gotta be 500 bucks of the whole thing. That is one of the most expensive parts. So on Wednesday, I went back to San Jose to see the talk show live, which is John Gruber's show where regularly he brings in actual Apple execs. So Craig Federighi was on the stage, by the way, when he played that guitar in the keynote.

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He actually was playing the guitar. He played it that night live in front of all of us, which was really cool. But one, they were talking about the, the, this headset, the lenticular display, which for folks who don't know, means that it's a display that has kind of triangular prisms that are stacked next to one another. So that if you're looking at it from dead on, you can see something. If you're looking at it from the edge, you can see something all these different sides. And this is what they're doing. They're not just rendering one view of your eyes. Because if you looked it on, you would see the eyes. But for every single crevice of that display, there are like eight, I can't remember how many, let's say 16 views. Each of those 16 views has your eyes rendered as if you were looking at it from, it's so over-engineered.

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And I misunderstood this cuz in the past you've seen those postcards, you know, where the eyes follow you mm-hmm. <Affirmative>, they don't follow you on this. You just see a side view in the eyes. Yeah. Which is better because the Yeah. It's not as the eyes is still looking dead on you. Exactly. <laugh>, they're creepy enough bad. Yeah. Oh, and also it's not a lot of folks thought in the sort of early after the event that it was like the 3D model that the eyes were just kind of like scanned of you and that they were shown there. No, this is actually what you're, this is a real view of your eyes live. So when you squint, you can see the eyes moving. So it's actually displaying, but is it like a, an emoji where it's a f it's a fake view that's duplicating what your eyes is doing.

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It is. Think of it like a camera. It's not a camera on your eyes directly. Exactly. So, well that or is it, that's unclear to me. Exactly. That's unclear to me. We'll find out or not. I'm again, I'm gonna say it will not ship with that. That's a waste of that lenticular display then. Yeah. But well, this is the problem with the whole thing. It's a lot was they spent so much money and time, like a decade and billions, probably hundreds of billions in going into this. They couldn't hold back. It's like, we gotta show you all of it. Ah, but, but the first thing that's gotta go is creepy eyes, <laugh>. Sorry. And maybe it's just me and I will admit this could just be my point of view, but I just don't wanna strap a computer to my face. Yeah. I just think that that to me, I have a visceral kind of revulsion to doing that mm-hmm.

(00:08:35):
<Affirmative> and, and have, have done that many times. And I just don't think that's a popular thing that people want to do. So anyway, we'll see. Yeah, we'll see. This saw definitely a we'll see, because I, I can't say for sure yet how I'm going to feel about it until the, because the big aspect of this, in my opinion that that sets this apart, is how much of it is really focused around still showing you the view around you. And yeah. One of the things again that they had talked about to keep you from getting sick, I think Exactly. Yeah. To keep you from getting sick. They, you know, of course market it as not being disconnected, but I think ultimately for me, that would potentially make me feel less like I had something strapped to my face. But who knows? Maybe.

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But everybody else thinks you have something strapped to your face. Ex everybody else knows I've got something strapped to my face, so nobody wants to be around me. <Laugh>. Yeah. So I'm sitting in the corner by myself. Really? Seriously, you're not gonna want to be around somebody like that. Yeah. I don't think No, I agree. I, the, the way sitting here wearing those, you would almost be insulted. Yeah. Yeah. Like, you can't be bothered to be in the room with me. Right. You have to have something. It's, it's a, it is bad enough. People stare at their phones. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>, which I feel insulted when you're at dinner with somebody and they're looking at their phones. That's insulting. Yeah. You look at your watch people. Yeah. Imagine they had this on <laugh>. No, I'm looking at you. I can see you honest. I could see you.

(00:09:52):
No. Anyway, very solitary. This, it's fitting though that this be released on the 30th anniversary actually yesterday, or today was the 30th anniversary of the release of Jurassic Bark. Oh. And the reason that's important is because that was the first movie to use computer generated graphics of the dinosaurs. Not Caliber. Yeah. Not models. In fact, it's a great story. You watched that documentary, oh my God. Amazing documentary about Lucas Arts Lucas light and Magic. It's just called Light and Magic. Yeah. Light Industrial Light and Magic. In which they were building a life-sized raptor. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative> or Tar sos Rex. In the middle of that, one of the Lucas graphic genius' computer geniuses shows Spielberg and Animated Dinosaur. And Spieler says, w Whoa, wait, wait a minute. We could do the whole thing that way. And it was the, it was, that was the watershed.

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Yes. Between everything that had gone before, which was basically models, like the original Star Wars was all physical models or animatronics and completely computer generated graphics. And it's because of Jurassic Park. A lot of directors saw that. And all these, the Luke Lucas himself decided to do the prequels. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>, all of these directors said, whoa, this changes everything. So in a way, 30 years ago, everything changed with computer graphics in movies. Here we are 30 years later and, and we're gonna strap <laugh> you know, an alien to our head. I what could possibly go wrong? What could possibly go wrong? <Laugh>, I, I don't think I'm as far as Kate Nibs in Wired. She was like, yeah, I loved it. I cuz I've been feeling bad. I thought, oh, I'm really harshing everybody's mellow by saying, oh, this is a terrible thing.

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Nobody wants this. And, and Kate Apple's Vision Pro isn't the future subtitled flop era. The new mis mixed reality headset is alarming. Misfire has Apple lost its innovation mojo. I thought I was bad <laugh>. I thought, good for you. That's a, that's a, she says, I'm not a gambler, but I bet everything that Apple's Vision Pro will flop. It's kind of what I've been saying, but I feel bad saying it. I can't. It's, it is. So I wanna ask you something, because you have the benefit of context here, which is a nice way of saying that you're older than me, <laugh>. I have been, I have seen you've seen past. Yeah. You've glared into the abyss. I am curious what you think about the number of people who I have seen who are sharing some, some variation of, well, my parents or my teacher or the school, or this bought me a apple two, an Apple two back in, da da da.

(00:12:56):
Yeah. And that would've been $10,000. Is this in your mind, the same situation? It's interesting. I think it was Harry McCracken who did the, you know, the in inflation calculator on the price 3,500 bucks and pointed out that the apple won the first apple, which was $666 and 66 cents in modern dollars would be more, would be almost $4,000. So it's true in the early days of computing these computers were prohibitively expensive. I remember pressing my nose against the glass <laugh> and looking at the Apple leases saying, I wish I could afford that. But it was $10,000 in, in, in 1980 $3. But, and then in 1984, the Mac came out, and I remember I couldn't afford it, but I had a Macy's card and I went down to Macy's and charged it was 2,500 bucks in 1980 $4, which would probably be three or four times more today.

(00:13:48):
So yes, computing has traditionally been expensive. In fact, we're an amazing era of inexpensive computing. For a long time it was, what we used to say is, the computer you want is always 2,500 bucks. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>, it's not true anymore. So. Right. You know, although interestingly, I just paid 2,500 bucks for a 15 inch MacBook Air. So the computer I wanted was <laugh>. That's the other thing. I feel bad for Apple. They finally announced the Mac Pro. Right. Right. After years of promising. It's more than a year late. No news. No ev all of that was just secondary. 15 inch MacBook Air, which was, is undoubtedly gonna be the bestselling Mac of all time. Certainly the current, the heirs are the current bestselling Max. And you should hear a, again, I, I should have people's names. The ma, what is it? Turn is his last name John.

(00:14:34):
Yeah. John John was at the, the talk show. And you should hear how they talk about MacBook Air as a whole, not even just the 15th. It's a, it's a big product. Apple really seems to enjoy their MacBook errors, and of course, yes. The people seem to enjoy it as well. But they, they put a lot focus on that and actually was surprised at how much they talked about gaming and seeing, you know, something as small as this. Being able to do that. And people finally have caught on a little bit at the time it was buried, but mm-hmm. <Affirmative> Apple at one of the tracks at ww c their developers conference this week, sh said, you know, you should really be porting your PC games over to the Mac. And so to show you how well they would run on a Mac, we've modified something called Wine, which is a way of running Windows programs on Linux without Windows.

(00:15:24):
Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. We've modified wine so that you can run your high end PC game on a Mac and see how well it would run. And then people who noticed this including I can't remember his name T S a I I think it was Johns. Anyway, he posted the video about it, that, that opened my eyes to it. Said, wait a minute. They've, there's, there's an emulator that will run AAA games on a Mac right now. Forget porting it. You can run them right now. And a number of people, there have been pages put up showing how is complicated, but you can't get it working. And there are a number of people who are showing their, well, I saw somebody run Diablo four Wow. On their Mac at 60 frames a second. This is huge. Yeah. It's huge. We'll see if people port their AAA games to the Mac.

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Cuz I think a lot of game developers say that's expensive. And I don't know if there's a market, so I don't know if I'm gonna, by the way, I did spend a few hours over the weekend playing Diablo <laugh>. I'm a big Diablo fan play Diablo one, two, and three. Uhhuh played three several times through. Hmm. so I was excited. Diablo four came out this week. It's a one of the big games from Blizzard. The reviews have been somewhat negative. Blizzard got in a lot of trouble with Diablo Immortal. Remember they put that out on the iPad? Oh yeah. I was gonna say iPad game. Yeah. Yeah. An iPhone. And got in a lot of trouble because it was a greedy game. You know, in order to really win this game, you had to give them a lot of money free to play, you know Diablo four, I saw one review saying is so grim, <laugh>, <laugh>.

(00:17:02):
It is so dark, it's so nasty. And you have to play it all the way through to get to the end before you can even do the fun stuff. He said, it's just too grim. I don't know. It's, it's Diablo. It's not so different from Diablo three. And I was, it was fun to see Diablo again. It was really nice to see it again. So that's what else? Is there anything else that happened? I ordered a MacBook air 15. I'll have that next, next show. Yeah. I'm excited about that. Did not get midnight blue, as I told you. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative> magnet. Fingerprint magnet. It is. I have a midnight blue 13 inch and it's fingerprint magnet. I actually put it in a plastic case, <laugh> to avoid the fingers. Keep it safe. So this time I got the silver. Nice. Nice old school.

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I went old school. Yeah. That'll be a good one. I, I, I did wanna ask you a question. Why did the Scarecrow win an award? Actually, chat. G p t tells me, Uhhuh <affirmative>, it's because he's outstanding in his field. Indeed it is. Because he's outstanding in his field. Isn't that an interesting report? Yeah. So this, by the way, the one thing that I focused on is this report on the jokes that chat G p T. And by the way, it's 3.5, not the newest one, but 3.5 tells were was from two German scientists. So they say Germans don't have a sense of humor. Yeah. Clearly they, they at least know enough to be able to get it to do some jokes. So what did they find? Yeah. So according to this, our Technica article about the, the research report over 90% of the thousand eight generated jokes were the same 25 jokes.

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They go on to list some of the jokes. The one that I just asked was said 140 times as they prompted the they're all the chat to, to terrible. They're, yeah, they're bad. Why did the tomato turn red? Cuz it's all the salad. Like this is, do you remember Laffy Taffy? You'd get these little pieces of taffy and they'd have underneath the flap the jokes. Yeah, sure. All of these jokes are from the back of Laffy Taffy. Sure. <laugh>. It's, they're not good. So do, are you saying that Chad g p t 3.5 was trained on Laffy? On Laffy Taffy? I may be saying that Willy Wonka trained chat G p t 3.5 at least. I, and of course this all depends on how you prompt it. If you're just asking for jokes straight up. But Alexa does the same thing and so does Oh yeah.

(00:19:17):
I mean, don't ask ever ask Amazon's echo for to tell a joke. Someone worst, worst, worst. They're so grown worthy <laugh>, which look I like a grown joke, but the, they're so, ugh, ugh, ugh. Waste of time. Waste of the second of my life. It took. So the big story this week is gonna be Reddit. Yeah. One last news story, then we'll start taking some calls. And again, the phone number, don't forget, eight eighty eight, I forgot to let it down. 7 2 4 down there. Yeah. There you go. 7 2 4 2 8 84. <Laugh>. Thank you. John Ashley <laugh>. What would I do without you? <Laugh> Reddit is right now going through a rebellion. You know, I don't know if you remember, but the Arab Spring began in Tunisia when people this was some years ago and has start kind of, Twitter had something to do with Facebook, had something to do with it.

(00:20:13):
People started to realize, you know, we don't have to be oppressed. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>, I think we're going through the Twitter spring <laugh> Okay. Right now. Okay. I get it. Yeah. Where people, people look at Twitter and they see how one evil billionaire can take a social network and take all the stuff you've posted. Cuz really, Twitter, read it, Facebook, YouTube, it's made of people. Yeah. Right. It's not, it's not the platform. Yeah. They provide a platform, but then the value of it is the stuff you and I, and everybody else posts on it. So people looked at Twitter and go, you know, we don't have to be stuck in Elon's hell mm-hmm. <Affirmative>, we can go to Mastodon and, and blue Sky and other sources of great pleasure contribute there instead. One note, one important point of this is people seem to want to go somewhere where no one can own it.

(00:21:04):
Where it's federated. There's no one person who can own it. So Reddit, now it's Reddit's turn the evil owners <laugh> of Reddit. Reddit was spun off. It was owned by Conde Nasco De Nest still owns a majority shares, but it was spun off to its own company and is about to do an initial public offering about to put out stock. And so they're trying to beef up, they've never been profitable. Right. Which frankly, to me is bad leadership. Right. Because it should be so easy to make Yeah, yeah. Make money on it. Right? Yes. Seems to me bad leadership mm-hmm. <Affirmative> anyway. Never been profitable. So now there's kind of, well, if we're gonna sell stock, we got What do you want? <Laugh> the email is, is relevant to Reddit after we're done talking about it. Yes. and thank you John Ashleys <laugh> <laugh>.

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So I used to do for many years in the, in the beginning of the century mm-hmm. <Affirmative> okay. I used to do a show called Live with Regis and Kelly. Oh yeah. Perhaps you remember it. Yeah. And they're very famous executive producers still there now that it's live with Kelly and her husband. That's actually how it's called too. Yeah. Yeah. Kelly and the Man <laugh> actually be a good name for it and would be they're producer, very famous Gelman. Right. Okay. Even Kathy Lee Galman. So he had that little whiteboard, just like you've got John Ashley. Oh, really? And he would write stuff on it, and then he'd tap it with a marker. <Laugh>. So I'm demonstrating gadgets. And he'd write, move On, and he'd tap it with a, if you didn't do it, he'd tap it with a marker.

(00:22:39):
Oh my goodness. Yeah. Go ahead. Tap it with a marker there. That all really <laugh> Bob. It's like there's a little bit Pavlov's dogs. Right. Did you know j Gelman <laugh>. Can you? I can't imagine that would make me anxious. <Laugh>. I'll be going anyway, what was I saying? Reddit. Anyway, we'll watch, because the Reddit boycott starts tomorrow. And a great many Reddit communities, they call 'em subreddits are going to go dark for a few days. One iPhone has said, we're going dark forever. Is the, is the boycott because of the I p o or because of the third party? Oh, yeah. Yeah. I didn't, I left out the middle chunk Cause of the ipo. You're right. Thank you. They're they're now gonna charge for access. And this means all the third party apps have already many of them already gone away.

(00:23:30):
June 30th Reddit is fun. Riff is gone. The big one, Apollo. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative> is gone. Christian Zelig, the creator of Apollo said it's gonna cost me 20 million a year if they charge what they say they're gonna charge. I don't make that much money. Yeah. I'm gonna have to shut down the app. At that point they had a a conversation, which did you read that? So taped. Oh my goodness. That was harrowing. <Laugh>, yeah. Steve Huffman, who I know, and I've interviewed the c current c e o. And the guy wrote Reddit in the first place in the Bing beginning in common. Li Steve Huffman, who's the current ceo E he was brought back to run it was kind of lying, I think is the only word you could say about his conversation with Celek.

(00:24:18):
So Celek said, well, that's good news. I've recorded it. And here, and he's Canadian, and it's a single party state. So it was legal. It's a single party countries who was legal to record it. And then Hoffman gave an ama in which he really didn't answer any questions. And when he did, he was dismissive and snarky. And now the entire Reddit, the, the, like the hardcore Reddits, the Reddit communities in Revolt. Yeah. And I don't know what's gonna happen, but I, there is no good re fei verse style. There's lemi, which is not, it's okay. But there's no real, this Reddit's one of those things where you kind of do need a central, I think, spot. I don't know. I might be, Ooh, that's tough. Yeah, it's very hard. Lemy doesn't have an, it doesn't even have mobile apps. So it's like, there is no, but it's not owned by anybody.

(00:25:05):
Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. It's not owned by Conde Nast or Elon Musk or anybody. So I think watch with interest, I will be, I mean, Twitter was one thing, but I will be very sad if Fred goes away. I, it's, it's chock full of so much good information that you can't find elsewhere. Yeah. Oh, I would be devastated. All right. That's that's just, I think a heads up on what's, what's coming this week and what happened last week. We like to do that every week. We do. Yes. But now we should really get to some calls, or should I do an ad? You know what, we should, you should do an ad and then we should do an email in the, in the add an email inbox and then calls. Okay. That's gonna be the order. But first, I slept so lovely last night. I wanna tell you about my sheets.

(00:25:46):
Yes. Sheets. Now, you know, I have that great mattress mm-hmm. <Affirmative>. And, you know, I have that great eight sleep. And my bet, my, our advertisers basically created my bed, right? <Laugh>, I got the Casper mattress, I got the eight sleep on it. But, you know, their final piece is great linens. And I got, now, see, I got the luxe. Yes. The luxe, the top of the line. Brooke Linens. That's their most popular bedding. You got the, the less, the less expensive ones. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. And, and you're happy. Yeah, because they sleep cooler. And I am a very, very, very warm sleeper. So it's not woven as tight. Brooke Lennon, that's the company. Their mission is to provide you with luxury bedding delivered to your door at a fair price. Rich and Vicky started this in Brooklyn, as you might imagine, <laugh> about eight years ago, nine years ago.

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It's Tech guy, the S is imaginary. Brooklinen is like Brooklyn, but with linen. So B r o o k l i n e n.com. And the code is Tech Guy. Four $20 off with orders of a hundred dollars or more. We love our Brook linens. Both of us. Yes. Both of us. So much. I, it's, I sleep cooler than I ever have before. And I already had, as we mentioned, the other sponsor helping me sleep cooler. Yeah, we kinda set right. We got I What else do we need? I don't wanna sleep anywhere else. Can I take it all with me if I need to go some other place? No, they're all they're all, they all stay here. We own them all. <Laugh> email. Oh, look at this from North Phoenix. Guy Anonymous. So maybe I shouldn't have read his email. Anyway. North Fix Guy.

(00:30:15):
Good morning. The tech guys. Can you please discuss why a lot of Reddit communities are shutting down or going private? Explain about how to join a private ones. No, you can't. That's the thing. I noticed our iPhone went private and I have no idea how to join it. You can't. Oh. Only moderators can use it. You could beg <laugh>, but it's basically closed. Okay. That's the point. So let me show you Lemi. You can't ask to join. I don't think so. Through some sort of process. Not that I know of. Yeah. Private. How see how to just be there. Basically what they're doing is they're saying we're gone. Got it. We're gone. So Lemi, which is the fe averse, the Mastodon for Reddit. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative> is Lemi or join lemy.org. Just like Maid on, there are multiple servers. So you can pick the server you want.

(00:31:05):
I joined LEMY World, which is the biggest right now. I'll log into Lemy world and show you this because it's not yet ready for much like Mastodon. I think it's confusing to people not ready for Oh yeah. Prime time. I'm gonna log in, sir. Hide. Hide your eyes. Don't look, wow. That yeah, there's so few users. 1.3 K users per month. What's gonna happen, I think over the next theory, now you can show gonna happen over the next few weeks. We'll see. But I think people are gonna go somewhere else. So there are communities, these are their versions of subreddits. And you could see how many people are in the community, how many posts are in the community, how active it is. And there's analogs for many of them. For instance, I'm in Apple, but you see, there's only 302 members right now.

(00:32:03):
So they're not gonna be very active in the long run. I thi Or in the short run, rather in the long run. Well, let's see, let's see. So I subscribe to, you know apple Diablo, Android Bay area, fed averse, culinary Creations. These are kind of, I'm trying to duplicate Formula One chat pt. There is an advent of Code Community. Oh, nice. You know, this is one of many things that are gonna be harmed by the loss of Reddit. Advent of code really relies on Reddit. Reddit is the community for those coding contests. We, I do every December. That's where you go to show your re you know, your code and ask for help and so forth. I don't know if we can survive without Reddit, but Lemi is the open source. No one owns it. Federated version. As far as I know.

(00:32:55):
There's no way to join our iPhone. That's the whole point. If you go to reddit slash r slash iPhone you'll see it says we're closed. And I think there's actually a post there. Does that mean you can't even wat like read any of the stuff there? Yeah, and the for instance, I can't find it now. I just searched for it. It's not there. Yeah, you can't read it. Let's see. If I go to reddit.com/r/iphone, that's how you go to a, directly to a subreddit. And the result is it's private in protest against Reddit's changes to a p I do not send us Mod mail. Oh, they're sending you to Discord. So that might be the other thing that will happen is that you is if there may be, it's not the same though. Right. But these communities may go to Discord.

(00:33:48):
I think Discords gonna, oh, discord is really, yeah. Yeah. So if you wanted, I, you know, you can't join rejoin the subreddit. That's it. It's gone. Unless you're mod you can't see it. Only approved members can view and take part in this discussion, but it says, do not, do not message us. So I guess you could ask, but I think what they really want you to do is go to discord.gg/iphone and then you will join that Discord. I don't think that that's in the long run, very tenable, but I think that that's probably what advent of code will do and things like that. How many, I mean, if you look at my Discord, I'm in a few groups, but how many, how many, you know, of course we have our club twit group, but how many Discord groups can you join? They, they're all over here on the left.

(00:34:31):
I guess you could, I'm in Mid Journey log seats. I am an old so many of them, but I, yeah, I I don't use it all podcasting part of Lisp and, and it's so easy to start a Discord community. But yeah. I wonder, <laugh>, how's Discord doing? <Laugh> given if I wanted to, I could spin up three in one day. You know what I mean? And I, I suddenly there are people joining it and it gets pretty complicated. Yeah. I, yeah, this is a great question. We are you know, I think this is the Arab Spring for social networks. That's what I think. We're not gonna take it. Yeah, we're not gonna take it. I agree. All right. Jesse is on the horn. Let's go to our caller. Jesse, come on down. Come on down. No, the next contestant on. Ask the tech guys. Yes, the tech guys. Jesse's in Zoom, so I think we're gonna see him. Hello. Welcome. Jay. Jesse. Jess, welcome. Where are you calling from? Hey,

Caller Jess (00:35:27):
I am calling from Lexington, South Carolina.

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (00:35:29):
Lovely. I bet it's beautiful right now in South Carolina.

Caller Jess (00:35:34):
It is. It's actually raining a little bit right now. Oh, okay. But the problem I'm having is I've had this as ASUS desktop since January, 2016. Yes.

(00:35:47):
And it is running Windows 10. It has Intel core I five. And last night it was idle, wasn't really doing anything, and a blue screen of death popped up with the code journal data in page error. And so I went through rebooting. It took me to the bios. I ended up going through Windows Boot Manager. Basically before it entered the bios, it said hardness may fail soon. Yeah. Backup data and replace something along those lines. I've checked the hard drive in it and I'm running a defragment on it now. It's, was it 5%? Now it's down to 1.6% fragmented with Windows 10 support ending in October, 2025. I have all my important files backed up to an external drive. Oh, good

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (00:36:41):
Man

Caller Jess (00:36:41):
And cloud. But I'm just considering, should I just go ahead and replace the hard drive? Yes. And wait, so 2025,

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (00:36:50):
That ker error means I can't load data from the hard drive. I mean, I guess it could be ram, but it's the hard drive. And really an eight year old computer, that's what happens. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>, the hard, the first thing that's gonna die is moving parts. The good news is you can, you can not only resurrect that computer, but in all likelihood, improve its speed to the point where you won't want a new computer just by putting in an ssd. And SSDs are cheap now. So that's what I would do. I would replace that hard drive with a solid state drive. It will give you at least 10 years, I think, of of reliability. It'll be much faster. And I'm, so, I'm, I was really pleased that you said you'd backed it up. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>, because that's gonna solve that whole thing. You don't wanna res, you wanna res, don't wanna restore windows. You wanna install Windows first, then restore your data.

Caller Jess (00:37:39):
Yeah. I have everything backed up, all my important followup to an external drive in the cloud. So I'm good. If the computer crashes, I just have to replace the operating system in the program.

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (00:37:49):
Yeah. Reinstall Windows 10. The good news is because you've installed Windows 10 on that machine Microsoft will just say, oh yeah, fine. And authorize it. You don't need a serial number or anything. And then you can restore your data. And honestly, this is a great thing to do. I'm so glad you've been backing up all along. That's, that's really the only hitch in that. And by the way, a hard drive of the same size as yours is gonna be probably under a hundred bucks. It's not gonna an s sd, it's not gonna be hugely expensive. The prices have really dropped. Look at that. The Soine. Now he may not, I doubt he's got that not two hard drives. You probably have a Saada drive in there, right? So you're gonna get a Yeah, I only

Caller Jess (00:38:28):
Have one SAT drive in there and then I have an external

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (00:38:30):
Track. Yeah. Yeah. The solo are good. That's actually the Intel SSDs. Oh. We talked to we had Alan Melvin on a couple of weeks ago, and that's what happened is Intel spun their hard drive division off. So those great intel Evo or not Evo, those are Samsungs. Samsung Evos are very good too. But Samsung or Soine, either one would be fine. Under a hundred bucks probably. How big a drive did you have?

Caller Jess (00:38:58):
Right now I have a one terabyte hard drive in the computer. And then my external backup drive is five terabytes.

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (00:39:05):
Good news. Your terabytes less than 50 bucks. Yeah, you're, you're good. But I would actually go to two at this point. Might as well, right? Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>, I, I, you know, when I ordered my new MacBook order two, two is my new standard. Used to be one. Now it's two <laugh>. I just don't wanna run. I never wanna run. Wanna run out and have to use something else to Yeah. Yeah. Manage it. Yeah. So so it depends on how much money you got, you know, where your finances stand. But I think this is definitely, don't try to save that hard drive cuz it's just gonna keep happening and at some point you will be sorry cuz you'll lose data or your thing won't boot.

Caller Jess (00:39:38):
Yeah. I'm kind on the budget, so I'm just trying to be mindful.

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (00:39:42):
Get the one terabyte then, you know. Yeah. I think that's a great way. Bucks.

Caller Jess (00:39:48):
Sounds great. Can you

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (00:39:49):
Do it?

Caller Jess (00:39:50):
Yeah, definitely thinking about

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (00:39:52):
It. Great to talk to you Anna. Thank you so much for listening to ask the Tech guys. We appreciate it. Thank you so much. Thanks. Single best thing you can do to to a computer really nowadays is put in an ssd. Yes. Speeds up everything. That's the other thing that you'll be happy about is after you do that, it's not just a, you're being, you're able to use your computer again. Right? But b, it's going to be a better experience for you because of that. S s d. Should we go to voicemail? Yeah, let's go to a voicemail. How about that?

Caller Brad (00:40:19):
Hello, Leo Micah. This is Brad. I'm from St. Louis and I do have a question for you. I've never been able to actually find the answer. So I am visually impaired and have one eye. And I know that the Apple Vision Pro headset is coming out, you know, early next year. And I just wanna know would I be able to use it or would it not work because of my one eye? Or would any of the headset's work? Or am I just outta luck? Thank you guys so much. You guys are the best. Have a great day.

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (00:40:54):
Isn't that a great question? Well, first of all, I'm going to reach out to my press person after this episode. And what, ask what happens if you only have one eye? Because I can't say with full certainty. I would say you know, because of, so, so it depends on, on the technology, right? Because if you go to, like, I can tell you, I'll, I'll give you the answer. Yeah. Because I have monovision, which means I only use one eye at a time. Did you know that about me? No. No. So I only use one eye at a time. So in order to use any VR headset, I have to defocus, I have to consciously get both eyes working. You could use it, you wouldn't get any 3D effect or stereoscopic effect cuz you don't have StereoVision as you know. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>, you have one eye.

(00:41:36):
Now that one screen is gonna work. I don't know what a That's the eye tracking part then that's why you have to ask Apple. Yeah. Because it depends on what Apple does. So he said if, or could I use any of them? Right? You could in fact, you know, go ahead and try an Oculus with an eye closed, you can use it. You just lose the 3D spatiality of it. It's in effect a a small screen right in front of your eye. There would be, part of the picture would be out of your, out of view, but you can turn your head mm-hmm. <Affirmative> and on everything. But the apple, the tracking is done with an accelerometer. I don't know how the apple, we don't know enough about the apple, know how it works. But on an Oculus for instance, when you move your head, that's when the view changes.

(00:42:25):
It's an accelerometer in the headset, not your eyes. So you, if you know you've got one eye closed, you can't see what's over here just as I can right now. But if you turn your head, the, the view in that single screen will rotate and you will see it. Right. So I think you could use somebody else's. Would it be the full experience? Absolutely not. But I can use it. I have monovision if I want that stereo effect, I defocus so that both eyes are used, but most of the time they're not. And it works. Wow. Is that something that you or like are you born with that or is that something developed all the time? Yeah, well I had as a kid amblyopia, which had a lazy eye. Okay. And was never corrected. The, I remember vividly my doctor, Dr.

(00:43:09):
Otter, hi Dr. Otter, my pediatrician said, well don't worry, he's never gonna be in TV or the movie. So it doesn't matter. And <laugh>, which is I think <laugh> Lord <laugh>, hi Dr. Otter. Hi Dr. Otter. Can you see me now? <Laugh>. So, but you, if you've ever noticed, one of my eye turns in a little bit and that's because I have a lazy eye. What's interesting is, which eye turns in is depends on which eye am using. So for instance, I'm wearing contacts right now. This one is for reading, this one is for distance. Oh. So you have two different prescriptions. Yeah. In your eyes. And it's, and it's, a lot of people do this without mono with it's called monovision without my particular lack of StereoVision. But when I, but even if I were wearing my glasses, when I'm reading whichever eye the book is closest to is the eye that's gonna do it.

(00:43:57):
And it shifts. Oh wow. Back and forth. So I have in, I don't have exactly your condition. In other words, I don't, I don't actually literally have only one eye, but I only use one at a time. And yes, I can use the Oculus Pro I can use and if I want the stereo it say I'll go to a 3D movie. In fact, maybe you've had some experience with a 3D movie. If you go to a 3D movie, it's not 3D for you anymore. Right. Cuz you need that to come together in the lens. And I can defocus and get the 3D effect, but it's kind of work so it goes away. You know, cuz most of the time I'm only using one eye. Huh. so those other ones should work. We don't know cuz the a nobody knows the Apple vision is.

(00:44:38):
I bet your press guy doesn't know. Probably doesn't. He's never used him. May not be able to answer. I can promise you <laugh>. Well, yeah. But can hopefully ask because it's the eye tracking part that I'm curious won't work. Probably that I would bet you the whole thing with which he might you. Yeah. But you can absolutely use an Oculus or an HTC five. It's just you won't get the stereo experience, you won't get the 3D experience. But you're not getting that in real life. You know what we do? Those of us who have this problem, I can still get two fingers to join. Right. Which you would in theory say, well, you don't have depth perception. How can you do that? It's with the, what's something called an Isaac Cade? Your eyes are always moving a little bit like this. Yeah. You can't see it.

(00:45:13):
And my, so I in effect get StereoVision with one eye by Cades. Oh by CIC CADing. That's an adaption. It's not normal. It's an adaptation. Wow. Yeah. See I'm a, I'm an alien, but no one knows it. <Laugh>. Let's do another no, wait a minute. Let's get Mr. Sam Allam on the line. Sam is gonna be doing a takeover of twit this afternoon. <Laugh>. Well not just me, but my friends Robbie and Nicole are gonna join us. Yeah. We're gonna do a wheel bearings takeover on Twit. And now I hope you guys are prepared to talk about some of the news, like the vision and so forth. Oh, absolutely. Yeah. But there's a lot of cards. We do, we do on wheel burns. We just wing it. Yeah. <laugh>. Just, that's all we need. You know what? I don't know, did you have something you wanted to talk about, Sam?

(00:46:00):
Cuz I have some questions for you, which we can say for twit too. Well go ahead. Ask, ask the questions. One of the big questions in my mind, Tesla of course has a different electric vehicle charging system. They call it ca right? That n a c s n na snacks. They Yeah, they, they, they, they rebranded it a few months ago. Okay. after, so what happened was the the rules came out for the the Nevi program, which is the National Electric Vehicle Infrastructure Program. This is the the, the the funding program that was part of the infrastructure bill to provide seven and a half billion dollars for building out a network of public EV chargers across the United States. And one of the stipulations in there was that in order to get the funding they had to use what's known as the c s connector.

(00:46:50):
And as it as it happens. That's what I was gonna talk about anyway. Oh, good. Because GM and now Ford have both announced they're gonna support Nax the Tesla. Right. Supercharger standard. And now I'm concerned Electrify America has just built thousands of c c s fast charging stations, Uhhuh <affirmative> all over the country. What is the plan? Are they gonna offer both N A C S and C C s or the IS C C CS doomed? I think CCS is now at the point where it's doomed. He's now going be, gosh, Betamax hd DVD of what? Isn't that the one that VW funded by being a bad steward? So VW funded the Build of Electrify America. In fact, they still own Electrify America. It's a division of the Volkswagen Group. But they, and, and they built them all out with c c s primarily CC s connectors.

(00:47:46):
So if you're watching the video stream, you can see over my right shoulder up, up here, up here. This is a CCS connector with the extra fast. That's a charging thing on the bottom. That's optional by the way. That doesn't Well, yeah. So the, the original standard that was developed by s a e, it was called J 1772. So if you're looking at the CCS connector, the top portion of it, the, the circular part with five pins in there, that is the original J 1772 connector. Right. That is only for AC charging. So up to 200 or up to one 20 up to 240 volts. Oh, two 40. Okay. Yeah. So that's your level one, your level two home charging. That's what I use at Home Chargers. Right. I just used that top part. Yeah. Right. But it charges pretty fast.

(00:48:29):
It charges overnight. I mean, it's not Right. Yeah. And then later on about 2013 or so, they created an extension to that, which adds the two larger pins down below right here, which are for DC fast charging. So on my Ford Mustang Maee on Lisa's mini, on our bolt, there's a little flap <laugh> Yep. That's normally closed for extras for the ex extra fins. But when you get to a fast charging station, you have full down the flap and you plug it in. Right. And so that's known as the CCS type one connector. There's also a c s type two, which is a variant of this that they use in Europe, which has two extra pins to support the three phase electrical system that they use in Europe. We only use single phase here. So this isn't the first time standards have changed.

(00:49:15):
Chato mm-hmm. Was very popular. Chato was, well, wow. I shouldn't say it that way. It was not really very popular. <Laugh> Chato was a standard that was developed in Japan. Nissan's Leaf uses it. It's the last vehicle in the US Yeah. The, yeah. The, the Nissan Leaf, because you know, it was developed in Japan at the time when the Leaf was introduced in 2010 c s didn't exist. Right. Chato was the only DC charging system that existed. So they used that. Yeah. And they still have that on there today. But, and you'll go around, there'll be Chato charges, a lot of the older chargers mm-hmm. <Affirmative> in the US are Chato. Yeah. Yeah. A lot of, well, and usually what they'll have is they'll have chargers will have you have a choice. Two cables on there. Yeah. One with a ccs and one with a Chato.

(00:49:56):
Right. And you know, if you go to most, you know, electrify America stations, there'll be you know, however many, you know, 6, 8, 10 chargers there, one of those will have a chato connector on it for leaf owners. And then all the others are ccs. Can I ask a stupid question? Sure. Yeah. So I'm guessing there's not an option to carry like a case full of Dons in your car. Yeah. Actually most of the time you get an vehicle as it happens. Yeah. So I, I thought you'd need like a bunch of technol or like, you know, but even my father came with adapters, but my mocking has. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So Tesla does offer an adapter and you can also buy some third party adapters that allow you to plug in a CCS charger into a Tesla, which, and Tesla. This yeah, this one over here.

(00:50:40):
This is the N A C S connector. This is the Tesla Connect. It's very simple. They, yeah. And they developed this you know, before CCS was created, they wanted a DC charging connector. So they created their own cuz there was no standard at the time. So they developed that. And so Tesla you can get an a dongle, essentially adapter that plugs into the N A C S port and then has a c s receiver port on the other side of it. So you can plug in a cc s charger to plug your Tesla or to charge your Tesla. Mm-Hmm. Yeah. And what we don't have right now is the reverse of that. We don't have one that allows you to plug in an N A C S charger into a c CCS equipped vehicle. But those are coming.

(00:51:26):
So those, so is that how four gonna do it, which is pro bundle? Both. So bundle and adaptor in or something like that? Yeah. They haven't, they haven't revealed all the details yet, but what they have said is that starting in early 2024 all of their EVs and the same is also true now for General Motors. They just announced the same thing essentially. Exactly the same thing that Ford announced a couple of days ago, that starting at early next year, all of their existing EVs with CCC s ports on them will also have a software update in there that has support for charging on the Tesla superchargers. So they're gonna get, probably get some kind of SDK from Tesla, integrate that into the, the charging software in their vehicles. And so you will be able to take those vehicles, plug them into a supercharger with the adapter and it then it will charge, it'll charge your vehicle and bill your whatever payment method you have hooked up to your vehicle.

(00:52:28):
So you don't have to use the Tesla app like you do today if you want to use a Tesla charger with a magic.com. But it's your prediction that this is gonna be the death now for Fast for c c s charging Yes. That everybody's gonna, will Tesla have a monopoly do or are they gonna let others use their, their patent because they have this patent? Sure. So Tesla has publicly stated that they are effectively open sourcing the patent. I don't know exactly what they've, Elon's the definition of open source is very different from mine. Yeah. I gotta point out, when this news came out, Tesla stock shot up. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative> considerably. This is the five day chart. They went up over 20 bucks because people assumed that means Elon's gonna own the entire electric infrastructure, like for charging electric vehicles. That's, that's, that's not, that's not a valid assumption.

(00:53:21):
I hope it's not like, so what, what we will see over the next 12 to 36 months over the next year or three is all of the other charging networks will start converting their chargers over and new chargers will be installed that have N A C S connectors on them. And so the I have confirmed with both General Motors and Ford, I've talked, talked to both of them the other day, that they're not paying any, they don't have to pay any royalties to Tesla to use this charger to use this connector. And anybody can use it free of charge. Okay. what Tesla will get is they will get new rev, new revenues, more revenues. Yeah. Cuz people chargings their superchargers. Yeah. Because, and the, and the reason why GM and Ford are doing this, and I believe that by the end of the year, we'll probably see most automakers do exactly the same thing that GM and Ford have just done.

(00:54:13):
The reason why they're doing this is because the rest of the ev charging industry has failed us miserably, particularly Electrify America. But Evie go and Blink and ChargePoint are not that much better. A recent study said 25% of Electrify America charging ports were out of service when they did the Yeah. Survey. I was, I was just over at my local EA station earlier this week. We were, I was doing a, a standup with one of the local Detroit TV stations for a report they were doing on EV charging. And while we were, I was standing there, you know, in front of a machi that I was driving that was plugged in and charging. And the charger right next to me said, you know, out of service. But is that, why is that, I mean, is there, is there inherently something in Tesla's supercharger that these Electrify Americas don't have?

(00:55:02):
Or is it just the companies aren't paying attention? I mean, I imagine Tesla's got, I think it's from maintaining the superchargers. Yeah. And, and it electrify America walked away after they built them. I, I think it's more the latter. Yeah. because, you know, when Tesla introduced the superchargers in late 2012, early 2013, this was one of the big selling points. Exactly. That's why I'm bought a Tesla. Exactly. Because yeah, you could, you could charge charge your Tesla fast. You could drive anywhere in the us and be within range of a supercharger station. And so this was, you know, so they, they were trying to overcome the range anxiety problem he people had with EVs. Yeah. You know, so you get lot, lots of range in the vehicle. Plus anywhere you could, you can go, you can charge up your Tesla quickly. Right. This was one of their major selling points.

(00:55:50):
And so they, they, unlike all these other companies, they have done a good job of actually maintaining their chargers, make sure that they work and and keep them reliable. So availability has been crucial. The rest of the industry has not done the same thing. Most of these other companies they, they've done a, a poor job of maintaining the chargers. They're, you know, they're oftentimes you'll go and connectors will be, you know, the, the, the connectors will be broken. It's cables will run over that. It's terrible. There's Yeah. A software problem. But that's just, it's nothing inherently better in the, in the N A C S charging. It's just they maintain 'em. Well, well there, there is one, one thing that dif that differs okay. With Tesla versus the rest of the industry, they have had an advantage similar to the advantage that Apple has versus Windows or Android in that Tesla control has controlled the entire ecosystem.

(00:56:48):
They may, they had their own chargers that had their own software and they had their vehicles, and those chargers only had to work with those vehicles so they could have the same software stack compatible software stack in their vehicles. Right. It's very charger. You plug it in. Yeah. It communicates, it identifies the vehicle. So it knows who to bill. And it does, it just does it. And, and it works because it, they've kept it limited. And, you know, it's the same thing with Apple or with you know, with on both Mac and on iOS and iPad OS and so on, you know, they have a limited scope of hardware that they support and they can make sure they can test their software and make sure it works on every piece of hardware that it supports. Windows. Microsoft, you know, for decades has had this problem of you have hundreds or thousands of companies making all kinds of different combinations of hardware and they have to test it with all these different variations.

(00:57:42):
Same thing for Google and Android. And so there's always been less reliability because they have to try and support all these different hardware combinations. And the same thing is true in the ev charging business. EA ev go. Cuz a lot of the issues that we have with the Nont Tesla chargers are not necessarily hardware problems. They are often many of the times that I've had issues, it's actually turned out to be a software issue communication issue. They're not they're not doing their handshake properly. When you plug it in it can't identify it, it doesn't know how fast it's supposed to charge. You know, there's any number of things that can go wrong. And this is a risk that Tesla faces going forward now opening it up, opening up their system to other vehicles. What happens, and we've already seen this, what happens to the nearly 1000 Electrify America stations?

(00:58:32):
Are they gonna change to cs? Yeah, I, I believe so. They have, they won't have a choice. Yeah. I I believe that by 2025 you know, when these these next batch of EVs from Ford and GM and from every other automaker start coming out with CS connectors on there, they are going to have to start putting N A C S connectors on their chargers. Yeah. So my guess is that by 20 sometime between now and 2025, my local station here that has six chargers they'll, they'll keep the one chato connector that they have on there now for, for legacy leaf owners. And they'll probably have maybe two CCS connectors and three N C s connectors. And over time those ccs and chato are gradually gonna get replaced. And eventually by, probably by the end of the decade, it'll be all C s I I predict that by 20, by the end of 2026, early 27, there will not be another new EV built with a c s port on it.

(00:59:32):
Wow. And probably sooner than that. So if you're buying a new EV in the next year or so, well, there is nothing right now, but eventually GM and Ford will have this. Yeah. GM and Ford have said that they will have in, in addition to the software support, they will have adapters available for for their vehicles with CCS ports so that they can plug into a supercharger. Yeah. and and then, you know, from 2025 onwards, the vehicles that are built with only the, the N A C S port, they will also have adapters. There's already adapters available to plug those into a C c S charger. And there's a, there's a list that one of my colleagues found and sent to me this morning of most of the charging system manufacturers have already said that they are already developing or, or are shipping, you know, ha have available to ship CCS connectors for their chargers.

(01:00:30):
So this includes companies like A, B B Tel blank, e ev go, Evie Go is a big partner of gm. They're building out something like 2,700 DC fast charging stations with gm. I I just don't trust Elon Musk one inch. Well, and I just figure he's gonna find some way <laugh> to Yeah. To basically own the electric vehicle infrastructure in the country. <Laugh>, and then, well, my, my, my my guess is that Ford and GM would not have signed Yeah. And done any kind of deal with him unless they had a contract that said, no, you can never, ever charge for this for access to this. Yeah. I mean, they'll, they'll charge, you know, Tesla will charge for the electricity that you use when you go to a supercharger station. Right. But they will not be able to charge royalties for use of this connector.

(01:01:17):
It's as if, it's as if at some point in our gas vehicle infrastructure you know, Esso, well, who's a, who's a shell said, you know, we're, we're gonna make one kind of gas. We're gonna let everybody make this kind of gas. And then all the vehicle manufacturers said, yeah, we're only gonna work with shell style gas and all the <laugh>. It just, to me, it feels like the, a monopoly somehow. And I just don't trust Elon not to exploit this in some fashion form or fashion. I, I would phrase that in a slightly different way. Okay. you're the car guy, you should use this in. In fact, in fact, you know, every oil company actually has there, first of all, there's no such thing as pure gasoline. Right. Gasoline, they all have formulas. Yeah. Yeah. Gasoline is a mixture of octane TTA and a bunch of other additives.

(01:02:11):
Right. In various, it's blended in various ways. Kind of like scotch whiskey, if you'd been listening to Richard Campbell <laugh> Yes. Says Blend, you've got a bunch of things that are blended together. Yes. that have certain, certain characteristics. You know, it's gotta have certain types of performance characteristics. So when you put it into a gasoline engine, it behaves in a certain way. But if you take gasoline from a shell station or an Exxon station or a BP station or anybody else and do a spectrograph and, and look at what's actually in there, you'll find there's a, there's, everybody's got a different formula. Or, you know, like cola, everybody's got a different formula for coal, but, but your car will run on any of the formulas. So that's good news, you know. But what we ha I mean, in the early days of the auto industry, we did not have, for example, a standardized size for the fuel filler on Oh, how funny.

(01:03:04):
For the gas tank. Well, this is what I'm, this interesting, this why we never had a standard for this charging. Yeah. Why didn't, I mean, we did, we had J 1772, but we, we, we did, I mean, a standard was developed. The, the industry apart from Tesla came together and developed Chase 1772 and then ccs. The problem is that while they were doing that, Tesla was actually going out and selling a whole bunch of EVs. Right. And so, up to this point, they have dominated much of the market for EVs. This is the, this is exactly what antitrust law is all about. Your dominance in one market should not allow you then to enter another market and use that dominance. Except I don't believe that they will be able to dominate. I hope not. I hope you're right. I just don't trust Ilan. The, the, the rest, the rest of the industry is going to use this connector, which is, you know, the analog to, you know, the standard size fuel filler neck in, you know, for your gas tank.

(01:04:00):
Every car today has exact same fuel filler size. So when you stick the nozzle in there Yes. It goes in, it fits properly. Thank you. That's, that's what the connect Yes. That's what the connector Yes. The these connectors are Yes. Is that fuel filler neck. And, you know, they're all using <laugh>. In fact, unlike gasoline, all the electricity is just a flow of electrons. So that is actually gonna be the same. Right. It's just a matter of whose label is on the charger. And so I believe that, you know, nozzle <laugh>, yeah. Yeah. Well, with this change, you know, GM and Ford and other automakers are saying to the rest of the ev charging industry, get your act together. You have to get your act together. Yeah. You have to make these things work, otherwise you will go out of business. Yeah. And so in a way that's simulating competition.

(01:04:48):
Yeah. That's interesting. Yeah. Because they really have failed us. These, this charging infrastructure has been, and it's, and it's not a technical problem, you're saying it's really just a maintenance problem, like Yeah. It's a, it's a business, it's a business issue. They have to care for their, their facilities. Yeah. And men just build them and then they walk away and there's nobody checking 'em. Yeah. Yeah. And, and part of the problem is the way that the, the infrastructure has been built out. You know, when you go to a gas station, you know, there's usually, you know, first of all, there's usually a over the gas pumps, so you're protected from the elements to some degree. There's usually a convenience store there where you can go in and buy some of terrible coffee and sushi that'll kill you. Yeah. <laugh>. But there's also somebody working there.

(01:05:31):
Yeah. You know, so if there's a problem with a gas pump, you go in and tell you, you tell the, the person working in there that, hey, you know, pump number three is not working. And they'll go out and put a tag on it, and they, they can call somebody and they'll come in, it'll get fixed, you know, fairly quickly with these charging stations. Usually they will drop them into the middle of a parking lot in front of a Walmart or an you know, an outlet's mall, you know, in Petaluma. And they'll, they'll put them in the, out there, they're out in the open with no protection for, for drivers slushies. No, no s slushies, no big bumps. And and there's nobody watching over them. Yeah. And so what needs to happen is, and there's a lot of gas vehicle owners who take delight in vandalizing them.

(01:06:16):
Yeah, yeah. Which is just, that's true. So I, so I think, you know, increasingly what we're going to see in the coming years is a shift more to something like the gas station model. Yeah. And this will actually help because, you know, if you look at a gas station, most of their revenue for the gas station owner does not come from selling gas. They're usually selling it at cost. Yeah. That's from selling those terrible hotdogs and, and dangerous sushi, <laugh> and awful coffee that's been sitting there on the pot all day. And that's where their profits come from. Yeah. And you know, particularly with charging, because you usually do have to sit around for 20, 30, 40 minutes, having a little restaurant or convenience store, something there will, will make it an advantage, you know, to use that station versus using the the charging station that's in the middle of the Walmart parking lot or behind the Yeah.

(01:07:09):
The outlet mall. And so the, I think the experience will get better for everyone, hopefully over the next several years, Sam, we're gonna see you and Nicole Wakefield and Robbie Wakeland. Wakeland, I'm sorry. And right now, I don't even wanna say Robbie's last name. <Laugh> Baldwin Baldwin will be and Sam Aam will be our special panel this afternoon on Twitter. And I'm sure this will be one of the topics of conversation, but there's a lot more in car news. And of course, there's the other day Nicole and I were in Austin together for an event, for an event for a manufacturer. And afterwards we went for a ride in a cruise, robo Taxii around Austin. Oh, fun. So, oh, neat. Happy to talk about that one. Yeah. The new cruises, it was an interesting little adventure.

(01:07:58):
The new cruises are finally coming to San Francisco with no driver, no steering wheel, no nothing. Wow. Yeah. Do, do living room on wheels. Thank you, Sam. I look forward to this afternoon. It's gonna be a fun twitch <laugh>. I'll, I'll talk to you in a couple of hours. All right. Thanks so much. Take care. Thanks so much. Thank you. I guess this is good news. I guess it means there'll be competition and we, if, if EVs are gonna become dominant, which I think everybody expects that to happen over the next 10 years or less we gotta have a good charging infrastructure. Yeah. At least, at the very least, to not have this untenable situation where you've got all these things hanging off of the side of the, the court. It's not good. You're having Yeah. Trying to find which one. And by the way, most of the time as a, how a four EV owner now mm-hmm.

(01:08:41):
<Affirmative> Tesla, Ford, the Chevy, the mini almo, almost all, if not all of our charging is done at home. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. And that's, that's the thing. It's, you have a gas station in your garage now. And so that's really the way you charge most of the time. It's only on for road trips that you need a gas station or an electrical charger. And that, you know, unless you go on a lot of road trips or you, or you routinely have a 500 mile commute, which I know some people do, Lord Lordy, Hey, let's take a break. We've got more calls, more emails, more voicemails. But first a word from Melissa. Melissa is a leading global data quality identity verification and address management solution provider. We've been talking about it for years. So proud of Melissa. They've just been named a leader by G2 for their Melissa Clean Suite and data quality suite G2 in the 2023 data quality and address for verification.

(01:09:41):
Spring report says these guys are the leader. They've been named momentum leader and high performer in the same reports across small business, mid-market and enterprise segments. Melissa, this, it's kind of like winning everything Melissa has received. Listen to the recognitions they've received. Good partner, easiest to do business with, easiest setup, highest user adoption, and easiest admin. So all I need to do really is explain why you need Melissa and, you know, need address verification. And you will then obviously go to the leader the best. Melissa ranked highly in the price category too. So also the most affordable for clean suite and data quality suite. That's cuz Melissa's always said, we, you gotta have a return on investment. It, it should always save you money to have data quality address verification should never cost you money. Poor data quality can cost a lot, though, I gotta tell you, 15 million annually.

(01:10:39):
And of course, the longer the bad data stays in your system, the more losses you accumulate by sending out mailings to addresses that don't exist by talking to customers <laugh>, as if they're a guy instead of a gal. There's all sorts of ways you can lose opportunities from bad data, incorrect mailings, poor customer satisfaction. And by the way, you may be in a business, in fact, I would say every business needs to verify identities. Right. But you may have a know, your know, your customer regulations, that kind of thing. Seamless, real-time identity verification tools as well. And customers don't have to wait for verification. It happens very quickly. Melissa's matching and DUP tools help establish a single high quality customer record. So all your customer touchpoints for an individual are in one place. You get a complete view of each customer. And Melissa works with UPS's move update requirements, which means you get the most current address data by processing in the United States Postal Services national change of address database.

(01:11:41):
But it's not just the US 240 countries and territories. Melissa is complete. They've been no wonder they've been doing this since 1985. They've specialized in global intelligence solutions to help organizations unlock accurate data for a more compelling customer view. And don't worry, your data is absolutely safe with Melissa. They undergo independent security audits continually because they're committed to data security, privacy and compliance. Yes, there's SOC two compliant, HIPAA compliant, GDPR compliant. Your data could not be in better hands. Make sure your customer contact data is up to date. Get started today with 1000 records cleaned for free at melissa.com/twit. That's melissa melissa.com/twi. M e l i s s A. Well, thank Melissa so much for their long-term support of all of our shows, including Ask the Tech guys. Okay. Tech guy. All right. I think we've got a video question. Woo. Let's see.

Caller Mark (01:12:40):
Hi, this is Mark Data Nutton, the Discord longtime caller, first time listener. I heard Leo was going to talk about the Kindle this Sunday. So I thought I'd asked this question about my 92 year old mother who as her vision is getting worse. I've been thinking about the Oasis and it's got a, it's a nice and lightweight and bigger than the Kindle Whites. Not quite a think as big as the Scribe, but I think it's quite a bit lighter weight. The one drawback on it is it's almost four years old. I've been waiting to see if there was an upgrade coming. The thing that I fear though is it might be dropped from the Kindle options. Just thought maybe Leo or maybe Dr. Mom or someone might have some insight on this. The Oasis. Thanks.

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (01:13:34):
Great question. Yeah. Excellent. As you know, last week I reviewed the new Kindle scribe, which is both a note taker and a reader. But it's big. It's eight by 10. Yeah. Huge. And I would, I love, I have my Oasis and yes, for an older person, the nice thing about the Oasis, it's easy to hold it's light weight. And I gave my 90 year old mom an Oasis. Oh. Because she was, she was having a hard time reading, you know, small print. You can make that print really big. I showed that last week on the Scribe. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. You can make it so big that it's like a large textbook. And she went back to reading again. She loved it. Oh, that's fantastic. So I can strongly recommend it for your 92 year old mom. They, the, I, you know, it's funny they haven't updated it.

(01:14:16):
Cause I guess cuz it doesn't really need an update. It's got a backlight, it's 300 dots per inch, so it's very high quality. It has, I think all of the features of the paper white, it's negative is it's 250 bucks. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>, it's pricey. You don't need more than eight gigabytes. Honestly. They make a 32 gigabyte version for even more. I don't think you need that. Because books are small. That's hundreds of books. Yeah. Not only are they small, but you don't need to have that many on the device at one time. Yeah. How many books can you read? Yeah. Although, you know, I switch 'em out, have quite a few on there, <laugh>. Yeah. You just download the ones you need and don't download and you'll save a little bit if you have the lock screen ad. I, that doesn't bother me.

(01:14:54):
You never see it when you're reading. It's just on the lock screen. But it's, you know, it's only, you only save a few bucks. So that's up to you. But I highly recommend the kind Oasis. I know folks who are absolute kind Oasis fans. Yeah. Still, you know, keep theirs going and when it dies or something goes wrong with it, they just get another one. Yep. Because it's just a great, great model of Kindle. Couldn't recommend it more highly. Perfect for mom. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative> because of those, you know, that large print, it has a back light. It also has you know, it can be yellower or bluer depending on daylight. And I like that feature. Actually read it in kind of a yellower format. What do they call that? They call it? It's warm. It's warm light.

(01:15:34):
Okay. You can adjust that. What else is the same screen is on the paper White. It's just Oh yeah. Yeah. So I think there's no reason not, I just think they didn't update it because there's nothing more to do. They do update the software by the way. The operating system gets regular updates. Yeah. You'll occasionally get new typefaces. Love it. Stuff like that. Highly recommend the Oasis. Great question. Video looked fantastic. Not that that's necessary. It's okay if you call us looking like a potato <laugh>, we'll still take your video call. It's totally fine. I wonder why the Oasis is a hundred bucks more than the paper wipe. Actually, I guess it's the back light. Yeah, I know. Is it the materials too? Isn't it made of, maybe it's aluminum or something. Yeah, it's very not. It's also waterproof. It's like water resistant.

(01:16:15):
Yes. That's actually, I think why I got the Oasis is so I go to the beach mm-hmm. <Affirmative>. Yeah. They show for the folks who are listening. They show the person in a bathtub in the tub. <Laugh>. We got somebody in the chat who goes in the tub. In the tub. Yes. You can read in the tub. Battery life is, you know, weeks if not months. Yes. It's really battery life. I really think it's a great choice. E especially for somebody who can't read anymore. Cuz the print's too small. You can read everything, make the print as big as you want. What else? Who else? Another call. Do we have? Yeah, let's go to the, do we have a phone call? An actual phone call? They're called Wireless Caller. Oh, sorry to read out your last name. Wireless. Wireless Caller. And we'll see. Let's see if 8 88 7 2 4 2 8 84. Hello? Hello. Wireless caller. Where you, what's your name? Where are you calling from?

Caller Kenny (01:17:03):
Hello, can you hear me okay?

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (01:17:04):
Yes. Yeah, we, you great.

Caller Kenny (01:17:07):
Oh, this is Kenny. This is Kenny. Decided to try to

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (01:17:10):
Smart man

Caller Kenny (01:17:11):
Phone call because fact, thanks for taking it. I will apologize Lord. It works great.

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (01:17:18):
It's works great. We're glad it worked. Yeah.

Caller Kenny (01:17:20):
Oh it does work. Great. Yep. I'm glad. Yeah, I bought in one of those new USB extenders and apparently it's acting up on the audio side of things, but I, anyway, I just wanted to kinda chat with you guys. I have some good news I wanted to tell you guys.

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (01:17:36):
Fire away. Kenny,

Caller Kenny (01:17:37):
You know how we talked. All right. You know, I've talked a lot about it and wanting to get a certificate. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. I got it.

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (01:17:45):
Oh, congratulations. Which one did you get?

Caller Kenny (01:17:47):
Yeah. sadly I did not get it from ACI Learning, but I did go and sample the website in the videos and that'll be something I'll definitely look forward to. I went to Coria because there, in the job that I'm working at right now, a coworker, or actually not a coworker, but a visitor was recommending that to me as a way to, you know, you start off for free and you eventually had to pay for

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (01:18:12):
It. You're talking about Cor cor trial, you're talking about Corra? Yeah. Yes, yes.

Caller Kenny (01:18:17):
Yeah. It's not Comp PNA as far as I know, but No,

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (01:18:20):
But Corra is fine. I've, I've used Corra for classes. They do a good job. Oh good. Yeah. Which, but which certificate did you get?

Caller Kenny (01:18:31):
<Laugh>. Well I am supporting the Evil Empire or if you like to call Google the Eagle Empire, but that's where I got mine from. I know that there's like meta has it and I used to call ipm, which I was real impressed with cause I've always been

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (01:18:46):
Oh, so you growing up as a kid, you got one of their so you didn't get like an a plus cert or one of those kinds of search? You got one of Oh no, one of the Google I forgot what they call them, but yeah, Google has a a special, yeah, yeah. Okay. Okay. Exactly.

Caller Kenny (01:19:02):
That's what I got. Yeah, I got one of those.

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (01:19:05):
And, and has it is gonna help you get a job. That's, that's an interesting question. Oh,

Caller Kenny (01:19:10):
That's why I was calling you about in terms of how to start off applications and what jobs to look for. And I guess, I don't know if an is there or not since the last time I called about it. What type of jobs do you think I would start out for? Should I start out in like say a help desk or entree level or something along that field?

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (01:19:31):
Yeah. an aunt who has worked in it would be a great guy. He is not here today. He doesn't, you know Oh okay. When he comes in on a Sunday, he does it out of the goodness of his own heart cuz he doesn't technically work on Sundays. So I don't know what aunt would say. These are the grow with Google certificates that you got. Yeah. and that's exactly

Caller Kenny (01:19:49):
What

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (01:19:49):
It's, yeah. And the nice, did it cost you anything at all

Caller Kenny (01:19:54):
$50 after the seven day free trial?

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (01:19:57):
That's not bad at all. Yeah, that's really good.

Caller Kenny (01:19:59):
No, it's not bad at all.

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (01:20:00):
Yeah. And which, which particular do they have a variety of different, you got, did you get the supports? Sir, what job did you get? Yes. Or cert did you get?

Caller Kenny (01:20:12):
Just Google it support. Okay. But I also got one for cyber security as well. Cause I figured Perfect. Smart. that smart in Handy. And that was got me to get some probably Python again. I haven't tried Python in months, so That's

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (01:20:26):
Great. Yeah.

Caller Kenny (01:20:26):
Good to get to shake that often to get that going. And as, as a matter of fact, I'm going to also try, I've got one for data analysts and I'm gonna try as well. I figured those three are the type of fields that I know pretty well. And it's funny because it was a six month course and I blew right past them in both of them in within three weeks. Cool. Cause I had the time to do it. Nice job. It was just a matter of timing.

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (01:20:50):
So proud of you. Good. Good job.

Caller Kenny (01:20:52):
Yep. Well thank you.

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (01:20:53):
I'm, I'm thrilled for you

Caller Kenny (01:20:54):
Now the Oh, I appreciate it. And I wanna thank you guys. You guys are kind of like in 2020 and I'm planning with the pandemic started. I started really kind of following you on a regular basis. I mean, I've known Yulia since Oh, call from help. As a matter of fact. I see your hairstyle is definitely in the call for help. Tara <laugh>. I can tell. But

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (01:21:15):
I'm trying to pretend I'm 20 years younger. It's not working apparently. Okay. I

Caller Kenny (01:21:19):
Understand. I understand. But no, it's working. It's actually working pretty well. You like

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (01:21:23):
It, huh?

Caller Kenny (01:21:24):
<Laugh>. Oh, I, I do. And but yeah, you were kind of like my inspiration to finally get myself nice back into that nice field and I wanna thank you And Micah and all the shows that I've watched, including security now is quickly growing my, one of my favorite shows to listen to. Especially with cybersecurity.

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (01:21:44):
Yeah, I was gonna say now that you're, now that you've got that under your belt security now will probably make more sense. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. And it is I know a lot of IT security guys who listen a lot of it, people who listen because it is a great way to kind of keep up on what's going on in the current state of the art. Google itself has some job support on their site, on their Grow dot Google site. I would certainly Square Circle. Yeah. I would already, I would start with that because apparently mm-hmm. <Affirmative>, they've got a deal with, they say 150 top employers to to introduce you to them. And I would start with that. It's gonna be an entry level position because you don't have any real on the, on the job experience. Right, right.

(01:22:26):
But I think support is probably where you'll end up starting out in IT support. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. But I think it's an opportunity for you then to show your chops mm-hmm. <Affirmative> build your chops. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative> and because you have the cybersecurity cert as well. I think people are, you know, the boss is gonna look at you say he's a hard worker, he is smart, he's actually taken this extra test. Maybe we should we should look at him in our cybersecurity training cuz they're gonna want to give you more training on top of it. Obviously. But it looks like there's a lot of companies, I'm just looking at the googlePage@grow.google lot of companies mm-hmm. <Affirmative> that they work with mm-hmm. <Affirmative>. so I would use that facility. I mean, that seems like you, you know, that's worth pursuing. It's gonna be hard on your own to go around and, and look for a job, you know especially not having experience.

Caller Kenny (01:23:14):
Yeah. I,

(01:23:17):
Yeah, that is definitely one of the things I'm really starting to look at, even in some of the areas that I'm looking outside of that. But yeah, I'll definitely use their platform and see if it'll good to go. And by the way, before I let you guys go, I really enjoyed last week's show where you guys were talking about HP printers and all that stuff. Cause one, I have one at home and I know what it's like, but I also have used the brother printers as well. And I find them at work and I find 'em real quick. And I'll show you one real quick thing. I impressed one of the designing managers cause I was able to print something real fast because most of our printers at work uses wifi. And I was like, you know, I've got an expert cable, why don't I just do it locally? And they were really impressed by how quick I was able to print up fast as opposed to the other ones <laugh>. So I'm using my IT aspect in hand. Nice. But anyway, I just wanna tell that story real

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (01:24:10):
Quick. Anybody who's listened to the tech guys show for a few years and ask the tech guys probably knows Kenny. And, and it will help if I tell you the town Kenny's calling from

Caller Kenny (01:24:25):
Cottontown,

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (01:24:26):
Cottontown, Cottontown, Cottontown, Tennessee. Now, do you, now, does that ring a bell? Getting from Cottontown? Kenny from Cotton and I, we started talking Kenny some years ago when you were, you were really thinking about, you were struggling with getting a new career, whether to go back to school, what computer you should get from school and stuff. I think you've done a great job. We have seen your progress over the years. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>, I am so happy for you. Good job.

Caller Kenny (01:24:51):
Yeah. Well now it's up to me to take that final step and get a job in that field and I'm definitely gonna work on it. But anyway I just wanted to give you guys an update on it and I'll just let you know if anything changes. And I'll, one other

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (01:25:03):
Thing to keep in mind, when I was, when I was starting in radio I couldn't get a real job, right? I, I had worked in college radio and they said, when you when you have some real experience, they said, that doesn't count. So what I did, it's something you might wanna do, is I went to the local nonprofit public radio station. You might go to a nonprofit in your area in Cottontown, somebody that needs help, a school, a charity, a church, and do a little for free. Maybe for free. I was doing it for free. Maybe they'll give you a stipend, maybe they'll hire you. But going to a nonprofit and contributing your skills is a great way to get now get some real s actual experience. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. So I went and I worked at the local public radio station in Santa Cruz at K U S P.

(01:25:48):
I did a show, made tapes, continued to pound the pavement. Eventually did get that first real job, commercial job. But starting at a nonprofit is a great way to get some real world skill under your belt. And, and I think an employer looks at that and they go, oh, that, that counts. That's, that qualifies. And you're gonna be helping somebody in the community. So you might look at that, see if there's somewhere in Cotton Town, you can pitch in volunteer. Alright. Thanks Kenny. I'll keep that in. Congrats. Thanks. Congratulations. You guys have a good day. So proud of you. That's great. We've been, I've been watching this. Good day. Thank you. Yeah. Watching the growth over time, watching this growth over three or four years is really fantastic. Should we, do I have another email here? Oh, let's do that. Should I reach back into the Oh, get into that.

(01:26:33):
Mailbox, mailbox, mailbox. Oh, make sure. Put the flag down. That's okay. There's no deliveries every time. I want to yell. This is from Gabe in Fort Lauderdale. Okay. Have I ever seen this before? No. <laugh>. I have not seen this before. Hi Leo and Micah. Like the new form of congratulations. Excellent chemistry reminding me on iPad today with Sarah and Leo. Yeah, that was fun. I remember those days. And then Mike and I did iPads today for some time. Mariah was today. He says that's the first show that brought me into the TWIT Subscriptions podcast. Now, club twit, we love our club TWIT folks. He says, gone to Japan in August for 12 days. Oh, I'm so jealous. Wow. That's exciting. That's one of the places I really want to go. Taking this whole family, family of four need ideas for cell phone and data coverage.

(01:27:22):
Yeah. The puck like device. Ah, the old puck. Like I still have that puck like device <laugh> in my drawer back there. I don't recommend that anymore. He says we have T-Mobile, they have data included, but it's slow. You might be surprised. I also use T-Mobile when I travel internationally. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. And they give you a certain amount of, they say two G speed. Now it's 3g by the way. I found it fast enough, plenty fast enough. And I never got limited. So you might surprise yourself. Hotspotting is gonna be the different though. Now if everybody in the family has a T-Mobile account you know, they'll be able to hotspot to their computer or the iPad. And remember your hotel, especially Japan, your hotel McDonald's. Yeah. Everywhere you go that's wifi. There's gonna be wifi free wifi everywhere. And so generally nowadays when I travel, I no longer buy an international travel plan or use that orange puck.

(01:28:19):
It's in my, actually John Ashley, you could probably find it. It's in the drawer. I, I know exactly where it is in my desk. As you're looking towards the cameras, it's the drawer on the right in the back at the top drawer there. John, John or John Ashley can, can find it for us. So I don't the puck like device, I think they're even out of business. I doubt they're cuz it, it wasn't a good way to go. You can't often, you get to the airport, you will see kiosks selling local sims that'll give you data and a, and usually a very good price. I think in Japan it's pretty cheap. So you might look at that. The problem is you're gonna lose that phone anyway. It's gonna lose its us phone number. You're gonna have a Japanese phone number on that. They may also have for rent.

(01:29:05):
That kind of MiFi. I call 'em MiFi. But they're devices that pick up 3G signals and turn it into wifi so that the entire family could use that one thing. They will probably have those for rent at the airport as well. Did you find it? Oh, you did. Look at that. I'm impressed. It's, this was the sky roam and it was a really good idea. You'd buy packets of, I'm surprised you remember this cause I haven't used it in years. You'd buy <laugh>. This is the puck. It really does look like a puck. And at this point I wanna play hockey with it. Yeah. <laugh> because it's, it's pretty much useless. It, you charge it up, it gets cell signal and the idea was you'd buy a certain amount of connectivity and then it would roam to wherever you were and then would work in many countries.

(01:29:49):
And then it becomes a, a a wifi access point. So it doesn't have a switchable sim, it's just a you buy No, through the company. Yeah, yeah. Exactly. That's bad. The Sky Room sous, I should check designed in Germany. So I should check and see if they're still in business. But I, I think you're better off just going to Japan and looking at a kiosk. And as again, you don't really need this in the hotel room. Right. You're gonna have wifi because you're gonna have good wifi and it's gonna be, I think it's gonna be cheap as I remember. And then, and, and most restaurants, yeah, they're still around. It's, it's called Solis, s o l i s wifi.co. And they still sell a hotspot. Oh, it looks a little nicer now. This is actually what, A little bit closer to what you'll get in Japan's a little card like that.

(01:30:42):
And oh, and it has a power bank built into it. Yeah. Yeah. So yeah, a hundred. This one says 4G and 5G speeds and 135 countries. I mean, there was nothing wrong with it. It worked. What I found was it ended up being fairly expensive because you, you ran through the data pretty quickly and the more additional data was expensive might be worth looking at. The nice thing about doing this is you'd have it ahead of time. I don't think you're gonna need anything. I think you're gonna use the wifi in the hotel. I guess I must have gotten the idea was you carry this in your backpack, I guess. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. And then I remember we used it in England some years ago, and then Lisa would, would pair up, pair her phone to it and so forth. You don't, I don't think you need it anymore.

(01:31:26):
I think this is a business that's gone by the wayside. But it, it is now. It's Sola. S o l i s wifi.co. They dropped the sky roam name. Hundred 35 countries, no sim card needed share with up to 16 devices. You know what, maybe the next time we travel I'll pick one of these up and see how, how well it works. I just the part where they don't have a sim card where you could just u you know, use it as a wifi puck. That is the, the sim of your choice. Yeah. That seems more in my mind. Yeah. Yeah. And you, and as I said, you can get it now, number two, is it safe to enter the master password for my master for my password manager? One password over open wifi? Oh, that's a great question. Yes. So the reason is, yes, the open wifi is open, but the communication between one password and your local machine is highly encrypted.

(01:32:24):
It's fine. And so what happens, actually, it's kind of interesting. You're not sending the password out over the over the connection at all. What happens is you enter the password locally and that just simply says, now you're logged in. And so it goes to the one password vault and downloads an encrypted blob. It doesn't send the password. It just says, yeah, he's, it's, he's verified, gets the blob, downloads it, and then uses the password to decrypt it locally. So it's completely safe. You're not sending, even if you were, it's over an encrypted channel, but you're not sending the password, I don't think. I think you're only sending a token saying, yes, this person is verified, it's Gabe. Yeah, I verify it's Gabe. Now gimme the blob. And the blob is encrypted all the way down. So nothing you're, nothing is going through. Even if the, even if you weren't using Secure http, if you weren't using tls, which you are con it would be fine, the conversation you had on security.

(01:33:19):
Now I found really fascinating where the individual was making an open source, I believe password manager. And due to the sort of what is it, the, the way that it was so far away from the base layer of the operating system resulted in the one character at a time kind of being stored in data. And so potentially someone could gain access to that password. And I I, I wish I could remember it was an open source tool and it was a password manager that some folks had used. Oh, this is ba this is Key Pass. Yes. Key Pass. Yeah. And the good news is there is a much more widely used version of Key PPA called Key Pass xc, which didn't have this problem. Good, good. So there was a problem with KeyPass. It's been patched. Just make sure you use the most recent, if you are using Key Pass KeyPass, use the most recent version.

(01:34:10):
But all the modern, as far as we know, <laugh>, you know, all the modern password word managers, LastPass one password bit Warden, they're all and Bit Word's our sponsor. But they're all, they're all they don't have this problem. They're all secure. Right. And I think, honestly, bit Warden is probably the way to go cuz it is open source. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative> and because they're a sponsor, so we like them. Another call, what do you think? Yeah, yeah. Oh, you just keep as 2.5 0.40 yeah, we do need to go to another ad. Let's do another ad. Yeah. Real quickly. And then another call. We have some let's get a voicemail queued up. Meanwhile, let's talk about security. Now let's talk about security. This episode of that The Tech Guys is brought to you by Thinks Canary. How do you know you've gotta, you've built your security beautifully.

(01:34:52):
I'm sure you have at work. You've got as we have all sorts of perimeter defenses. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>, there's a problem though in, in the modern workplace, which is that people get through those perimeters using things like spearfishing attacks, right? Through your employees, through the weakest link, which is your employees. They get into your network. Now, we know this happens because plenty of people with good perimeter security still get attacked by ransomware. Once they're in there. They, they wander around sometimes for months, sometimes for years. I think it was the Star War attack. They were in their system for three years. What are they doing in there? They're probing, they're looking at everything in your system. They're downloading passwords, downloading customer information. Cuz remember now it's not just ransomware. They blackmail you too. They figure out all the places that you send your backups, right?

(01:35:46):
These intruders in your system are a huge threat. Great perimeter defenses. But how do you know if there's somebody in your system? You need the Thinkt Canary. It's a honey pot, an easy ploy honey pot. That can be anything you want it to be. Our canary here is a Sonology Nest, but it could be a Linux server, a Windows server. It could be Windows 95 <laugh>. It could be all sorts of things. You can set it up so that it'll looks super vulnerable with lots of open ports. I have Port 1 39 open on mine just for fun. Or you could pretend it's a hyper secure vault. I think this is the best way to go. Challenge that hacker. Go ahead. Try to get, but it's, but in fact it's none of those. It is a little box you keep on your network that will notify you the minute a hacker attacks.

(01:36:36):
Just look at all the love the thinks gets. If you go to Canary dot what is the, what is it? Canary.Tools/Love. That's it. That's the that's the Twitter love that people have been passed. Some of the best biggest CISOs and CTOs in the world use Canaries. A big bank might have hundreds of canaries. A small operation like ours, a handful of canaries. You set 'em up to be whatever you want. They are quiet until somebody attacks them or opens them. Another thing that Canary can do is you can create what they call canary tokens. Files. You distribute all over your network work the same way they phone home when they're, somebody tries to open them. So I have spreadsheet files hidden away on various hard drives. Say things like payroll information, Micah's, social security numbers, stuff like that. Things that hackers are gonna immediately try to open.

(01:37:29):
And then when they do, there's nothing in there. They just get, I get a notification and I get the notification the way I want it. You can have it via email, sms, but Canary has Sports Assist Log. You get a Canary Console with your Canaries, you can get it via webhooks. So that means there's pretty much anything you can use. You can, you can even you can even have, they have an api. So you can create your own Canary interface. Only the alerts you need. When you get that alert, it'll tell you exactly what happened, what IP address, if they tried to enter a password, what login and password they used. It is the best way to protect your network. Visit canary.tools/twit you can get for $7,500 a year, five Canaries. As I said, you may want more, you may want fewer, but just as an example, $7,500 a year, you get the Canaries your own hosted console.

(01:38:20):
You get upgrades, support, maintenance, use the code TWIT in the how did how did you hear About Us Box? And you'll get 10% off the price for life. Now I know you've read all the testimonials, you've heard me talk about it, but here's the other good news. Yeah. If you're still skeptical, you've got a 60 day, two month money back guarantee. Full refund if you don't like your canaries. So there's absolutely no risk. I have to tell you though, in the years we've been doing these ads, and we've been doing 'em for, I dunno, four or five, six years now, no one has ever asked for their money back. I love that because once you get the canary, you go, oh, this is a no-brainer. You gotta have this on your network. Go to canary.tools/twit. That's the url. Canary.Tools/Twit enter, enter the code twit in the, how did you hear about Us Box?

(01:39:08):
These guys really know their stuff. They have they're, they've taught how to break into systems, to governments and, and, and, and con companies all over the world. They're brilliant. They're ki they're white hat hackers. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>, they're really nice guys. And Harun and his steamer fantastic. I love them. Canary do tools slash twit the offer code twit in the, how did you hear about us box? Thank you. Thanks for supporting. I didn't know it. They're usually on insecurity now. It's nice to have one guys. Hi. Hi Canary. Hey Canary. Great to have you voicemail time. What have we got?

Caller Harry (01:39:41):
Hi, this is Harry from Carmel. Hi Harry. And I'm wondering whether you have any information or knowledge on how to charge my e-bike at ev charging station <laugh>. I've read some chatter about bringing your own charger a level two charger or, or one with a that capacity and getting some sort of adapter for the J 1 70 72 plug with an NEMA outlet that you can simply plug into the EV station and then plug your charger into the NEMA device and then charge your battery on your e-book so you can cruise for miles and miles and take long trips on it. What a, any information you have on that.

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (01:40:23):
A what a great idea. Thank you. Bye-Bye. I love that. And by the way, I have charged in Carmel at a public charger. We went down there, stayed at a hotel and there is a city charger. In fact, that was one example where I knew these charges were we were gonna have problems. I used the app, found the charger, it was inoperative. Oh wow. Had been operative for some time. And the pro, there was another one on the other side of the parking lot. But I went to the one that was dead. And fortunately I found the one on the other side of the parking lot, but it was a slow charger. So that's an interesting question because of course the amperage of the J 1772 or the, or the public chargers and the J 1772 as as Sam was explaining is the little round part.

(01:41:07):
Mm-Hmm. <affirmative> above the fast chargers. That amperage is very high. The voltage is also very high. So you'd need something that would step it down. I mean the truth. That's a really interesting Yeah, it is. Question. let me see here. I just got d here's a on an E-bikes forum. I just got done installing a J 70 72 plug in my electric Enduro frame. Huh. Okay. Wow. A lot of times. The other problem is that cars have software. When you plug into those, there's a whole charging infrastructure and the car identifies itself and so forth. He says it was a pretty simple thing to do aided by the excellent cycle satiated. See, this all sounds a little scary to me. I'd be worried about plugging something in and then my bike catches five. Yeah. I mean the bikes were designed to be plugged into the one 20 volt Yeah. Wall charger. Although in the, in the EU they use a higher voltage. Yeah. you could also charge your laptop <laugh>. That just actually gave me a bit Ah, my heart did not. Wow. Well let me, let me look at this cycle. Satiated. See what that is when it's at home. Cuz that's, that's what he used to do. This. I'm gonna have to do a Google search on it though. Cycle satiated.

(01:42:41):
That's a really interesting question and I should probably have read those emails ahead of time. The satiated, ah, from E-bikes dot ca but you can also get it on Amazon is an interesting box. It is a programmable, ah, electric bike battery charger that will handle 24, 36, 42 or 52 volts. Now it's not cheap and it looks pretty heavy. You gotta carry this carry this around $365. But if you have, you know, a, a a basket or you know, some, you know, pens or something, you could, so it looks like, yeah, this is an interesting product Ator

Startup Video (01:43:38):
Startup video. So we can get you charging your batteries

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (01:43:41):
From grin. It's from Grin, so this is what you would need. It's a programmable bar battery charger. It's compatible. It, it looks like with a variety of charging standards. It has xlr, you'd have to get an adapter to make it work with the, the the J 1772. Sounds like this guy was able to get that adapter. There is a website also called E EVs e adapters.com, and they sell one where on one side it's the nema and then on the other side it's just your standard there. Plug. There you go. And there's a I'll, I'll share that. So you could, you could use that to charge your laptop, as I said. Yeah, <laugh>, well, oh God, I'm not saying yes. So it's gonna have to step it down. E V S E adapters. So that comes from scooter X in the chat.

(01:44:31):
And so there's a whole article in electric bike review.com where this individual not only did this, but also looked at the amount of power coming out of the device and all sorts of stuff to make sure that we're gonna, this, this is ridiculously heavy, I'm sure. 219 bucks. You see on the one side, the J 1772 adapter, you would plug in. And then on the other side, regular standard US plug sockets. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>, it's a big old transformer is what it is. So just carry that on your bike and it'll drop your mileage bike. Yeah. Quite a bit. But what the heck, you know, they, they do have some other options that are a little smaller. That one in, that one in the bottom left corner there. The J 1772 to NEMA five 15, which is of course your regular plug socket.

(01:45:24):
Yeah. Now, if you're gonna use this, it's only a hundred bucks and it looks like it'd be pretty lightweight to carry around. If you're gonna use that though, your battery on your e-bike has to handle 220 volts. Yep. cause it's not a step down transformer. This is just a connector. So it's an adapter. Do some research before you plug it in. Please, please. I don't want you to blow up your bike. But yeah, that's for a hundred bucks, fairly lightweight. You'd go to the charging station, you'd plug the the charging station's plug into this side, plug your bike into the other side. <Laugh>. I'm just imagining someone with one of those e-cigarettes and they come over and they have this whole contraption just to charge charging cigarette <laugh>. Okay. Oh Lord Mercy. So you can power anything and has a standard electrical plug as long as it can operate at 240 volts, which by the way, because of international use is, is usually the case.

(01:46:26):
Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. And you'd see that it would be written on your, on your, on your bicycle battery or your charger, so you'd know what you were doing. Wow. You'd have to carry your bike charger mm-hmm. <Affirmative> as well. And this adapter caution, make sure your EV charger appliance is figured to operate on two 20 volts before connecting to the charging station. Most charging stations at about 220 volts. Oh, golly. That's the other thing. Most, most <laugh>. And as someone points out, you'll also wanna make room for your entire fire retardant vest that you'll wear <laugh> while you try this to make sure it works. Okay. And as our chat room is pointing out, and this is thank you Eric Deckman, you also have this software issue, and so you want something that's gonna signal Yeah. It looks like it'll work. Yeah. the ones on the E V s E, excuse me.

(01:47:17):
The E V S E adapters most of them have something built in that will communicate and say, Hey, yes, it's okay. I'm a car charge. Yeah. I'm a car. I'm a car. I swear, your Honor. I'm not a, a cast, I'm a, I am a car <laugh>. Wow. What a great question. And I thank you to the IRC for coming up with a, a pretty cool looking answer. I don't think I'm gonna do this, but it's not a bad idea. Most electric bikes have a range of a hundred miles at thereabouts. But yeah, if you're in Carmel and you want to go, I don't know. You want to go to San Jose <laugh>? You could, you could carry this with you. It's a thought, at the very least. Okay. What else should we do? Who else should we talk to? I see.

(01:48:03):
Who else should we talk to? I see Jeffrey in our zoom. Let me, oh, Jeffrey, pick up on Jeffrey. Be driving. Is Jeffrey driving? Be very careful, Jeffrey. Okay, Jeffrey, don't don't risk your life. Find the road. Yes. There he is. Hey, Jeffrey. Calling from a Tesla. Perhaps. I see a big sunroof. Yeah. Oh, he is riding in model three. Look at that, Jeffrey. Well, we don't hear you, unfortunately. We do see you. Does he? I, geez, I'm so, I'm nervous now. Yeah. I'm not seeing the microphone bounce. So it, the audio is unmuted. And by the way, your daughter is going, oh, dad, dad, <laugh>, keep the phone.

(01:48:48):
And this is fine, just for the video. I know. <Laugh>, I don't, we, can you sign? Do you know sign language? There's lots. The wife, the whole families called the call. Hello, Fred. Hello, everybody. <Laugh>. we gotta figure out, look at this view. Now. Wait a minute. Is this a model three? Is it my, are we looking at a model three here? It's very open. Oh, it's frozen. Okay. And there we go. Well, that was a fun interlude. Yes. I'm sorry, Jeffrey. Might have you just call Jeffrey. (888) 724-2884. You could probably use the Tesla's builtin microphone. Redacted said the best way to get from Carmel to San Jose is put your e-bike on a Greyhound, <laugh> <laugh>. And to San Jose. Let us go to voicemail. Go ahead.

Caller Nora (01:49:38):
Hi, my name is Nora. And I had a question I wanted to back up my laptop computer onto or an external disc drive. If you would, please gimme a call. I'd like some advice. Thank you.

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (01:49:52):
Oh, oh, well, we don't call back because we, that is not a service providers show <laugh>, but we can help you on the show. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. There are certainly a lot of services that do this. For a long time we had iDrive as a sponsor, and I still think it's a very good way to do this. Before that we had Carbonite. They're still around. There are many ways to do this. Probably the easiest is something you already have. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative> your operating system. If it's a Mac, you've got iCloud. If it's Windows you've got OneDrive. And if it's a Chromebook, you've got Google Drive. So all three of the major operating systems except for Lennox. So three of the four major operating systems have a commercial entity that lets you do this backup very easily and transparently. If she's on a Mac, B b, I mean, aside from Time machine which is, that's local for local.

(01:50:46):
Yeah. So if, yeah. In fact, I do both, by the way, I should say that Cloud backup's great because it's offsite. If you have a fire or there's a flood, or your house falls into a hole you still have, you know, somewhere out there in the cloud, all your most important data is but it's hard to get at it. It's distant for day to day. You should have a local backup. So I think both is really important. Yeah. In fact, I've got three means of backing up on my Mac. So I use time Machine, which is something that you can set up very easily on your Mac if you haven't learned about it. It's a simple if you hold down, if you, if you go to Spotlight on your Mac to, to get to the search feature and you just type in time machine, you'll be able to find it.

(01:51:28):
You can also go into your settings. But aside from that, which is gonna do backups, and what's great about it is that it also does storage management. So you don't have to worry about how much space it's taking up on whatever drive you're putting it on. But also what Leo is talking about is a built-in backup tool where your documents folder and your desktop folder are backed up to your iCloud drive automatically. It's a checkbox and it's turned on by default. Exactly. And if you keep most of your files in the, on the desktop or in your documents folder, then it's gonna be there anyway. Your photos are stored there already. Your messages are stored there already. So a lot of what you have on your Mac is incredibly portable. And then the third party tool that I personally use as my kind of third offsite is back Blaze.

(01:52:17):
And that's just the tool that was recommended to me a long time ago. Love. Yeah. So I just keep using that. And it runs in the background on its own as well. I don't have to interact with it really ever. And it's just there doing its thing and it's very cost effective. I've got, you know, two max and they both have back Blaze and I'm running both of them there. But that's how you do it on the Mac. Very simple. It's the same on Windows, oddly enough. Except you're using OneDrive. Onedrive will automatically back up my documents. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative> and anything else you want it to, the thing I would always remind people, people often want to back up everything. Right. Especially for online, that's a lot of storage. Takes a long time to get up there. We'll take a long time to get back.

(01:52:55):
Just back up your documents, the stuff you create, it's a little more complicated when you're talking photos and music and movies. Media files are big and fat for those. I think local backup is probably better than online backup. But for just backing up your documents or your mind documents folder, OneDrive on Windows, iDrive on the Mac, very very iCloud rather on the Mac. Very easy to use. Google Drive works the same way. And in fact, Chromebook is designed to always be backing up to Google Drive. I think that's sufficient. Yeah. Yeah. I don't think you need to do more than that. The reason you wanna have a local and a cloud backup is what I call 3 21 backup. And that was an idea that was created by a guy, a photographer named Peter Krog. And he has a very good article on 3 21 backup on the internet.

(01:53:47):
It's on a site he worked on with the Library of Congress. Oh, okay. Of all things for photographers particularly, but it really applies to everybody. The 3, 2, 1 idea is three copies of everything. Now, one can be an original, that's okay. But remember, if you erase the original, now you're down to two copies. Right? So, so three copies of everything, two different kinds of media, local hard drive and cloud is, is perfect. And one of them should be offsite in case of the worst kind of disaster. That's what photographers do. You know, they can't afford to lose. They, they do a wedding shoot. You can't afford to lose those pictures. You're not gonna do that again. They're not gonna hold the wedding again, just so you can take the pictures again. So that's what Peter created. And I really believe in it.

(01:54:35):
3, 2, 1, backup, three copies, two different kinds of storage, and one of them in the cloud. So if you do that, you're golden. Let's see, let's see. What have we got in? Let's see what else. Someone is calling in. Is that the person? Oh, yeah. The, our driver is on the phone. Is that Jeff? Oh, I think that was Joseph who was the, no, yeah, yeah, yeah. I think that was Jeff. Jeff. All right. I don't know. He was red and now he's yellow. Red leather. Yellow leather. Yes. Hi, Jeff. Who today? Hey. So hi. Did you hear me? Yes. You're in a model three.

Caller Jeff (01:55:08):
That's correct. 2021.

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (01:55:10):
Very nice. You like it?

Caller Jeff (01:55:13):
Yeah, I, we switched the ranges a little bit better.

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (01:55:16):
Yeah, that's life. And you got the whole family in the car with you.

Caller Jeff (01:55:22):
That's it. We're being safe now. I'm not looking at, there's no camera now.

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (01:55:26):
<Laugh>. What can we do for you, Jeff?

Caller Jeff (01:55:31):
We inherited we have a Mac Mini one. But I, we inherited waiting for this, the two eight iac, like an older one. Oh. and it was a shame to throw it out. And we wanted it, it working just like a spare computer. I put Arctic Fox on it, so the browser's working. Ok. I, my question is what kinda what kinda Chrome I put on if I want from the flash drive that you recommend?

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (01:56:00):
All right, so first of all, Arctic Fox is a open, part of, it's an open source project built around Firefox. And they're keeping older versions working, which is great. It's also designed to be more secure, but you want to use Chrome on there. And obviously Google Chrome, it's what's, what version of MAC Os is on that 2008? Is it Snow Leopard?

Caller Jeff (01:56:22):
It's 10.6. I think it's 10.6. I think High Sierra is the

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (01:56:26):
High Sierra. Yeah. And, you know, there are ways to get a more modern version of the operating system on there. We've talked about that before. But snow Leopard is the last version you could get on that 2008 iMac. So you need something, Chrome won't work a browser that will work with 10.6. There are so many browsers based on Chromium, which is the open source version of Chrome. Kind of like Arctic Fox, which is, is, you know, the based on the open source version of Firefox. I'm not sure though, which ones will allow you to run on a pretty old machine. You, I would start with the Chromium project itself. So search for Chromium and see if that will work on, on 10.6. If not my favorite browsers that are based on Google's chromium are Vivaldi, which might, I really like Vivaldi.

(01:57:22):
Brave. I really like Brave. That's also based on chromium. I think Opera now is also based on Chromium Opera might run a pretty old or a pretty old version of Mac Os. I wouldn't be surprised. The reason they're reluctant to, of course, is security. And, and so then it, in that case, it might be worth using these tools to get to a newer version of Mac Os. Yes. So you can use, okay. Yeah. I, because we've talked a lot about it on the show before. And it will let you, and I'm, you can see I'm trying to, I can't remember the name ever. We always forget the name because it's generic <laugh>. Yes. So someone in the chat will tell us momentarily, but essentially what will it, what'll let you do is it kind of just ignores the fact. It's called Open Core Legacy.

(01:58:12):
That's it. Open core legacy Patcher. Yes. And so what it does is it kind of ignores the fact that you're running on older hardware and lets you install newer versions of Mac Os, which will then in effect allow you to install newer browsers. Browsers. Yeah. Yeah. So ironically, your tooth is named Mac is probably fast enough to run Ventura. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative> the latest Mac os It's an artificial thing that Apple does to prevent you and I guess to sell new computers. I don't know why do it. They're, I guess if I'm gonna be charitable, they're gonna say, well, yeah, it's gonna run, but not very well. Right, right. When you do use the open core legacy patch, there are issues. You can't, you know, you have to be careful about updates cuz you know, things won't work normally, but you, you're now at least running a secure operating system and you can now run secure modern versions of the browser, which is kind of what you wanna do. So I would try that Rosa now. Yeah.

Caller Jeff (01:59:08):
Okay. Now my question is, if I wanted to turn into partition for a, like a Chrome box, can you put Chrome, like a Chrome software on Old Mac?

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (01:59:19):
Yeah, that's an interesting question. You, you, this Old Mac supports bootcamp, so I bet you that you might be able to, and that would maybe be a good use for it. It's really a shame. I have a bunch of old Mac too. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. And it's a shame because the computer and the screen are built in together. This is a perfectly good screen, which you could use with a modern Mac. Your 2008 might even support target screen mode. I think it, it does target split mode, which, which could use that screen. So let's see. I'm looking at iMac models introduced in 20 11, 20 12, 20 13, and mid 2014. It looks like Chromo S Flex, which is what Google calls their version of chromos designed for Windows in Mac, does work on Mac. So Chrome enterprise.google, which is a weird r url, <laugh> Chrome enterprise.google.

(02:00:19):
And I, the reason they they're doing this is for businesses that own old hardware. So it's a free upgrade. It might also run straight out of the box on your Mac. So that would be another thing to take a look at. This is actually a real gift to the community because these 2008 computers should not go in the landfill. You know, they should be somewhere. There should be somewhere that you can make this usable. So I would take a look at that. You can't use the Android store through Chrome OS Flex. It's a kind of an open source operating system. They also have it for education. Actually that's the enterprise version. There is one for personal devices. There's a link. You create a USB installer at support.google.com. We'll put a link in the show notes to this. I will also put a link, I I forgot to give you the u r URL for Peter Kros.

(02:01:20):
Great article on 3 21 backup. It's DP best flow.org. And we will put a link to the page, the direct page on 3 21 backup@dpbestblow.org. It looks like, I'm trying to see if they have a list of supported MAC hardware. I don't, let's see. Certified models list. And we're gonna look at Apple and see which certified models for Chrome OS Flex. Even if it's not certified, it would yeah, see they're doing it by Apple MAC 11 two. I don't know what the hell that is. <Laugh> the webcam may not work. That's one thing that may not work. Yeah, if you're just wanting the display alone, then you can get that. Yeah. Yeah. I So target display mode, you said it will work on a 2008. Yes. But it's only if you're connecting a Mac to it. Right. So, so you could get a Mac.

(02:02:23):
What you could do is get a Mac mini connected to that display. At least you're not thrown out display. I think in order of operations you should certainly try the open core mm-hmm. <Affirmative> Legacy boot. Because that might give you Ventura solve the whole thing. Then you should take a look at Chrome OS Flex. You might be able to turn it into a Chrome box in effect or target display mode is the last opportunity. Yeah. I think the, the most, the least desirable is to run, you know, snow leopard with older versions of the operating system. It's just a little too risky for Yeah. At least desirably safe. Yeah. Anyway, I'm glad we were able to get through. Is this for your daughter in the backseat?

Caller Jeff (02:03:04):
Absolutely. <laugh>. And I tried Target display mode. They spent 2009 with the year you could do it.

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (02:03:11):
Oh yeah. It was a very limited slice of IMAX that could do that. That's too bad. Oh, well we want her to get a, a good, safe, modern computer. I like the idea of putting Chrome OS on it. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative> to be honest, especially with, we were just talking about the caller who was talking about backing up with Chrome Os. So much of it is just built in. Yeah. You don't have to worry about the files getting lost there. Yeah. Where are you guys going?

Caller Jeff (02:03:37):
Feeding something. Probably chilly

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (02:03:39):
Chilis. I baby back baby. Back rib baby. Anyway, thank you. Cheer. Thank you baby. Goodbye. Barbecue sauce. <Laugh>. Take care guys. Care now. They're definitely going to Chili's. There's no choice. They gotta go. Are sure they've brought to you. I want a blooming onion. I need a blooming. No wait, but that's Outback Steakhouse, isn't it? Yeah, I think it's what? I think they've got something there. Does Chilis have something like that? Do we even have a Chili's in the area anymore? Park. Awesome. Blossom is what it's called. Awesome Blossom. Awesome Blossom. It's like a blooming onion only. It's not from Australia. Right. Our show today brought to you by Miro. We've been playing with Miro and having such a good time. Just don't call it a whiteboard. Miro is a solution for your team if they're going from tab to tab, a tool to tool.

(02:04:34):
And meanwhile, every time you switch context, losing brilliant ideas, you're just floating away. You need Miro. Miro is a collaborative visual platform that brings all your great work together, no matter where your team is, no matter what time zones they're in, because there's always a single source of truth. And the beauty of Miro, it can be anything. Whether you're working from home in a hybrid workspace, everything comes together in one workspace. Online workspace may be the best way to think of Miro. And because it supports so many third party tools Zapier, we use it with Zapier, it works with Google Drive, it works with every everything. Instead of having all your stuff spread out all over the place, it's all in a simple digital workspace. Miros capabilities are so far beyond that whiteboard. That's why I don't want to use it. It's a visual collaboration tool packed with features for the whole team to build on one another's ideas to build on your future.

(02:05:38):
You could shorten your time to launch. So customers get what they need faster. Miro is the one tool you'll need to see your vision come to life for planning. That's how we use it to plan our shows for researching, for brainstorming, designing feedback. It can all live on a Miro board across teams. And faster input means faster outcomes. Miro users report the tool increases project delivery speed by up to 29%. And they're also saying <laugh>, on average, Miro users save 80 hours per user per year two weeks of vacation, basically free. Just because it streamlines the conversations and the feedback. You can zoom in to get all the details. Zoom out to get the 30,000 foot level. You can move around. You can cut any confusion about who needs to do what they've got, can band boards and swim lanes. They've got everything you need.

(02:06:33):
In fact, the best thing to do is go to miro.com/podcast. Click that button that says on the left, that says Miro verse. And look at what people have done with Miro. You'll be blown away. Strategic Planner is easier because it's visual and accessible. It's a great way to map processes. You ever use a mind map? This is like a mind map on steroids and nothing ever goes away. So you can set up stuff, think about stuff, brainstorm stuff, and never lose any bits of information. It works with the whole team. They not only view it, but they have a chance to interact with it to give feedback. And if you're feeling meeting fatigue, you'll love the timer that lets, that keeps your Zoom meetings on track. Be part of the more than a million people who use Miro every month. That's kind of remarkable. Really is a great, great tool.

(02:07:25):
Get your, and by the way, you don't have to trust me. You can try it for free right now. Your first three boards are free forever. Start working better together. Miro m i r o.com/podcast. It's an amazing tool, but I can't really describe it to you because it's different for everybody who uses it. So you just gotta try it and see what you can do with it. It will blow you away. Miro.Com/Podcast. Okay. Okay. All right. Okay. All right. I wanna take a call. Let's go to the call. Joe is on the line. Let me press a button, see if we can bring Joe into the magic space that we call the tech guy. There he is. Hi Joe. Hello Joe. Unmute your microphone. Oh, are you a dog walker? Are those leashes? Look at all the leashes and No, those are guitars. You fool. Oh, can't you? <Laugh> Can't you tell? Look, I've got, that's not a dog. That's a guitar. Are <laugh>. Joe, we still can't hear you. See if you can is it us? Is it him? Is it Us? Press there it

Caller Joe (02:08:38):
Is. I'm unmuted.

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (02:08:39):
Go. No, we There you go. We hear you now. There you go. So I, you guys don't, I'm thinking you play the guitar. I might be wrong. Are you a

Caller Joe (02:08:46):
I'm a music producer so I use them to help other people.

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (02:08:48):
Wonderful. So are you in your studio right now?

Caller Joe (02:08:52):
This is my home studio, yes. Nice.

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (02:08:54):
Fantastic. What do you use? Pro Tools.

Caller Joe (02:08:58):
Pro Tools and Logic.

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (02:08:59):
And Logic. Why Nice. Are

Caller Joe (02:09:01):
You I have to use Pro Tools most of the time cuz all my production partners use

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (02:09:04):
That. Yeah. But Logic is a great tool and I'm really pleased they put it on the iPad. So now

Caller Joe (02:09:10):
You Absolutely. Yeah. Yeah,

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (02:09:11):
Yeah.

Caller Joe (02:09:12):
Haven't played with it on, on the iPad yet, but I'll get around to it. Well, you

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (02:09:16):
Don't need to if you've got a nice studio, you've got a desktop. But I think just, you know, you're on the road, you're traveling around, you got, you wanna sketch out ideas. What a great way to do that anyway, what can we do for you? So,

Caller Joe (02:09:26):
So the problem I'm running into, it's more obnoxious than anything else. I use apple Music for testing different mixes and listening to it on my AirPods and speakers. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative> and whenever you look at it in Apple Music, it has the wrong graphic and usually it's the Twit graphic

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (02:09:49):
<Laugh>. Oh wow. So the, the metadata is showing an album cover. It's

Caller Joe (02:09:55):
Just picking something because I'm not putting any graphic on there.

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (02:09:58):
Interesting. So where does this music coming from? Your're exporting it directly from Logic or Pro Tool? Yes.

Caller Joe (02:10:03):
So directly from Pro Tools or Logic

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (02:10:05):
To your desktop or to a Documents folder and then dragging it into Apple Music I'm

Caller Joe (02:10:09):
Dragging it into Apple Music.

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (02:10:11):
Okay. And then does it show up at that point in Apple Music on the Mac with the wrong album cover? Or is it once you have it on your phone that it's showing up with the wrong album cover?

Caller Joe (02:10:22):
It just, it, it immediately assigned and just picks something and throws it on there. Interesting. And it's usually one of your guys' podcasts?

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (02:10:30):
<Laugh>. Oh, well our podcasts have the appropriate content built into the metadata, so you should see it. Although I have to say on my Tesla in the old days, cuz Tesla doesn't have CarPlay it would, Tesla would just basically pick random album Art <laugh> to, to put on top of the podcast.

Caller Joe (02:10:51):
And that's kinda what's happening. Ah,

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (02:10:53):
Ah,

Caller Joe (02:10:53):
So, and I've, I've read about this and people say the way to fix it is to delete everything off your iPhone and then start over.

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (02:11:02):
No. So that's what

Caller Joe (02:11:03):
I said. No,

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (02:11:05):
In, in the, the music app on the Mac, if you go into the settings and you go into the advanced pain, there is an option that says automatically update artwork for imported songs. And you can either have that checked or you can uncheck it. I do not have mine checked. I have mine unchecked. I don't want it making any assumptions about what music I'm adding and what album covers it has. And then it keeps it as just a little gray box with a little music icon on the top of it. It doesn't assign it artwork. And then if I choose to, I can right click on that file, choose get info and then add album artwork to it if I like. Yes. Got it. And if it's coming to Apple Music, it's going to have that assigned. It doesn't just mm-hmm. <Affirmative> assign it because it thinks that you want it to. So if that's turned off, that should solve your problem. That should keep it from popping up with that Apple or with the our our twit thing on. Yeah. As you know Jeff, that's great. There is a metadata in all MP three s and yes, part of the metadata is album art. There are MP3 metadata examination tools you could use to see if the data is actually

Caller Joe (02:12:13):
There. Right. Yeah, yeah, I know about those.

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (02:12:15):
Yeah. And

Caller Joe (02:12:16):
And the interesting thing is a lot of these are waived Yeah. Which have no

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (02:12:20):
Metadata. Oh there's no metadata on waves. Yeah. Yeah. So, but

Caller Joe (02:12:22):
It's, it's still figures out some way to grab some rare,

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (02:12:27):
It's, yeah, it's making silly assumptions. Probably what happened is at some point maybe you had maybe downloaded a twit podcast from you know, just directly as a file. You dragged it into music to transfer it to your phone or something. And from that point on, it said, oh, anytime he drags a Wave file in or he drags a file that's like this in, we're just gonna put twit stuff on it and or you know, it could be the size. The way it used to do this, and I don't know how it does it these days is is literally by the length you would think, well you must be looking at the file in some way. No, no. It just says the length. Oh wow. And so cuz what else is it gonna do? It's, it, it, it's not gonna analyze the music and say, well I could tell that's Bruce Springsteen.

(02:13:09):
It's gonna say, well, right, right. There was a song that was exactly two minutes and 13.7 seconds long and it was from the Beach Boys and it's gonna put that album art on it. That's interesting. So it is cuz there's no, there's on a wave that's all it's got is the actual contents of the wave No metadata and the length of the song. Right. So it has no other way of, of doing this. And that's a pretty primi as you might imagine. Yeah. Primitive way of doing. Lots to guess there. I think the longer a show a podcast is the more likely you'd have a unique Yeah. Album or, but maybe not, you know, but Right. Most, most songs are under three or four minutes. Right. So there's gonna be a lot of collisions, but ultimately yes. Turning off that automatically thing should solve your problem and use MP three s. Why are you using Waves?

Caller Joe (02:13:54):
Because they sound better. No,

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (02:13:55):
They don't. Oh boy. I'm not, I'm not participating in this part. Well they, they, no,

Caller Joe (02:13:59):
It's interesting cause I do a lot

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (02:14:00):
Work. If you were getting a wave from us for instance. That's true. But you're getting an MP3 from us. It's never gonna sound better than the mp3. Yeah. He's talking about well

Caller Joe (02:14:10):
I'm talking about for music now. For your

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (02:14:11):
Music. I completely understand. Yeah. Use, you don't wanna use compressed format. Absolutely. Right.

Caller Joe (02:14:17):
And there is, there is,

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (02:14:18):
Can I recommend though, there are formats like Apple Lossless or Flack that do support menu? I use those. Yeah. And they, and you don't have this problem with Apple Lossless or Flack cuz they support metadata.

Caller Joe (02:14:29):
Yeah, I do MP4 all the time. Yeah.

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (02:14:31):
And those are on, you know, apple Lossless and Flack are just like waves basically. That's the only difference is they're waves with metadata. Metadata <laugh>.

Caller Joe (02:14:39):
And the only reason I send people waves instead is they'll be importing them back into a, a Pro Tools thing. That makes sense. That makes sense. So there's no conversion

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (02:14:47):
Does, does Pro Tools not natively support Flack or Apple Law Lossless?

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (02:14:52):
That seems like it. Not that I know of. Yeah. Thank you very much. Boy, that's ridiculous. <Laugh>. But you know, it's

Caller Joe (02:14:58):
Old, it's like micro. It's my Microsoft word. Yeah,

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (02:15:01):
I know. It's, I know it's PC

Caller Joe (02:15:03):
What everybody in the, everybody's

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (02:15:04):
Using, they want PCM audio, they just want just the bits, man.

Caller Joe (02:15:09):
Right, exactly. So, and a lot of it now is 32 bit. Yeah. So there aren't a lot of things that support that.

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (02:15:15):
Yeah. Right. Well that makes sense. Yes, you kind do use it.

Caller Joe (02:15:18):
So one other quick question on my wife's M one laptop, she has it hooked to an older Mac, the, the Thunderbolt display. Yeah. And it will on occasion turn off for no reason. Oh, it'll go

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (02:15:35):
Black. Oh, my wife's and

Caller Joe (02:15:37):
I've got all the settings turned off so it's not sleeping. Yeah.

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (02:15:40):
My wife's, what

Caller Joe (02:15:41):
We end up having to do is open the top mm-hmm. <Affirmative>, get it to work and close it again. Is that the way to have to do it?

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (02:15:47):
So I used to have this problem a lot with the Thunder. It's not

Caller Joe (02:15:51):
A printer pr question.

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (02:15:52):
No, it, it's not. And, and my poor wife has been complaining about this for years. Yeah. There's, I I it's, it's an energy saving feature. I, you can read dozens of Reddit threads about this and well now wait a minute, does it go dark or does it when she turns it on start dark

Caller Joe (02:16:11):
It goes dark. It

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (02:16:12):
Goes dark. Oh yeah. That is an energy saving problem. Yeah. Yeah. However, yeah.

Caller Joe (02:16:16):
Now, now on my, I have a new M one max laptop mm-hmm. <Affirmative> that it does the same thing with my external display where it starts dark, but then I just open the top and close it and it works <laugh>.

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (02:16:28):
Yeah. So you're running in clamshell mode and you want it to just work. But occasionally it does that in, sometimes you can't turn off display sleep. You can, but there's still something that's not communicated because it's in clamshell mode, specifically the Yeah. The clamshell mode plus this Thunderbolt display, these two specific things. Yeah. For some reason it is just the way of the world. Unfortunately. Now, if it were a Windows machine, I would say go into the driver properties and turn off sleep because I don't know how you would do that on a Mac, but it is not unusual for the hard, so like the Thunderbolt chip to have a sleep mode also. And there may not not be on any way to control that directly on a Mac. I want these machines. Right. Yeah.

Caller Joe (02:17:10):
Cause I have every sleep thing I can find. I always turn it off. Yeah. Because da ws hate sleep mode.

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (02:17:16):
Right. They go, what the hell happened? Yeah. Right. And I'm not gonna reconnect <laugh> you loser.

Caller Joe (02:17:22):
Exactly.

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (02:17:23):
Well

Caller Joe (02:17:24):
It will, but it breaks everything else,

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (02:17:26):
So. Yeah. Well, and I understand they expect everything to be consistently on. So I don't know if there's a way to Thanks,

Caller Joe (02:17:32):
Thanks guys. I appreciate it.

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (02:17:33):
Yeah, sorry about that. Hey, it's really great to talk to you. What kind of music do you produce?

Caller Joe (02:17:38):
It's a lot of alternative. Some sweet abstract, classical, that kind of stuff. Wonderful.

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (02:17:43):
Wow. Cool. Anything do you anything we would know?

Caller Joe (02:17:47):
There's a woman by the name of Janet Feder. Uhhuh <affirmative>. And she has a couple albums that I worked on that are great. How

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (02:17:52):
Fun. Well, I'm

Caller Joe (02:17:54):
F e d e r. F

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (02:17:55):
E d E R. Okay. not the attorney Janet Feder. Nope.

Caller Joe (02:18:01):
No, no. There's an album called This Close, which is great.

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (02:18:06):
Well, that's cool. We'll definitely check that out. Meet Very nice. We'll meet, have the right album Art When Good. Meet

Caller Joe (02:18:11):
Youtube

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (02:18:11):
<Laugh>. Yeah. Have a great Oh yeah. Look at there. There she is. She's performing. She's actually on on YouTube if you wanna, you wanna listen. There

Caller Joe (02:18:21):
Are a few things on YouTube. Mostly on band Camp though.

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (02:18:24):
Yeah, I see. Band Camp. Yeah. Very nice. Thank you Jeff. Have a great day.

Caller Joe (02:18:30):
All right. You take care.

Leo Laporte, Mikah Sargent, Sam Abuelsamid (02:18:31):
A great way to end the show with us not knowing what the hell to do. Hey, at least we solved the first question. I think, you know, it's, this was a used to be a problem on Windows where the network card would go to sleep and you could go into the prep properties of the hardware mm-hmm. <Affirmative> and say, no, never sleep. And I'm betting you that cuz remember Thunderbolt was a joint venture of Intel. Yes. And Apple, I'm betting you. There's the, the, there's actually that, that feature is still in the hardware. Maybe there, there might be some terminal command. I mean, but the, I've looked at, oh, I have terminal command vehicle. I've looked at so many different thread Reddit threads and it always ends with, yeah, I've owned four Mac and every single one of them does this. And it's, it's just this specific arrangement of having clams show mode and then the Thunderbolt display of yester year.

(02:19:17):
Oh, that makes sense. Yeah. And so it's just that whole Lisa's problem was she, we had a, we had a weird monitors that were type C, there's a type C display monitor mm-hmm. <Affirmative>. And I had to get just the right cable, the type C display cable, and then it seems to have solved the problem. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative> I hope. Yeah. They get picky. They they are picky. Yeah. What a fun show. This has been like, this was a great show, sergeant. Yes. we love our calls and I will explain to you how we get these voicemails. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. So during the show, if you call 8 8 8 7 2 4 2 8 8 4, we'll put you right into the zoom and then we can pick up. But if you call when we're not on the air and we're on the air every Sunday from two to 5:00 PM Eastern, that's 11 to one Pacific time.

(02:20:00):
If you call when we're on the air, well we'll transfer you into the Zoom call and take it live. But if you call any other time of the, of the day or week you'll get a chance to leave us a voicemail. If you keep it to about 30 seconds, start with your first name and city very likely the likelihood is high. The likely <laugh> that we will answer your call. We will not call you back. Yeah. Sadly, we're not gonna call you back. But we will, we will answer your question. On the year we do this show, as I said, 11 to one Sunday specific time, two to five Eastern, 1800 utc. If you wanna watch live, just like an old time radio show. Remember those, those, yeah. I remember. Go to live.twit.tv. There's live audio and unlike a radio show, there's video.

(02:20:42):
Whoa. And you know, if you can watch the video, because Mike is such a good looking guy. <Laugh> live TWI tv. If you're watching live chat, live at irc, do twit tv that's open to all. There is a private club, the stadium level. Mm-Hmm. If you mm-hmm. If you will that's our club twit. You can chat with us in Club Twits Discord. If you are a member, why would you become a member? Oh, there's so many reasons besides the Blooming Onion. <Laugh> you all, you, you also, you also get ad free versions of this show and every show we do plus shows that are not out in public, they're in the club only like Micah's HandsOn, McIntosh, hands on Windows with Paul Thout, the Untitled Lennox Show, Stacy's book Club, the GIZ Fizz, and on and on and on. In fact, home Theater Geeks just got launched with Scott Wilkinson every week.

(02:21:32):
Another home theater Geeks in the club. And you can watch him do it live, usually does it once a month. You can watch those live broadcasts in the club. Twit Discord the Discord has lots of events as well that are just for club members. And there's a twit plus feed, which includes things that we don't put in the podcasts, like all the swearing. It's all, it's all in one spot at twit.tv/club twit. It does also, in all seriousness, keep us on the air, which is, which we think is a good thing. Keeps the lights on, keeps the staff employed. It is, it is more and more becoming the number one way we stay afloat. So thank you in advance for your seven bucks a month, twit TV slash club twit. Now everybody can watch this show after the fact. There's an on-demand version, ads included at Twit tv slash atg or is it a ttg?

(02:22:25):
Both. Both. You choose a T G or a T T G. There's also a YouTube channel dedicated to ask the tech guys. I don't know what that address is, but if you go to Twitter TV slash atg, there's a link right there. You can click that. Best way to get any of our shows is to subscribe in your favorite podcast client. Just, you know, podcast, overcast Apple Podcast, Google Podcast. Just find a client you like and subscribe. And that way it all gets downloaded behind the scenes, middle of the night automatically without your paying any attention to it. But the next time you get in the car, oh look, I've got a new ass, the tech guys or, or any of our shows. So that's the best way to do it. Just subscribe. Actually, there is a, we have these special feeds that are everything feeds.

(02:23:14):
Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. So there's all Twitch shows. That's just one feed. You subscribe to get 'em all. There's a all Micah all the time. There's an all Leo all the time, all Jason, all the time. All an all the time. You subscribe to those individual ones, you'll get all the shows we're a part of. I think the all Twit feed would do it. Yeah. And then you just get every show and you get, you know, like a pori of fun and you just pick the one you want. Anyway, that's a, those are a few ways that you can get the show during the show call. Do TWIT TV is our Zoom handle. Eight eight eight seven two four two eight. Eight four is the phone number. And the emails are atg twit dot v Mike is gonna be back on Tuesday with Rosemary. Indeed. Actually this week it'll be Christopher Lawley iPad Connoisseur who will be joining me and will be talking about, he was at the Apple event as well.

(02:24:03):
Oh, nice. So we'll be wrapping up our coverage of every operating system feature that was announced at wwdc. That's iOS today. Tuesday's 9:00 AM Pacific noon Eastern. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative> after that, of course, Mac Break weekly, so you can make your whole day. You hold happily day, all Aply and of course Techno's Weekly on Thursdays with Jason Howell. Yes, absolutely. And remember, join the club so you can also watch Hands on Mac. Oh yeah. What are you doing on Hands on Mac these days? Right now I'm covering window management. So it's been several episodes about all the different ways that you can manage Windows on the Mac, which they've continued to add more and more. So there's a lot to dig into. Stage Manager coming soon. I I am getting, as you know, a brand New Mac probably arriving Wednesday. That's what they say.

(02:24:48):
Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. So I won't have it in time for Mac Break Weekly, but I'll have it in time for this show and I decided to start from scratch. Nice. So I'll show you how I set up a Mac. Maybe we'll do that on, on next Sunday. That'll be fun because I have a process. I mean, when I say start from scratch, I don't have to manually download everything. Right. I have a way. Yes. I have a magical way. There's a magical way. And I will show you. Thanks for joining us. Everybody. Have a great geek week Micah Sergeant and Leo Laporte!